GAW / Josh Garza discussion Paycoin XPY xpy.io ION ionomy. ALWAYS MAKE MONEY :)

[interstellar]

You still haven't explained why they need to buy any coin from an exchange to prop up a floor that simply doesn't exist until paybase is opened.  They are just wasting money to buy coins they don't need.

I give up. This has been explained to you numerous times, I'm not quite sure why you're still so adamantly denying simple math. $5 < $20.

I think his whole purpose here is just to annoy us actually. Ignore if he bugs you.

I love you too interstellar.

I love how the haters complain about the heavy handedness at hashtalk but can't take a dose of their own medicine here... then complain that they wish they could have a moderated forum.

Lol, I'm only here because I got banned on HT. Asking too many questions. Like on last Sat. for example, there was this thread where everyone was saying the price of XPY was going to go to the moon and I said wait a minute, be cautious, most altcoins go down in value. What are the market forces that are going to raise the price? That got me a few downvotes right there.

I just want to have an open discussion. I haven't ignored you, but the option is there for people if they choose. It's a whole lot nicer than banning though.

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[seedtrue]

@Full-Metal-B*tch said:

$20 is going to be the floor.
Depends on your perspective. If you're under a bridge, then the floor is above you. Just saying.

How does that even make sense? Even if you are under a bridge there is still something below you(the ground).

[DARKANGEL6415]

wait what paycoin is now on cryptsy no way are you sure its not getting mixed up with some other coin with similar name? I am sure gaw would not let coins out of their control so i dont think its gaws paycoin on cryptsy. I really hope i am right lol

[bitcoinnoisseur]

I got all my paycoins out of GAW's control and successfully at Cryptsy. I'll wait for some signs of a pump and a dumping I will go. Now I never have to login to zencloud again. Good fucking riddance.

Glad to hear you got out whole. I have read some really disturbing things on HT, like a guy who invested his kid's college fund in Paycoin and now realizes he has been a fool. If this continues the way logic and greed seem to indicate there are most likely going to be some bad things happening to a whole lot of people. Do you think if Paycoin goes totally into the toilet and some victims of this fraud commit suicide that Josh's smirk will change at all?

I agree and have been saying that for the last month. It's a shame that some people are going have to learn a lesson the hard way but everyone has had the same opportunity to investigate GAW on their own. If you threw all your money at GAW you are a complete idiot blinded by greed. How anyone could have so much faith in an uneducated, compulsive and perpetual liar is beyond me. Josh thoroughly disgusts me on every level and I detest even hearing his name. I can only hope that there are very few people that did throw all their money at GAW.

[interstellar]

@Full-Metal-B*tch said:

$20 is going to be the floor.
Depends on your perspective. If you're under a bridge, then the floor is above you. Just saying.

How does that even make sense? Even if you are under a bridge there is still something below you(the ground).

gaw will happily sell you that bridge too btw along with their cashtakers!

[TracerX]

Ill say this but no one will listen. Im not a gaw fan. There idea seems solid to me and i invested what i felt comfortable for perceived risk. Ive seen these massive hate campaigns doing to zero legal effect. yet to see a single civil or criminal suit against the man you all claim is the antichrist.

I'm not sure if Mr. Karpeles or the cats at BFL would agree with you there....

TracerX just noticed your picture to the left Do you get your vests from the same place Josh does? I'm anti GAW i just thought it funny to mention the vest thing as it made me chuckle

... I am Josh!  Now I have to kill you before you alert others! 

[interstellar]

I got all my paycoins out of GAW's control and successfully at Cryptsy. I'll wait for some signs of a pump and a dumping I will go. Now I never have to login to zencloud again. Good fucking riddance.

Glad to hear you got out whole. I have read some really disturbing things on HT, like a guy who invested his kid's college fund in Paycoin and now realizes he has been a fool. If this continues the way logic and greed seem to indicate there are most likely going to be some bad things happening to a whole lot of people. Do you think if Paycoin goes totally into the toilet and some victims of this fraud commit suicide that Josh's smirk will change at all?

I agree and have been saying that for the last month. It's a shame that some people are going have to learn a lesson the hard way but everyone has had the same opportunity to investigate GAW on their own. If you threw all your money at GAW you are a complete idiot blinded by greed. How anyone could have so much faith in an uneducated, compulsive and perpetual liar is beyond me. Josh thoroughly disgusts me on every level and I detest even hearing his name. I can only hope that there are very few people that did throw all their money at GAW.

