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i dont think mtgox will die.
i've just heard and believed it to many times before.
this time again its a real joke: letting no money out, not freezing trading...
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So much for this ever-lasting pyramid. Wether you were legit or not, not many people tend to invest in these things as 9/10 they turn out to be scams. Sometimes the ones with websites seem to work better, but most still leave well enough alone.
eh? i did not "invest" because it is a pyramid... its even in the gambling section  |
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To flower1024 who said that they may be illegal. That's an important point this site owners need to consider.
For me I'm pretty sure that where I live participating in gambling (and I consider bitcoin ponzis gambling) is illegal. It doesn't bother me much.
there is a difference if you are allowed to gamble or if the forum is allowed to advertise gambling (which they do by providing a category). the second concerns me more |
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i like the idea of a seperated ponzi/pyramid section.
but i've seen op's which try to lie about it.
afaik ponzi/pyramids are illegal in many countries. i dont knoe if the forum could get legal trouble by providing an own section.
so i prefer them to be in the gamble section (but certainly not in investing)
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seriously? People are actually throwing their money into pyramid schemes? How do people not know what they are yet?
i guess shills... |
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i would not call it scam... ...its just a pyramid scheme: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pyramid_schemewhich btw is illegal in many countries also: the op takes a HUGE cut. just call it a game and make sure that in your country you are allowed to participate (otherwise if you are unlucky you have to give back any gains to authorities) |
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they are rapidly becoming irrelevant.
ive heard this to often before |
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Wow it's rare to see a company being so ignorant...
bfl? |
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he is not really a scammer because he already said that he may not pay back (so i dont consider this a loan at all).
and i got a little bored about all the scam accusations: a technical discussion is way more fun
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flower1024 - That sounds like a good idea but it doest really apply to real-life transactions does it?
use testnet to "test" different user behaviour and the effect on your wallet use current blockchain to get an estimate what is currently(!) accepted. i've heard on exchange saying that it had to pay a > 5btc fee: BUT this is a few years ago. i used mtgox to collect my dust and i can imagine other people use "online wallets" (which most exchanges are) to do the same. i would be concerned about fees too if i would ran some kind of online wallet (which i wont ever do ) EDIT: btw you can always talk to a mining-pool to always include your transaction and pay them some monthly fee. mtgox did (does?) this with eligius. |
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just use testnet?
regarding fees: just ran a simulation on the current confirmed and unconfirmed tx.
the problem is this: many people depositin real small amounts (say smaller 0.0001) and then somebody wants to cashout 2btc. if the big transaction can only made using very small inputs it will result in a very large fee
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afaik i've read stories about people withdrawing eur without problems.
maybe it was just a usd problem?
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4) Someone looking at this tx list will spot some of the failed transactions and modify them so they become bitcoin-0.8+ compliant. This gives a new tx and the transactions get through. MtGox fails to spot its own tx in the blockchain; gives up and returns funds to the customer.
do you have proof that the balance has been refunded? |
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Someone please show me how to do this easy check with a few bitcoind commands?
