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2081  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN] FACTOM - Introducing Honesty to Record-Keeping on: August 03, 2016, 02:03:55 PM


 
And a few minutes ago I've started the new video with Tiana Laurence:

IDC Q2 2016 S4 Disruptive Infrastructure Solutions
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w_gPYSaZAfE&feature=youtu.be&t=15m45s


After seeing the first minutes I believe it's damn cheap right now. I'm not sure how to interpret something she says there. That's why I won't make guesses here right now. But there is something that is interesting.


She says theres 27 people working there. LoL the price right now is a joke.  She is also very well spoken an excellent member of the team herself.

Yes, but there is something that is more interesting. I just really don't know how exactly it's meant and how to interpret it. At about 18.30 she speaks about Bitcoin first, 7 transactions per second and scaling problem. Than she speaks about Factom and says:

"But we have customers that come to us and say 'hey, we got a trillion transactions a day that we want to secure (...)'"



Question is if she just speaks more theoretically about what is theoretically possible or if they really talk to (potential) customers who have to think in that numbers. I don't know enough about all those things. I mean, Visa handles about 180 Mio transactions a day and there are services whit numbers in the billions. But what could be about a trillion?

Next question is if transactions in that example would be the same as entries.

But, if she doesn't make a mistake there and if it's about a real scenario and not just a theoretical example:
She also uses the word "customers" - Plural.

I really don't know how to interpret it, but in best case they talk to (potential?) customers, more than just one, who think in trillions. Again, I doubt that it means entries. That would be very high costs if the price for entry credits wouldn't be reduced - which is possible. But with more than just one "big-data-customer" it's most likely more than just possible that it could be about billions of entries for Factom - per day.

And what I sometimes used as kind of best-case-example is the dropbox-upload-number. Dropbox has about 1 bn uploads each day. Maybe even more now because that number is old. And it's just one cloud-service and uploads are slow. So, it might be possible. I really don't know.

But what I'm sure about since I began to understand what this is about: Factom won't be about something in the middle with 20 customers who have to handle just 10k entries each. I believe that Factom, if high quality and successful, will be about very large numbers and it can be used for everything, all kinds of data. And there is no lack of important and time dependent data in this world. 

For the Factoid-price there are "just" two important questions:

1. Quality of the system
2. Demand

But even if we can't know about how much demand it will be in future, I believe it's realistic to say: If point 1 will be positive, point 2 will be high.

Thing is: Factom won't give much if any informations about that until there is something safe to say. Every word would be hype. So we have to wait. But it won't be boring.

2082  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN] FACTOM - Introducing Honesty to Record-Keeping on: August 02, 2016, 11:27:39 PM

In best case Factom can grow and grow for years. If that should happen nobody will know when to sell.


Yeah, aside from saying FCT is underpriced atm, I think it's hard to tell what would be a more accurate market cap, actually. At what point would FCT be overbought? I have my sell orders beginning at several multiples the current price, but have been going through an inner debate, trying to think honestly about FCT's long-term potential, and even those sell orders might be too low. Hmm. I guess this is to say that I don't think FCT "price discovery" has happened in a meaningful way yet. Curious to see what happens when people ultimately catch on.

I realize this may seem overly optimistic to some, but my own estimate about a more reasonable, post-discovery market cap is in the 500m - 1b range. Curious what others think ...? 50m? 5b? What happens when everyone knows about FCT?

Until now and also for some time in the future, the price is just a result of that what I call a psychological market. It's betting on the future. Some bet for longterm, some for a week or just 24 hours. But with a longterm-focus it's possible to think in objective future scenarios from worst-case to very optimistic and to do that with different calculations about possible demand-scenarios.

But in any case the psychological market always will play a role. And for the past since launch and until now and also the next time, it's only about that. So it's always about the reactions of Investors/Speculators/Traders etc. Some of them, the minority, is longterm-focused. The minority already has made enough research to understand Factom. A minority understands that a lack of short-term-signals is not a bad sign if it's seen in the context of all the good signs we get for longterm. But to see that it also needs research, and to follow Factom.

