ASICMINER: Entering the Future of ASIC Mining by Inventing It

[necro_nemesis]

In case anyone missed it:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=655464

Datatank mining operation by Allied Control using AM chips.

This reminds me of Sea Launch in that one benefit was being able to geographically situate the operation where there was greatest efficiency. In Sea Launch's case it was to position near the equator in order to increase payload by reducing fuel necessitated by the plane change for geostationary satellites positioning on the geo belt and in this case it's to allow mining to be transported to the lowest operating cost environment.

Let's hope this one isn't forced into bankruptcy protection.

[Chris_Sabian]

In case anyone missed it:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=655464

Datatank mining operation by Allied Control using AM chips.

This reminds me of Sea Launch in that one benefit was being able to geographically situate the operation where there was greatest efficiency. In Sea Launch's case it was to position near the equator in order to increase payload by reducing fuel necessitated by the plane change for geostationary satellites positioning on the geo belt and in this case it's to allow mining to be transported to the lowest operating cost environment.

Let's hope this one isn't forced into bankruptcy protection.

Hopefully the trip to the Moon doesn't start off like this: 
Relevant video:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M7wBN-U2KXI

[TheJuice]

If that company becomes big that means huge money for us and higher share prices. I like what they are doing not investing into it cause other investments going.

1 sold container = 0.1$/share dividend for AM1 ... not so breathtaking

I get $1/share/container at $0.2/gh profit.

Also I think the potential for franchising is huge.

yes, my bad  $1/share/container at $0.2/gh profit. ... seems much more better now 

How many containers are they expecting to sell?

[jimmothy]

If that company becomes big that means huge money for us and higher share prices. I like what they are doing not investing into it cause other investments going.

1 sold container = 0.1$/share dividend for AM1 ... not so breathtaking

I get $1/share/container at $0.2/gh profit.

Also I think the potential for franchising is huge.

yes, my bad  $1/share/container at $0.2/gh profit. ... seems much more better now 

How many containers are they expecting to sell?

5-10 this year. 5-10 per month in 2015.

[antirack]

In case anyone missed it:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=655464

Datatank mining operation by Allied Control using AM chips.

This reminds me of Sea Launch in that one benefit was being able to geographically situate the operation where there was greatest efficiency.

Actually if you situate the system at places with higher electricity cost or higher temperatures it makes even more sense (not for Bitcoin mining though, where you try to keep electricity costs low).

The DataTank PUE is 1.01 (less than 1% of electricity for cooling) in cold or hot climates. While the average PUE for air cooling is 2.2 (120% ! of extra electricity for cooling) in hot and humid places like Hong Kong. Immersion complete new possibilities in the choice of locations.

The reason why the first phase is at $0.02 in Washington State is Bitcoin mining. Having said that, not being limited to cold climates means you now have a lot more places with cheaper electricity where you can mine. Example: cooling a mine in the the Caribbean can be a challenge and expensive with water or air cooling, for immersion it's no different than being in Washington State or in even hotter places. Same same. South East Asia is another example.

[Franktank]

How many containers are they expecting to sell?

5-10 this year. 5-10 per month in 2015.

Like other hardware, it all depends on price and availability. The current going rate for in-hand hardware is about $1-2 a GH, roughly speaking. What's special in this case is scalability, which no other manufacturer can do currently for in-hand hardware for such quantities. Realize that even if one container costs $500k $670k for 2 PH/s at 1.2 MW, you can still ROI in BTC in under 30 days at current network hashrate. No other manufacturer can say the same about their hardware (citation needed).

Go ahead and plug in the numbers here: https://bitcoinwisdom.com/bitcoin/calculator (or any other mining calculator).

The first container will most likely be sold at a premium, where it can easily mine over 250 BTC in profit and potentially break 1000 coins (again, in profit) over its lifetime. After the first several containers are sold, they will quickly fall in line of $1-$2 a GH/s.

Feel free to correct my math.

EDIT: Saw that a DataTank is about 1100 BTC or $670k, that skews my numbers a bit. Regardless, the first container will still mine a boadload.

[antirack]

Please keep in mind that this is a long term plan with power supplies and everything included and reusable.

We are cooperating closely with AM on this to get their hardware in the tanks repeatedly.

[aahzmundus]

I predict low share prices for AM in the near future, maybe record lows... not for bad news but because I imagine many AM investors will want to get into DataTank... and many of us already used all our available funds to purchase cheep AM shares.

I myself am... not sure if I want to get involved.  Personally I worry about Havelock crashing, centralized securities exchanges in the bitcoin world have a worse track record then the bitcoin exchanges.

Then again, I feel like DataTank really is the future... only really bitcoin mining can take full advantage of immersion cooling with the heat density... bitcoin mining has been begging for a new paradigm in data centers since day one.  People trying to use traditional data centers are just asking for trouble.

