Bullion (CBX) 'the Digital Precious Metal' | 2019 Roadmap published

[thew3apon]

any new developments with this?

[1715111210]

1715111210

[1715111210]

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[1715111210]

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[raizor]

Herewith, the basic CBX Proof-of-Value Network Certification document that I used to back some of my own CBX holdings with physical sliver.

- https://mega.nz/#!2pUlADxA!-VUrzNkNL8tUvgHKwMYyOuqwi8-TS0qhD5RGais8NOU - CBX-Proof-of-Value-Network-Certification.odt

- https://mega.nz/#!j1FSyQIL!BmdMcDaIOwjsoaBFcSYaW92j5OHXbpEQ8MtcFpTLgdo - CBX-Proof-of-Value-Network-Certification.doc

See: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=951753.msg11844494#msg11844494

If others start doing this then we have some interesting data to work from, at the very least. CBX will also have a thread topic that looks rather shiny to potential investors! The concept can also be presented in a new thread and eventually be developed into a dedicated forum and/or website perhaps. I have joined a couple of silver and gold investment forums with the intention of presenting this concept to them.

I must admit, I had trouble getting my head around this initially. The penny has finally dropped now though, and I can see the real potential in this. With CBX backed by physical precious metal, it's possible to track in realtime the current backed value of CBX, both individually (per CBX) and for all CBX in existence (as we know the number of CBX currently in existence at any one time, hell, we can even predict exactly how many will be released in future thanks to PoSP). In my mind, this acts as something of a 'Gold Standard' for Crypto Bullion, and if this information was stored (perhaps on the CBX blockchain ^^), we could display statistics in realtime within the wallet or on a nice website. This website could have an individual (secured) vault area for each CBX holder where they could go to see the value of their holdings against Gold, Silver, BTC, USD. We could also provide physical backing certificates in future too, and/or have virtual ones in the 'web vault'. Damn, the more I think about it, the more I think this really is a killer app for Crypto Bullion! As Crypto Bullion increases in value, holders could increase the amount of physical precious metals used to back their holdings. I love the idea of the value of my CBX being pegged to something physical, as opposed to Fiat Currency or Bitcoin. Another advantage of this is that each time another CBX holder decides to physically back their holdings, every other CBX holder benefits from the global rise in backed value!

The only sticking point that I can think of is the problem of verifying the physical holdings. I'm sure there's a solution to this, so let's give it some thought. Fantastic idea though! Very visionary

I too will be backing 1,000 CBX with 1 Troy oz of Silver. I will prepare and upload the picture and cryptographic proof later in the week. Having a physical metal backing my CBX holdings feels nice and its always wise to diversify your holdings. I particularly like the fact that CBX was designed to mirror the properties of precious metals in its release of coins and total coin availability (rarity). This really is a perfect fit!

Great stuff!

raizor

[BTCat]

I must admit, I had trouble getting my head around this initially.

I'm still there but it's fun to play with the idea.

What I can't understand is why would I purchase CBX and then purchase some silver on top. It feels like paying twice.
Wouldn't this work better if there is an option to back someone else's CBX.

Example: I will back 1,000 CBX that belong to Raizor for 1 year with 1 oz Silver. If he choose to sell his CBX before the year ends then the Silver will start to back another persons 1,000 CBX. If Raizor holds his coins for the full year he may claim the Silver.

That would be an incentive to hold them. Raizor could return the favor and back a 1,000 from me for similar value.  

It would require trust or it needs to have legal backing with a contract. 

[raizor]

I must admit, I had trouble getting my head around this initially.

I'm still there but it's fun to play with the idea.

What I can't understand is why would I purchase CBX and then purchase some silver on top. It feels like paying twice.
Wouldn't this work better if there is an option to back someone else's CBX.

Example: I will back 1,000 CBX that belong to Raizor for 1 year with 1 oz Silver. If he choose to sell his CBX before the year ends then the Silver will start to back another persons 1,000 CBX. If Raizor holds his coins for the full year he may claim the Silver.

That would be an incentive to hold them. Raizor could return the favor and back a 1,000 from me for similar value.  

It would require trust or it needs to have legal backing with a contract. 

