ASICMINER: Entering the Future of ASIC Mining by Inventing It

[bkminer]

(update: from a photo of a Cointerra wafer I found, it looks like they can probably make around 700 chips per wafer, which at 500 GH/s a chip is around 350 TH/s per wafer; much higher than AM's 40 TH/s per wafer. thus at the wafer/chip level Cointerra might be cheaper than gen3 AM, even though their 28 nm per wafer costs are likely much higher)

Sorry if I'm being ignorant here but I believe Cointerra like KnC use 4 DIE per package so the 700 chips on the wafer are 125GHs each and they missed their speed and power marks first go around.  If I'm missing something please correct me.

[dmcdad]

(update: from a photo of a Cointerra wafer I found, it looks like they can probably make around 700 chips per wafer, which at 500 GH/s a chip is around 350 TH/s per wafer; much higher than AM's 40 TH/s per wafer. thus at the wafer/chip level Cointerra might be cheaper than gen3 AM, even though their 28 nm per wafer costs are likely much higher)

Sorry if I'm being ignorant here but I believe Cointerra like KnC use 4 DIE per package so the 700 chips on the wafer are 125GHs each and they missed their speed and power marks first go around.  If I'm missing something please correct me.

You are very likely correct -- I just assumed 1 die per chip. My 700 dies per wafer is just a guess as well -- I just counted an approximate radius from the photo and did pi*r*r. I did hear as well they hadn't met their speed/energy marks.

[libitum]

Standard ASIC miners in the market (28nm) consume an average of no less than 1000 Watts per Terahash. (it is in reality a lot worse, about 1.3kW/TH).

1 Kilo Watt    --> 1 TeraHash
1 Mega Watt  --> 1 PetaHash
1000 MegaWatts --> 1000 PetaHash

Where is ASICMINER building the nuclear power plant they need to power their miners? The biggest nuclear power in the world generates 6200 MegaWatts, and employs 4000 people. Then ASICMINER needs, not the biggest, but an average sized nuclear plant.

They also need to start buying some land, to start building supermegadatacenters, thousands of times bigger than Google ones. But maybe they have that problem figured out already, as they said, they will outsource those minor issues to local chinese shops.

Or is it that ASICMINER will only build the waffers? (with only <10 PH per year becoming working bitcoin miners).

And they are not even talking about bleeding edge technology. They will build waffers with 40nm chips.
2013 was the 28nm ASIC miners, and this 2014, the 20nm ASICs will start mass delivery.
There is a reason for building ASICs with newer generation chips. Electricity consumption is tightly related to it.
Ask Cointerra, which promised that their new 28nm ASICs were going to be 2x more efficient than KNCs 28nm ASICs because of some magic technology they had. Once Cointerra chips became a reality (TerraMiner IV), their 28nm ASICs were exactly as efficient as KNC ones. How efficient will be ASICMINER chips? At 40nm? They will consume about 50% more electricity than 28nm ASICs, and double what 20nm ASICs (2014 miners) will consume, regardless of any storytelling they might tell now about some magic technologies that will make their ASICs more efficient (exactly as Cointerra did).

Libitum

[dmcdad]

Standard ASIC miners in the market (28nm) consume an average of no less than 1000 Watts per Terahash. (it is in reality a lot worse, about 1.3kW/TH).

1 Kilo Watt    --> 1 TeraHash
1 Mega Watt  --> 1 PetaHash
1000 MegaWatts --> 1000 PetaHash

Where is ASICMINER building the nuclear power plant they need to power their miners? The biggest nuclear power in the world generates 6200 MegaWatts, and employs 4000 people. Then ASICMINER needs, not the biggest, but an average sized nuclear plant.

They also need to start buying some land, to start building supermegadatacenters, thousands of times bigger than Google ones. But maybe they have that problem figured out already, as they said, they will outsource those minor issues to local chinese shops.

Or is it that ASICMINER will only build the waffers? (with only <10 PH per year becoming working bitcoin miners).

