I feel that I put way more into any one of my posts by pasting the output of a lorem ipsum engine than int03h has put into all of his posts together.

Back onto a real conversation. I was hoping you could provide an example of a major online retailer that charges the full amount to your credit card (not just an authorization) for a pre-order.

Here is my post on the subject (sans nonsense)
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=207331.msg2270904#msg2270904

Nulla et massa vitae tortor condimentum vestibulum.  

Have someone explain my post to you. It was clear, concise, and to the point. Moreover, consectetur adipiscing elit. Ut at nulla enim, sed pretium odio.

Bad for whom? Why does BFL care what some random person types on these forums? Josh himself has already declared that bitcointalk.org is irrelevant to them.
AFAIK, BFL has the power to review every post on their forums, so there is no excuse for content appearing there that they do not condone. That is what makes me curious. Unless Xian struck a nerve. Impossible to know at this stage.

I said it was important for them to have their customers agree to the new specifications. See my bolded quote. I am not sure why you would call me agreeing with you a game of chase the point.


That is not true at all AFAIK. Amazon, Ebay, Barnes & Nobles, and Newegg will authorize the purchase (which is reserves the balance on your card, but does not count as money you have spent and you pay no interest) for an item not in stock, but will not actually charge the purchase to your card until the item you ordered ships. You can try it and then check your credit card statement online. For larger purchases, most companies take a deposit for pre-orders like houses, cars, in order to limit their liability.

Relevant pages from retailers about pre-order items:
http://www.barnesandnoble.com/help/cds2.asp?pid=26974
http://www.amazon.com/gp/help/customer/display.html/ref=hp_rel_topic?ie=UTF8&nodeId=201132830
http://help.newegg.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/386/kw/pre%20order%20charges/session/L3RpbWUvMTM2OTUyNjQxNi9zaWQvNkgxQmg2cmw%3D

You don't understand anything I articulate, remember?  So dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit. Maecenas lacinia lacinia molestie. Maecenas porttitor consectetur nulla non pretium. Mauris at risus ut leo luctus eleifend.

With hindsight, of course he should have sold his units. I personally never thought BFL would stoop to canceling the orders of angry customers. Especially the ones from June/July of 2012. I *think* BFL has the right to refund any of the pre-orders, should they wish to do so. On the other hand, that might open them up to legal issues if they don't deliver on a significant chunk of their pre-orders. I have already posted the relevant sections of Missouri law they are in violation of. It seems to be a pretty powerful statute.

It is pretty clear Xian could have gotten more than just his refund had he sold his orders on these forums. He has also been a bit strident about it, his spelling and grammar have been mediocre as well. However, he is righteously pissed, and I am not at my literary best when I am upset either. Still, his actions in this thread leave a lot of room for improvement. 

And you never will be. You could get 1000 posts in a day and you would still not understand a thing.

http://www.moga.mo.gov/statutes/chapters/chap407.htm
That I believe would be the governing statute in the state of Missouri


Yes, when he ordered it was scheduled for October. After that date came and went, the series of misrepresentations about the state of the product became more numerous. But even before then, statements about measurements of power usage and performance were made. It was only after BFL shipped their first few units that people realized that those claims about power usage could not possibly have been valid. In fact, there is much evidence to suggest that BFL did not have any working chips at all by October 2012. Of course, that would have made it impossible to measure the power usage of them.


Yes. Having their customers agree to the new specifications was a very important legal hurdle for BFL to surmount. Had they not done so, they would have been up a creek sans paddle so to speak. The problem is that BFL took payment in full for the pre-orders. Most companies do not charge your card for the full amount until they can ship you the product. They authorize the purchase, but do not complete it. BFL could not support credit cards to pre-order because CC companies frown on imaginary products being sold (they will yank your account and freeze your funds). That puts them into a very gray legal area. For instance, how do they account for those funds? They cannot be sales because they have not shipped the units. Do they collect sales tax? Do they escrow the funds? Are they using the funds for capital investments and/or development? Did they notify their customers that their pre-order funds would be used for these purposes and does that constitute a solicitation of investment?

Edit: And yes, ASICMiner has only achieved 24% of the network hash rate. I believe only Avalon unit account for a larger percentage. But ASICMiner is walking carefully for very good reason. Right now, friedcat and btcguild could get together and attempt a 51% attack. The fact that it only takes 2 entities to accomplish this makes a lot of people nervous.