Hey BTCat,

Your idea of pairing your CBX with someone else's physical precious metal holdings is something that I hadn't thought of. I think that would provide another excellent entry point for both CBX and precious metal holders. Great idea!

In my mind, it's a case of what gives currency value. The Gold Standard for instance, where currency is backed by physical gold. The value of the currency is dependent on gold reserves to which it is tied. If you were to sell off 50% of the gold, the currency would devalue as the amount of gold that backs it has been reduced. Using precious metals to provide backing for the value of Crypto Bullion would in effect provide a 'Gold Standard' for Crypto Bullion. It would remain up to you to decide whether or not you'd like to back your CBX with physical precious metal. If you chose to do, the amount of precious metal backing CBX's value would increase (by whatever amount to used to back your CBX). This results in the backed value of Crypto Bullion rising, which benefits everyone who holds CBX. That is the reason you would choose to back your coins, to increase their value against the precious metals backing Crypto Bullion. As new investors come into CBX and also back their holdings with physical precious metals, the precious metal market cap for Crypto Bullion increases accordingly. This acts as an incentive for everyone who holds CBX to physically back their CBX with physical precious metals. It even encourages people who have already backed their CBX to increase that backing, as they (and by-proxy every other CBX holder) benefits. The wonderful thing is, they still hold their CBX and their physical precious metal and simply by having both, they increase the value of their CBX holdings. If the physical backing is verifiable and encoded securely in the blockchain (eg. this unit of 1 CBX in the blockchain is pegged to 0.1 oz of physical gold stored securely at XXX, deposited by XXX on XXX date, all cryptographically signed with the holders/depositors identity). We can cryptographically encode this proof-of-holding into the blockchain, which makes CBX a digital representation of physical precious metal holdings.

It's a lot to get your head around, I admit, but once we revise and refine this it should be very easy for everyone to realise the true potential. This is a truly perfect fit for Crypto Bullion. In time, this should allow Crypto Bullion to be pegged in value against gold or silver in addition to Bitcoin or traditional fiat currencies. In my mind, the value of CBX against its physical precious metal counterpart carries much more weight that its value against fiat currency, where fractional reserve banking and the removal of the gold standard make it increasingly hard to ascertain the true worth of the majority of fiat currencies. This plays very well with the reasons many of got involved in Cryptocurrency and Crypto Bullion in particular. Crypto Bullion ceases to be a purely 'virtual' currency if this is implemented.

The sticking point remains with verifying the physical holdings. Once that problem is solved, the sky is the limit

As it stands, with BitcoinFX's verified holdings, CBX has a physically backed value of.... $15.54 (current USD value of 1 Troy Oz of Silver). As more investors back their CBX holdings with precious metals, purchase CBX with precious metals or pair their CBX with someone holding precious metals, the 'CBX precious metals market cap value' increases and increases, attracting more CBX investors and more physical backers. Physically backed Crypto Bullion is our killer app, in my humble opinion. People today talk about the value of CBX in USD or BTC primarily, I can see a future where Gold, Silver, Platinum etc are included too. This is the most exciting idea I've come across in Crypto so far. I'll think on it for a couple of days to be sure it isn't just caffeine and lack of sleep, but I'm pretty convinced that this is a real game changer, both for CBX and Crypto in general. When you consider the mindset of the average intelligent crypto investor, who looks for a store of value, safe from capitol controls during times of economic uncertainty. It's easy to see why so many cryptocurrency advocates also hold precious metals. CBX is perfectly poised to be the link between those two worlds, aligning the digital and physical and providing forward-thinking investors to get involved early and help to realise the massive potential this offers (both on a technical level and a potential financial gains level).

These are just some of the ideas flying around in my head this morning. I'm sure in the near future we'll be investigating interacting with precious metal brokerage markets directly from the Crypto Bullion wallet, using a decentralized exchange system that automatically purchases the corresponding amount of precious metal (automatically encoding this pegging on the blockchain) when someone purchases CBX. That's certainly one way to have fully-automated and decentralized cryptocurrency to precious metal pegging. Exciting times for CBX indeed!

raizor

[BitcoinFX]

Herewith, the basic CBX Proof-of-Value Network Certification document that I used to back some of my own CBX holdings with physical sliver.