when a new block arrives get it with rpc and look through the json output? Sure, poll getblockcount, then what? Please show how easy it is to spot this. $ bitcoind getblock 000000000000010c5ba86d05c6f43df46921d453d23fdafe85229f6a7d840e16 '{"tx":"obj", "script":"asm"}'
{
"hash" : "000000000000010c5ba86d05c6f43df46921d453d23fdafe85229f6a7d840e16",
"confirmations" : 43,
"size" : 1473,
"height" : 186154,
"version" : 1,
"merkleroot" : "47de80c28529a69bddefb90ea15388f10e2647482560bb50857e7b586d45a8c3",
"time" : 1340614357,
"nonce" : 728350342,
"bits" : "1a09b78a",
"difficulty" : 1726566.55919348,
"tx" : [
{
"txid" : "11af9ba807942f7db6274f40442651c7b58b02b0a942867847b2b8a3932df7b1",
"version" : 1,
"locktime" : 0,
"size" : 142,
"vin" : [
{
"coinbase" : "048ab7091a027702062f503253482f",
"sequence" : 4294967295
}
],
"vout" : [
{
"value" : 50.00000000,
"scriptPubKey" : "04b034ecbcbe86f327d2edd25ce1fce3f4463710c00ae00d1a25198bab882be95c72d3468dc6931f756b03d99a3b7f3a07543834370ad023b37cb1127c6266d91a OP_CHECKSIG"
}
],
"confirmations" : 0
},
{
"txid" : "9fb85b2c9085284a6c39407025cbec31b4c88b1075f3d98840395bc4e389616d",
"version" : 1,
"locktime" : 0,
"size" : 259,
"vin" : [
{
"prevout" : {
"hash" : "1f16f657fb093f4618c1ad6504130d08fa71bb1964d0be5574f44011124f7b64",
"n" : 1
},
"scriptSig" : "3046022100dea86a40b8ffcfa446e05886e18c7ea8bca371118da48d4adfde846b87af43190221009652d86f7013afd35311fe8d080c9e592758716c08e971c39283ca08746db78501 04a1ce79a9fec1018129bb79c19dc90dcb4657e8cf725c635909ea402143b64e84fb06bf0b2c96ca6f0db9ac8ae480399f7724a9b288faf52c16d1535f13b90fe6",
"sequence" : 4294967295
}
],
"vout" : [
{
"value" : 1066.13121507,
"scriptPubKey" : "OP_DUP OP_HASH160 e51a349be7044a8d84c6e8370ff56ff6860f3597 OP_EQUALVERIFY OP_CHECKSIG"
},
{
"value" : 1242.21306062,
"scriptPubKey" : "OP_DUP OP_HASH160 51fb66b01bcdbcdc67049fa97a8da21a2fa912e0 OP_EQUALVERIFY OP_CHECKSIG"
}
],
"confirmations" : 0
},
{
"txid" : "060cbd899b2c1fac0cdbcf580a3f90aae131b16d516f049baf1d13c66e410892",
"version" : 1,
"locktime" : 0,
"size" : 226,
"vin" : [
{
"prevout" : {
"hash" : "f2b6efbef50c026efc19dac73ed787b0ccc1697c8640e96637ab861e85afca60",
"n" : 0
},
"scriptSig" : "3045022100a0be436cb85b899740792206a17658ef96e6d786e53448cab8b11f9e51be96a6022063ab6d9337fa71b9d5a75e3ebe0a33c151ad6cdca70f9170c1b0297d655c5b3301 022cb39adb02162270b89b08975256293182bcaa84622d18a30c3bd72751d4ddd5",
"sequence" : 4294967295
}
],
"vout" : [
{
"value" : 1.40018289,
"scriptPubKey" : "OP_DUP OP_HASH160 d6211f74851b1cc1d181d0fe591445a18f49c818 OP_EQUALVERIFY OP_CHECKSIG"
},
{
"value" : 1.00000000,
"scriptPubKey" : "OP_DUP OP_HASH160 713c581950bbfb0545f1418bbfe825911e8efa5c OP_EQUALVERIFY OP_CHECKSIG"
}
],
"confirmations" : 0
},
{
"txid" : "2da6e2a83abe9e870a3a4762d8159e523a3068cce26c5670afdcd2c63486a1ac",
"version" : 1,
"locktime" : 0,
"size" : 765,
"vin" : [
{
"prevout" : {
"hash" : "9aa47d859bda3eba62fd366461adda78f6df3293dd7b1681361f54531220b378",
"n" : 2
},
"scriptSig" : "3046022100f10d0f6fc6ce90ae97a04627a659791b1caed48aae8d70b82c73c5c730758576022100aba76d54166189b50e678faac63a4265d6d2daf48889a23a1fc285e042fb9c8901 04addfdfd09989768bc93678fd4eca1bf8d485e98690b7584a7559ab30a63ac16fd33e8e7db59f72c21b402a78bacbde205d642e60037d8b660a57341a60c4e646",
"sequence" : 4294967295
},
{
"prevout" : {
"hash" : "125ea4a6f9e86333de7566af28e6a5558a2c66e5c41b197560bd9a8e6c56866b",
"n" : 0
},
"scriptSig" : "3045022100c9e3d69de5bcbb9252b2b637e6846eaef971959653c887e7bb13f6528f1587f2022059d47b80f98460c0a02a9f7a7977202533fe3566a1cbecc599b122af02a8b8ac01 04a875f1a901e23be1435350f1a94820f84f590e297c0a34e393b873ac5b3182d071ca43890a54c750ad2fd6288416a319e70e48f2c2d2fe828666cfc98689ce0e",
"sequence" : 4294967295
},
{
"prevout" : {
"hash" : "e2b9a62cd1ad312f510510bf071ae0079b6b858db8b43e86809b7269d8ad1ff7",
"n" : 1
},
"scriptSig" : "3045022100a198dea14374a5d0584cfedeb8f6a457556b9bdd0488c433b179ad328a007c7102200a3179f1b8a95ae4e02183c25fb3234f1efe0db9129806d38579b2845e77a11801 047b19a9c3e6b0a92e9bdeeb294ebea709dd1d9b5e2ccb7e1fb03ca6bfa43b78dd0a6d72ddd9e64130513d63dc1ea5609906a15f1d3044f50ee6415b2e4eaf59e4",
