I see that this voluminous and categorically important topic has been raised again.
After all, the argument about the denazification of Ukraine is one of the main factors in the support of the Russian population, which increased even more after the publication of videos showing Ukrainian soldiers installing military equipment in residential areas, and Russian war prisoners being tortured.
This support for Putin was confirmed even by the Russian opposition.



Against the backdrop of current events, the rhetoric of some experts has intensified that Hitler's Nazism is only about anti-Semitism, and that the presence of Vladimir Zelensky, who is a Jew, in the presidential post in Ukraine, shatters Putin's argument about denazification.
However, if we turn to the origins, then according to the book of Adolf Hitler, his goals concerned not only the Jews. Hitler was going to take over the living space in the East and considered the Slavic peoples to be an inferior race. During the Second World War, millions of Soviet citizens were exterminated in the death camps, mostly Russians, Ukrainians and Belarusians. Consequently, Hitler's Nazism manifested itself not only in relation to the Jews, but also to the Slavs. Moreover, the authors of modern Ukrainian textbooks call Ukrainians one of the oldest agricultural civilizations and allegedly are "Slavicized Germans". At the same time, the Russians are supposedly not Slavs, and are of Finno-Ugric origin.
By the way, residents of Ukraine in social networks and on forums often call Russia - "Mordor", and Russians - "orcs". Judging by this logic, Ukrainians apparently consider themselves like elves or what?

Now we need to answer the question, was Putin's statement alone enough for Russian citizens to believe about the struggle of the Russian army against Nazism in Ukraine? Did ordinary Russian people have reason to believe that the modern Kyiv regime condones the spread of Nazi ideology, or, to be more precise, its offshoot in the form of Russophobia? Undoubtedly, there were such facts, and this was actively promoted by the ruling Ukrainian elite, which, in a decade and a half, was able to kindle the fire of Russophobia, unprecedented since the time of the Ukrainian Insurgent Army (1942-1956).

1. In 2017, NBC News released a video about Ukrainian children's military camps, where kids were taught military training and Russophobic chants like "Death to the Muscovites!" and "Beat the Muscovites! Pile up the dead!"
2. There were other Russophobic chants from schoolchildren and young men, such as "Muscovite on a branch!" and "Muscovites on the knives!"
3. The torchlight processions in honor of the Nazi Stepan Bandera.
4. The names of the streets in honor of the SS division Galicia.
5. The neo-Nazi Azov battalion in the National Guard of Ukraine.
6. The positive attitude of President Zelensky and a large number of Ukrainians towards Stepan Bandera.
7. After 2014, the use of the Russian language In Ukraine was methodically limited at the legislative level. In May 2022, people who spoke Russian began to be beaten on the streets in Western Ukraine.

Before 2022, various Russophobic actions were widespread in Ukraine, under the guise of allegedly "trolling in the direction of the Kremlin propaganda".
Examples of such frenzied Russophobia in Ukraine, which they call "jokes". Links are given only to Ukrainian sources.
- Compote "Blood of Russian babies"
- Cake in the form of a baby, lying on the Russian tricolor
- "Colorado beetles in Odessa style, baked" (note: in 2014, 42 people who protested against the Maidan were burned alive in Odessa)
- "Separ in sour cream in the sauce of Russian-speaking babies" (the date on the banks 06.10.1942 apparently refers to an agreement on supplies from the USA to the USSR during World War II).
- "The last shelter of a separatist with the aroma of the Donetsk morgue". This is about predominantly Russian-speaking Donetsk, whose citizens the Kiev government has been bombing since 2014 and is still bombing. Ukraine from April 2014 to February 2022 is conducting a so-called anti-terrorist operation against residents of eastern Ukraine who protested against the illegal overthrow of the president and wanted to receive a special legal status within the country.