- https://mega.nz/#!2pUlADxA!-VUrzNkNL8tUvgHKwMYyOuqwi8-TS0qhD5RGais8NOU - CBX-Proof-of-Value-Network-Certification.odt

- https://mega.nz/#!j1FSyQIL!BmdMcDaIOwjsoaBFcSYaW92j5OHXbpEQ8MtcFpTLgdo - CBX-Proof-of-Value-Network-Certification.doc

See: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=951753.msg11844494#msg11844494

If others start doing this then we have some interesting data to work from, at the very least. CBX will also have a thread topic that looks rather shiny to potential investors! The concept can also be presented in a new thread and eventually be developed into a dedicated forum and/or website perhaps. I have joined a couple of silver and gold investment forums with the intention of presenting this concept to them.

I must admit, I had trouble getting my head around this initially. The penny has finally dropped now though, and I can see the real potential in this. With CBX backed by physical precious metal, it's possible to track in realtime the current backed value of CBX, both individually (per CBX) and for all CBX in existence (as we know the number of CBX currently in existence at any one time, hell, we can even predict exactly how many will be released in future thanks to PoSP). In my mind, this acts as something of a 'Gold Standard' for Crypto Bullion, and if this information was stored (perhaps on the CBX blockchain ^^), we could display statistics in realtime within the wallet or on a nice website. This website could have an individual (secured) vault area for each CBX holder where they could go to see the value of their holdings against Gold, Silver, BTC, USD. We could also provide physical backing certificates in future too, and/or have virtual ones in the 'web vault'. Damn, the more I think about it, the more I think this really is a killer app for Crypto Bullion! As Crypto Bullion increases in value, holders could increase the amount of physical precious metals used to back their holdings. I love the idea of the value of my CBX being pegged to something physical, as opposed to Fiat Currency or Bitcoin. Another advantage of this is that each time another CBX holder decides to physically back their holdings, every other CBX holder benefits from the global rise in backed value!

The only sticking point that I can think of is the problem of verifying the physical holdings. I'm sure there's a solution to this, so let's give it some thought. Fantastic idea though! Very visionary

I too will be backing 1,000 CBX with 1 Troy oz of Silver. I will prepare and upload the picture and cryptographic proof later in the week. Having a physical metal backing my CBX holdings feels nice and its always wise to diversify your holdings. I particularly like the fact that CBX was designed to mirror the properties of precious metals in its release of coins and total coin availability (rarity). This really is a perfect fit!

Great stuff!

raizor

You got it raizor! It's potentially a 'Bullion Dollar' idea in principal and in practice!  

Realize also that all 'backed' CBX is not in direct circulation anymore, being relative to the 'unbacked' CBX in-circulation against the total supply, which in theory means that the circulated CBX potentially has increased 'worth'.

[BitcoinFX]

I must admit, I had trouble getting my head around this initially.

I'm still there but it's fun to play with the idea.

What I can't understand is why would I purchase CBX and then purchase some silver on top. It feels like paying twice.
Wouldn't this work better if there is an option to back someone else's CBX.

Example: I will back 1,000 CBX that belong to Raizor for 1 year with 1 oz Silver. If he choose to sell his CBX before the year ends then the Silver will start to back another persons 1,000 CBX. If Raizor holds his coins for the full year he may claim the Silver.

That would be an incentive to hold them. Raizor could return the favor and back a 1,000 from me for similar value.  

It would require trust or it needs to have legal backing with a contract. 

Indeed. With the creation of a legally binding contract between parties it would be possible to 'back' mutual holdings and/or to use individual or combined holdings to back other assests, stocks and even to back entire business ventures as proof-of-capital.

You have described in practice a 'Smart Contract' in relation to blockchain technology.

Also realize that the notion of backing has two stand points i.e.

"I BitcoinFX hereby back 1000 CBX with 10 Troy Oz of .999 Fine Silver."

and/or

"I BitcoinFX hereby back 10 Troy Oz of .999 Fine Silver with 1000 CBX"

Remember also that in the action of backing something, you are not necessarily buying or selling anything. You are simply combining a tangible and intangible asset and proving ownership. At first, this concept is perhaps somewhat mind-numbing. However, it truely is a concept of 'Sound Money'.

