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Author Topic: ASICMINER: Entering the Future of ASIC Mining by Inventing It  (Read 3898971 times)
NotLambchop
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June 01, 2014, 03:42:20 PM
 #20161

If by "everyone" you mean investing enthusiasts and finance aficionados, and by "troll" you mean "guy who has been right on the money, each and every time," than we're on the same page Smiley

Guy starts posting for the first time in AM thread in the last 24 hours = "obvious expert"  Roll Eyes

Feel free to point out any of my posts where I have been wrong.
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El Cabron
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June 01, 2014, 03:43:34 PM
 #20162

To be fair, FC has never ever been good at communication. It is just no one cared when massive divs were flowing.

Sorry El Cabron, you are banned from posting or sending personal messages on this forum.
Trolling
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=622250.msg7030081#msg7030081
NotLambchop
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June 01, 2014, 03:44:47 PM
 #20163

...
Wouldn't the board have said something if the person they were meeting with had changed/the company was sold? ...

If it was in the board's best interest, yes.

Well we haven't seen board members unload shares, if they are privy to information this catastrophic, then wouldn't they have tried to unload shares before the everyman would have found out? Maybe I missed it.

JoTheKhan, not sure if I remember you from Active Mining or Ukyo threads, could you remind me?  I remember similarly heavy logic being dropped in both.
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June 01, 2014, 03:48:52 PM
 #20164

...
600 isn't 5K though, I know you had someone who was trying to offload some, but those weren't close enough to be a Boardmember. If the company was going to shit and the Boardmembers knew of it, then you would expect to see 2-3 Boardmembers trying to unload atleast a couple thousand, if not all of theirs.

How any times must it be said that you not understanding how a scam works is exactly why a scam works.  If you understood, you would never fall for it. 
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June 01, 2014, 03:53:04 PM
 #20165

Feel free to point out any of my posts where I have been wrong.

Uses straw man's argument = therefore, can "never be wrong"  Roll Eyes

RoadStress Sock Puppet
JoTheKhan
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June 01, 2014, 03:55:16 PM
 #20166

...
Wouldn't the board have said something if the person they were meeting with had changed/the company was sold? ...

If it was in the board's best interest, yes.

Well we haven't seen board members unload shares, if they are privy to information this catastrophic, then wouldn't they have tried to unload shares before the everyman would have found out? Maybe I missed it.

JoTheKhan, not sure if I remember you from Active Mining or Ukyo threads, could you remind me?  I remember similarly heavy logic being dropped in both.

Not the Ukyo thread, definitely the Active M. Thread. My logic in Active Mining thread has pretty much been that dividends won't exist by the very definition of what a dividend was. Since the company has and will continue along in the Red until it folds or pigs fly. I believe we had a very nice conversation about this until it was deleted. =/

Edit: Please enlighten me on how this specific scam works though. I don't think I am being roped in on scams, as I am Up in AsicMiner at the moment, didn't get caught in Mt. Gox, Labcoin ( I actually made some money flipping the IPO shares since it was so obvious about the pumping, I actually feel guilty about this ), skipped Neobee, didn't keep money on WeX or BF, or any of the other stuff.

Active Mining being the only big red blot on my history, 100% fault of my own.

I always look forward to your advice. =)

I guess there is an assumption that the board members were paid off to not say anything about the company being bought or some other nefarious event?
Lohoris
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June 01, 2014, 03:55:42 PM
 #20167

In addition to this, the reality of the entire board of directors not being aware of this and then also not acting out on it is extremely unlikely. A complete change in ownership may be possible to pull off from the perspective of a BitcoinTalk forum account, however to convince / trick / bribe the board of directors that this change happened and not verbalize this information sounds more like fantasy.
And how could they know?
AFAIK ASICMINER is a virtual company, doesn't really exist officially.
Bitfountain is the real company, and it is not publicly traded.
Are you aware that the so-called "board of directors" do not really meet face-to-face?
I'm not sure exactly how they communicate, but you are assuming there's a "real company" behind all that, while there isn't.
Nothing is "verbalized".

1LohorisJie8bGGG7X4dCS9MAVsTEbzrhu
DefaultTrust is very BAD.
jimmothy
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June 01, 2014, 04:05:28 PM
 #20168

In addition to this, the reality of the entire board of directors not being aware of this and then also not acting out on it is extremely unlikely. A complete change in ownership may be possible to pull off from the perspective of a BitcoinTalk forum account, however to convince / trick / bribe the board of directors that this change happened and not verbalize this information sounds more like fantasy.
And how could they know?
AFAIK ASICMINER is a virtual company, doesn't really exist officially.
Bitfountain is the real company, and it is not publicly traded.
Are you aware that the so-called "board of directors" do not really meet face-to-face?
I'm not sure exactly how they communicate, but you are assuming there's a "real company" behind all that, while there isn't.
Nothing is "verbalized".


How do you imagine FC would be able to pull off such a conspiracy?

Do you really think the CEO could change without a single leak from one of his friends, family, business partners (don't think I need to remind you there are a lot), board members, employees or basically anyone who knows his real identity? We are talking 100+ people that would need to keep this secret.