To those who say that this is just trolling and never Nazism - if you replaced the word "Russian" with "Jewish" or "African" in the name of these products, then the world society would instantly harshly criticize such "jokers". This is the most natural Nazism, no matter what words they try to cover it up with. And the fact that in Ukraine no one has been sued for this shows proving that these actions were encouraged at the highest levels. In fact, this is not trolling at all, but years of incited hatred broadcast in Ukraine against Russian-speaking people. It looks like a well-planned action to pit two neighboring peoples on ethnic and linguistic grounds. The purpose of these events is to introduce into the minds of Ukrainians literally a *cannibalistic rhetoric* that Russian and pro-Russian minded people are subhuman, whose deaths mean nothing. The consequences of such a policy can be seen in the way Ukrainian nationalists torturing Russian war prisoners and terrorized civilians in the eastern regions of Ukraine.

If someone sincerely believes that the incitement of an ethnic conflict in Ukraine against Russia is natural and only Russia is to blame for this, then these people most likely forgot that during the Cold War, the US Central Intelligence Agency didn't hesitate to cooperate with Ukrainian Nazis for subversive activities against the USSR. In 2014-2021, the Western media saw Ukrainian nationalists as a serious threat (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6), but then this topic has been carefully muffled and it was called as Kremlin propaganda. And it looks very much like the current US government is following a 70-year-old pattern, taking advantage of nationalist groups in Ukraine.

- Cold War Allies: The origin of CIA's Relationship with Ukrainian Nationalists
- Background: The West collaborated with the Nazis to carry out the coup in Ukraine in 2014
- CIA‘s Use of Nazi Strategy on Ukrainian Right-Wing Nationalists Unabated since Cold War

Who started the war? Russians, without a question. Why? Because Ukraine wants to join NATO and you are afraid of NATO, is this right or do you really believe in the military operation motives that Putin said days before the war?

You have to seriously ask yourself some questions. Why is it always Russia that has problems with bordered countries? Georgia - 2008, Crimea - 2014, Ukraine - 2022.
Why do Polish dislike Russians more than Germans? I know three languages, German, English and Russian. I had no problem in Poland when I was asking someone a question in German and English but when they were hearing Russian (I have a great Russian accent, I have lived in Moscow too), sometimes they were ignoring me or weren't bothering.
Do you know why? Because Germany changed and Russia didn't. Germans don't worship Hitler but Russians worship Stalin. Germans dislike what Hitler did but Russians like what Stalin did and some people even pray for him. Russia hasn't changed a single, it still has imperialistic goals.

Ask yourself, why post-soviet 1. Joined 2. Are joining and 3. Want to join NATO but don't want to return back to the USSR?
Czech Republic, Hungary, Poland, Bulgaria, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Romania and Slovakia. Have you heard about these countries or do you know from your history that some of them were part of the Soviet Union and some of them were satellite nations of the Soviet Union?

You guys better ask yourself why Putin and other guys are rich, have multi-billion dollars, palaces and you have a low quality of life outside the Moscow and Saints Peterburg, dream to get higher education abroad.
Visit Norway and see how Norway spends its income on its citizens. Then ask yourself, why Putin doesn't do the same.

You have an unhealthy obsession with Hitler.

Here is what Ukrainians were up against besides Hitler:





Sounds eerily familiar these days.

Fun fact: Russia's glorious forever-president is a former officer of the KGB (the agency was known as NKVD at the time when the above atrocities were committed). But that's probably just a coincidence, nothing to do with him being a genocidal psychopath like the decades-worth of other NKVD/KGB agents.


Gotta love Putin's copypasta boys accusing others of "propaganda".

Here,how about this one? More nazi collaborators listed for "hero" status. If you proudly and shamelessly embrace their legacy without any care about what they did to Jews and other ethnic minorities then that makes you a NAZI sympathiser by default. Are you a NAZI sympathiser light_warrior ? I myself am Jewish and want my tax money and donations spent to help peaceful refugees and provide medical assistance but not to aid and abet anyone who makes light of the fact these "heroes" slaughtered our people and many others. Also stop using the typical russian sympathiser slur against anyone who dares question your "heroes" war criminal past crimes as it only makes you look like a thug and we already know there are plenty of thugs on BOTH sides of this conflict. Thugs never apologise or show remorse for what they do or have done. Thugs have no place in a civilised world.

https://www.euronews.com/my-europe/2021/08/04/controversy-as-ukraine-mulls-giving-hero-status-to-alleged-war-criminals

Seventy-eight Ukrainian lawmakers from all sides of the parliament have proposed to give the title ‘Hero of Ukraine’ to controversial figures such as Stepan Bandera and Roman Shukhevych.
...
The proposal also asks the Ukrainian Parliament and the country’s president Volodymyr Zelenskyy to commemorate the Ukrainian Insurgent Army, UPA, operating from the 1940s and into the 1950s, on their 80th anniversary in October next year.
...
he is not arguing against the atrocities committed by members of the UPA towards Jews and Poles. However, he argues that Bandera should be remembered for his fight for independence.

