Lottery sounds like an interesting idea, but what about a queue? You guys know you are going to have a nightmare fulfilling 821 orders, why not letting us to get in line sooner? Please come up with something better than an F5 fight for the 821 sale...
Lottery/Q will simply create a secondary market for selling Q spot or winning lottery ticket. This will add to the price. Speculators abound with NO intention of actually buying a unit will sign up for the Q or lottery in the hopes of winning and selling their "spot". You think traffic was bad now, go ahead add a lottery or Q and watch what happens. If you really want a Q just wait for the 821 pre-order and you can pay and sit in the Q as long as you need to. |
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The ignorance in this thread is pretty impressive. This theory that bitmain is taking your money specifically to run their own miners is just plain dumb. Bitmain has 10k+ of their own mienrs sitting on the ground because even they cannot find datacenter space for them all. Why do you think they tried making agreements with places like great north data to run their equipment? They can only put them up as fast as new space becomes available so thats another conspiracy theory you can toss out the window.
An s9 makes $850/month before power costs and everyone is complaining that bitmain is holding down profits. Were none of you in this industry a year ago? Gimme a break.
Yes the ignorance displayed here in your comment is amazing. If bitmain has so many sitting on ground and nowhere to put them then WHY are they not shipping immediately? Hmmmm Have a nice day Br Or why not sell them for 3k each (its not like that's 25 or 30 mill dollars sitting around)... LOL on top of that we can see the hashrate climbing FAST. But ok keep running around telling everyone the hashrate/diff jumps are retail miner sales... |
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so basically bitmain, avalon etc are all big scam business? taking money from "retail" miners while the only ones who can make profit are the few who cobtrol the few asci miners?
only way to have a chance to earn on mining is by gpu as this is not controlled market?
Scam is a pretty strong word for it. I don't think anywhere in my post did I say or imply they are doing anything illegal. Selling money machines to wide eyed newbs in full FOMO mode at the highest price they can, I don't believe that's illegal anywhere. It can be looked at from a business POV as taking advantage of extremely favorable market conditions. Selling retail will allow them to put a multiple of machines online for themselves FREE and months ahead of retail miners. Again not sure where that is illegal. NO ONE is forced to buy their product. It is literally economics 101, in a free market supply and demand will set the price. In this market we have the manufactures don't need insiders trading info, the have a demand supply ratio skew in their favor as high as 10 to 1. This is what professional sales people DREAM about. Life as a sales exec is easy, profits soar and you look like a genius as a sales exec when your demand exceeds supply by magnitudes.. No they're not scams they're smart legitimate business' taking advantage of extremely favorable market conditions. Any business would do the same. |
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Did some mining calculations in MyCryptoBuddy and it doesn't seem like either one unit or 20 units combined for 146 TH/S can make money. 20 units will generate 2.5 coins and at current price would cost around 32,000. It shows one unit would lose about 125 dollars in one year at 1400 price per Avalon and 15,000 BTC. Do you miners just assume price will double to take these risks? What am I missing? Is it a bulk situation where you have to pair hundreds of them up to profit? Ty If BTC went to 50k per coin then sure, but was there a time previously when margins were not so "gamblish"? This seems like a shot in the dark w this Hash Rate. But I'm desperate to try mining!  I get that prices of Bitcoin should go up, however, what am I missing cuz these units sell out instantly?Economics 101 supply and demand. In an imperfect market such as one where demand GREATLY exceeds supply the price is always set by the most optimistic buyer. You yourself are "desperate to try mining", how many more people are more "desperate" than you? FOMO aint it great!!! |
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I too was making similar observation some days ago. What hit me is if currently 1000-5000 new S9 or equivalent are turned on every day, where they come from? Obviously its nearly impossible to buy new miners, at least on short term, if you are lucky and are able to order you have to wait months. some of these numbers could be from old miner models being turned back on again, others from some s9 getting delivered from old batches. but anyway numbers seems huge! Can it be that the miner factories (avalon, bitmain etc) put most of their production into their own farms? or can it be someone made a more effective miner (like n10 chip) but does not offer it to public and just use it for own farming? Ideas?