Compared with other projects Factom did not get much attention etc. And exactly that is also seen as bad sign while it is in fact potential - room to grow if, again: focus on the context. Safe to say is: It won't be boring. We constantly got good news in the past. That also had an increasing dynamic and I believe it will continue to increase. But because there is not that much attention, the price doesn't react like a rocket how it would be in some other projects. Imagine Ethereum and DHS or Ethereum and Smart Cities. That would be like an explosion (subtract the DAO mess and the HF for now Cheesy )

Will the increasing tendency stop? Just if Factom should fall into sleep - and that won't happen. It's much more likely that attention and identification will increase very sharp at some point - and the price would follow and hype.


The question than would be again: Is it overbought? In relation to demand at that time it's safe to say: yes. But for the future after M3 and when it gets traction? I don't believe that. The potential is extreme in my opinion.

 
And a few minutes ago I've started the new video with Tiana Laurence:

IDC Q2 2016 S4 Disruptive Infrastructure Solutions
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w_gPYSaZAfE&feature=youtu.be&t=15m45s


After seeing the first minutes I believe it's damn cheap right now. I'm not sure how to interpret something she says there. That's why I won't make guesses here right now. But there is something that is interesting.
2083  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN] FACTOM - Introducing Honesty to Record-Keeping on: August 02, 2016, 07:56:43 PM
Ancun usage still rising, from less than 1k to almost 50k+ in a few days; we could see a big uptick in usage from prior china MOUs into Q4


Oh wow! That's really great. It's a first sign for that what I believe will happen in big in future. Until now I believe that most if it is testing. But it seems that this could be more than that.

If Factom will work how planned - and I really have no rational doubt - we'll see an explosion of entries. And that will be an ongoing buy-signal like increasing prices. But contrary to prices Entries won't go back down. In best case Factom can grow and grow for years. If that should happen nobody will know when to sell.
2084  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN] FACTOM - Introducing Honesty to Record-Keeping on: August 02, 2016, 11:59:45 AM
Papermill doesn´t work for me. A windows pops up for a second and that´s it. I used the tutorial ( it only says "double click " so i don´t think i did a mistake by try )

EDIT:

Got it. You have to use the command line !

perfect! Smiley
2085  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN] FACTOM - Introducing Honesty to Record-Keeping on: August 02, 2016, 11:58:59 AM
Papermill doesn´t work for me. A windows pops up for a second and that´s it. I used the tutorial ( it only says "double click " so i don´t think i did a mistake by try )

I had the same problem, but this was a solution for me (from Brian Deery):

"yah, sorry about that. when you doubleclick on the program it opens a terminal window, generates a keypair then finishes and closes. We are very terminal oriented here at factom, doing development in linux, etc.
to use it, open a command prompt, navigate to where you saved the program, then run factoidpapermill.exe It will show the keys without exiting then."


https://www.reddit.com/r/factom/comments/49zf1x/setting_up_factom_wallet_without_koinify/

You can just drag and drop factoidpapermill.exe into the command-line. At least that works for me.
2086  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN] FACTOM - Introducing Honesty to Record-Keeping on: August 02, 2016, 10:36:26 AM
I'm not a big fan of technical-chart-analysis but this is at least a better one:


$FCT/BTC Technical Analysis "in the middle of difficulty lies opportunity"
https://steemit.com/factom/@ozchartart/usdfct-btc-technical-analysis-in-the-middle-of-difficulty-lies-opportunity
2087  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN] FACTOM - Introducing Honesty to Record-Keeping on: August 02, 2016, 10:35:18 AM
Thank you very much.

No problem! Smiley

2088  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: How Ethereum Classic will exceed Ethereum in market cap. on: August 02, 2016, 12:28:01 AM
You are too optimistic. It could happen but the ETH foundation will not give up without a fight. I am sure they will try to destroy ETC and prevent the original coin from taking over. Remember they have lots of ETC too.