Can we please stop entertaining this as if it is more than fantasy?
NotLambchop
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June 01, 2014, 04:05:44 PM
 #20169

Feel free to point out any of my posts where I have been wrong.

Uses straw man's argument = therefore, can "never be wrong"  Roll Eyes

wat

Each time I called a fail, it failed.
Granted, the odds were stacked in my favor, since almost everything out there is either a scam or just some incorrigible child role-playing bznz, but nothing unfalsifiable about my predictions Smiley
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June 01, 2014, 04:16:17 PM
 #20170

Feel free to point out any of my posts where I have been wrong.

Uses straw man's argument = therefore, can "never be wrong"  Roll Eyes

wat

Each time I called a fail, it failed.
Granted, the odds were stacked in my favor, since almost everything out there is either a scam or just some incorrigible child role-playing bznz, but nothing unfalsifiable about my predictions Smiley

NotLambchop
1) Posts pics of Havelock "assets"
2) Takes data 'X' and misrepresents as 'Y'
3) Insults other users because they don't see it as 'Y'
4) Claims to be right, those who disagree = wrong

Clearly not a straw man's argument  Roll Eyes Cheesy

RoadStress Sock Puppet
jimmothy
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June 01, 2014, 04:21:34 PM
 #20171

Feel free to point out any of my posts where I have been wrong.

Uses straw man's argument = therefore, can "never be wrong"  Roll Eyes

wat

Each time I called a fail, it failed.
Granted, the odds were stacked in my favor, since almost everything out there is either a scam or just some incorrigible child role-playing bznz, but nothing unfalsifiable about my predictions Smiley

Staw mans arguments + 9/10 odds of guessing correct by calling everything a scam = legitimately the smartest person on this forum.

Care to enlighten us on how asicminer is a scam?
jdany
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June 01, 2014, 04:31:29 PM
 #20172

I'm not terribly excited about what happened here over the last few days.
Based on a few of the balance sheet assessments, I tend to agree that AM is setup pretty well over the next few quarters.

However, I do see a time where investors become too much of a pain in the ass - and totally unnecessary.
It would be better to buy them out, and become more private/

If it were me and I wanted to kill off investors.
I would cut off dividends.  Shut them out for awhile.  Let them panic.  Let the value tumble.  Buy back their shares.  And carry on.

No conspiracy.  But, we have become a really big group of whiny bitches.  (myself included)
Regardless if it's warranted or not - I wouldn't want to put up with us.
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June 01, 2014, 04:39:47 PM
 #20173

There is no friedcat.
"friedcat" is just an account with no RL name attached, Bitfountain could have easily changed account's owner down the line.

As long as he was giving regular updates yes, he was rightly labeled as reliable and trustable.
Then everything changed.
Like past dividends do not imply future dividends, past reputation do not imply you are still honest.
Especially if we don't even know who "he" is.

Brandon Lu (Xinyu Jiang)

The same name and email that friedcat used for email in 2012 is associated with the AM200 design documents from 2014 so I don't believe account ownership has changed.



NotLambchop
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June 01, 2014, 04:51:54 PM
 #20174

...
I guess there is an assumption that the board members were paid off to not say anything about the company being bought or some other nefarious event?

I'm not implying that the board members were paid off, but I know that TAT, for one, gave up his position.  I also have no idea how many shares are currently held by the board--shares could have changed hands at any point, by multiple means.  I'm also not clairvoyant, I don't always know exactly how each and every scam is done.  I simply allow for the fact that there are possibilities I haven't considered.  Con artists who are good at their trade are as specialized as aardvarks, they study and refine their craft just like any other professional. Just like I don't expect to understand the minutia of ant-eating, it seems foolish to assume I grasp the art of the con as fully as the ones working it.

And that's all I'm saying here--not understanding how a scam works is not proof of it not being a scam.  Everything beyond that was thrust onto me by ASICMINER fanbois and jittery "investors."  To be clearer still, I never called this a scam--merely pointed out that the odds of losing on this are astoundingly high.  Not only due to FC, but to a slew of third-party risks--exchanges, etc.  The potential upside in no way compensates for this, making this a nonstarter as an investment.

Hope this is a bit clearer.
necro_nemesis
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June 01, 2014, 04:54:33 PM
 #20175



No conspiracy.  But, we have become a really big group of whiny bitches.  (myself included)
Regardless if it's warranted or not - I wouldn't want to put up with us.


I wouldn't be so quick to be apologetic about investor behavior. It's largely attributable to the lack of information coming from AM. IMHO there would be a fraction of the problems if they reported and didn't let imaginations run wild. To blame investors for their poor behavior as a result of the situation is wrong.
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June 01, 2014, 04:56:34 PM
 #20176

...
I guess there is an assumption that the board members were paid off to not say anything about the company being bought or some other nefarious event?

