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Author Topic: NastyFans: The Bitcoin Enthusiast Fan Club (est. 2012)  (Read 798253 times)
zapeta
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March 24, 2016, 12:37:50 AM
 #3301

I'm not opposed to pool mining, but I have no idea what pools are out there at this point.  I think that it would be better to have less variance in weekly payout than we currently experience with P2Pool.

As for the suspension/termination - is there a ballpark number of how many seats are suspended or in danger of termination?  What would be the benefit to the rest of us if we started terminating memberships?

One way or another those members paid for seats.  My understanding is that suspended seats don't receive donations, and I can't imagine that there is any significant costs associated with of keeping track of those seats that are suspended or near termination.  In all likelihood, those members probably won't come back, but imagine the negative publicity that could arise if they did come back and found that their seats has been "terminated". 
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March 24, 2016, 01:00:25 AM
 #3302

I believe there are a few good options out there to switch mining to besides P2pool.  I understand the appeal of decentralized mining, but unfortunately the hashrate doesn't seem quite high enough to lend enough support to that idea.  I think we could be really well off supporting one of the pools that does a lot of good for the community such as Kano's or Bitminters, as opposed to f2pool and antpool that don't fill blocks regularly.  I understand that this might be against what the group stands for, but options are getting thin.  I also don't support mining lottery style for solo blocks.  Using Nicehash is also a good way to get higher mining rewards than currently being paid, something to think about.

I think that expanding mining operations would be a good route to go.  It seems like silver sales are the main drivers behind distributions currently, and current mining gear will only continue to mine less as time goes on.  By beefing up mining capacity, I think the group would overall benefit from higher distributions, more being put back into mining gear, and more silver and seat sales.  Going about this may be tough though, I know I could offer my entire basement as housing for units, but I would need compensation for electricity (around 8 cents per kwh).  There may need to be some creative conclusions to get there, but my belief is mining should expand.

Other business units may be a good investment as well.  Investing in the creation of a faucet or small payout game could help profits.  There are numerous other possibilities as well where expansion could occur.

I think the login period should be extended, I don't think I will remember to login every 3 months to "renew" my seat.  I personally believe you should never lose your seats and should always get distributions, but perhaps say after a year or so those donations are considered donations back to the group if you don't login, but you keep your seats.

These are a couple of my thoughts, there isn't quite enough money to procure large discounts from major equipment manufacturer's, but there are always deals on these forums if you look hard enough.

 

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OgNasty
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March 24, 2016, 04:32:47 AM
 #3303

As for the suspension/termination - is there a ballpark number of how many seats are suspended or in danger of termination?  What would be the benefit to the rest of us if we started terminating memberships?

You would have to get that answer from nonnakip.  I suspect there are more than 2,000 seats that have never logged in since after the original migration from GLBSE.  The benefits to the rest of us are the removal of a liability, a larger reported ownership stake in the fan club, and an accurate current seat count, which will result in more precise statistics.


Using Nicehash is also a good way to get higher mining rewards than currently being paid, something to think about.

Indeed.  I think that setting the miners to take advantage of above average payouts when the opportunities present themselves is something I can do.


Other business units may be a good investment as well.  Investing in the creation of a faucet or small payout game could help profits.  There are numerous other possibilities as well where expansion could occur.

I would love to see NastyFans with the ability create things like this that generate donations to NastyFans.  Anyone can build something that ultimately sends BTC to the donation address.  Smiley


I think the login period should be extended, I don't think I will remember to login every 3 months to "renew" my seat.  I personally believe you should never lose your seats and should always get distributions, but perhaps say after a year or so those donations are considered donations back to the group if you don't login, but you keep your seats.

There are reasons why a termination statement exists in the policy.  It isn't reasonable to expect NastyFans to permanently hold the liability for pending payments to users that are impossible to track down.  Every effort is made to locate them prior to their account being suspended.  The goal is not to terminate users, which is why the policy has not been enforced to date.  We are talking about a period of 3 years with my proposal and those in violation of the policy last logged in when the policy was 30 days for each penalty period.  I think it is safe to say they have abandoned the project and should be treated as such.  Not to mention one of the things that makes Minted Seats special is that there is no membership requirement to own them forever.  I do not think it is too much to ask that members sign in once every two years if they don't want to lose any distributions and once every 3 years if they want to maintain membership.  If you have an email address listed, or your username is the same as here, you will receive many notifications prior to that point.