The ETH foundation stated that they would do what ever the community wanted. If over the next few weeks it's demonstrated that ETC is the most popular chain why wouldn't they support it? They have equal amounts of ETH/ETC (not including DAO refund), on one chain they had their DAO ETH returned to them, they continue the facade of a neutral stance on the fork and maintain the principle/purposes of using a blockchain (instead of a centralized server). It sounds like a satisfactory solution for them.

Let's think about it: They bail out themselves with a hard-fork. Than the other chain, ETC, wins. And they announce they will support it and leave ETH? Or do they say they support both? And do they sell their holdings before the announcement or after?

The last question is the most important one. Their holdings on ETH will become worthless over time if they support ETC. No doubt about that.

If you think about it, it's a pretty unsolvable problem. If they should cash out to support ETC they are done and most likely that would not end well regarding legal consequences. If they announce it without cashing out - they will lose more than they've bailed out.

I see no way here. And besides that: The loss of credibility is already hard but would be tremendous.

What would be the legal consequences? To my knowledge there is no binding contract that state ETH developers should develop on ETH for life. Or are you saying that there will be no legal consequences for the developers for as long as ETH is increasing in price? That's not how law works although market crashes usually brings one thing or the other to light.   

Just theDAO could be a case for the SEC. That's not my opinion it's said here:

"However, based upon the structure of The DAO, it is foreseeable that the US Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC) would view its tokens purchased by investors as a security or investment contract, subject to its jurisdiction.

The voting system implemented for The DAO is likewise problematic due to its mixed incentives and propensity to depress the value of ETH and its own tokens. Because investment in The DAO is laden with risk and seems to implicate SEC jurisdiction, The DAO may attract regulatory attention.

(...)

The sale of DAO tokens by The DAO in exchange for ETH carries all of the hallmarks of an investment contract or security, and under this analysis, the SEC could assume jurisdiction over The DAO. The DAO presents novel legal issues, both with respect to its ability to interact with the legal system, and as to the potential regulatory ramifications of investing in a new novel structure."

http://www.coindesk.com/the-law-of-the-dao/

We have add to this that a lot of the funds came from Ethereum-members.

And if we think about a scenario that there was...

1. TheDAO
2. A hack (and some believe it could have been an insider)
3. A hard fork to bail-out

...it's already interesting.

If then those who bailed themselves out dump their ETH, including premine, to join ETC - not sure how that would look. I'm not a lawyer, but this game already created some collateral damage (Investors and most likely also exchanges). To dump on their Investors to leave ETH and join ETC would lead into a lot of lawsuits. But that won't happen because they won't quiet ETH to get over to ETC.
 



Quote
And well if ETC becomes larger by useful metrics it's not 'unsolvable' at all. I think Vitalik would step down in that case or continue on ETH but for the rest I am not sure if ETC community would allow a "ETC Foundation" despite all the opportunists that have come about these last couple days of ETC.
The loss of credibility I agree with you on but it could be a non issue given that I doubt many ETH developers and contributors would be well received by ETC community since they lost credibility by HF. If it's above ETH new contributors will be found and new structures will be set. Seems likely it could become similar to Bitcoins development process. Some attack that process but evidently it is better than ETH approach.

Yes, we agree here. It's possible but not very likely that ETH-Dev's go to ETC. Maybe one or two but not sure. Not VB or the foundation.

