Eventually yes.

This isn't a "token" like some altcoin or something. This is an actual stake ownership in the company. We are selling 5% of company ownership (the Wallet division), not just random tokens that don't mean anything.


Where do you get the idea that these tokens give you no rights whatsoever? When buying, you have to sign a contract with Mycelium that has a legal binding. It gives you legal rights to any increase in company valuation, and makes the token a transferable contract that grants you ownership rights to 5% of the company (which would go down if you pull your increased valuation cash out, of course).

The whole thing may be moot by now anyway though, since we set a cap of 7,500, and some private investors may have filled it all up by now. We won't update the final amount on the site until we know we have the money.

Repurchasing tokens only repurchases the contract that you bought, not the gains that the contract entitles you to. There is nothing in the agreement that erases your gains. If your contract is worth $100 and the gains are worth $1000, you can still get your gains, which are always separate from the contract itself, before selling the $100 contract.



If this was a donation, you would get nothing in return. With this you are getting a share of the company. So no, I should make it clear that you are buying a share ownership of the company, and not making a donation.

Why do you think that? I'm in charge of this wallet project, and I've spent years building a very trustworthy and ethical reputation. That's more valuable to me than any amount of money. Especially considering I'm an ancap who believes that if bitcoin wins over national currencies, without government oversight your reputation will be the most important thing. My hope is that we will have decentralized reputation systems, and everyone who has scammed and got away with it so far will be exposed, and no one would want anything to do with them. This project might fail, of course. There's no guarantee of returns or profit. But considering this is my project that I hope launches Mycelium to the top and gets me recognition, it won't be failing from a lack of me trying.

Alanis I remember that Barcode scanner. Saw it at CompUSA once.

Huh, I think Douglas figured out how to do something we weren't even considering with importing other xpriv keys. That scan QR code option was supposed to be for single address accounts. Cool.

The wallet makes money, and this is investment in the new wallet that will make more. It is possible to invest in things that are just starting out, not making money, but have a huge potential to.

Considering bitcoin itself has outperformed every other investment, and is expected to in the future, I can't really argue with that sentiment...


We spent 8 figures of our own founder's money to get Mycelium to where it is now. After Ruble and Bitcoin both crashed in value, he felt a bit broke and was tired of spending his own money. So we got some private investors. We also now believe that the wallet is strong enough to break out and start earning its own money, so we offered 5% non-dilutable stake to our users to share in what we hope will be that earnings potential, partially as a way to thank them for their support. We'll be selling 20% of the stake later, to actual professional investors and VCs to help fund the wallet the rest of the way.

We can make huge money/profit in the same way that Google Android makes huge money/profit: the Android OS is free, but many of the apps you buy cost money, and Google takes a cut on app sales. That's what we're building, but with our apps being specific to crypto finance.

No, your investments go to the wallet only, but some of the resources that the wallet depends on are used by other products in the company as well. Fir instance, the investment will pay for the wallet backend servers, which the wallet can't work without, but Mycelium Gear uses the wallet backend servers to track whether payments have been made too.


No I haven't

For not you just havery to remember to back out of the app completely. We'll probably save any serious security enhancement for the new app though.


As others said, the current wallet only supports one seed. Any extra accounts will also be generated from that seed. If you want to import a new seed, you basically have to wipe the currently installed wallet. Just make sure you have a backup first. But an even better idea is, since our wallet seed is a BIP standard, you can import it I to any other wallet that supports standards (Electric and Armory do not). So, install Breadwallet on your phone, or MultibitHD on your comouter, and import the seed into those. Then send your money elsewhere.

And for answers to the concerns brought up in said discussion https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1455773.msg14821578#msg14821578

Honestly I wish whoever wrote that first post had actually bothered to do some research first.

It's not. It's currently worth 33,703.504 BTC, which at $450/BTC is $15million, not $100.



The business is in initial startup stages, so no revenues. Yes, we believe this investment will increase revenues.

And an indepth interview about what we're actually doing here https://news.bitcoin.com/interview-rassah-mycelium/

On to the rest...


You are buying legal ownership to company assets. These are actual legal SAR's.


This is an investment in a startup. Profits are never guaranteed. But if the company becomes more valuable, or starts turning a profit, the legal contract you receive with the token binds the company to pay you your increased share of the company, should you ask to receive it.


There's no fall back on the SEC, but there is still fallback on the legal system. You can take your contract to court to sue us if we defraud you.


We did not put any worth on our company. That's what the sale is for, to see what the market believes our company (the wallet division, at least) is worth. The $100 was just round (unfortunately high) numbers to explain the math easier.



This wasn't a privately secretly shared document, this document was publicly available here https://wallet.mycelium.com/elements/documentation.html since the beginning. Only things changed since then was supposed to be times added to the date (we initially said May 1st, but pushed it to midnight May 1st due to running out of time to prepare) and formatting. If there are other differences, please let me know.



We are currently funded through the end of the year, and should have enough funds to get this project done. We will need the extra funds to develop the necessary business relationships and APIs after, and to hopefully hire three more devs to get it out sooner (one iOS, one Android, one UI). Also don't forget this is the initial 5% sale. We will be doing a 20% sale, to "real" investors and VCs, later.


I don't know about Lisk or Waves, but with Etherium you buy currency tied to the project, on the speculation that the currency itself will be useful. With this, you are literally buying stake ownership in the company, which will grow along with the company like any other investment, and has a future possibility of paying dividends should the company become profitable. This isn't just a donation.


