fresca
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December 28, 2014, 12:55:34 AM |
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Something about this chip gives me the feeling that all mining will eventually go the way of underclocked ASICS. Its a lot less GH but its so much lower J/G.
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philipma1957
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'The right to privacy matters'
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December 28, 2014, 12:59:54 AM |
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Something about this chip gives me the feeling that all mining will eventually go the way of underclocked ASICS. Its a lot less GH but its so much lower J/G.
yeah after I have run my sp20's from spondoolies and I get .47 at 1000 gh = 470 watts or .756 at 1620 gh = 1225 watts I think these will be the same hard to knock the power savings from underclocking |
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sidehack
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Curmudgeonly hardware guy
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December 28, 2014, 01:08:53 AM |
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That's all the S2 is, is sorely underclocked S1 - even used the same VRM hardware. Twice as many chips per bank, half the speed and half the power. Underclocking new hardware is really a discussion in arbitrary stock setpoints - when a new ASIC is released, they could say "the stock point is 0.5W/GH but it underclocks to 0.2W/GH" or they could say "the stock point is 0.2W/GH but it overclocks to 0.5W/GH" and nothing really changes (except maybe the retail price). All mining will go the way of economically-efficiently-clocked ASICs; whether that's "underclocked" or not is mostly semantics.
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RchGrav
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December 28, 2014, 01:33:18 AM
Last edit: December 28, 2014, 02:35:33 AM by RchGrav |
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Something about this chip gives me the feeling that all mining will eventually go the way of underclocked ASICS. Its a lot less GH but its so much lower J/G.
Chips are not much more than the cost of sand if you own the manufacturing and intellectual property.. clearly a growth path to sell miners with more and more chips per unit with low power requirements one the tech is proven to be stable to the community I would think. It seems like it would be easy to double the hashing output with similar cooling and power consumption when the timing is right for bitmain to do so. I'm not an EE genius.. but I don't understand why they wouldnt eventually just use different DC-DC modules internally to provide 9v or 12v w/ standard PSU. Possibly saving that for the next miner with the BM1384? I also don't fully understand the string vs chain discussions going on.. I guess stringing the chips make other chips dependant on one another for hashing output.. My mind draws analogies to a string of christmas lights where the rest go out when a bulb blows, or running a bunch of hard drives in raid 0 (other drives in the array have useless data with the missing member). Of course I haven't scoured the discussions on these matters, and have only gleaned over the facts... but there sure is a lot of crazy heated discussion going on. Anyone have any link backs to messages in this thread or other threads which may help to learn me up. When I get a minute I'll try to read over the BM1384 whitepaper, I assume it might be the source of a lot of this conjecture. So far MOST of the bitmain stuff I have purchased has been pretty on point and meets the specs which they claim their miners should meet*, and have publicly and quickly adjusted those specs when they were not accurate.. Ie. Antminer S3 launch 480GH/s -> 441GH/s and even gave refunds for the hashing difference if you purchased when they claimed it would be 480GH/s (*Its important to note that honesty is good business, but bitmain isn't in the business of charity, you would be lucky to mine back the BTC you spend buying any miner.. so do this for the fun of it.. Don't buy miners to profit.. companies which make miners certainly aren't selling them so you can make a profit.. you WON'T make a profit mining.. Expect 60% of your BTC to come back that you spend AFTER you pay the electric bill. the shrewd miners who do still mine do it for the love of mining and they will sell their equip to recoup and break even, and buy back in on the next most efficient equipment.. even though they know even that isnt the sane investment to make.. The smartest miners probably rebuy their BTC so they are spending fiat not crypto, so at the end of the day they can see some justifiable profit.. even though buying BTC would have been much smarter.. but not nearly as tangible, or fun.) As far as spondoolies goes. I love my Sp20's.... great miners. However the Spondoolie guys clearly overstated its hashing power at 1.7TH. Honest marketing here would have been 1.333TH/s @ .55J/Gh at the wall... with overclocking to 1.55TH/s (1.7TH/s being possible but not guaranteed).. This is the real specs of the Sp20 miner... And what about those refunds they said they would be sending for slipped delivery dates.. I never got one? Did anyone? Anyway.. I can understand concerns with chip failures.. they happen.. and if it takes out a whole string permanantly if a chip dies permanantly.. thats bad bad bad.. but so far every other antminer I have owned (well over 30 so far) have had exceedingly resilient asics... if one did overheat it has always come back after a reboot if it dropped off because of an overclock, and always behaved well when it was clocked at the advertised frequencies... When deployed sanely the built in safeties seem to do their job.. and allow an adjustment to consistently stable operation. I'm just sharing some thoughts. Rich |
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MrTeal
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December 28, 2014, 02:21:31 AM |
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What's the usual confirmation time on an order getting switched from unpaid to paid after a wire transfer, or does it never update? My recollection from the S1/S2 days is that the website often never gets updated with that kind of thing, but it'd be nice to make sure the transfer made it through.