And under the line, I believe that both have not that much chance in longterm. For the next weeks or months it will be a race between both and it will be about hashrate and the markets. But if we speak about business, customers - I don't believe that Ethereum will be used widely.
2089  Local / Trading und Spekulation / Re: Der Aktuelle Kursverlauf on: August 01, 2016, 11:36:33 PM
http://www.n-tv.de/wirtschaft/Grossbanken-bewaehren-sich-in-Stresstest-article18305261.html

Fassen wir zusammen, wir machen einen Test damit wir allen zeigen können das es läuft bei den Banken. Natürlich damit es stabil ausschaut, lassen wir die NNN-Zinsen außen vor, definieren keine Durchfallgrenzen und sagen statt Pleite lieber negative Eigenkapitalquote   Cool perfekt es geht, alle haben bestanden, wir sind toll!  Grin

NNN-Zinsen bedeutet Niedrig-Null-Negativ-Zinsen (kam grad auf die Idee)  Wink

Es ist und bleibt eine Religion, das mit dem Geld, man muss fest dran glauben ohne wenn und aber, sonst geht es nicht.

Denkst Du, die Bitcoin-Börsen sähen bei einer Überprüfung besser aus? Ich persönlich glaube das schon lange nicht mehr. Aber davon mal abgesehen: Sollte es tatsächlich zu einem Zusammenbruch des weltweiten Finanzsystems kommen, dann rauscht auch der Coin ungebremst in den Keller. Bitcoin ist nur ein Parasit. Ein Parasit kann nicht ohne seinen Wirt überleben. Unternehmen wie Pantera Capital erwischt es bei einem Crash ganz sicher nicht als Letzte. Dazu sind diese Unternehmen viel zu stark vernetzt. Von den Chinabörsen reden wir lieber erst gar nicht. Wenn die Titanic sinkt, geht auch das Orchester mit unter. Das ist mal klar. Zumindest mir ist das inzwischen klar.

Das halte ich für einen Irrtum. Bevor es zu harten Problemen im Finanzsystem kommt flieht Geld in andere Werte. Genau das sehen wir schon, denn die hohen Aktienkurse z.B. sind im Grunde Inflation die den Real-Markt nicht erreicht. Wir sehen das auch an Immobilien-Preisen und auch der Goldpreis steigt seit Anfang des Jahres etc. Im Grunde kann man überall Vorboten erkennen.

Und Bitcoin - ich würde nicht behaupten dass der Kursanstieg auch eine Reaktion ist, aber ganz sicher würde einiges an Geld in Bitcoin gehen wenn es wirklich eng wird. Es ist unlogisch anzunehmen, dass Bitcoin als Counterpart zum Finanzsystem, nicht im Wert zulegen würde wie es eben auch andere Werte tun. Denn Bitcoin ist kein Parasit. Wie Gold hat Bitcoin das Potential als Wertspeicher zu fungieren und dazu noch einen Vorteil: Bitcoin ist viel praktischer und deutlich sicherer.


Natürlich würden Staaten das nicht gerne sehen und möglicherweise irgendetwas tun um das zu verhindern. Aber im Vergleich zu allem wohin Geld flieht ist Bitcoin nur eine Fliege um die sie sich daher noch nicht wirklich kümmern - und gleichzeitig ist Bitcoin kaum kleinzukriegen wenn die verschiedenen Staaten nicht zusammen arbeiten, von China über Europa bis in die USA.
 
2090  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: August 01, 2016, 11:23:01 PM
Is there any reason besides the more or less normal market for the price decline?

Could it be that the rumors about Coinbase have some impact on the price?

For those who don't know what I mean:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/4ura14/is_coinbase_insolvent/

And this is highly biased, but gives a good overview about potential problems (I'm not saying that are facts):

https://bitflikz.com/blogs/news/critical-security-update-from-bitflikz-gdax-coinbase-may-be-insolvent




Edit, because actual: https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/4vouto/coinbase_blocked_my_withdrawl_even_after_i/?


Edit 2, statement after the ETH-HF: https://medium.com/the-coinbase-blog/on-the-ethereum-hard-fork-780f1577e986#.t5cmkg6la


My own conclusion for now is that it's possible that they've "lost" funds but I it would be too early for the bitcoin-market to react on those rumors. And for now I don't believe lost ETC-funds would lead into an insolvency.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/4vl5gd/coinbase_has_all_funds_to_cover_user_deposits/


But, not sure - I would like to hear other opinions.
2091  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: August 01, 2016, 10:49:00 PM
Is there any reason besides the more or less normal market for the price decline?