People who put money into Avalon will probably get their chips and/or mining units. ASICMiner has also been a reliable way to convert capital into network hash rate. There is currently no evidence that I am aware of to support the contrary.

To date BFL is an unreliable way to convert your money into hash rate. Moreover, there have been a continuous series of delays which benefited all miners. To maximize their profits, every miner should encourage people looking for ASICs to order from BFL.

I am bored.
After careful analysis, I will fling my BTC indiscriminately at random BTC addresses. This has a higher chance of success than ordering from the OP.

Go put a bet on a bitcoin betting site. I don't do anything without escrow that involves people who only have posts dated from today. 
Of course I don't make sense to you. Nothing I type will ever make sense to you.

Yep. I don't expect you to understand anything.

Over under on when int03h vanishes into the setting sun: 18 days.

I'll take the under 

If it was firmware. This sounds to me more like a 3 chip Jala since they took the offer down. Perhaps they ran out of chips binned for 2GH instead of 2.5GH.

All of your 15 posts in one day. Very impressive.
How long will this one last? A week? A month?

Except you didn't, it wasn't, you haven't, I have, it does. Now run along and play.

Smokes? You didn't buy them at the warehouse. They had no product.
Drink? You didn't buy it at the warehouse They had no product.
You wait for 11 months in the warehouse, then get bounced for complaining about the delays. They do refund your money.
Then you come here and warn people, but get insulted by low post count noobs.

When Xian paid, there was no product.
It is you who is deaf, blind, and all your posts are from today. Very interesting.

No. I do mine, but I am not currently using Avalon, ASICMiner or BFL.

I should thank BFL for sucking up all the capital that would have gone to either Avalon or ASICMiner. That capital would have been converted to hashing equipment sooner and impacted the network hash rate (and thus my profits) sooner. BFL has put money in my pocket by being so late. Now that Avalon has dumped 400,000+ chips onto the market (plus around 90TH of mining units), it is unlikely that BFL will ship enough product to make a dent in the Bitcoin hash rate. My mining equipment has already paid for itself and is quite power efficient, so I anticipate just letting it run and earning whatever it earns.

The best situation for me is for BFL to trickle out a few units a week while holding onto all the capital that otherwise would go to Avalon or ASICMiner to be converted into hash rate. If I were looking out for my wallet, I should be encouraging people to put their capital in limbo via BFL preorders. BFL might deliver, but Avalon and ASICMiner will almost certainly deliver.

So you go to a club .. you pay your entrance fee - there is no club, no music, no bar, no dancers, no dance floor, no DJ, no bathrooms, no roof. The owners say, there will be a club, just come back in two weeks. You come back in two weeks, but there is still no club. The owners say, there will be a club, just come back in two weeks. You come back in two weeks, but there is still no club. The owners say, there will be a club, just come back in two weeks. You come back in two weeks, but there is still no club. The owners say, there will be a club, just come back in two weeks. You come back in two weeks, but there is still no club. The owners say, there will be a club, just come back in two weeks. You come back in two weeks, but there is still no club. The owners say, there will be a club, just come back in two weeks. You come back in two weeks, but there is still no club. The owners say, there will be a club, just come back in two weeks. You come back in two weeks, but there is still no club. The owners say, there will be a club, just come back in two weeks. You come back in two weeks, but there is still no club. The owners say, there will be a club, just come back in two weeks. You come back in two weeks, but there is still no club. The owners say, there will be a club, just come back in two weeks. You come back in two weeks, but there is still no club. The owners say, there will be a club, just come back in two weeks. You come back in two weeks, but there is still no club. The owners say, there will be a club, just come back in two weeks. You come back in two weeks, but there is still no club. The owners say, there will be a club, just come back in two weeks. You come back in two weeks, but there is still no club. The owners say, there will be a club, just come back in two weeks. You come back in two weeks, but there is still no club. The owners say, there will be a club, just come back in two weeks. You come back in two weeks, but there is still no club. The owners say, there will be a club, just come back in two weeks. You come back in two weeks, but there is still no club. Then you behave like a dick. You don't get thrown out, there is nothing to throw you out of. NO REFUND. This is the proprietors fault.