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kroneko
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March 27, 2016, 01:56:24 AM
 #3304

I have no problem with switching over to a larger pool to up consistency.  I think we certainly did our part to make it as viable as possible, but as with most things it takes a lot of the people in the community to make waves that are needed.  I'd prefer to stick with mining bitcoins too, but that's just my two satoshi.

As for suspension/termination of members, I'm comfortable with us proceeding in the direction proposed.  In reviewing the policy the tl;dr is as follows:

1) You must login every 90 days to remain active to remain active
2) If you go past 90 days you're in probation (donations go to temp account)
3) If you go another 90 days you're in suspension (no voting and donations disabled)
4) Another 90 days you're terminated ( account closed, group determines what to do )

So you're giving people 270 days before their account is terminated, which seems reasonable to me considering there's some effort at attempting to reach members.  While we don't want to lose members, inactive members doesn't exactly help either. 

As for my vote on the terminated seats?  I'd nullify them and if we're under 25,000 - take that difference and hold on to them for a round of fund raising or use in bartering for equipment. 
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March 27, 2016, 11:15:11 AM
 #3305

kano is a for-profit pool operator.  I don't think it aligns with our principles to mine that way.

Ok, i'm not going to comment against your statement about kano...


"We could move our hashrate to a larger private BTC mining pool to reduce variance"


Then i don't know or understand which larger private BTC mining pool you would propose?

I have admittedly not researched what other pools are doing in quite some time.  There are many other factors than just operator fee, but I would like to think that 0% fee pools still exist.  Is ELIGIUS still 0% fee?

Yes, i think eligius is still 0% but keeps the trx-fees!

Their web site home page says otherwise, and claims the fees are paid out.

However I'm not a huge fan of their payout method, which has a small degree of Ponzi-ness to it. That said I should say that I have personally used it.

I like the idea of some of the hash rate continuing to support p2pool because it is good for Bitcoin and some on a centralized pool for regular payouts. Some could even go to plain old solo mining (but solo mining on a centralized pool for lottery purposes is silly, and literal solo mining may be too much work). Splitting it up that way has the effect of reducing overall variance.

On the idea of moving away from p2pool, I would discourage too much emphasis on the recent bad luck as that can reverse quickly, but at the same time I do understand that getting no income from too long can be harmful.

I have only a few seats here so while I'm a spiritual supporter, I don't expect much weight to my views, nor request it.

 
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March 28, 2016, 06:17:25 PM
 #3306

https://nastyfans.org/mint.json may be bugged as all minted coins have 0 holding value.

 Huh

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March 28, 2016, 07:33:09 PM
 #3307

"We could move our hashrate to a larger private BTC mining pool to reduce variance"

Then i don't know or understand which larger private BTC mining pool you would propose?

I have admittedly not researched what other pools are doing in quite some time.  There are many other factors than just operator fee, but I would like to think that 0% fee pools still exist.  Is ELIGIUS still 0% fee?

Yes, i think eligius is still 0% but keeps the trx-fees!

Their web site home page says otherwise, and claims the fees are paid out.

However I'm not a huge fan of their payout method, which has a small degree of Ponzi-ness to it. That said I should say that I have personally used it.

I like the idea of some of the hash rate continuing to support p2pool because it is good for Bitcoin and some on a centralized pool for regular payouts. Some could even go to plain old solo mining (but solo mining on a centralized pool for lottery purposes is silly, and literal solo mining may be too much work). Splitting it up that way has the effect of reducing overall variance.

On the idea of moving away from p2pool, I would discourage too much emphasis on the recent bad luck as that can reverse quickly, but at the same time I do understand that getting no income from too long can be harmful.

Please explain what you mean by "small degree of Ponzi-ness to it." 

I agree that supporting p2pool is a well liked idea.  I'm not sure what nonnakip would like to do as far as NastyPool is concerned.  I think as time passes p2pool will look more and more like solo-mining.  Some diversification might be welcomed.  Perhaps a p2pool/pool combination of some sort.


Quote from: wizkid057
Quote from: OgNasty
How do you make BTC to pay for your expenses?

Donations.  Eligius is volunteer run, not for profit.

Eligius certainly appears to be a good match on the surface.

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March 28, 2016, 08:05:54 PM
 #3308

Eligius certainly appears to be a good match on the surface.

They also have public stats and 105% PPS namecoin payouts, which I'm a fan of.

I mined with them for a while. I got mediocre luck, but it happens to the best of us.  Smiley

Always use escrow. OgNasty is pretty sweet.

Help me out with compiling a list of mining datacenters!
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March 28, 2016, 08:15:42 PM
 #3309

"We could move our hashrate to a larger private BTC mining pool to reduce variance"

Then i don't know or understand which larger private BTC mining pool you would propose?