Could it be that the rumors about Coinbase have some impact on the price?

For those who don't know what I mean:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/4ura14/is_coinbase_insolvent/

And this is highly biased, but gives a good overview about potential problems (I'm not saying that are facts):

https://bitflikz.com/blogs/news/critical-security-update-from-bitflikz-gdax-coinbase-may-be-insolvent




Edit, because actual: https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/4vouto/coinbase_blocked_my_withdrawl_even_after_i/?


Edit 2, statement after the ETH-HF: https://medium.com/the-coinbase-blog/on-the-ethereum-hard-fork-780f1577e986#.t5cmkg6la
2092  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN] Ethereum: Welcome to the Beginning on: August 01, 2016, 07:11:14 PM
That's a really interesting subject and it seems it will bring new trouble for ETH and ETC.

I don't know how to solve it if Casper won't be finished and I highly doubt that it will be finished until the difficulty goes up exponential.

I mean, since the DAO-Mess they've lost at least one month.

So, what will they do? Another Hard fork to remove the time-bomb? It's something that ETC also would have to do.

Are there any other solutions if Casper shouldn't be ready?


Edit: Why didn't they remove the time-bomb with the HF? That would have prevented ETC! ETC with time-bomb and ETH without it - the future would be clear.

Removing the diff bomb (which was a stupid idea to begin with but I digress) would be far less contentious than a bail out. I'm sure both ETH and ETC can smoothly fork through that one and any splinter forks would simply die in the bomb blast.

Yes, right.

But, I believe to see a missed chance here.

Imagine it this way:

TheDAO is hacked --> a lot of trouble how it was.

The foundation needs some days to find a solution and they announce:

We need a hard fork anyway, because Casper won't be finished until the difficulty will increase sharp. So, why not do both. The Community won't vote if HF or not, because everybody understands that it needs one. But they'll vote if bail-out or not. But of course, they say yes. And the reason looks also much more technical than just like "bailing out buddies".

Than the HF:

- removing Time bomb (or delaying it)
- preventing replay attacks
- DAO-bail out.

The situation would be different now. Most likely ppl wouldn't see the HF differently and most likely nobody would touch ETC, because it would be really different - it would include the time-bomb. And without the replay attacks it's even more unlikely that exchanges would be forced to open markets for it.

Or do I miss something? Because if not - I believe that nobody would care about ETC and there wouldn't be an ideology-battle. 
2093  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN] Ethereum: Welcome to the Beginning on: August 01, 2016, 06:46:34 PM
I really don't have time to follow all this fork saga, so let me better ask. What is a general consensus of the ETH devs? Will they support and take care of the ETC chain as well or this is out of question and ETC chain will have to find new devs?

The things developed by the Ethereum Foundation will be applicable to both the ETH and the ETC.

That's how open source works. Now students please get out your crypto 101 book and turn to page 420

So what is a point of paying then 10x more for ETH when we can buy 10x cheaper ETC and still have all of the features and a working product. I don't get it...
It was x10. Now is x6. And parity is not far away because more people see there is no point.

because it was a trap with a timebomb   https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1487014.0

That's a really interesting subject and it seems it will bring new trouble for ETH and ETC.

I don't know how to solve it if Casper won't be finished and I highly doubt that it will be finished until the difficulty goes up exponential.

I mean, since the DAO-Mess they've lost at least one month.

So, what will they do? Another Hard fork to remove the time-bomb? It's something that ETC also would have to do.

Are there any other solutions if Casper shouldn't be ready?


Edit: Why didn't they remove the time-bomb with the HF? That would have prevented ETC! ETC with time-bomb and ETH without it - the future would be clear.
2094  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: How Ethereum Classic will exceed Ethereum in market cap. on: August 01, 2016, 06:02:13 PM
You are too optimistic. It could happen but the ETH foundation will not give up without a fight. I am sure they will try to destroy ETC and prevent the original coin from taking over. Remember they have lots of ETC too.