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dogie
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dogiecoin.com
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December 28, 2014, 02:39:34 AM |
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What's the usual confirmation time on an order getting switched from unpaid to paid after a wire transfer, or does it never update? My recollection from the S1/S2 days is that the website often never gets updated with that kind of thing, but it'd be nice to make sure the transfer made it through.
Wire transfer confirmations can take a few days to show, you'll probably get a dispatch confirmation have the product dispatched at the same time. You can email info@ with your transfer details to help match it up to you. |
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dogie
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dogiecoin.com
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December 28, 2014, 02:40:48 AM |
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Something about this chip gives me the feeling that all mining will eventually go the way of underclocked ASICS. Its a lot less GH but its so much lower J/G.
That's typically what the second revision of a generation is - more chips and less extreme clock rates. It wouldn't make sense for the first product in a generation though as the W/GH is already sufficiently low, compared with the potential loss of GH to get down further. |
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RchGrav
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December 28, 2014, 02:42:55 AM
Last edit: December 28, 2014, 03:15:25 AM by RchGrav |
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What's the usual confirmation time on an order getting switched from unpaid to paid after a wire transfer, or does it never update? My recollection from the S1/S2 days is that the website often never gets updated with that kind of thing, but it'd be nice to make sure the transfer made it through.
Since its a manual process it wouldn't hurt to follow up with an e-mail to info@bitmaintech.com with the relevant details.. |
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Qba'g lbh unir nalguvat orggre gb qb?
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727miner
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December 28, 2014, 03:35:01 AM |
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Something about this chip gives me the feeling that all mining will eventually go the way of underclocked ASICS. Its a lot less GH but its so much lower J/G.
Chips are not much more than the cost of sand if you own the manufacturing and intellectual property.. clearly a growth path to sell miners with more and more chips per unit with low power requirements one the tech is proven to be stable to the community I would think. It seems like it would be easy to double the hashing output with similar cooling and power consumption when the timing is right for bitmain to do so. I'm not an EE genius.. but I don't understand why they wouldnt eventually just use different DC-DC modules internally to provide 9v or 12v w/ standard PSU. Possibly saving that for the next miner with the BM1384? I also don't fully understand the string vs chain discussions going on.. I guess stringing the chips make other chips dependant on one another for hashing output.. My mind draws analogies to a string of christmas lights where the rest go out when a bulb blows, or running a bunch of hard drives in raid 0 (other drives in the array have useless data with the missing member). Of course I haven't scoured the discussions on these matters, and have only gleaned over the facts... but there sure is a lot of crazy heated discussion going on. Anyone have any link backs to messages in this thread or other threads which may help to learn me up. When I get a minute I'll try to read over the BM1384 whitepaper, I assume it might be the source of a lot of this conjecture. So far MOST of the bitmain stuff I have purchased has been pretty on point and meets the specs which they claim their miners should meet*, and have publicly and quickly adjusted those specs when they were not accurate.. Ie. Antminer S3 launch 480GH/s -> 441GH/s and even