NEM Official Non-Moderated Thread [Updates & Discussion]

[crackerhead]

Goodnght everyone, great work all!

Something to think about. Even with all the drama that went on today, NEMstakes are trading at the same price they were a few days ago. The stakes may have gone down anyways, considering BTC took a hit today as well.

Not that it matters, I don't even have my stake on the AE. Just a fun fact to sleep on.

[KingCole]

As a stakeholder I wish to add my support to the core dev team and have no intention of going anywhere, I read the thread numerous times a day, remain interested and committed to the original cause. One thing I would propose is that everyone takes time and gets some rest. Lets learn from the many things that UP did right not the one thing he did wrong. His decisions (mostly) always seemed to be considered and with an end objective insight. Please lets not start messing with the distribution of NEM or changing elements off the cuff. If people want a debate about a particular change or enhancement here is probably not the best place, a better place is probably on Trello where a request can be made and the full short and long term impact considered.

KC

[Eadeqa]

When is the last day to claim the coins?

Why not just destroy / not generate the unclaimed coins?

I have no problem with this.

[Eadeqa]

As a stakeholder I wish to add my support to the core dev team and have no intention of going anywhere, I read the thread numerous times a day, remain interested and committed to the original cause. One thing I would propose is that everyone takes time and gets some rest. Lets learn from the many things that UP did right not the one thing he did wrong. His decisions (mostly) always seemed to be considered and with an end objective insight. Please lets not start messing with the distribution of NEM or changing elements off the cuff. If people want a debate about a particular change or enhancement here is probably not the best place, a better place is probably on Trello where a request can be made and the full short and long term impact considered.

It's not unimportant question. If there are 25% unclaimed coins, then add 10% developer stakes, and 15% future development, and you are left with a situation where 50% of coins are controlled by developers. Even more if unclaimed coins are higher (as I suspect they will be)

How the fuck is that different than arura and ripple?

This is not "decentralized" system.

[KLONE::Vader]

When is the last day to claim the coins?

Why not just destroy / not generate the unclaimed coins?

I have no problem with this.

better is distribution to stakeholderlist

[kattokassinen]

I think the unclaimed coins should be distributed between stakeholders and not for resale.

I am also opposing the auction of the 135 stakes, as the trust has been compromised. Those stakes should also be distributed between stakeholders. I believe the auction could develop in to a huge PR problem after yesterday's events.

[Vicodin]

Can people still request NEMstakes?

[sevenyears26]

As a stakeholder I wish to add my support to the core dev team and have no intention of going anywhere, I read the thread numerous times a day, remain interested and committed to the original cause. One thing I would propose is that everyone takes time and gets some rest. Lets learn from the many things that UP did right not the one thing he did wrong. His decisions (mostly) always seemed to be considered and with an end objective insight. Please lets not start messing with the distribution of NEM or changing elements off the cuff. If people want a debate about a particular change or enhancement here is probably not the best place, a better place is probably on Trello where a request can be made and the full short and long term impact considered.

It's not unimportant question. If there are 25% unclaimed coins, then add 10% developer stakes, and 15% future development, and you are left with a situation where 50% of coins are controlled by developers. Even more if unclaimed coins are higher (as I suspect they will be)

How the fuck is that different than arura and ripple?

This is not "decentralized" system.

One thing I can honestly say about this project. If you honestly wanted a say in what happens with the leftover stakes, you do have a chance to be heard. Not everyone involved with this coin is a "developer". Try getting involved and you'll see what I mean. Or, you can just sit back, watch, and make comments.

[Tompa]

Can people still request NEMstakes?

I believe so.
Please visit this thread for more info: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=650505

[conbos]

This complete issue about UF's behavior was a good test for NEM. The community is strong, the dev team shown strong resilience. I'm glad that pat is taking the role of UP. I don't known him personally, but through all his posts he has shown a coherent behavior.
I want to thank the dev team to keep spirits high. Very proud to be part of this community!

[Eadeqa]

One thing I can honestly say about this project. If you honestly wanted a say in what happens with the leftover stakes, you do have a chance to be heard. Not everyone involved with this coin is a "developer". Try getting involved and you'll see what I mean. Or, you can just sit back, watch, and make comments.

I am contributing by posting my opinion. I personally never liked the distribution plan because it was designed from start to milk as much money as possible. 10%, 15% future, and there was plan for auction which meant even more bitcoins for "developers". The whole thing was designed to milk as much money as possible for "developers" (don't forget 66 BTC and several thousand Nxt during IPO). 