The ETH foundation stated that they would do what ever the community wanted. If over the next few weeks it's demonstrated that ETC is the most popular chain why wouldn't they support it? They have equal amounts of ETH/ETC (not including DAO refund), on one chain they had their DAO ETH returned to them, they continue the facade of a neutral stance on the fork and maintain the principle/purposes of using a blockchain (instead of a centralized server). It sounds like a satisfactory solution for them.

Let's think about it: They bail out themselves with a hard-fork. Than the other chain, ETC, wins. And they announce they will support it and leave ETH? Or do they say they support both? And do they sell their holdings before the announcement or after?

The last question is the most important one. Their holdings on ETH will become worthless over time if they support ETC. No doubt about that.

If you think about it, it's a pretty unsolvable problem. If they should cash out to support ETC they are done and most likely that would not end well regarding legal consequences. If they announce it without cashing out - they will lose more than they've bailed out.

I see no way here. And besides that: The loss of credibility is already hard but would be tremendous.
2095  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN] [ETC] Ethereum Classic: Immutable Smart Contracts on: August 01, 2016, 05:48:26 PM
Cease and Desist


To Bitpop and all other creators/retainers of Ethereum Classic.


You may not be aware of this, but "Ethereum" is a registered trademark, your reckless use of the Ethereum brand has caused substantial losses to our shareholders (in the millions of dollars), in which you can be held responsible.

This is a 0-day notice to immediately change, or remove, in every place possible, your description of Ethereum Classic that does not have any name or mark confusingly similar.

We are choosing not to reveal our identity and give you an opportunity to comply. You are hereby notified that if you do not comply with this request, we will immediately file a complaint with the Federal Trade Commission and the Attorney General's office in your state. Civil and criminal claims will be pursued.



Really folks, I was so bored because there is not one good show I don't already know (should say that I'm german) in the TV the last time. But since the DAO it's about drained out Mothers and their children and about the fight between black- and whitehats, about splitting vitaliks baby into twins and one will die and the other will suffer just longer.

And the newest episode is called "cease and desist". Really love it!

Several episodes per day and a whole season in two days - how it should be!

I would pay for it if needed!  Cheesy


P.S.: The last Crypto-show I really enjoyed was "Craig Wright is Satoshi!".

But it was too short. Tthat's why I like the Game of clones more.
2096  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN] [ETC] Ethereum Classic: Immutable Smart Contracts on: August 01, 2016, 03:51:02 PM
I still feel some ETC regret. I was watching the price a week ago when it was ~$0.50. I figured I enjoy mining more than trading so I would just rent some hashpower instead of buying 3-5 BTC worth outright. Woke up in the morning and it was over $2. Mistakes were made...

Same here. But it was and still is a gamble. I mean, it was not predictable if not large ETH-whales would dump their ETC's to damage the market. Or if ETH-pools wouldn't attack the chain with hash-power. And that's the plan - if it's still planned and it looks like that. There were and still are a lot of risks.

So yes - a missed opportunity, but I won't touch ETH or ETC any time soon, most likely never.
2097  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN] [ETC] Ethereum Classic: Immutable Smart Contracts on: August 01, 2016, 09:15:32 AM
question:

like i ask pumpy and like i understand it( and i am not a superbrain like vitalik) if there is a fork and the outcome is 2 chains that is not a success ? right ?
thats a failed hardfork? and blockchain techniques are clear if you use both you are suporting both coins. the only way to have a chain die is to not touch that coin. as a holder you have to choose ? and not get tempted by the extra money ? right ? so far ?
well i read in that skype leak that devs. didnt expect extra coins saw them got happy and sold them . right ?
a bit greedy but also not smart ? if sold they creat a market for the enemy ? right ?
i thought ethereum developers and foundation are soooooo samrt guys . super brains that know how to design the future?
they keep telling between teh lines that we depend on them there smartnes . but it feels like the emprers new clothes .

so now my question:
if eth loses and etc is the new dominant chain. can vitalik and the core devs ( up there discribed ) demand to be the etereum clsissis foundation ?