One thing is for sure however, there is going to be a large demand for chips, and that is good for AM.

[VJain]

Has FC posted regarding DataTanks' authenticity?

[Franktank]

I predict low share prices for AM in the near future, maybe record lows... not for bad news but because I imagine many AM investors will want to get into DataTank... and many of us already used all our available funds to purchase cheep AM shares.

There seems to be an appeal with DataTank, as they're working closely with AM. However, are current shareholders willing to let go of their shares for something that is farther down the line?

Dividend Payments
Profits will be paid weekly in form of dividends. First payments are expected when the initial hardware is deployed, 3-6 months after successful fund raising.

Perhaps I'm reading it wrong but it seems like quite the trade off with 3-6 months later, with the assumption that AM will start dividends sooner than that. There's lots to consider.

[chairforce1]

Has FC posted regarding DataTanks' authenticity?

Jutarul has.

I can confirm that this offer is legit.

Please do your due diligence w/ respect to the viability of the investment (which means run your own numbers).

When will the next general update of the company be made? Is there a standardized schedule or is it random? I'm interested with recent developments arising.

[VJain]

Has FC posted regarding DataTanks' authenticity?

Jutarul has.

I can confirm that this offer is legit.

Please do your due diligence w/ respect to the viability of the investment (which means run your own numbers).

When will the next general update of the company be made? Is there a standardized schedule or is it random? I'm interested with recent developments arising.

And Juratul is a long-standing board member... so that's pretty good to see! Might look at purchasing a few coins worth to see how it pans out in 12 months.

[Swordsoffreedom]

I predict low share prices for AM in the near future, maybe record lows... not for bad news but because I imagine many AM investors will want to get into DataTank... and many of us already used all our available funds to purchase cheep AM shares.

There seems to be an appeal with DataTank, as they're working closely with AM. However, are current shareholders willing to let go of their shares for something that is farther down the line?

Dividend Payments
Profits will be paid weekly in form of dividends. First payments are expected when the initial hardware is deployed, 3-6 months after successful fund raising.

Perhaps I'm reading it wrong but it seems like quite the trade off with 3-6 months later, with the assumption that AM will start dividends sooner than that. There's lots to consider.

There are two ways to play this

One bet on the chip sales and gamble on the payments then do a switch
Or jump into the Datatank early and assume the price will rise as the dividends approach

Both strategies have a chance of burning so some people may just play it safe and do a 50 50 approach or a ratio more favorable to them.

[bitcoin.newsfeed]

I predict low share prices for AM in the near future, maybe record lows... not for bad news but because I imagine many AM investors will want to get into DataTank... and many of us already used all our available funds to purchase cheep AM shares.

There seems to be an appeal with DataTank, as they're working closely with AM. However, are current shareholders willing to let go of their shares for something that is farther down the line?

Dividend Payments
Profits will be paid weekly in form of dividends. First payments are expected when the initial hardware is deployed, 3-6 months after successful fund raising.

Perhaps I'm reading it wrong but it seems like quite the trade off with 3-6 months later, with the assumption that AM will start dividends sooner than that. There's lots to consider.

There are two ways to play this

One bet on the chip sales and gamble on the payments then do a switch
Or jump into the Datatank early and assume the price will rise as the dividends approach

Both strategies have a chance of burning so some people may just play it safe and do a 50 50 approach or a ratio more favorable to them.

Or just hodl the coins ... the best strategy so far

[VJain]

I predict low share prices for AM in the near future, maybe record lows... not for bad news but because I imagine many AM investors will want to get into DataTank... and many of us already used all our available funds to purchase cheep AM shares.

There seems to be an appeal with DataTank, as they're working closely with AM. However, are current shareholders willing to let go of their shares for something that is farther down the line?

Dividend Payments
Profits will be paid weekly in form of dividends. First payments are expected when the initial hardware is deployed, 3-6 months after successful fund raising.

Perhaps I'm reading it wrong but it seems like quite the trade off with 3-6 months later, with the assumption that AM will start dividends sooner than that. There's lots to consider.

There are two ways to play this

One bet on the chip sales and gamble on the payments then do a switch
Or jump into the Datatank early and assume the price will rise as the dividends approach

Both strategies have a chance of burning so some people may just play it safe and do a 50 50 approach or a ratio more favorable to them.

Or just hodl the coins ... the best strategy so far

High risk investments can lead to great rewards... just ask all the IPO investors in this thread =]. I myself turned 10btc into a heck of a lot more then 10btc by NOT holding. People who are holding 100% probably don't even bother reading the security threads.

[Swordsoffreedom]

I predict low share prices for AM in the near future, maybe record lows... not for bad news but because I imagine many AM investors will want to get into DataTank... and many of us already used all our available funds to purchase cheep AM shares.

There seems to be an appeal with DataTank, as they're working closely with AM. However, are current shareholders willing to let go of their shares for something that is farther down the line?