"sequence" : 4294967295
},
{
"prevout" : {
"hash" : "b6548149a182fd10330b9f69024bdd55ce521ce367e9125d1bd8c91a8c5539da",
"n" : 0
},
"scriptSig" : "30450220670628b426d996131f064bb861554e31bd3afcdc581ae9824af1610dcc079080022100d240e2f445670f8e2be82f5fc74dfbc98312f0adb5f2ec163449588bdd8e9f8401 045c7e935730d0a7e45615e4a5df7c50b8bdde7fad7c978c569563b5451a756710d7dc0f1a248bd233467f17dd28e27484a91c0af4123c131b87d959dd37850692",
"sequence" : 4294967295
}
],
"vout" : [
{
"value" : 0.19950871,
"scriptPubKey" : "OP_DUP OP_HASH160 c6b92e0b69d3a7aa53a28e2bc5a6de3f32fbff5a OP_EQUALVERIFY OP_CHECKSIG"
}
],
"confirmations" : 0
}
],
"previousblockhash" : "00000000000006d68b5d22acef2a43b38dc692782d7c12c0ae43259b9eb46078",
"nextblockhash" : "000000000000023b6a46f950ef1ccd08519c2e26208d1af157c6e7fa541bd043"
}
just loop through vin and check your already sent transaction for dups. anyway: i dont have a bitcoin node ready to check and i just copied it from the forum. for anybody developing custom client software this should be easy, dont you think? |
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Yes, you are right. But I think they want to provide the hash to the client, as a prove of delivery. (but actually, this could not be a proof...)
i think you misunderstood the problem. the problem is that mtgox sent a in an old tx format which prevents miners to include it in a block. someone "fixed" it for them and rebroadcastet (and this made a new txid). mtgox did not recognize that the tx has gone through and (maybe, hopefully not) refunded it to its customers balance. the problem you are referring to is that some of their tx just did not go through. this is just a followup: as they did not recognize the original transaction has gone through they tried to reuse the ouputs in a new tx. EDIT: the only necessary proof is that mtgox has signed the transaction. |
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i dont like the idea to do a hardfork just for one company when there is a working solution publicly available (for years btw).
they should just fix their custom client to work the same was as the reference client.
No, you don't get it. There is no hardfork, not even a softfork. The just propose an alternative way to identify a transaction then this means that mtgox just can implement it in there custom client and continue? why would they even need bitcoin foundation for that? anyway: i still think they should just do the same as the reference client. Because if the proposal is not widely adopted, their customer won't understand the new tx id format. what do you mean by "understanding"? it is enough if the reference client credits my balance. |
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Someone please show me how to do this easy check with a few bitcoind commands?
when a new block arrives get it with rpc and look through the json output? |
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i dont like the idea to do a hardfork just for one company when there is a working solution publicly available (for years btw).
they should just fix their custom client to work the same was as the reference client.
No, you don't get it. There is no hardfork, not even a softfork. The just propose an alternative way to identify a transaction then this means that mtgox just can implement it in there custom client and continue? why would they even need bitcoin foundation for that? anyway: i still think they should just do the same as the reference client. |
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i dont like the idea to do a hardfork just for one company when there is a working solution publicly available (for years btw).
they should just fix their custom client to work the same was as the reference client.
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