“They are controversial; I agree with that,” Yurash says, “(But) they said that we don’t want to be a puppet or an instrument. We want to be an independent state. The story here should be remembered, but we should also not forget all the problems. However, their goal was very clear - an independent Ukraine. And it is worthy of giving stamps and coins for.”

Yurash says that it should be made clear that Bandera and the UPA aren’t receiving the honour due to the atrocities committed but for their role in the Ukrainian fight for independence.
...
“I do not disagree that we should remember, examine and acceptably apologise for horrible deeds done, but so did the other side.
...
“He is one of the people who defended Ukraine’s freedom,” Zelenskyy said in 2019.

“He is a hero for a certain percentage of Ukrainians, and it’s normal, and it’s cool.”

“Ukrainian nationalist groups including the Azo[v] Movement are actively recruiting racially or ethnically motivated violent extremist-white supremacists (RMVE-WS) to join various neo-Nazi volunteer battalions in the war against Russia,” the report said.

In a recent Washington Post interview, the head of the battalion, Andriy Biletskiy, said the group “completely” rejects Nazism. The Post noted that he has been quoted previously making white supremacist statements, and now denies having made those comments. The article quoted Bellingcat’s Michael Colborne, who has written a book on the battalion, saying that “there are clearly neo-Nazis” within the Azov movement’s ranks.

To those supporting the war, to those who have friends joining the army, to their families and relatives: Make an informed decision when you sign in:

https://youtu.be/5OQbIEKbZyc

The war is senseless, the leadership cares little for the foot soldier and Russia is not at risk. Joining the Russian army is not easy money nor a way of life, it is a way of death.

The US has been sending weapons to Taiwan for almost 50 years.

Some highlights from the past couple years:

40 155mm M109A6 Paladin Medium Self-Propelled Howitzer System and related equipment. ($750 million)

100 Harpoon Coastal Defense Systems (HCDS) consisting of up to four hundred 400 RGM-84L-4 Harpoon Block II Surface Launched Missiles; and four 4 RTM-84L-4 Harpoon Block II Exercise Missiles. Also included are four hundred and eleven 411 containers, 100 Harpoon Coastal Defense System Launcher Transporter Units, 25 radar trucks, spare and repair parts, support and test equipment. ($2.3 billion)

135 AGM-84H standoff land attack missile expanded response (SLAM-ER) missiles, 4 ATM-84H SLAM-ER telemetry missiles, and 12 CATM-84H captive air training missiles (CATM), including 151 containers, spare parts, support and test equipment, operator manuals, technical documentation, training. ($1 billion)

108 M1A2T main battle tanks, 14 M88 recovery vehicles, 16 M1070A1 transporters, 16 M1000 trailers, ammunition. ($2 billion)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_US_arms_sales_to_Taiwan

I can tell how much you're concerned about Taiwan by all the threads you've started on the topic, and even that is not enough since you need to derail this one.

Meanwhile in the real world, Russian nazis have outdone themselves again. Well, they did it a month ago, I just came across it now:

One can claim any stupid shit, but Russia invaded Ukraine in 2014, Ukraine did not invade Russia. Same in 2022. No amount of strawmanning/whataboutism can justify feeding parts of sovereign countries to the fascist Moscow regime just because Putin is stuck in his imperial delusions.

You forgot to mention China's nuclear weapons in Mexico, you're slipping.

Oh, sweety, those were instigated by FSB and the Russian military.

There was no problem in Ukraine until Russia started its terrorist operations.

Russia is a terrorist state.

You are lost and definitely on the wrong side of history.

The EU is probably keeping 500 euro notes as legal tender because they know it's going to cost that for a McDonald's meal in the future.