Many questions. For Ethereum and the foundation it's of course not a success that ETC is not dead but on it's way to get some respect and solidarity. But I wouldn't say in general that it's bad if a hard fork results in competition.

And I don't believe that the foundation-guys already sold their ETC's. It's possible that there is still some risk of a crash if they do it. But it's also possible that it would result in legal problems, because Ethereum started with a CFC and premine. To cash out on one chain, to make money and to damage the ETC-market - I don't know if that would be accepted.

ETC is stronger than expected because there is a market at least since Poloniex decided to add it. And ppl and miners saw it as opportunity. It's a wild mix of capitalism, idealism and crypto-war. I also believe that ETC is used by those who would like to see ETH in a bad position. With other words: Most likely not everybody who supports ETC believes in Ethereum in general. In my opinion we will find out in 1-3 years that both are without chance.

If ETH should lose this fight Vitalik and most of his guys will most likely be out of the Ethereum-game. It could be seen as take-over but it also could be seen as if the team has abandoned it's own project. The majority believes Ethereum is Ethereum because of VB and the original team. But that might turn out as misconception.

One interesting question is: What to do with the funding and the premine if Vitaliks Ethereum should lose.

Btw: That's also a reason why they won't give up. They will most likely keep on with ETH even if ETC should overtake an be superior in all important parts, including hashrate.
oh i geuss the legal problems havenent even started . i am old and my experiance over the years tis that law and order are slow to get going.
what do you mean by that ?
In my opinion we will find out in 1-3 years that both are without chance.




What I mean is: If we look at Cryptocurrencies and Blockchain-projects in general, we just see the first steps. If we focus on the really innovative projects and forget all the scams and shit, it's still unsure which one will find it's way into real use and real business. My Nr. 1 is Factom, because it's the only project I know of, that already has deals and companies and institutions and even governments already seem to be very interested. But it's use case is about data. It's an ambitious project but in comparison to smart contracts it's kind of simple.

Ethereum gets a lot of attention and smart contracts will most likely be part of our future life. But it's very early. And if we think in years, I don't believe that Ethereum has chances. There will be much more competition on that field. And Ethereum has a lot of weaknesses. The DAO-Hack wasn't just a result of a buggy smart contract. Or, more precise: That the DAO turned out to be buggy is a result of Ethereums design itself. Some Coders say Solidity is deeply flawed and some go even beyond that.

And even if there wouldn't be a problem: The eco-system is very risky in my opinion. They want to switch to PoS and I have some doubts that it's possible to be on the safe side with that over years. PoS means that the rich become richer and poor poorer. It's a one-way-ticket into a centralization. But maybe I'm wrong with that because it needs a lot of time to get into problems.

But: While Factom for example found a way to have a system-currency that is a crypto-currency, it also found a way for potential customers to use the system without touching a Cryptocurrency - Entry Credits for access.

That is important because banks and other companies don't like volatile Cryptocurrencies including all the regulatory issues. And the price to use the system is not dependent on the price of Factoids. FCT's are just to pay the servers to keep the system decentralized and are converted into Entry Credits for it's customers/users.

In Ethereum it's all about Ether. The costs to use Ethereum are dependent on the market. That's not optimal.

Plus: How to trust it after the HF? Will companies just don't care about the HF or maybe say: Naah... little risky to trust a Blockchain that goes through a hard fork to bail out an application if needed?