gave refunds for the hashing difference if you purchased when they claimed it would be 480GH/s (*Its important to note that honesty is good business, but bitmain isn't in the business of charity, you would be lucky to mine back the BTC you spend buying any miner.. so do this for the fun of it.. Don't buy miners to profit.. companies which make miners certainly aren't selling them so you can make a profit.. you WON'T make a profit mining.. Expect 60% of your BTC to come back that you spend AFTER you pay the electric bill. the shrewd miners who do still mine do it for the love of mining and they will sell their equip to recoup and break even, and buy back in on the next most efficient equipment.. even though they know even that isnt the sane investment to make.. The smartest miners probably rebuy their BTC so they are spending fiat not crypto, so at the end of the day they can see some justifiable profit.. even though buying BTC would have been much smarter.. but not nearly as tangible, or fun.) As far as spondoolies goes. I love my Sp20's.... great miners. However the Spondoolie guys clearly overstated its hashing power at 1.7TH. Honest marketing here would have been 1.333TH/s @ .55J/Gh at the wall... with overclocking to 1.55TH/s (1.7TH/s being possible but not guaranteed).. This is the real specs of the Sp20 miner... And what about those refunds they said they would be sending for slipped delivery dates.. I never got one? Did anyone?Anyway.. I can understand concerns with chip failures.. they happen.. and if it takes out a whole string permanantly if a chip dies permanantly.. thats bad bad bad.. but so far every other antminer I have owned (well over 30 so far) have had exceedingly resilient asics... if one did overheat it has always come back after a reboot if it dropped off because of an overclock, and always behaved well when it was clocked at the advertised frequencies... When deployed sanely the built in safeties seem to do their job.. and allow an adjustment to consistently stable operation. I'm just sharing some thoughts. Rich Nope, I never got a refund from SPT for the slipped SP20 dates back in November.. I have emailed Barbara and Katya multiple times about it and they just blow me off with empty promises. Their miners are top notch and well built but their slow shipping and poor communication make dealing with them a hassle. |
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MyRig
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December 28, 2014, 03:46:22 AM |
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Wire Transfer payment Processing Time varies depends on where you send the money from and if the sending bank has direct wire to the receiving end or it requires intermediary bank then to out of the country. Example, the wire transfer from the major bank that doesn't require intermediary could show up as the same night, or the next business day. While the originating bank that requires intermediary bank to send the international wire may take 3-4 business days before Bitmain receives pending incoming wire notice and 1 additional business day to clear the actual wire. Wire payment should show PAID in your account, as those are manually processed by the international sales team. What's the usual confirmation time on an order getting switched from unpaid to paid after a wire transfer, or does it never update? My recollection from the S1/S2 days is that the website often never gets updated with that kind of thing, but it'd be nice to make sure the transfer made it through.
Since its a manual process it wouldn't hurt to follow up with an e-mail to info@bitmaintech.com with the relevant details.. |
Antminer & DragonMint Repair E-mail: support@myrig.com T: @MyRig_com Return Address: MyRig 3700 Quebec Street, Unit 100-239, Denver, Colorado 80207, USA |
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Guy Corem
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Spondoolies, Beam & DAGlabs
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December 28, 2014, 04:11:34 AM |
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Something about this chip gives me the feeling that all mining will eventually go the way of underclocked ASICS. Its a lot less GH but its so much lower J/G.