Dividend Payments
Profits will be paid weekly in form of dividends. First payments are expected when the initial hardware is deployed, 3-6 months after successful fund raising.

Perhaps I'm reading it wrong but it seems like quite the trade off with 3-6 months later, with the assumption that AM will start dividends sooner than that. There's lots to consider.

There are two ways to play this

One bet on the chip sales and gamble on the payments then do a switch
Or jump into the Datatank early and assume the price will rise as the dividends approach

Both strategies have a chance of burning so some people may just play it safe and do a 50 50 approach or a ratio more favorable to them.

Or just hodl the coins ... the best strategy so far

High risk investments can lead to great rewards... just ask all the IPO investors in this thread =]. I myself turned 10btc into a heck of a lot more then 10btc by NOT holding. People who are holding 100% probably don't even bother reading the security threads.

Fair point risk brings reward

My point was that if you assume AM dividends are incoming you could wait and collect those first but you take some risk that Datatanks are produced earlier than schedule and they start mining before their estimate or that they get an aggressive dividend schedule a month or two from today.

On the other hand if you buy Datatank shares the price may go up a lot and its cheaper to get IPO shares than it is to buy later, that said considering Rockxie shares and rockminer also listing on Havelock I am not sure how a third factor will equate into the price calculations.

A possible scenario would be
Asicminer Dividends for 2 months --> Rockminer Dividends for 2 months --> Datatank Dividends for 2 months

With buy ins after the first dividends start to wean down and speculators move onto the next company assuming their distributions will start afterwards.

[Chris_Sabian]

A possible scenario would be
Asicminer Dividends for 2 months --> Rockminer Dividends for 2 months --> Datatank Dividends for 2 months

Now that sounds like a high risk - high reward scenario.

I may play with that on paper and see how it turns out. 

[bitcoin.newsfeed]

On the other hand if you buy Datatank shares the price may go up a lot and its cheaper to get IPO shares than it is to buy later

Please explain to me, how is appreciation of cloud mining shares possible in terms of BTC, thank you

EDIT : because by "shares", you're buying fixed amount of power(megawats) , not fixed share in company(like ASICminer), there will be a lot more offerings from DataTank, until they stop production

[Swordsoffreedom]

On the other hand if you buy Datatank shares the price may go up a lot and its cheaper to get IPO shares than it is to buy later

Please explain to me, how is appreciation of cloud mining shares possible in term of BTC, thank you

There were two types of Shares
Series A and Series B
Only one of the two series involves cloudmining I believe I'll need to recheck on that (not sure capacity isn't mining so only series A does it? although the space is still being used I presume either way)
http://www.datatank-mining.com/files/DataTank_Mining_Ops_Prospectus.pdf

"A"

Unit Holders purchase capacity + mining devices.
100% of the income generated is paid out to unit holders. Funds raised via "A"
units are used to build DataTank mining systems and mining hardware, "A" units are therefore more expensive than "B" units below.

"B"

Unit Holders purchase capacity only (no mining hardware). This capacity is made available on the market and used by third party miners (mining organizations, end - users) for appropriate market prices, bidding models, or special franchising agreements with ASIC manufacturers (ie. 80/20 franchising, 20% of mining income goes to holder of "B" units), or used by unit holders for self-mining.

100% of the income generated is paid out to unit holders.

Think its sort of like a mining bond in that the market speculates on it if I interpreted it correctly if we are allowed to analyze the datatank IPO in the AM thread? If so I'll continue we can also try to guess how many chip sales this will generate for AM as well

Voluntary Reinvestment
As 100% of income is paid to unit holders, there is no fixed reinvestment percentage or schedule.
However, DataTank Mining recommends unit holders to reserve 20% of earnings for reinvestment to replace outdated /inefficient mining hardware
and fund additional capacity.

This way, investors are in control over reinvestments individually and decide autonomously if and when reinvestments are being made.
Moreover, DataTank Mining intends to establish a reinvestment program at favorable market rates for existing unit holders.

I guess Bitcoin is made depending on how shareholders interpret the market and when to go all in or do nothing in terms of reinvesting in the company.
The shares appreciate if reinvested growth is greater than the increase in difficulty as they are able to generate more Bitcoins with the hashrate
With a lag time of a few months from decision to working hash in the network allowing the market to freely interpret the price, based on their estimated hash and estimated difficulty increases.

Just a rough idea though feel free to correct me may be totally off.

A possible scenario would be
Asicminer Dividends for 2 months --> Rockminer Dividends for 2 months --> Datatank Dividends for 2 months

Now that sounds like a high risk - high reward scenario.

I may play with that on paper and see how it turns out.  

Cool tell me how it goes

[jimmothy]

Bitmains new 28nm chip announcement: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=656461

Looks decent. Quite a bit less efficient than I expected but much sooner.