Lots of customers have had a fair change to exit now. Unless you are stuck knee deep in cashtakers you should probably be okay at this point. I don't feel too bad for whatever happens to the lot of them. It's probably time to move on to the more promising projects out there in the crypto world. In some ways, hanging around here is like watching a car accident or even worse, it reminds me a bit of the weeks I spent to the tv watching 911 and the OJ Simpson trial. I know I need to pull away, but the spectacle just keeps me glued to the screen. Oh well, I need a break. I have lots of projects to work on myself.

[T0urist]

The pay coin is in Zencloud from the HP conversion but you cant withdrawal it. Typical GAW

you can i just did... you need to cater for the transaction fee.... if you have 100.. try to withdraw 95. Thats what i did straight to a coinswap address. Guess who's cashing out? i look forward to my under expected price but at least its btc mmmmm tasty btc

[bitcoinnoisseur]

I got all my paycoins out of GAW's control and successfully at Cryptsy. I'll wait for some signs of a pump and a dumping I will go. Now I never have to login to zencloud again. Good fucking riddance.

Glad to hear you got out whole. I have read some really disturbing things on HT, like a guy who invested his kid's college fund in Paycoin and now realizes he has been a fool. If this continues the way logic and greed seem to indicate there are most likely going to be some bad things happening to a whole lot of people. Do you think if Paycoin goes totally into the toilet and some victims of this fraud commit suicide that Josh's smirk will change at all?

I agree and have been saying that for the last month. It's a shame that some people are going have to learn a lesson the hard way but everyone has had the same opportunity to investigate GAW on their own. If you threw all your money at GAW you are a complete idiot blinded by greed. How anyone could have so much faith in an uneducated, compulsive and perpetual liar is beyond me. Josh thoroughly disgusts me on every level and I detest even hearing his name. I can only hope that there are very few people that did throw all their money at GAW.

Lots of customers have had a fair change to exit now. Unless you are stuck knee deep in cashtakers you should probably be okay at this point. I don't feel too bad for whatever happens to the lot of them. It's probably time to move on to the more promising projects out there in the crypto world. In some ways, hanging around here is like watching a car accident or even worse, it reminds me a bit of the weeks I spent to the tv watching 911 and the OJ Simpson trial. I know I need to pull away, but the spectacle just keeps me glued to the screen. Oh well, I need a break. I have lots of projects to work on myself.

Agreed on all accounts. I'll stick with Texas Holdem when I want to gamble. At least I know what I'm holding.

[vabchgent]

The pay coin is in Zencloud from the HP conversion but you cant withdrawal it. Typical GAW

you can i just did... you need to cater for the transaction fee.... if you have 100.. try to withdraw 95. Thats what i did straight to a coinswap address. Guess who's cashing out? i look forward to my under expected price but at least its btc mmmmm tasty btc

They fixed it after I posted I wanted on the dump express early.

[bitcoinnoisseur]

XPY on the rise at Cryptsy. Large sell order at .021

[eightcylinders]

You still haven't explained why they need to buy any coin from an exchange to prop up a floor that simply doesn't exist until paybase is opened.  They are just wasting money to buy coins they don't need.

I give up. This has been explained to you numerous times, I'm not quite sure why you're still so adamantly denying simple math. $5 < $20.

I think I get what puwha is saying (can't believe I see his point, but its worth thinking through).  Let me try without all the smoke and mirrors.

Take the 500,000 mined PoW coins.  Lets assume for the sake of argument that GAW mined zero of them, which is worst case for GAW.

Who are the buyers?  (for this purpose, a miner who retains a coin is economically the same as a buyer)

(1) Speculators who think the price will go up.  This group probably divides into (a) short term (betting on GAW trying to establish a floor price), and (b) long term (betting on long term rise in price of Paycoin irregardless of the floor).

(2) Stakers/Commercials who need coins to stake. These are probably not the Orion Controller folks who most certainly would have bought coins in the $2 ICO round, but rather are folks who want to stake their wallets with GAW and/or their downloaded wallets for the 5% yield.

If GAW does in fact establish the "floor", then most of 1(a) will dump, folks in 1(b) will dump a percentage of their holdings to lock in profits but will retain a position for the long term, and folks in 2 won't care.  Let's say dump percentages in that case are 1(a) - 90%, 1(b) - 50%, and 2 - 5%

If you assume a 50/50 distribution between speculators and commercials, and an equal distribution also between short and long term speculators, I think what puwha is saying is that GAW doesn't need to buy ALL the 500,000 wild XPY; they only need to buy 90 % of the coins held by 1(a) group, 50% of the 1(b) coins, and 5% of the coins held by group 2. So the likely cost is much less even at a flat $20/coin than the assumed $3,000,000 max.