And they are not even talking about bleeding edge technology. They will build waffers with 40nm chips.
2013 was the 28nm ASIC miners, and this 2014, the 20nm ASICs will start mass delivery.
There is a reason for building ASICs with newer generation chips. Electricity consumption is tightly related to it.
Ask Cointerra, which promised that their new 28nm ASICs were going to be 2x more efficient than KNCs 28nm ASICs because of some magic technology they had. Once Cointerra chips became a reality (TerraMiner IV), their 28nm ASICs were exactly as efficient as KNC ones. How efficient will be ASICMINER chips? At 40nm? They will consume about 50% more electricity than 28nm ASICs, and double what 20nm ASICs (2014 miners) will consume, regardless of any storytelling they might tell now about some magic technologies that will make their ASICs more efficient (exactly as Cointerra did).

Libitum

You are so off I don't know where to start. Let's just say that AM's 40 nm chips are spec'd to be more efficient than any shipping or announced chips. Next as it has been discussed on here and several other threads, AM is focusing on selling chips not on mining.

[antirack]

Where is ASICMINER building the nuclear power plant they need to power their miners? The biggest nuclear power in the world generates 6200 MegaWatts, and employs 4000 people. Then ASICMINER needs, not the biggest, but an average sized nuclear plant.

They also need to start buying some land, to start building supermegadatacenters, thousands of times bigger than Google ones. But maybe they have that problem figured out already, as they said, they will outsource those minor issues to local chinese shops.

That's where immersion cooling comes in. They are going to "cool" them chips without using and paying any significant extra electricity, and sell the heat generated back to local power plants and actually have income on hot water (to heat buildings) and generate electricity (from the hot water). Essentially, ASICMiner containers ARE the power plants (and heaters) of the future ;-)

Sorry, couldn't resist.

[Danglebee]

I have KNC :| How I sell 25 asicminer share ?
I bought user on this forum. i sell same on forum ?

[ujka]

I have KNC :| How I sell 25 asicminer share ?
I bought user on this forum. i sell same on forum ?

You can put your direct shares on auction, over there in Auctions board, or transfer direct shares to Havelock AM1 shares, and sell there. Instructions for transfering shares are on Havelock site.
https://www.havelockinvestments.com/fund.php?symbol=AM1

[Danglebee]

thanks!
if sell share in forum do i inform friedcat he verify? same process months ago ?

[empoweoqwj]

thanks!
if sell share in forum do i inform friedcat he verify? same process months ago ?

The process has not changed.

[CoinChex]

Incredible...

[FuzzyBear]

This may get lost in here so please feel free to PM me.

I am in a situation I would like a trusted member with ASICMINER shares to help me out with. I need to buy 5 shares at the market rate.. not sure what that is or if I have enough for it, but here is the story behind the NEED.

Essentially I was running a pass through on 5 shares of ASICMINER for the DVC devcoin community here https://cryptostocks.com/securities/39

The person I was running the pass through held the 5 shares and did the payouts... now they have gone all quiet and left the share holders all in the dark and no dividends or anything.

I am looking to source 5 ASICMINER shares direct so that I can take over the listing and reimburse the investors from my own pocket. 

Would you be interested in selling me 5 shares?? How much do they go for these days??

Feel free to PM me if you would rather keep this not public but I wanted to show openness in my attempts to resolve the pass through I was a part of helping run

Fuzzybear

[silverfuture]

This may get lost in here so please feel free to PM me.

I am in a situation I would like a trusted member with ASICMINER shares to help me out with. I need to buy 5 shares at the market rate.. not sure what that is or if I have enough for it, but here is the story behind the NEED.

Essentially I was running a pass through on 5 shares of ASICMINER for the DVC devcoin community here https://cryptostocks.com/securities/39

The person I was running the pass through held the 5 shares and did the payouts... now they have gone all quiet and left the share holders all in the dark and no dividends or anything.

I am looking to source 5 ASICMINER shares direct so that I can take over the listing and reimburse the investors from my own pocket. 