Goal was August, actually, but Microsoft screwed us over, so we had to move it back to "end of the year"

It's a common practice for companies to sell, or give away for free, stock to employees and company insiders. We are just doing this for the initial public. Note our "insiders," those being managers and owners, will not be buying to avoid any conflicts of interest.



You buy a share of company stock at $x. That means you are literally owner of $x amount of the company, including company assets such as cash. If the company valuation grows, such as from a second round of investments or from increased revenues, your $x worth of stock grows. Then if the company offers to repurchase stock shares, you can trade your stock for the amount of cash that you literally already own. How is this set up any different?



Wrong about no legal feedback. Yes, tokens are not traded on regulated markets, but SARs typically are not. You do get a legal signed contract between you and the company which gives you the legal right to any growth in company value, which you can take to court to claim your right. This isn't just ETH token that only represents what people feel about ETH's growth, this is an actual legal contract granting you legal rights.
As for no refunds, refunds aren't given during valuation sales because otherwise those sales would never go anywhere. A few people invest, see too little has been invested, and pull back out. Next group invests, sees too little, and pulls out. Valuation never goes above zero. That's why there are no refunds in these types of sales.


You said no ETA, and then literally linked to where an ETA was given. We're sorry we can't give you an exact date, but we have experience launching big projects, and know they will always be delayed beyond whatever date is giver. So we see no point besides a generalization. Remember Butterfly Labs? Etherium? Practically everything else in this space?



It is being build on ReactNative, with Bitcore as the initial bitcoin library. The initial planning began in August, development began in late October, and the project has been in development for over 6 months. At this point the development platform is set up, UI is done, app development has started and works for sending coins, and we are currently in the process of developing the API. Regarding what it's going to be, it's on the web page, the press releases, and a dozen or so articles discussing it in depth, about what it will be, what our business plans are, and how it will make money. Or you could ask. We are not a secretive company. I'm all over the place and am pretty easy to reach.


Mycelium Entropy was a success. More than half was sold our before it was done, the rest was sold out, and then some, shortly after. Demand was so high we ran out of units. We made a pretty good profit on that. The wallet itself is a success too. Consistently ranked among the top bitcoin wallets, over 300,000 downloads, over 200,000 active users, a strong brand recognition and an extremely loyal user base.


Regarding the shares being bought back at the initial price, you, along with unfortunately many others, misunderstood what these shares you are buying are. The token itself is just a contract, used to prove that you are a legitimate owner. Think of them as just a really expensive piece of paper. What those tokens give you are Stock Appreciation Rights (SAR), which grants you a legal right to any increase in company valuation. So if you buy a token for $1, and the company grows 10 times, your token is still worth $1, which is what we will repurchase it for, but your SAR, the right attached to that token, is worth $9, which you can exchange for cash, or if we ever have an IPO, can convert directly to equivalent share of stock. And, should the wallet ever get a profit, those tokens will be converted to dividend paying assets, allowing you to receive a share of those profits. Basically, instead of the usual shares of stock that we are used to, which themselves grow with company value, SARs themselves don't grow, but have a right attached to them which, when combined with the SAR, grow together like a share of stock would.


We have only one Accounting, Legal, and HR department for the whole company. And it's very likely that other of Mycelium's projects will just be rolled into the wallet eventually anyway. I know this raises some concerns, but I can't give a better answer in this case.


Tokens will be issued as colored coins, which you can hold and trade now in Colu wallet, and will be able to hold and trade from within Mycelium wallet by the end of the month. We expect exchanges will adopt the Colu platform and allow trading them on the market soon too. So I don't know why this is misleading.

Hi. Mycelium rep here. Sorry, I kinda abandoned bitcointalk for a while. Most if not all of the questions asked here have been answered on Reddit. If you can't find them, ask me and I'll answer them here as well.

Regarding tokens, you aren't buying an altcoin, you are buying an SAR with all the standard legal rights granted by such an investment. The tokens will be issues as colored coins, you are free to trade them on the market, while the tokens themselves don't grow in value (why we say we will buy them for the same price), they are just proof for your SAR right, which does grow in value. So if you buy a token for $1 and company doubles in value, you'll have same valued $1 token, and a $1 SAR right in the share of company which you can ask to withdraw in cash. Long term the company expects to make a profit, and if that happens, tokens will be converted into dividend paying assets instead. The reason funds can't be promised to be spent on the wallet exclusively is because some backend servers are used for other Mycelium services as well, and legal, accounting, and management are shared among all Mycelium products. Also, many of the other products will be rolled into the wallet eventually too.

Any more questions, feel free to ask.

Less than $100 mil for total valuation. We have a number (which I'm still hoping we can lower), but we won't mention it unless we hit it, and after the sale closes.

Yes


Check the Reddit posts. Lots of info and Q&A there.

Yes

We can't set a number of shares, because they we would be valuing ourselves. We are setting shares at 1 BTC, no I vestments minimum, and will value ourselves based on how much we sell. We will probably put a cap in place if the sale gets too large. We don't want to be another Etherium.

No private sales, but small so that we can sell larger ones later, and give our first supporters room to grow.


You don't have to buy a whole token they are just an arbitrary number to get the total valuation from. Just as you can own a fraction of a stock, you can open a fraction of a token (divisible to 8 decimal places). We already have pledges for small amounts too.