Under the line I believe to see problems on all important fields:

1. Code
2. Eco-system
3. Trust

And that in mind - plus: more competition. I believe it's very unlikely that ETH or ETC will be on top in years. I'm very unsure about the next months to be honest. Of course they will keep on with Ethereum. It's also possible that the price will see new ATH's in future. But I've never understood why it's so expensive. I believe it's more a hype without the base ppl believe to see in it.
2098  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN] FACTOM - Introducing Honesty to Record-Keeping on: August 01, 2016, 08:48:54 AM
been watching from the sidelines and now I have decided to get in.

Any good youtube videos?

Thanks

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=50gGy59cGq4&feature=youtu.be
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pcEZNeypL7M&feature=youtu.be

check out their youtube channel which those videos are posted on Smiley

I would add this to start with Factom:


Paul Snow explains Factom
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wPQMosvjz88

It's from early 2015 but a good one to start with to understand Factom and the vision behind.



How Factom is Bringing Digital Currencies To Business & Governments With Paul Snow
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1noFK6M8ktU

One of the best interviews in my opinion.






2099  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN] FACTOM - Introducing Honesty to Record-Keeping on: August 01, 2016, 08:42:06 AM
Some questions:

- Where can i find my private key and or wallet.dat?
- How can i decrypt my wallet?

I'm not sure honestly how to backup the wallet. Never did it because I just use it to import a private key and make a transaction. I don't store Factoids with it. For now it's not possible to decrypt it.

But it's possible to be on the safe side with the combination of the Wallet and the papermill.

What I do is:

1. Generating addresses on an offline computer--> papermill
2. I send FCT's I want to store in longterm (from the wallet or an exchange) to those addresses
3. Wallet for importing private keys if needed

But they've said that there will be a improved wallet in future. Not sure if after M2 or M3.


https://www.factom.com/howto/
2100  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN] [ETC] Ethereum Classic: Immutable Smart Contracts on: August 01, 2016, 08:34:59 AM
question:

like i ask pumpy and like i understand it( and i am not a superbrain like vitalik) if there is a fork and the outcome is 2 chains that is not a success ? right ?
thats a failed hardfork? and blockchain techniques are clear if you use both you are suporting both coins. the only way to have a chain die is to not touch that coin. as a holder you have to choose ? and not get tempted by the extra money ? right ? so far ?
well i read in that skype leak that devs. didnt expect extra coins saw them got happy and sold them . right ?
a bit greedy but also not smart ? if sold they creat a market for the enemy ? right ?
i thought ethereum developers and foundation are soooooo samrt guys . super brains that know how to design the future?
they keep telling between teh lines that we depend on them there smartnes . but it feels like the emprers new clothes .

so now my question:
if eth loses and etc is the new dominant chain. can vitalik and the core devs ( up there discribed ) demand to be the etereum clsissis foundation ?

Many questions. For Ethereum and the foundation it's of course not a success that ETC is not dead but on it's way to get some respect and solidarity. But I wouldn't say in general that it's bad if a hard fork results in competition.

And I don't believe that the foundation-guys already sold their ETC's. It's possible that there is still some risk of a crash if they do it. But it's also possible that it would result in legal problems, because Ethereum started with a CFC and premine. To cash out on one chain, to make money and to damage the ETC-market - I don't know if that would be accepted.

ETC is stronger than expected because there is a market at least since Poloniex decided to add it. And ppl and miners saw it as opportunity. It's a wild mix of capitalism, idealism and crypto-war. I also believe that ETC is used by those who would like to see ETH in a bad position. With other words: Most likely not everybody who supports ETC believes in Ethereum in general. In my opinion we will find out in 1-3 years that both are without chance.

If ETH should lose this fight Vitalik and most of his guys will most likely be out of the Ethereum-game. It could be seen as take-over but it also could be seen as if the team has abandoned it's own project. The majority believes Ethereum is Ethereum because of VB and the original team. But that might turn out as misconception.

One interesting question is: What to do with the funding and the premine if Vitaliks Ethereum should lose.

Btw: That's also a reason why they won't give up. They will most likely keep on with ETH even if ETC should overtake an be superior in all important parts, including hashrate.
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