The Biden administration will ban Russia’s government from paying bondholders through American banks starting Wednesday morning, the Treasury Department said.
...
“OFAC can force Russia into default at any time. OFAC is still in the driving seat,” Ash said.

Welp, let's just throw another crisis onto the pile (Texas school shooting). During an election year no less.

Gee, what are the odds.  

Bandera was not near the massacres in Volhynia. You are attributing these atrocities to him instead of Mykola Lebed because you are a zombie who can only consume pro-Russian propaganda. Bandera was in the concentration camp when these atrocities were carried out.

I don't think you will find many Ukrainians today who would approve of the massacres of Poles during WWII. Of course, what happened was
deliberate, brutal ethnic cleansing. You will not find many Ukrainians today who are for the extermination of ethnic groups in Ukraine or elsewhere. That is just insane to suggest that the WWII massacres are somehow related to the invasion of Crimea and Donbas by Russia in 2014.

But on the other hand, Russian soldiers and Rosguardia have been given direct orders to annihilate the Ukrainian nation.

If you are truly against ethnic cleansing, you would be against Russians committing war crimes in Ukraine.  You would be against this war.

Instead, you are supporting a genocidal maniac who turned Russians into Z-ombies who think that bombing schools, hospitals, and civilian infrastructure somehow makes Russia great again and is just.  

All because Ukrainians consider Bandera their national hero?  That is just insane. But I repeat myself.

That wedge that Russians were always trying to stick between Poles and Ukrainians will not work. Polish people hosted millions of Ukrainians
fleeing Russian tanks in THEIR homes.

Here is the Polish president talking about the Polish-Ukrainian relations, current and past:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rpaz22R2WBw

Russians lost the social media war, lost the economic and political wars, and soon they will lose the military war.

President of Poland Andrzej Duda has decided to sign the law On Institute of National Memory that envisions introduction of criminal responsibility for propaganda of the Bandera Ideology and hand it over to the Constitutional Tribunal.

Google Translate
The ambassadors of Poland and Israel criticize Kyiv and Lviv for their historical policy
Diplomats explained that on December 24, the Lviv region council adopted a resolution on the allocation of public funds in 2020 to commemorate the Nazi collaborator Andriy Melnyk, as well as "xenophobic, anti-Semitic and anti-Polish writer" Ivan Lypa and his son Yuri Lypa, creator of the "racist Ukrainian theory" race ".

The ambassadors also pointed out that on January 1, a banner with the image of Stepan Bandera was displayed on the building of the state administration in Kiev.

"Bearing in mind our innocent brothers and sisters murdered in 1939–1945 in the occupied territories of Poland, which are now part of Ukraine, we, the Ambassadors of Poland and Israel, believe that glorifying those who actively promoted ethnic cleansing is an insult that is counterproductive in the fight against anti-Semitism and in the process of reconciling our nations, "reads the statement.

...

A bit of time travel. And then teleportation?


You know what they say about extraordinary claims.

Perhaps you should have settled on "controversial" instead of trying to prove Putin's fantasies with fake information and lots of fallacies.

For his refusal to rescind the decree, Bandera was arrested by the Gestapo and on 5 July 1941 held under house arrest.[6] After January 1942 Bandera was transferred to Sachsenhausen concentration camp but kept in special, comparatively comfortable detention.[7][8][9] In 1944, with Germany rapidly losing ground in the war in the face of the advancing Allied armies, Bandera was released in the hope that he would be instrumental in deterring the advancing Soviet forces.

You dipshit.  I am not Ukrainian. Read my post.
Bandera is a Ukrainian hero and always will be because he fought for the independence of Ukraine.

What Russia did to all of Eastern Europe/Caucasus/Siberia over the years is not forgivable. They are animals.

The current Z-ombification of Russia should be of concern to any sane human being.

The Z Russians today are ready to commit genocides without thinking twice about it.

All this de-Nazification nonsense is for idiots like you. It is to turn away your attention from the fact that Z Russians are NaZZZis.

Ukrainians are killing Russians because the Russians invaded their country.  

Russians are killing Ukrainians because they are Ukrainians.

BTW, can you list the mass killings of civilians committed by Ukrainians since 1991? Who is the Nazi now? LOL.