Moreover, if GAW tries to buy all 500,000 wild caught coins for $6 in market now, a massive buy like that would quickly escalate the price well above $6.  That would mean that the long term speculators 1(b) and commercials 2 would pay more for their coins... so GAW would be hurting is loyal base by doing so.

Whether puwha is right depends heavily on your assumptions about how many coins are going into holders in each group, and what those holders are expecting in terms of exit price tiers.

 

 

[Liquid71]

I love seeing the people have a chance to dump the people's money ponzicoin.

I just caught up on the last 10+ pages, and well worth the time spent, getting to see people with money stuck on ponzicoin getting a chance to dump, it's like a Christmas  miracle  

Wonder how those people who bought ponzicoin for $20 from Gaw before shopify shut down GAW's credit card processing feel about the back tracking from the $20 floor  

[puwaha]

You don't think GAW has run these models?

No, I really don't they seem like they are totally winging it. Even you have to admit that. Things change on a day by day basis. Their master plan seems to be: survive until tomorrrow.

It looks bad from this angle, no doubt.

[T0urist]

I am very surprised people haven't pulled their buy walls, I must say Coin-swap are doing a good job with this there site has coped well with activity & its been a very nice early xmas pressie for the owners

I feel sorry for coin-swap. They've done well and it seems a fantastic service. Just a pity they will get exposure from the dump of a shitcoin and then proceed back to normal volumes. Maybe this raises exposure for them and more ltc, btc, doge deals get done.

[ikeboy]

Whoever thinks that paycoin is a scam and will go bust soon, we don't have to argue over it, we can bet!

https://www.betmoose.com/bet/paycoin-to-be-worth-at-least-_01-btc-in-2015-1049

If you think gaw won't maintain the $20 floor, then presumably everyone who bought for $10 expecting to make a quick buck will realize that gaw is a scam, and paycoin will crash. This will happen in a few days, after gaw is unable to continue buying paycoins. So make 10% in 2 weeks (currently there's odds of 1.1 on "no", which works out to  10% if you bet no and are right.)

If you are unwilling to take that bet, then you cannot claim with a straight face that paycoin is a scam that will crash in a few days.

[Meanotor]

You still haven't explained why they need to buy any coin from an exchange to prop up a floor that simply doesn't exist until paybase is opened.  They are just wasting money to buy coins they don't need.

I give up. This has been explained to you numerous times, I'm not quite sure why you're still so adamantly denying simple math. $5 < $20.

I think I get what puwha is saying (can't believe I see his point, but its worth thinking through).  Let me try without all the smoke and mirrors.

Take the 500,000 mined PoW coins.  Lets assume for the sake of argument that GAW mined zero of them, which is worst case for GAW.

Who are the buyers?  (for this purpose, a miner who retains a coin is economically the same as a buyer)

(1) Speculators who think the price will go up.  This group probably divides into (a) short term (betting on GAW trying to establish a floor price), and (b) long term (betting on long term rise in price of Paycoin irregardless of the floor).

(2) Stakers/Commercials who need coins to stake. These are probably not the Orion Controller folks who most certainly would have bought coins in the $2 ICO round, but rather are folks who want to stake their wallets with GAW and/or their downloaded wallets for the 5% yield.

If GAW does in fact establish the "floor", then most of 1(a) will dump, folks in 1(b) will dump a percentage of their holdings to lock in profits but will retain a position for the long term, and folks in 2 won't care.  Let's say dump percentages in that case are 1(a) - 90%, 1(b) - 50%, and 2 - 5%

If you assume a 50/50 distribution between speculators and commercials, and an equal distribution also between short and long term speculators, I think what puwha is saying is that GAW doesn't need to buy ALL the 500,000 wild XPY; they only need to buy 90 % of the coins held by 1(a) group, 50% of the 1(b) coins, and 5% of the coins held by group 2. So the likely cost is much less even at a flat $20/coin than the assumed $3,000,000 max.

Moreover, if GAW tries to buy all 500,000 wild caught coins for $6 in market now, a massive buy like that would quickly escalate the price well above $6.  That would mean that the long term speculators 1(b) and commercials 2 would pay more for their coins... so GAW would be hurting is loyal base by doing so.

Whether puwha is right depends heavily on your assumptions about how many coins are going into holders in each group, and what those holders are expecting in terms of exit price tiers.

sorry but you are totally wrong

this has been explained many times now so I won't repeat it, i'll just point you to it:

What is the purpose of the PoW stage? Why create the 500,000 XPYs on the loose? you want to fill yout cashtaker or speculate? buy it at $20 or at whatever price someone from the ICO's 12,000,000 or HP to XPY conversions. Why give you this opportunity to grab it for an hour's hardware mining? When you really understand this you will figure out what GAW does not have to buy Any of the coins.