[raizor]

You got it raizor! It's potentially a 'Bullion Dollar' idea in principal and in practice!  

Realize also that all 'backed' CBX is not in direct circulation anymore, being relative to the 'unbacked' CBX in-circulation against the total supply, which in theory means that the circulated CBX potentially has increased 'worth'.

I hear ya my man! I'm blown away now that I 'get it'!. I think you're probably as excited as me about this, so I'd like to share ideas and work together if that's appealing to you, of course. I think our biggest hurdle at the moment remains verifying the physical holdings. The only idea that immediately comes to mind is using a secure third party to physically hold the physical assets. That third party could be audited, which certifies the holdings. In addition to precious metals, I think we should allow CBX to be backed by BTC too. We could even open this up to using other semi-precious metals (or other materials). As long as the asset can be held securely, verified and have its current value tracked (price of gold, silver, BTC, tin, pork bellies etc), that asset should be able to be used as backing (theoretically anyway). There may be scope for opening this up to the futures market too, hell, you could allow stocks to be used to back CBX too! Internet high five, BitcoinFX!

raizor

[BitcoinFX]

Herewith, a post I have just made in the Premium Members area of The Silver Forum to try and attract existing holders of Precious Metals.

"How to use crypto-currency to verify value and secure your PM (Precious Metals) trading."

" ...

As a fellow silver stacker, numismatics collector and long-term supporter and user of digital 'crypto-currencies', such as Bitcoin and Litecoin - I hope to present to you an easy and perhaps revolutionary concept in " How to use crypto-currency to verify value and secure your PM trading."

Aside from the actual benefits of crypto-currency as 'money' or as a 'store-of-value', most people are perhaps unaware of the added security or proof-of-ownership potential when buying and selling goods and/or services online (or in person) that crypto-currencies can already facilitate.

Watch: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3oxM9_OCQKM - How to sign and Verify messages with your Bitcoin Adress from your Software wallet

- https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/18qy88/bitcoin_message_signing_and_verification/

Practical use cases:

Lets imagine that you want to make a trade with someone on this forum (you don't even need to make the payment using crypto-currency or even hold a balance in said crypto-currency to sign and/or verify messages).

You could request that the seller posts a 'signed' message of an address that they own and includes it with a screen shot of the actual item that they are selling, thus presenting cryptographically verifiable proof-of-ownership to you as the buyer.

As the buyer proposing to purchase an item with crypto-currency you can also demonstrate to the seller that you have the currency/money to pay them and/or that you own the particular wallet address.

As an online vendor (whether choosing to accept crypto-currencies for sales or otherwise) you could present screen shots of physical bullion to your potential buyers of items which are signed and verified as being your own wallet address.

Lets say that you are selling a 5 Kilogram Silver Bullion Bar - you can post a screen shot of this item on your website with a signed statement that you own this bullion. This is 100% verifiable to anyone who verifies your message.

To further build trust as an individual seller or as a vendor you can sign the statement to include both the item type and weight and even back it with an address containing the corresponding denomination in crypto-currency. So, in the case of the 5 Kilogram Silver Bullion Bar you could present a Bitcoin address that also contains £2000 to £2500 worth of Bitcoin (approx. example at the current silver price).

This is also providing a potential buyer (or investor) with proof-of-value or proof-of-capital. If you are a small retailer of 1 Oz Silver coins then you might post a signed image and statement to verify said stock.

In short, this is a better way to do online trading in precious metals. It is more secure for both the buyer and the seller.

... "

I have followed this post with screen shots of my own signed backing along with a link to this thread and to the cryptobullion.io website, explaining how anyone can easily download the software and use it to sign/verify messages.