Bandera is a Ukrainian national hero who fought for Ukrainian independence. He was against the Soviet invasion of Ukraine, a staunch anti-
communist, nationalist but not a Nazi.  He collaborated with the Germans, but later was arrested by them and imprisoned in the concentration
camp.

He was assassinated by the Russians.

You support Russians who committed and are committing genocides and war crimes. Who executed people in Katyn?
Santa Claus? Who killed innocent people across Europe during Soviet times?

Russians did. So shut the fuck up about your support for these animals.

Stepan Bandera (1909-1959), head of the Organization of Ukrainian Nationalists that formed in 1929 as an amalgamation of movements including the Union of Ukrainian Fascists.[2][3] The union, known as OUN-B, had been engaged in various atrocities, including murder of civilians, most of whom were ethnic Poles.
...
These massacres resulted in the deaths of 80,000-100,000 Poles and 10,000-15,000 Ukrainians.
..
The OUN-B (Banderites) formed Ukrainian death squads that carried out pogroms and massacres both independently and with support from the Germans
...
To ensure maximum impact of the systematic ethnic cleansing campaign in the contested territory, OUN-B faction spread antisemitic, racist, and fascist propaganda among the ordinary peasants and other Ukrainians.
...
Bandera wrote a manifesto entitled "Ukrainian National Revolution" that called for the annihilation of so-called ethnic enemies.
...
included specific instructions about the killing of Jews, Poles, and Ukrainian opponents of fascism.
...
OUN leaflets...read: "Exterminate the Poles, Jews and communists without mercy. Do not pity the enemies of the Ukrainian National Revolution!
...
The first pogrom took the lives of at least 4,000 Jews... and the "Petlura Days" massacre of more than 2,000 Polish Jews by the Ukrainian militants.

Organization of Ukrainian Nationalists[1][2] (OUN), an organization responsible for ethnic cleansings also implicated in collaboration with Nazi Germany.
...
largely responsible for the massacres of Polish civilians[28] and partially for the Holocaust in Ukraine.
...
his organization, the Organization of Ukrainian Nationalists, was involved in a massacre of Poles in Volhynia and, in early 1944, ethnic cleansing also spread to Eastern Galicia. It is estimated that more than 35,000 and up to 60,000 Poles, mostly women and children along with unarmed men, were killed during the spring and summer campaign of 1943 in Volhynia, and up to 100,000 if other regions, such as Eastern Galicia, are included.[

So, not trying to make light of what Hitler did at all, but Stalin was in power much longer than Hitler, and between the Famines, Gulags, Korean War (turns out that was on him somehow), mass execution's, there are historians say he's responsible for over 40 million victims, including 20 million deaths.  (Victims including those that survived the Gulags, were driven from their homes, towns destroyed, etc)

He was willing to have anyone killed for pretty much any reason.


^^^Stalin gets credit for a lot of that

He deliberately starved 3-4 million Ukranians to death, sent a million that didn't die of starvation to work camps (where most died of starvation), and then hunted down hundreds of thousands that left Ukraine for other parts of the SU, as well as any of their relatives and executed them.

He ordered any troop that surrendered or captured to be considered a trader and sentenced to death if they ever returned.  And he followed through. When the British and Americans liberated German camps, the Russian prisoners begged them to let them stay.  No joke.  Every Soviet prisoner that was returned to the SU killed.  The Brits and Americans had to trick them to get on the trains, and were later investigated for war crimes for doing so.

There was the "Not One Step Backward" rule, the military was ordered to kill any soldier that retreated for any reason.  There were special Russian units that were positioned just behind the front line who's only job was to kill other Russian soldiers that looked like they might be thinking about retreating.  Almost 200,000 were killed this way.

As of 2019, in Russia Stalin hit a record approval rating of 51% in 2019.  

The way Putin controls the media and cracks down on dissent is straight out of Stalins play book.  Even the way Putin invaded Ukraine, by claiming to only be there to "liberate" Russian speakers, is crazy similar to how Stalin justified invading Poland, claiming he was there to "liberate Ukrainians", but later it was revealed he had made a secret deal with Hitler to divy up the land and not get in each others way.

No, it's still you bringing in unrelated shit into this thread.