LULZ of course the manufacture's are putting machines online as quick as they can... Bitmain has HUGE FARMS. There is no chance that these diff jumps are simply retail sales of miners. Think about the pre-order game. You pay them X BTC now and with that money the manufacture can put maybe 3 or 4 or 5 machines of their own online with YOUR MONEY... They mine as much as they can drive up diff and then ship out a few units to retail customers a few months later. Miners are literally building their competition up at a multiple rate. |
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I was wrong again. You were created that badly.  You are wrong. I wasn't created at all. I evolved.  Science shows that evolution doesn't exist.  Only in the mind of a brainwashed fool does "The Scientific Theory of Evolution" some how prove scientifically that evolution is a hoax. The entire SCIENTIFIC THEORY OF EVOLUTION was formulated to fucking scientifically support evolution you moron... BADecker uses his own meaning for a lot of words. For a quick read on the actual science of the theory this a great explanation of some terms. It also covers clearly what the scientific community thinks about the theory of evolution. http://www.nas.edu/evolution/TheoryOrFact.htmlI think one of the best sentences in the above article is this one: Because the evidence supporting it is so strong, scientists no longer question whether biological evolution has occurred and is continuing to occur. Instead, they investigate the mechanisms of evolution, how rapidly evolution can take place, and related questions. That is what SCIENCE thinks about evolution. It completely illustrates BADeckers complete lack of understanding when it comes to the world of science. If you want to argue creationism, fucking go for it. Preach all day long brother it's your RIGHT to! But your just flat our wrong trying to use science to prove it. |
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So it took you this long to realize I'm not brainwashed?  Most creationists are a little slow on the uptake, our buddy here BADecker is just the slowest of the slow! Hes exactly like the flat earthers. Denying evolution is as stupid as denying gravity or that the earth is an oblate sphere! ALL religions are a hoax! |
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God is the maker of all things, because all things are machines in one way or another.
Badecker would say that's impossible, since a god cannot make himself and can't be the effect (caused by) something else. Take away god, all you have left is the theory of evolution - it hasn't be proven wrong yet in billions of scientific observations. Badecker contradicts himself all the time like: Free will but also everything is determined. Everything has a cause but god doesn't. Scientific theories are not known to be true, asks me to prove something by telling him if there is a scientific theory of that something. He is just going insane, I think. Now you are simply talking fud. The free will of man is only free will. It doesn't connect to mans' capabilities. God, who is outside of cause and effect, looks at mans' free will choices, and then goes back to the Beginning, and adjusts the universe, using cause and effect to change the universe according to the free will of mankind, and the objectives that He, God, has. Any proof for any of that? Why is god ''outside'' of cause and effect? If free will of humans is not connected to their capabilities, then why are they punished/rewarded for it? By BADeckers own words god is supernatural. By definition the supernatural requires belief in something not of the natural world... As we have seen very clearly we can not have a rational natural science discussion when the supernatural is involved. So another question BAD, is god supernatural? A simple yes or no would be great! |
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Climate change is a real and objective measurement. However what is not clear is to waht degree human activity is involved.
That's true, were not sure yet if its 99.9999% our fault or 99.99999% our fault. |
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There is lots of evidence for it. It's just that the financial powers that be have gone the route of not being interested in someone developing on. But if it has been developed, it simply has not been advertised. Or you could go with the real reason why we don't have a Scientific Theory of god which is clearly that such a Theory simply by nature can never pass the requirements of a Scientific Theory. The vast majority of you posts are full of blatant bullshit, made up things from your crazy brain and flagrant misrepresentations. I mean I get why your posts are full of that shit, it's literally all you have. It's quite amusing to watch someone who has almost 0 understanding of the ACTUAL Scientific Theory of Evolution trying to argue against it. You are so much like the Flat Earthers it's fucking creepy. Go back to your incest filled, child killing, slavery manual written by warmongering goat herders that couldn't even fucking write at the time of supposed divination. Leave science to people with an actual ability to think critically. I don't blame you. Since your religion obviously doesn't include God, I can understand how you would be upset to find that God exists. But don't you want the truth? Consider: Cause and effect, something that shows scientifically that everything is programmed to act the way it does within the whole universe, almost proves that God exists all by itself (C&E)! You should study a little before you use defamatory statements. This is the "Evolution is a hoax" thread. But I don't blame you for forgetting that part of this thread. Why not? It's so easy to realize that C&E proves God at the same time it disprove the evolution presented by evolution theory. However, don't you want to find the real religion? Why would you continue with the foolish religion of evolution, and the foolish religion that doesn't have