[jfabritz]

Sounds like he's taunting his own customers:

https://twitter.com/gawceo/status/545739656676270081

Josh Garza
‏@gawceo
Lets see who holds

Yo man, you holdin'?

No way, what if the cops search me?!?  

[puwaha]

You have insulted yourself far more than anyone ever could by simply continuing to open your mouth and spew utterly ridiculous comments and questions. It seems as though you are a glutton for punishment as you never shut up and say the same things over and over ad nauseam. Does someone actually have to slap you upside the head to get you to understand all of this or to at least attempt to get your presimian brain to wrap around such basic math?

Ugh... you don't want to discuss anything do you?

I hope you see the irony in your statements considering you do nothing but state the same things over and over again.  Though, you do usually come up with unique insults, I'll give you that.

puwaha, we've discussed it over and over. It comes down to this. You guys/gals all believe Josh on face value and are unwilling to entertain the possibility of what we are saying to be true. You keep asking for proof that it is a ponzi. We have provided many red flags and issues, crappy videos without sound showing minimal mining when they said they'd do a clear walk through, lack of transparency to show mining etc.

You continue to ask for definite proof that it is a scam yet you can't provide any proof yourself that it isn't a scam. You're unwilling to believe us and we are unwilling to believe you. The people here questioning it work on logic and facts of which none have been provided to us. When we ask questions of supporters such as yourself the answer are always indirect and dance around the issue. I get it... many have invested a alot and don't want to believe that it is a scam.

The end result is we can't help you and you can't help us. Make up your own mind and be done with it. You won't convince us here and we won't convince you likely. I'll be the bigger man and in a years time if its shown as legitimate has all regulatory bodies involved and is transparent i will retract each and every one of my statements and apologize. I would hope that should this be exposed you will also return to this topic stating the same.

Nobody here is commenting against GAW because they are jealous of success etc... many have money and could invest if they so choose. The fact they don't and are criticising GAW to this degree with valid questions should indicates something just isn't right.

No, I get it now.

[bitcoinnoisseur]

You still haven't explained why they need to buy any coin from an exchange to prop up a floor that simply doesn't exist until paybase is opened.  They are just wasting money to buy coins they don't need.

I give up. This has been explained to you numerous times, I'm not quite sure why you're still so adamantly denying simple math. $5 < $20.

I think I get what puwha is saying (can't believe I see his point, but its worth thinking through).  Let me try without all the smoke and mirrors.

Take the 500,000 mined PoW coins.  Lets assume for the sake of argument that GAW mined zero of them, which is worst case for GAW.

Who are the buyers?  (for this purpose, a miner who retains a coin is economically the same as a buyer)

(1) Speculators who think the price will go up.  This group probably divides into (a) short term (betting on GAW trying to establish a floor price), and (b) long term (betting on long term rise in price of Paycoin irregardless of the floor).

(2) Stakers/Commercials who need coins to stake. These are probably not the Orion Controller folks who most certainly would have bought coins in the $2 ICO round, but rather are folks who want to stake their wallets with GAW and/or their downloaded wallets for the 5% yield.

If GAW does in fact establish the "floor", then most of 1(a) will dump, folks in 1(b) will dump a percentage of their holdings to lock in profits but will retain a position for the long term, and folks in 2 won't care.  Let's say dump percentages in that case are 1(a) - 90%, 1(b) - 50%, and 2 - 5%

If you assume a 50/50 distribution between speculators and commercials, and an equal distribution also between short and long term speculators, I think what puwha is saying is that GAW doesn't need to buy ALL the 500,000 wild XPY; they only need to buy 90 % of the coins held by 1(a) group, 50% of the 1(b) coins, and 5% of the coins held by group 2. So the likely cost is much less even at a flat $20/coin than the assumed $3,000,000 max.

Moreover, if GAW tries to buy all 500,000 wild caught coins for $6 in market now, a massive buy like that would quickly escalate the price well above $6.  That would mean that the long term speculators 1(b) and commercials 2 would pay more for their coins... so GAW would be hurting is loyal base by doing so.

Whether puwha is right depends heavily on your assumptions about how many coins are going into holders in each group, and what those holders are expecting in terms of exit price tiers.

And you actually believe that this is what has been running through puwha's mind and he just opted to never verbalize any of it? You seriously can not. His point about GAW not having to buy any paycoins was based solely on him not comprehending basic math and he proved that many times over. It is that simple.