I'm not implying that the board members were paid off, but I know that TAT, for one, gave up his position.  I also have no idea how many shares are currently held by the board--shares could have changed hands at any point, by multiple means.  I'm also not clairvoyant, I don't always know exactly how each and every scam is done.  I simply allow for the fact that there are possibilities I haven't considered.  Con artists who are good at their trade are as specialized as aardvarks, they study and refine their craft just like any other professional. Just like I don't expect to understand the minutia of ant-eating, it seems foolish to assume I grasp the art of the con as fully as the ones working it.

And that's all I'm saying here--not understanding how a scam works is not proof of it not being a scam.  Everything beyond that was thrust onto me by ASICMINER fanbois and jittery "investors."  To be clearer still, I never called this a scam--merely pointed out that the odds of losing on this are astoundingly high.  Not only due to FC, but to a slew of third-party risks--exchanges, etc.  The potential upside in no way compensates for this, making this a nonstarter as an investment.

Hope this is a bit clearer.

TAT never had a position. He had it because of the Passthrough management and he was forced out of it when Havelock took over. Now his personal opinion is one thing but he definitely doesn't have super secret conspiracy type information to base his opinion on.

Will take me a while to climb up again, But where is a will, there is a way...
NotLambchop
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June 01, 2014, 05:00:37 PM
 #20177

...
NotLambchop
1) Posts pics of Havelock "assets"
2) Takes data 'X' and misrepresents as 'Y'
3) Insults other users because they don't see it as 'Y'
4) Claims to be right, those who disagree = wrong

Clearly not a straw man's argument  Roll Eyes Cheesy

Do you understand what a straw man argument is?  Not one of your points, with the possible exception of (2), even implies it.
Re. (2):  What, specifically, are you talking about?
El Cabron
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June 01, 2014, 05:01:28 PM
 #20178

...
I guess there is an assumption that the board members were paid off to not say anything about the company being bought or some other nefarious event?

I'm not implying that the board members were paid off, but I know that TAT, for one, gave up his position.  I also have no idea how many shares are currently held by the board--shares could have changed hands at any point, by multiple means.  I'm also not clairvoyant, I don't always know exactly how each and every scam is done.  I simply allow for the fact that there are possibilities I haven't considered.  Con artists who are good at their trade are as specialized as aardvarks, they study and refine their craft just like any other professional. Just like I don't expect to understand the minutia of ant-eating, it seems foolish to assume I grasp the art of the con as fully as the ones working it.

And that's all I'm saying here--not understanding how a scam works is not proof of it not being a scam.  Everything beyond that was thrust onto me by ASICMINER fanbois and jittery "investors."  To be clearer still, I never called this a scam--merely pointed out that the odds of losing on this are astoundingly high.  Not only due to FC, but to a slew of third-party risks--exchanges, etc.  The potential upside in no way compensates for this, making this a nonstarter as an investment.

Hope this is a bit clearer.

TAT never had a position. He had it because of the Passthrough management and he was forced out of it when Havelock took over. Now his personal opinion is one thing but he definitely doesn't have super secret conspiracy type information to base his opinion on.

He was also speaking in a place that is very anti anything that MP is selling. There is a reason he did not say that stuff here.

anyway TAT is not a guy i would take trading advice from, or even trust with BTC.

Sorry El Cabron, you are banned from posting or sending personal messages on this forum.
Trolling
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=622250.msg7030081#msg7030081
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June 01, 2014, 05:05:23 PM
Last edit: June 01, 2014, 05:51:27 PM by hdbuck
 #20179

Mehh everything is on track. Within the next month or two, we will see even more miner companies blooming thx to AM's chips. The lately XBTec now advertizes 5Ph immersion cooled mining rigs on their websites (here come your new competitors spondoo..)..
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=626694.msg7074332#msg7074332

AM share price will go up back to 0,4 in a blink once we got a better idea about quantities, production/selling prices, advancement in production, kicking off of solomining and franchising. They just started selling WORKING chips (in-stock!) for barely a month. Cut FC some slack so he can sell those 8M worth chips (production cost). And there's still a massive 3rd batch for june..
Tape out was successful 3 months ago only (or could it be 2 maybe? I remembered some delays so everything would be perfect - ie not like Avalon, Hashfast & co.).
I predict by july/august 1st round of agressive divs. Taking the price back to 0,7 at least.

Now keep your FUD to yourselves or feel free to sell your shares at those RIDICULOUS prices

edit: Plus AM is dealing with TSMC. thats no bullshit industry partner. what's 3 months of no divs? or even 5 or 6? or a year? NEVER in any normal companies divs has been payed every fucking weeks. you noobs.
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June 01, 2014, 05:09:02 PM
 #20180



No conspiracy.  But, we have become a really big group of whiny bitches.  (myself included)
Regardless if it's warranted or not - I wouldn't want to put up with us.


I wouldn't be so quick to be apologetic about investor behavior. It's largely attributable to the lack of information coming from AM. IMHO there would be a fraction of the problems if they reported and didn't let imaginations run wild. To blame investors for their poor behavior as a result of the situation is wrong.

The less communication we have, the more irritated we become.  
The more irritated we become, the less communication we'll be provided.

I totally agree with you.  But, there's no good reason for them to fix it.  We're irrelevant.



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