God in it? Think... so that you can live in reality rather than science fiction as you are living. Answer the question: WHAT WAS THE CAUSE OF GODSince according to you EVERYTHING has a cause... Once you prove that, then we can start to determine what God's cause might be. Up until then, we don't know that He needs a cause. So you're saying he doesn't exist then. Thanks, I agree god is nothing! Actually, that is your suggestion that God doesn't exist. When you consider the machine nature of the universe, and that machines have makers, God is the maker of all things, because all things are machines in one way or another. So, you don't like God. What does that have to do with the fact that evolution is a hoax? I neither like nor dislike god, personally I'm not able to like or dislike something that doesn't exist. Now take the whole machine universe out for a sec, stay on topic bud (I know you just love to through out the red herrings but focus for a sec), we were talking about C&E proving god and the bible making evolution a hoax. You said EVERYTHING has a cause and effect. Either god is something or nothing or supernatural and it's both. Now if you want to make the claim that it is nothing and something at the same time therefore he isn't subject to C&E then fine go ahead but understand now you're bringing the supernatural into it. Now that the supernatural is involved we can easily throw out every single argument you make as irrelevant, scientifically. As such any claim you make about the validity of evolution must be subject to your belief system. Either concede god is supernatural, which by definition takes science out of the equation and requires faith. Or concede god is something which by your definition requires a cause and creates and endless loop of circular logic. Or concede that we just don't actually know if there is a C&E for EVERYTHING. If you want to run around telling people the earth is about 6000 years old and evolution is a hoax or any other horse shit you want, by all means go ahead that's your right. But don't think for one second when you try and use supernatural to explain science that rational people wont laugh at your stupidity. Now why is this relevant? It's mostly young earth creationist and the religious community disputing things like the Theory of Evolution. It is entirely fair to point out that that view requires a supernatural belief and incredible amount of faith. Anyone reading the comments should know what agenda those kinds of people are pushing. P.S if you really think I'm OT here feel free to report me to the mods if they agree with you they will trash my posts and I won't care. |
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There is lots of evidence for it. It's just that the financial powers that be have gone the route of not being interested in someone developing on. But if it has been developed, it simply has not been advertised. Or you could go with the real reason why we don't have a Scientific Theory of god which is clearly that such a Theory simply by nature can never pass the requirements of a Scientific Theory. The vast majority of you posts are full of blatant bullshit, made up things from your crazy brain and flagrant misrepresentations. I mean I get why your posts are full of that shit, it's literally all you have. It's quite amusing to watch someone who has almost 0 understanding of the ACTUAL Scientific Theory of Evolution trying to argue against it. You are so much like the Flat Earthers it's fucking creepy. Go back to your incest filled, child killing, slavery manual written by warmongering goat herders that couldn't even fucking write at the time of supposed divination. Leave science to people with an actual ability to think critically. I don't blame you. Since your religion obviously doesn't include God, I can understand how you would be upset to find that God exists. But don't you want the truth? Consider: Cause and effect, something that shows scientifically that everything is programmed to act the way it does within the whole universe, almost proves that God exists all by itself (C&E)! You should study a little before you use defamatory statements. This is the "Evolution is a hoax" thread. But I don't blame you for forgetting that part of this thread. Why not? It's so easy to realize that C&E proves God at the same time it disprove the evolution presented by evolution theory. However, don't you want to find the real religion? Why would you continue with the foolish religion of evolution, and the foolish religion that doesn't have God in it? Think... so that you can live in reality rather than science fiction as you are living. Answer the question: WHAT WAS THE CAUSE OF GODSince according to you EVERYTHING has a cause... Once you prove that, then we can start to determine what God's cause might be. Up until then, we don't know that He needs a cause. So you're saying he doesn't exist then. Thanks, I agree god is nothing! |
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There is lots of evidence for it. It's just that the financial powers that be have gone the route of not being interested in someone developing on. But if it has been developed, it simply has not been advertised. Or you could go with the real reason why we don't have a Scientific Theory of god which is clearly that such a Theory simply by nature can never pass the requirements of a Scientific Theory. The vast majority of you posts are full of blatant bullshit, made up things from your crazy brain and flagrant misrepresentations. I mean I get why your posts are full of that shit, it's literally all you have. It's quite amusing to watch someone who has almost 0 understanding of the ACTUAL Scientific Theory of Evolution trying to argue against it. You are so much like the Flat Earthers it's fucking creepy. Go back to your incest filled, child killing, slavery manual written by warmongering goat herders that couldn't even fucking write at the time of supposed divination. Leave science to people with an