Would you be interested in selling me 5 shares?? How much do they go for these days??

Feel free to PM me if you would rather keep this not public but I wanted to show openness in my attempts to resolve the pass through I was a part of helping run

Fuzzybear

Alternatively, you could buy them here:  https://www.havelockinvestments.com/fund.php?symbol=AM1  and have them transferred to direct shares.

[Jere.Jones]

I'm expecting shenanigans with tomorrow's dividend payments due to the new "malleability bots".  Since the dividend payments are normally sent using a chain of unconfirmed transactions, any transaction that has a mutated version confirmed will invalidate all the transactions further down the chain.

He (or anyone else) could not completely protect against this other than sending one group, then wait for confirms, then send the next group, etc, but maybe it is possible to improve the odds? What if the final transaction in the chain had a higher than usual fee?  Wouldn't that encourage a rational miner to mine the whole chain instead of piecemeal?

Otherwise, he (or anyone else) would have to watch the confirms and, if it gets off track, reissue all the dependent transactions.  That sounds like a pain in the butt to me.  Of course, I have no idea what his internal system is for generating and broadcasting the payments.  It is possible that he has already considered the mischievousness of others.

Any thoughts?

[webbrowser]

The person I was running the pass through held the 5 shares and did the payouts... now they have gone all quiet and left the share holders all in the dark and no dividends or anything.

Am I the only one that is curious as to who this person it?

[empoweoqwj]

I'm expecting shenanigans with tomorrow's dividend payments due to the new "malleability bots".  Since the dividend payments are normally sent using a chain of unconfirmed transactions, any transaction that has a mutated version confirmed will invalidate all the transactions further down the chain.

He (or anyone else) could not completely protect against this other than sending one group, then wait for confirms, then send the next group, etc, but maybe it is possible to improve the odds? What if the final transaction in the chain had a higher than usual fee?  Wouldn't that encourage a rational miner to mine the whole chain instead of piecemeal?

Otherwise, he (or anyone else) would have to watch the confirms and, if it gets off track, reissue all the dependent transactions.  That sounds like a pain in the butt to me.  Of course, I have no idea what his internal system is for generating and broadcasting the payments.  It is possible that he has already considered the mischievousness of others.

Any thoughts?

I think dividend payments are likely to be delayed a bit, but as long as they fix the issue once and for all, another 24-48 hrs is fine by me.

[mb300sd]

I'm expecting shenanigans with tomorrow's dividend payments due to the new "malleability bots".  Since the dividend payments are normally sent using a chain of unconfirmed transactions, any transaction that has a mutated version confirmed will invalidate all the transactions further down the chain.

He (or anyone else) could not completely protect against this other than sending one group, then wait for confirms, then send the next group, etc, but maybe it is possible to improve the odds? What if the final transaction in the chain had a higher than usual fee?  Wouldn't that encourage a rational miner to mine the whole chain instead of piecemeal?

Otherwise, he (or anyone else) would have to watch the confirms and, if it gets off track, reissue all the dependent transactions.  That sounds like a pain in the butt to me.  Of course, I have no idea what his internal system is for generating and broadcasting the payments.  It is possible that he has already considered the mischievousness of others.

Any thoughts?

Submit the entire chain by directly connecting to the largest mining pools. The malleated transactions will be seen as double spends and not accepted into mempool.

[empoweoqwj]

The person I was running the pass through held the 5 shares and did the payouts... now they have gone all quiet and left the share holders all in the dark and no dividends or anything.

Am I the only one that is curious as to who this person it?

Apparently so 

[lophie]

mmmm, what the hell was I just got sent something from asicminer.... ten satoshies?

[mutex]

Are you sure that was from ASICMiner? There are lots of transactions of 1 satoshi going around the net, ads for a bitcoin gaming site or something.

[lophie]

Are you sure that was from ASICMiner? There are lots of transactions of 1 satoshi going around the net, ads for a bitcoin gaming site or something.

yeah my bad...... new multi output tx on Wednesday... I just jumped of t conclusions prematurely