I have admittedly not researched what other pools are doing in quite some time.  There are many other factors than just operator fee, but I would like to think that 0% fee pools still exist.  Is ELIGIUS still 0% fee?

Yes, i think eligius is still 0% but keeps the trx-fees!

Their web site home page says otherwise, and claims the fees are paid out.

However I'm not a huge fan of their payout method, which has a small degree of Ponzi-ness to it. That said I should say that I have personally used it.

I like the idea of some of the hash rate continuing to support p2pool because it is good for Bitcoin and some on a centralized pool for regular payouts. Some could even go to plain old solo mining (but solo mining on a centralized pool for lottery purposes is silly, and literal solo mining may be too much work). Splitting it up that way has the effect of reducing overall variance.

On the idea of moving away from p2pool, I would discourage too much emphasis on the recent bad luck as that can reverse quickly, but at the same time I do understand that getting no income from too long can be harmful.

Please explain what you mean by "small degree of Ponzi-ness to it."  

Earlier miners are slightly more likely to have their shares paid than later miners. This depends on a continued supply of new miners (and variance) to keep the payouts going.

It isn't a large factor, but it is there.

Quote
I think as time passes p2pool will look more and more like solo-mining.

This is very possible but the future is uncertain. A few years ago p2pool was down to roughly its current share of the net hash rate, then experienced a period of significant growth as some very large miners adopted it. Now it seems to be going in the opposite direction.
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March 30, 2016, 07:14:50 PM
 #3310

I met with a solar representative today and got some quotes on the installation of a few different solar systems.  Prices vary between $29,000-$48,000 depending on the system to be installed.  I would love to invest in a solar system for many reasons and think it would be a huge positive for NastyMining.  If anyone is interested in purchasing a large amount of seats (>5 BTC) from me directly in order to enable the purchase of a solar system, please send me a message.

Update:
5 BTC out of the needed 70 BTC has been raised so far.

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March 31, 2016, 12:21:20 AM
 #3311

I may not be understanding how this works totally, I have 1 seat at address 1Nasty4EcS2DhFdcMFMDLNumZVLismquYW and it is not showing any donations on hold or any coins at the address.

 

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March 31, 2016, 12:30:40 AM
 #3312

I may not be understanding how this works totally, I have 1 seat at address 1Nasty4EcS2DhFdcMFMDLNumZVLismquYW and it is not showing any donations on hold or any coins at the address.

There's an issue with bitcoind that is making things a little screwy at the moment.  Seat purchases along with statistics are not working.  It is also delaying distributions.  This has no effect on our miners and will be resolved eventually.

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March 31, 2016, 12:34:07 AM
 #3313

I may not be understanding how this works totally, I have 1 seat at address 1Nasty4EcS2DhFdcMFMDLNumZVLismquYW and it is not showing any donations on hold or any coins at the address.

There's an issue with bitcoind that is making things a little screwy at the moment.  Seat purchases along with statistics are not working.  It is also delaying distributions.  This has no effect on our miners and will be resolved eventually.

ahh great, thanks for taking the time to respond.  Now the funding for the solar panels, are you more looking to sell seats to fund it or are you also interested in taking out loans to do so?

 

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March 31, 2016, 12:41:57 AM
 #3314

Now the funding for the solar panels, are you more looking to sell seats to fund it or are you also interested in taking out loans to do so?

I am looking to sell my personal seats to fund the panels.  I think this is a good way for me to turn my equity in NastyFans into a positive for the organization.

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April 08, 2016, 08:27:28 PM
 #3315

TL;DR Many services on nastyfans.org not working correctly. I am alive. I will fix everything. No distributions will be lost. I ask for patience.


And now full story...

In middle March I had privilege of traveling to meet OgNasty again. There was long talks of current mining situation and the fanclub and current to-do items and the future of Nasty. It was sometimes difficult discussions because some things like P2Pool situation is not good. But in the end we traded many interesting ideas that I hope someday come to be reality. I look forward to discussing these ideas with the fanclub. Some ideas I see OgNasty already presenting: NastyPool mining and nastyfans policy.

During my travels the Bitcoin-Core on our transaction server died. Hard. This was the reason the 2016-03-18 distribution did not happen. After I return home I see many LevelDB errors. I spend some days trying to recover LevelDB database but it was a mess.

I decide that once LevelDB is corrupted there is not much to do except redownload the full blockchain. So I do that but it takes 5 days. This was the reason the 2016-03-25 distribution did not happen.