That's a lot of "milking"

Make it 10% for developer, 15% for future, and distribute the rest equally among stakeholders who do claim their coins.

How is that?

Pretty simple

[rockethead]

Don't worry. We'll consider doing this once we know how many unclaimed stakes there are.

You have to make a decision before sending the coins to stakeholders (as they will get 90% instead of 75%). I am sure you have enough time, but the decision could  be made just a day before distribution.  

Send it to social impact investments if that is going to be a problem. No need to re-distribute. This will give NEM a real coin that "walk the talk" or "put your money where your mouth is".

I oppose sending billion coins free to anyone, social impact or not, as anything that is "free" is worthless. Why should anyone pay anything for Nem when 1 billion of them are given out for free to a group who will dump it for any amount of fiat cash.

That's what happened to aurora. "Free coins" to icelanders who immediately dumped them on exchanges for bitcoins.  

If you want nem to have any value you should avoid handing them for "free" -- especially not 1 billion out of 4 billion.

Please understand social impact investments before you shoot rubbish out your mouth. Nothing is free? What about your proposal to re-distribute it out? Isn't that free? What makes you think that extra 1 billion, when redistributed is not going to fall into the wrong hands that will also dump the same into the exchange?

Please do not assume 25% will not claim their stakes because there is a precedent. I am not even one of the original 3K stakeholders here as I was late in coming. Should I not ask for some?

Like I said, we should only worry if we cross the bridge and I strongly do not believe that it should be simply re-distributed but instead used to make this whole thing work. For example, hire a bunch of programmers to put more things into the eco-system. You don't spend them overnight. Put some into here and there that will generate more activities and create a NEM - New Economy Movement.

I am more interested in knowing how these leftovers are going to be used than a self-serving intention to get more share and then get all dumped into the market just the same!

And there are many ways to handle this undistributed NEMs. Cryptos are built on distributed and decentralized consensus. The very tenet of Cryptos can be used to manage the leftovers.

[kattokassinen]

One thing I can honestly say about this project. If you honestly wanted a say in what happens with the leftover stakes, you do have a chance to be heard. Not everyone involved with this coin is a "developer". Try getting involved and you'll see what I mean. Or, you can just sit back, watch, and make comments.

I am contributing by posting my opinion. I personally never liked the distribution plan because it was designed from start to milk as much money as possible. 10%, 15% future, and there was plan for auction which meant even more bitcoins for "developers". The whole thing was designed to milk as much money as possible for "developers" (don't forget 66 BTC and several thousand Nxt during IPO). 

That's a lot of "milking"

Make it 10% for developer, 15% for future, and distribute the rest equally among stakeholders who do claim their coins.

How is that?

Pretty simple

I agree, with the 25% NEM should be fine already, and doesn't need another auction to "milk" more BTC.

[unvoid]

One thing I can honestly say about this project. If you honestly wanted a say in what happens with the leftover stakes, you do have a chance to be heard. Not everyone involved with this coin is a "developer". Try getting involved and you'll see what I mean. Or, you can just sit back, watch, and make comments.

I am contributing by posting my opinion. I personally never liked the distribution plan because it was designed from start to milk as much money as possible. 10%, 15% future, and there was plan for auction which meant even more bitcoins for "developers". The whole thing was designed to milk as much money as possible for "developers" (don't forget 66 BTC and several thousand Nxt during IPO). 

That's a lot of "milking"

Make it 10% for developer, 15% for future, and distribute the rest equally among stakeholders who do claim their coins.

How is that?

Pretty simple

I agree, with the 25% NEM should be fine already, and doesn't need another auction to "milk" more BTC.

Good point. Uncaimed stakes should be divided and distributed to claimed stakeholders. This should be simple and fair.

[amytheplanarshift]

The moment I heard about NEM I read through the call for stakeholders thread and immediately paid for my stake because I thought NEM was an amazing idea. I'm never going to sell that stake to anyone and I have made a promise to only use the NEM I own to invest directly back into the NEM economy. I will never exchange my NEM for any other currency because if we want to truly build a new economy, we have to maintain our stance as a solid and viable option for people to join our movement.

The actions of one person in a group of many do not reflect on the group as a whole. This is the beauty of decentralization and our new reality in an age where like-minded thinkers can join freely and create a new way to propel society forward into a new generation and a new global society with freedoms that humanity has not yet had the luxury to experience.