[raizor]

Fantastic BitcoinFX! Your post has also got me thinking about identity. With the trading scenario you mention, a precious metal (or other asset) trader could use the cryptographic identity associated with the CBX pegged to their assets as a proof of identity and integrity. In essence, the public/private key identity that is digitally associated with their physical assets becomes a bona-fide digitial representation of their physical identity. This allows them to use their digital identity for trading and verifying correspondence (messages, trades etc). This 'digital identity' would exist on the CBX blockchain and could accumulate feedback as the person associated with the identity conducts trades. This would be very useful for anyone wanting to conduct trades in private and avoid fees etc. The identity verification would be very useful and if they are conducting a trade using CBX in some way, multisig could be utilized for escrow purposes.

raizor

[BitcoinFX]

You got it raizor! It's potentially a 'Bullion Dollar' idea in principal and in practice!  

Realize also that all 'backed' CBX is not in direct circulation anymore, being relative to the 'unbacked' CBX in-circulation against the total supply, which in theory means that the circulated CBX potentially has increased 'worth'.

I hear ya my man! I'm blown away now that I 'get it'!. I think you're probably as excited as me about this, so I'd like to share ideas and work together if that's appealing to you, of course. I think our biggest hurdle at the moment remains verifying the physical holdings. The only idea that immediately comes to mind is using a secure third party to physically hold the physical assets. That third party could be audited, which certifies the holdings. In addition to precious metals, I think we should allow CBX to be backed by BTC too. We could even open this up to using other semi-precious metals (or other materials). As long as the asset can be held securely, verified and have its current value tracked (price of gold, silver, BTC, tin, pork bellies etc), that asset should be able to be used as backing (theoretically anyway). There may be scope for opening this up to the futures market too, hell, you could allow stocks to be used to back CBX too! Internet high five, BitcoinFX!

raizor

Sounds good.

The use of any third party or counter party, as with crypto-currency, is not required in the main and should also be avoided.

This is a decentralized and independent Value Network, although third parties will no doubt offer storage services as you have described.

The issue with verifying precious Precious Metal holdings (or that of double representation) can be solved somewhat by separating the data set between certificated and non-certificated Bullion i.e. individually numbered bars vs metal presented via type and weight value alone.

A website where members use a 'trust' voting system to provide weighted assurance on others individual holdings will work best imho.
 

[raizor]

Sounds good.

The use of any third party or counter party, as with crypto-currency, is not required in the main and should also be avoided.

This is a decentralized and independent Value Network, although third parties will no doubt offer storage services as you have described.

The issue with verifying precious Precious Metal holdings (or that of double representation) can be solved somewhat by separating the data set between certificated and non-certificated Bullion i.e. individually numbered bars vs metal presented via type and weight value alone.

A website where members use a 'trust' voting system to provide weighted assurance to others individual holdings will work best imho.
 

Sounds good too. This will be an incremental process, so it can be revised and extended as things move forward. Throwing ideas around is good for pinning down the guts of how we want this to work and I think we're making some good progress. I very much appreciate your input BitcoinFX, thank you

raizor

[BitcoinFX]

My public post at The Silver Forum "How to use crypto-currency to verify value and secure your PM trading.

- https://thesilverforum.com/topic/3613-how-to-use-crypto-currency-to-verify-value-and-secure-your-pm-trading/

...

On a separate note this thread makes for a wonderful read for anyone perhaps overly immersed in the Bitcoin / Alt. coin / crypto scene with an interest in numismatics.

- https://thesilverforum.com/topic/584-bitcoin-and-other-crypto-currencies/

[BitcoinFX]

In search for the lowest retail denomination of physical gold 'bullion' ownership available from the internet I have discovered valaurum.

Whilst their 1/10 gram 24 karat gold 'certificates' are a few 100% above spot price, they are individually numbered!

See: http://valaurum.com/ (N.B. That is not a 'yellow' peice of paper, but a very thin layer of pressed gold and is a similar size to a bank note.)

Thus, at the lowest entry point one could even back 0.000001 CBX with 1/10 gram of 'certificated' gold.  

[raizor]

Thanks BitcoinFX. A lot of this info is probably new to a lot of people here (it certainly is to me), so it's good to have someone to point us in the right direction. I think I've come up with a way to encode these certificates into the CBX blockchain for a nominal fee (slightly above the standard transaction fee) without requiring any changes to the underlying protocol. If you have any ideas on workflow (step by step of how you see this system working once it's ready for initial release), those would be really helpful in understanding the process and coming up with an implementation plan. It also enables me to start thinking ahead in relation to the technical aspects.