Chips are not much more than the cost of sand if you own the manufacturing and intellectual property.. clearly a growth path to sell miners with more and more chips per unit with low power requirements one the tech is proven to be stable to the community I would think. It seems like it would be easy to double the hashing output with similar cooling and power consumption when the timing is right for bitmain to do so. I'm not an EE genius.. but I don't understand why they wouldnt eventually just use different DC-DC modules internally to provide 9v or 12v w/ standard PSU. Possibly saving that for the next miner with the BM1384? I also don't fully understand the string vs chain discussions going on.. I guess stringing the chips make other chips dependant on one another for hashing output.. My mind draws analogies to a string of christmas lights where the rest go out when a bulb blows, or running a bunch of hard drives in raid 0 (other drives in the array have useless data with the missing member). Of course I haven't scoured the discussions on these matters, and have only gleaned over the facts... but there sure is a lot of crazy heated discussion going on. Anyone have any link backs to messages in this thread or other threads which may help to learn me up. When I get a minute I'll try to read over the BM1384 whitepaper, I assume it might be the source of a lot of this conjecture. So far MOST of the bitmain stuff I have purchased has been pretty on point and meets the specs which they claim their miners should meet*, and have publicly and quickly adjusted those specs when they were not accurate.. Ie. Antminer S3 launch 480GH/s -> 441GH/s and even gave refunds for the hashing difference if you purchased when they claimed it would be 480GH/s (*Its important to note that honesty is good business, but bitmain isn't in the business of charity, you would be lucky to mine back the BTC you spend buying any miner.. so do this for the fun of it.. Don't buy miners to profit.. companies which make miners certainly aren't selling them so you can make a profit.. you WON'T make a profit mining.. Expect 60% of your BTC to come back that you spend AFTER you pay the electric bill. the shrewd miners who do still mine do it for the love of mining and they will sell their equip to recoup and break even, and buy back in on the next most efficient equipment.. even though they know even that isnt the sane investment to make.. The smartest miners probably rebuy their BTC so they are spending fiat not crypto, so at the end of the day they can see some justifiable profit.. even though buying BTC would have been much smarter.. but not nearly as tangible, or fun.) As far as spondoolies goes. I love my Sp20's.... great miners. However the Spondoolie guys clearly overstated its hashing power at 1.7TH. Honest marketing here would have been 1.333TH/s @ .55J/Gh at the wall... with overclocking to 1.55TH/s (1.7TH/s being possible but not guaranteed).. This is the real specs of the Sp20 miner... And what about those refunds they said they would be sending for slipped delivery dates.. I never got one? Did anyone?Anyway.. I can understand concerns with chip failures.. they happen.. and if it takes out a whole string permanantly if a chip dies permanantly.. thats bad bad bad.. but so far every other antminer I have owned (well over 30 so far) have had exceedingly resilient asics... if one did overheat it has always come back after a reboot if it dropped off because of an overclock, and always behaved well when it was clocked at the advertised frequencies... When deployed sanely the built in safeties seem to do their job.. and allow an adjustment to consistently stable operation. I'm just sharing some thoughts. Rich Nope, I never got a refund from SPT for the slipped SP20 dates back in November.. I have emailed Barbara and Katya multiple times about it and they just blow me off with empty promises. Their miners are top notch and well built but their slow shipping and poor communication make dealing with them a hassle. Not my thread, I'll be quick. Please PM your order # |
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MyRig
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December 28, 2014, 04:24:44 AM |
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@Spondoolies-Tech, Good Catch! @727Miner, Hope you get your refund!!! Bring your refund $ to us for a better $/GH and W/GH miner for longer expected mining duration!  ************************************************ Bitmain will be at the 2015 International CES Show in Las Vegas, USA - January 6-9, 2015. http://www.cesweb.org/************************************************ $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ S5 Available to Purchase with a Credit Card for USA Customers http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B00RBV2OE6/ref=sr_1_2_olp?ie=UTF8&qid=1419741122&sr=8-2&keywords=Antminer+S5&condition=new$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ |
Antminer & DragonMint Repair E-mail: support@myrig.com T: @MyRig_com Return Address: MyRig 3700 Quebec Street, Unit 100-239, Denver, Colorado 80207, USA |
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Guy Corem
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Spondoolies, Beam & DAGlabs
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December 28, 2014, 04:31:11 AM |
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@Spondoolies-Tech, Good Catch! @727Miner, Hope you get your refund!!! Bring your refund $ to us for a better $/GH and W/GH miner for longer expected mining duration! It's not fair, I shouldn't reply in your thread. Can't resist it though. All statements are untrue. I suggest that you'll do legendaries reviews party for the S5 to prove. |
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MyRig
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December 28, 2014, 04:37:02 AM |
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We see no issues with the post! We all have to work together to keep the customer happy. Bitcoin 2.0, keep the business CLEAN and Honest!! This Forum is a big family in a way  We didn't send as many as you did, but yes, we shipped out some Demo Units to Legendary and Hero Members! We are learning the tricks fast Some may got caught up in the holiday shipping delay/closure but they should be finally arriving on Monday or so  Happy Holidays! Hope BTC Bull will take some Caffein steroid and hops on a jet engine to get to the MOON!!! @Spondoolies-Tech, Good Catch! @727Miner, Hope you get your refund!!! Bring your refund $ to us for a better $/GH and W/GH miner for longer expected mining duration! It's not fair, I shouldn't reply in your thread. Can't resist it though. All statements are untrue. I suggest that you'll do legendaries reviews party for the S5 to prove. |
Antminer & DragonMint Repair E-mail: support@myrig.com T: @MyRig_com Return Address: MyRig 3700 Quebec Street, Unit 100-239, Denver, Colorado 80207, USA |
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Guy Corem
Donator
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1414
Merit: 1051
Spondoolies, Beam & DAGlabs
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December 28, 2014, 04:44:34 AM |
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We see no issues with the post! We all have to work together to keep the customer happy. Bitcoin 2.0, keep the business CLEAN and Honest!! This Forum is a big family in a way We didn't send as many as you did, but yes, we shipped out some Demo Units to Legendary and Hero Members! We are learning the tricks fast Some may got caught up in the holiday shipping delay/closure but they should be finally arriving on Monday or so Happy Holidays! Hope BTC Bull will take some Caffein steroid and hops on a jet engine to get to the MOON!!! @Spondoolies-Tech, Good Catch! @727Miner, Hope you get your refund!!! Bring your refund $ to us for a better $/GH and W/GH miner for longer expected mining duration! It's not fair, I shouldn't reply in your thread. Can't resist it though. All statements are untrue. I suggest that you'll do legendaries reviews party for the S5 to prove. Amen. |
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727miner
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December 28, 2014, 05:25:39 AM |
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Something about this chip gives me the feeling that all mining will eventually go the way of underclocked ASICS. Its a lot less GH but its so much lower J/G.
Chips are not much more than the cost of sand if you own the manufacturing and intellectual property.. clearly a growth path to sell miners with more and more chips per unit with low power requirements one the tech is proven to be stable to the community I would think. It seems like it would be easy to double the hashing output with similar cooling and power consumption when the timing is right for bitmain to do so. I'm not an EE genius.. but I don't understand why they wouldnt eventually just use different DC-DC modules internally to provide 9v or 12v w/ standard PSU. Possibly saving that for the next miner with the BM1384? I also don't fully understand the string vs chain discussions going on.. I guess stringing the chips make other chips dependant on one another for hashing output.. My mind draws analogies to a string of christmas lights where the rest go out when a bulb blows, or running a bunch of hard drives in raid 0 (other drives in the array have useless data with the missing member). Of course I haven't scoured the discussions on these matters, and have only gleaned over the facts... but there sure is a lot of crazy heated discussion going on. Anyone have any link backs to messages in this thread or other threads which may help to learn me up. When I get a minute I'll try to read over the BM1384 whitepaper, I assume it might be the source of a lot of this conjecture. So far MOST of the bitmain stuff I have purchased has been pretty on point and meets the specs which they claim their miners should meet*, and have publicly and