And on that note, NEM is one of the many projects that are working towards creating this new society. NEM does not need to be "better" than Bitcoin or any other cryptocurrency. For now, we have our own ecosystem and that is all that matters. If we prove that our model works and can show positive results through our actions, we will grow and naturally become a larger part of this new global economy that is beginning to emerge solely on the Internet.

So let's just put our differences behind us, and focus on working together to build a new future for a new generation. We live in fast-changing times, and we can all be a part of history if we simply work together and focus on the goals of our project as a team.

Alpha can't get here fast enough!

[jenea4pda]

NEM!
IN BAD SITUATION OR IN GOOD SITUATION, I WITH YOU! AND DO MY BEST FOR NEM!
NEM IS THE BEST!!!
BEST WISHES FOR NEM COMMUNITY!!!
THANK YOU FOR EVERYTHING OUR DEVS!
CHEERS

[Eadeqa]

One thing I can honestly say about this project. If you honestly wanted a say in what happens with the leftover stakes, you do have a chance to be heard. Not everyone involved with this coin is a "developer". Try getting involved and you'll see what I mean. Or, you can just sit back, watch, and make comments.

I am contributing by posting my opinion. I personally never liked the distribution plan because it was designed from start to milk as much money as possible. 10%, 15% future, and there was plan for auction which meant even more bitcoins for "developers". The whole thing was designed to milk as much money as possible for "developers" (don't forget 66 BTC and several thousand Nxt during IPO). 

That's a lot of "milking"

Make it 10% for developer, 15% for future, and distribute the rest equally among stakeholders who do claim their coins.

How is that?

Pretty simple

I agree, with the 25% NEM should be fine already, and doesn't need another auction to "milk" more BTC.

Good point. Uncaimed stakes should be divided and distributed to claimed stakeholders. This should be simple and fair.

UP was planning to auction 200 or so "stakes" which meant even more bitcoins for the "developers" -- apart from 10% and 15%  and 66 BTC and several thousand nxt during IPO. This "auction" idea was designed to be as self serving as possible.

Really, after all the Nxt bashing, it had the simplest and fairest IPO. Everyone who contributed got  proportion amount of Nxt and there was ZERO development stake. Luckily 25% never showed up to claim their coins and that money went into various groups that community formed and voted (marketing, development, infrastructure, etc). There was nothing complicated or self serving.

[Simakki]

Nice to see that community keepin it real !

[yifei1201]

support NEM! support NEM! support NEM!

[gimre]

I'll repost it here, just in case someone missed it.

I looks like the old NEM thread was locked before I could post my response. In any event, these are my thoughts:

I'm saddened and disappointed by what has happened today. There is no excuse for what utopianfuture did. It's unprofessional to bash another coin anonymously using sockpuppet accounts. It's worse that those same sockpuppet accounts were used to sign up for NEM stakes because that goes directly against NEM's fair distribution principle.

Having said all that, I would like to thank utopianfuture for what he has done for NEM up until now. Without utopianfuture, NEM wouldn't exist. He conceived of the idea and recruited a lot of the core dev team, including myself. He has also done a number of things behind the scenes, including paying some out-of-pocket costs (in fiat).

I've heard from a plurality of the core dev team and they mostly share this sentiment. I'm sure I will hear from the rest of the team at some point over the weekend. But, aside from a lot of extra gossip, this transgression shouldn't impact the development of NEM. utopianfuture is not a developer and has not written a single line of code.

I'm hopeful that NEM will emerge from this situation even stronger. NEM was always built around decentralization and fairness and having a single "leader" is really diametrically opposed to that. NEM needs to have a community, not a leader.

As for myself, can you trust me? That's up to you to decide, but I will share a few things:

1. I've never heard of simcoin.
2. I'm to busy coding to have sockpuppet account.
3. I don't have a multiple personality disorder.

Let's try to move forward instead of living in the past. The open alpha is less than two weeks away!

P.S. The core dev team will be reaching out to the community to find someone to lead the marketing and biz-dev of NEM going forward. Understandably, we want to spend most of our time coding until NEM is ready.

P.P.S. I will be on the #ournem IRC channel for the next half hour if anyone has questions for me.

1. No one inside core team was aware of UF accounts.
2. Without UF, there would be NO NEM at all. HE recruited all the people.

Let's move on.