[BitcoinFX]

Thanks BitcoinFX. A lot of this info is probably new to a lot of people here (it certainly is to me), so it's good to have someone to point us in the right direction. I think I've come up with a way to encode these certificates into the CBX blockchain for a nominal fee (slightly above the standard transaction fee) without requiring any changes to the underlying protocol. If you have any ideas on workflow (step by step of how you see this system working once it's ready for initial release), those would be really helpful in understanding the process and coming up with an implementation plan. It also enables me to start thinking ahead in relation to the technical aspects.

OK. I will look to produce a workflow diagram of the cryptobullion Value Network for community discussion.

...

On a less serious note;

- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z-YKw8w-e50 - Philomena Cunk Money "Moments of Wonder."

- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fW8amMCVAJQ - First Follower: Leadership Lessons from Dancing Guy   

[elambert]

Sent you a PM

[raizor]

OK. I will look to produce a workflow diagram of the cryptobullion Value Network for community discussion.

...

On a less serious note;

- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z-YKw8w-e50 - Philomena Cunk Money "Moments of Wonder."

- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fW8amMCVAJQ - First Follower: Leadership Lessons from Dancing Guy   

That would be great! Thank you.

[BitcoinFX]

...

As it stands, with BitcoinFX's verified holdings, CBX has a physically backed value of.... $15.54 (current USD value of 1 Troy Oz of Silver). As more investors back their CBX holdings with precious metals, purchase CBX with precious metals or pair their CBX with someone holding precious metals, the 'CBX precious metals market cap value' increases and increases, attracting more CBX investors and more physical backers. Physically backed Crypto Bullion is our killer app, in my humble opinion. People today talk about the value of CBX in USD or BTC primarily, I can see a future where Gold, Silver, Platinum etc are included too. This is the most exciting idea I've come across in Crypto so far. I'll think on it for a couple of days to be sure it isn't just caffeine and lack of sleep, but I'm pretty convinced that this is a real game changer, both for CBX and Crypto in general. When you consider the mindset of the average intelligent crypto investor, who looks for a store of value, safe from capitol controls during times of economic uncertainty. It's easy to see why so many cryptocurrency advocates also hold precious metals. CBX is perfectly poised to be the link between those two worlds, aligning the digital and physical and providing forward-thinking investors to get involved early and help to realise the massive potential this offers (both on a technical level and a potential financial gains level).

These are just some of the ideas flying around in my head this morning. I'm sure in the near future we'll be investigating interacting with precious metal brokerage markets directly from the Crypto Bullion wallet, using a decentralized exchange system that automatically purchases the corresponding amount of precious metal (automatically encoding this pegging on the blockchain) when someone purchases CBX. That's certainly one way to have fully-automated and decentralized cryptocurrency to precious metal pegging. Exciting times for CBX indeed!

raizor

With the screen shot and signed message I in fact backed 1000 CBX with 5 x 2 Troy Oz Scottsdale Mint "Stacker Round"s - i.e. 10 Troy Oz Total (thus far) See: https://www.scottsdalesilver.com/store/product.php?productid=17562 - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u5EJrjUtRuw  

(sounds like you had to much caffeine and no sleep)

...

It is vitally important that the majority of the proof-of-value backed holdings are individually owned, personal and therefore decentralized. Think of this as the very oposite to the centralized mining farms that we now see with Bitcoin. 3rd party vault storage is generally a bad idea as well, although I can envisage that some centralization will probably occur.

If we look pre-bitcoin to understand why centralization is a massive potential hinderance, we can see that the majority of centralized DGC's (Digital Gold Currencies) - https://wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_gold_currency have in fact failed. Not only due to having centralized servers, but also due to having centralized gold holdings.

Again, a fully decentralized proof-of-value network is the best approach.

[BitcoinFX]

Sent you a PM

Indeed elambert, I will drop you a response soon.

Cheers!

[BTCat]

About identity:

The Basics Of A Bitcoin-Based Global Identity System
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xZC98s4paYY

This guy has a lot more interesting video's, check his channel.

Smart Contracts & Bitcoin's Big Bang of Disruption
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4nOfHpOFhN8