You brought up Bandera as one of the reasons Ukraine needs denazification (correct me if I'm wrong). I responded as to why that's absurd. If you can't make a coherent argument that's not really my fault.



But still Bandera streets in Ukraine - bad, Ukraine needs denazifying.

Stalin streets in Russia - nah, I just don't condone it.

How many Russians died in WWII?

Serious question, what are your thoughts on Stalin.  All this manufactured Nazi drama seems to be a distraction from the fact that when it comes to being responsible for human death and suffering, Hitler was a noob compared to Stalin.  And here we are watching Putin, the former KGB agent that never got over the collapse of the SU, make play after play directly from Stalins hand book.  

You may want to clean the foam off your mouth.

I'm not trying to convince you one way or another. You clearly have a bias here that seems to be rooted in Soviet/Russian history books, where only nazis committed atrocities, whereas soviets were the liberators and anyone who fought against soviets was automatically a nazi.

For example, just in this war Russian invaders killed thousands of civilians in Ukraine. I'm gonna guess that you will not call every pro-Russian collaborator in the occupied territories a criminal who killed thousands of civilians. Am I right? "Litmus test" for you.

Ukraine: names a street after Bandera.

Russia: puts this guy into government positions...



Which one of these countries claims to be "denazifying" the other? Yep.

Russian propaganda is one huge projector.

Many of the Polish victims regardless of age or gender were tortured before being killed; some of the methods included rape, dismemberment or immolation, among others. The UPA's actions resulted in between 50,000 and 100,000 deaths...the killings were directly linked to the policies of Stepan Bandera's faction of the Organization of Ukrainian Nationalists (OUN-B) and its military arm, the Ukrainian Insurgent Army, whose goal as specified at the Second Conference of the OUN-B on 17–23 February 1943 (March 1943 in some sources) was to purge all non-Ukrainians from the future Ukrainian state.

Bandera was a Ukrainian nationalist, who fought against Soviets and against Nazis. Ended up imprisoned in the same concentration camp as Stalin's son IIRC. Allegedly for helping Jews, despite having anti-semitic views. Controversial figure. But that doesn't fit your narrative, does it? Black or white, putinist or nazi, no other options.

His group also was involved in the ethnic cleansing that killed tens of thousands of Poles in 1942-44. The Organization of Ukrainian Nationalists portrayed Russians, Poles, Hungarians and Jews — most of the minorities in western Ukraine — as aliens and encouraged locals to “destroy” Poles and Jews.

Israel’s ambassador condemned the torchlight march Friday in Kyiv in memory of Stepan Bandera, issuing the strongest rebuke yet by an Israeli official of the event, which has grown in scope amid rising nationalism in Ukraine.

“We strongly condemn any glorification of collaborators with the Nazi regime. It is time for Ukraine to come to terms with its past,” Ambassador Joel Lion wrote on Twitter Saturday.
During World War II, Bandera led the Ukrainian Insurgent Army, whose men killed thousands of Jews and Poles, including women and children, while fighting alongside Nazi Germany against the Red Army and communists.

Expressions of admiration for Bandera and other collaborators have increased in scope and status following the 2014 revolution in Ukraine, which toppled the regime of Viktor Yanukovych amid claims that he is a Russian stooge, and triggered an armed conflict with Russia.

 

BURGER (AA): Die Bundesregierung verurteilt und stellt sich gegen jede Form von Antisemitismus und gegen jede Glorifizierung der Verbrechen der Nazis. Ich kann Ihnen ergänzend sagen, dass wir natürlich auch die von der Organisation Ukrainischer Nationalisten teilweise unter Leitung Banderas begangenen Verbrechen insbesondere an Zivilisten verurteilen. Ein erheblicher Anteil ‑ das muss man im Kopf behalten ‑ dieser Verbrechen wurde in Kollaboration mit deutschen Besatzungstruppen begangen.

Google Translate
BURGER (AA): The federal government condemns and opposes any form of anti-Semitism and any glorification of Nazi crimes. I can also tell you that we of course also condemn the crimes committed by the Organization of Ukrainian Nationalists, in part under the leadership of Bandera, especially against civilians. A significant proportion - one must keep this in mind - of these crimes was committed in collaboration with German occupying forces.