quickly adjusted those specs when they were not accurate.. Ie. Antminer S3 launch 480GH/s -> 441GH/s and even gave refunds for the hashing difference if you purchased when they claimed it would be 480GH/s (*Its important to note that honesty is good business, but bitmain isn't in the business of charity, you would be lucky to mine back the BTC you spend buying any miner.. so do this for the fun of it.. Don't buy miners to profit.. companies which make miners certainly aren't selling them so you can make a profit.. you WON'T make a profit mining.. Expect 60% of your BTC to come back that you spend AFTER you pay the electric bill. the shrewd miners who do still mine do it for the love of mining and they will sell their equip to recoup and break even, and buy back in on the next most efficient equipment.. even though they know even that isnt the sane investment to make.. The smartest miners probably rebuy their BTC so they are spending fiat not crypto, so at the end of the day they can see some justifiable profit.. even though buying BTC would have been much smarter.. but not nearly as tangible, or fun.) As far as spondoolies goes. I love my Sp20's.... great miners. However the Spondoolie guys clearly overstated its hashing power at 1.7TH. Honest marketing here would have been 1.333TH/s @ .55J/Gh at the wall... with overclocking to 1.55TH/s (1.7TH/s being possible but not guaranteed).. This is the real specs of the Sp20 miner... And what about those refunds they said they would be sending for slipped delivery dates.. I never got one? Did anyone?Anyway.. I can understand concerns with chip failures.. they happen.. and if it takes out a whole string permanantly if a chip dies permanantly.. thats bad bad bad.. but so far every other antminer I have owned (well over 30 so far) have had exceedingly resilient asics... if one did overheat it has always come back after a reboot if it dropped off because of an overclock, and always behaved well when it was clocked at the advertised frequencies... When deployed sanely the built in safeties seem to do their job.. and allow an adjustment to consistently stable operation. I'm just sharing some thoughts. Rich Nope, I never got a refund from SPT for the slipped SP20 dates back in November.. I have emailed Barbara and Katya multiple times about it and they just blow me off with empty promises. Their miners are top notch and well built but their slow shipping and poor communication make dealing with them a hassle. Not my thread, I'll be quick. Please PM your order # PM sent.. |
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727miner
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December 28, 2014, 05:27:56 AM |
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Thanks.. I have purchased lots of S1, S2 and S3 hardware and have been very happy with them. I skipped the S4 lot but am considering buying the S5's since I have plenty of power supplies and the form factor fits my space well. I'm just waiting to hear some reviews from some of the members on here. |
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RchGrav
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December 28, 2014, 06:03:09 AM
Last edit: December 28, 2014, 07:44:21 AM by RchGrav |
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Not my thread, I'll be quick. Please PM your order #
My PM is sent as well... |
4C 6F 6E 67 4C 69 76 65 42 69 74 63 6F 69 6E
Qba'g lbh unir nalguvat orggre gb qb?
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raskul
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December 28, 2014, 08:00:26 AM |
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this page warms the cockles of my old heart good to see BMT and SP-T discussing things and acting together. |
tips 1APp826DqjJBdsAeqpEstx6Q8hD4urac8a
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edgar
Legendary
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Activity: 1848
Merit: 1001
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December 28, 2014, 09:39:56 AM |
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Thank you for your reconsideration of the matter.
Unfortunately you seem to have overlooked the three (3) blades that were also part of the same issue. Valued by BITMAIN China at 100USD each.
Also, if we had closed the matter in June as agreed, then the June BTC value would indeed be acceptable.
Instead you opted to cause us all much frustration & financial burden up until now, where the BTC value is less than half of what it was when you could/should have ended the matter.
As such i implore you to re-calculate the full refund value of 260 + 230 + 100 + 100 + 100 = 790 USD in todays BTC price.
This will be acceptable & i will agree that the matter is closed. I will also post my appreciation on each thread to remove the aforementioned tarnish.
I am regretful it has taken so long and so many posts to finally come close to a reconciliation, but i welcome the opportunity.
Sincerely,
Edgar
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