Unfortunately after successful download of full blockchain LevelDB corruption happens again. It is not hardware errors. Instead the problem is not enough RAM on transaction server. Bitcoin-Core is C++ and this is bad when out of memory errors happen. Things just start crapping themselves. So I move wallet to a fatter server so I can push out 2 missed distributions. After download of full blockchain again I think I am ready. But I make a mistake in moving over transaction server software. This resulted in accidental partial payout. More verification is necessary to be sure all missed and future distributions are 100% correct. This was the reason the 2016-04-01 distribution did not happen.

This week I rethink how the transaction server works. I do not like reliance on Bitcoin-Core because it is a house of cards and a memory pig. I am looking now at creating raw transactions on a server with no blockchain and only keys. I think this makes more sense. Since still there is no transaction server running this is the reason the distribution for today will not happen.

Many nastyfans services are based on transaction server. The JSON services. The auction. The account balance tracking. The distributions. None of these services work since about 4 weeks. I try to get these online again soon but as life has it I am very busy these days. So I find little time for it. I hope this post relieves some questions about what is going on. I look forward to reducing depedency on Bitcoin-Core but it is not a quick change. I ask members for patience and trust that things will return to normal so we can move forward (like bring new online shop online that I mostly programmed in airplane to OgNasty). Luckily we have a public ledger so no Bitcoin can be lost.

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April 08, 2016, 10:40:53 PM
 #3316

I'm looking to implement Electrum instead of the heavy Bitcoin daemon on a personal project of mine. It wouldn't be a bad idea to use Electrum on the transaction server Smiley
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April 14, 2016, 07:23:49 PM
 #3317

Wow! Thanks quite an adventure! Keep us posted on how things are working out. I'm curious about these new plans aswell. Thanks for your hard work!

TL;DR Many services on nastyfans.org not working correctly. I am alive. I will fix everything. No distributions will be lost. I ask for patience.


And now full story...

In middle March I had privilege of traveling to meet OgNasty again. There was long talks of current mining situation and the fanclub and current to-do items and the future of Nasty. It was sometimes difficult discussions because some things like P2Pool situation is not good. But in the end we traded many interesting ideas that I hope someday come to be reality. I look forward to discussing these ideas with the fanclub. Some ideas I see OgNasty already presenting: NastyPool mining and nastyfans policy.

During my travels the Bitcoin-Core on our transaction server died. Hard. This was the reason the 2016-03-18 distribution did not happen. After I return home I see many LevelDB errors. I spend some days trying to recover LevelDB database but it was a mess.

I decide that once LevelDB is corrupted there is not much to do except redownload the full blockchain. So I do that but it takes 5 days. This was the reason the 2016-03-25 distribution did not happen.

Unfortunately after successful download of full blockchain LevelDB corruption happens again. It is not hardware errors. Instead the problem is not enough RAM on transaction server. Bitcoin-Core is C++ and this is bad when out of memory errors happen. Things just start crapping themselves. So I move wallet to a fatter server so I can push out 2 missed distributions. After download of full blockchain again I think I am ready. But I make a mistake in moving over transaction server software. This resulted in accidental partial payout. More verification is necessary to be sure all missed and future distributions are 100% correct. This was the reason the 2016-04-01 distribution did not happen.

This week I rethink how the transaction server works. I do not like reliance on Bitcoin-Core because it is a house of cards and a memory pig. I am looking now at creating raw transactions on a server with no blockchain and only keys. I think this makes more sense. Since still there is no transaction server running this is the reason the distribution for today will not happen.

Many nastyfans services are based on transaction server. The JSON services. The auction. The account balance tracking. The distributions. None of these services work since about 4 weeks. I try to get these online again soon but as life has it I am very busy these days. So I find little time for it. I hope this post relieves some questions about what is going on. I look forward to reducing depedency on Bitcoin-Core but it is not a quick change. I ask members for patience and trust that things will return to normal so we can move forward (like bring new online shop online that I mostly programmed in airplane to OgNasty). Luckily we have a public ledger so no Bitcoin can be lost.

Newar
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April 15, 2016, 08:22:36 AM
 #3318


For another source of some income, has mining coins such as Gridcoin been considered on the miner controller boxes?

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April 17, 2016, 12:26:09 AM
 #3319

For another source of some income, has mining coins such as Gridcoin been considered on the miner controller boxes?

I'm not sure it would warrant the effort.

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April 17, 2016, 06:47:39 AM
 #3320

Here are the most recent quarterly performance numbers.  I am predicting the current quarter will have the highest (USD) distribution amount in more than 2 years.

(click to enlarge)



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