actual ability to think critically. I don't blame you. Since your religion obviously doesn't include God, I can understand how you would be upset to find that God exists. But don't you want the truth? Consider: Cause and effect, something that shows scientifically that everything is programmed to act the way it does within the whole universe, almost proves that God exists all by itself (C&E)! You should study a little before you use defamatory statements. This is the "Evolution is a hoax" thread. But I don't blame you for forgetting that part of this thread. Why not? It's so easy to realize that C&E proves God at the same time it disprove the evolution presented by evolution theory. However, don't you want to find the real religion? Why would you continue with the foolish religion of evolution, and the foolish religion that doesn't have God in it? Think... so that you can live in reality rather than science fiction as you are living. Answer the question: WHAT WAS THE CAUSE OF GODSince according to you EVERYTHING has a cause... |
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There is lots of evidence for it. It's just that the financial powers that be have gone the route of not being interested in someone developing on. But if it has been developed, it simply has not been advertised. Or you could go with the real reason why we don't have a Scientific Theory of god which is clearly that such a Theory simply by nature can never pass the requirements of a Scientific Theory. The vast majority of you posts are full of blatant bullshit, made up things from your crazy brain and flagrant misrepresentations. I mean I get why your posts are full of that shit, it's literally all you have. It's quite amusing to watch someone who has almost 0 understanding of the ACTUAL Scientific Theory of Evolution trying to argue against it. You are so much like the Flat Earthers it's fucking creepy. Go back to your incest filled, child killing, slavery manual written by warmongering goat herders that couldn't even fucking write at the time of supposed divination. Leave science to people with an actual ability to think critically. |
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ROFL. What does that mean? You are saying that elements don't decay on their own or what's your argument here, I'm confused, you are just making things up now.
Well, of course, you're confused. That is the issue, or I wouldn't be responding to your confusion. I'm saying that elements decay via cause and effect, just like everything else works through cause and effect. Is there a solid science theory that shows that elements don't decay by cause and effect? Cause and effect fits everything, because everything has action of some sort.So what is the cause of god? |
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In other words, Jesus is God. Jesus died to uphold God's Name and God's purity in the eyes of men and angels. God let the Jews think they were killing Jesus for the sake of money. But that wasn't the real reason God allowed and even promoted it. It was for the honor of His Own Name that He did it.
God promoted and allowed the death of his only son for the honor of his own name? You worship a sick god my man, a sick disgusting god. Even if science was a religion (which let me clearly say it's not, its pretty much the opposite of it lol which is why all religions have feared it forever!) at least my science doesn't worship and egotistical sky fairy that promotes the death of their only child. Face it bud Astargath destroyed every argument you made. Even theologians don't make the claims you are. Probably because they don't want to sound too silly. Even your fellow religious brethren in this here thread tell you god requires belief and faith. Even your circular logic proves any and every god or anything else you want to make up. You are literally the only person saying this absolute non sense, at least notbatman had a couple buddies and some other morons with his movement. Face it man you sound silly, lost the argument hundreds of pages ago. Frankly at this point you come across as a raving lunatic. Well done Astargath for putting up with this sillyness for so long and doing such a good job. +million bud! |
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As you say, we don't have evidence of any thing that can make the complexity of the universe. That leaves room for God, only. God, not being a thing, or anything, has made the universe.
Right! We have no evidence other than the machine-nature of the universe. And machines have makers. This is the simplest proof. Right, we have no evidence than the magic spaghetti-nature of the universe and since all spaghetti magic is made by the spaghetti god, the universe is therefore made by the spaghetti god, this is the simplest proof, irrefutable. It's always funny to hear "every single solitary thing in the universe has a cause, except my god" LOLOLOL! Now the next topic: Scientific proof ALLAH exists. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=737322.0 Just replace God every time its mentioned with Allah, bam proof 100% irrefutable. BADecker are you Muslim now? |
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Ok think about the article for one second. Scientists have to measure something that is trillions trillion trillions times weaker than a fucking fridge magnet. LOL go figure it's hard to measure accurately past 3 more decimal places. Second, the NIST had a problem with the number past 3 decimal places, not whether gravity fucking exists or not. Because like duh they know gravity exists... Jesus bro did you skip 9th grade science class and did they not teach any type of actual reading comprehension where you went to school... Fuck me sideways with a chainsaw. |
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Pallet pricing for the 821 is on their website now. But everything is sold out.....already or just preparing?
I would assume it's preping. Everything official to date has been "no pricing yet, don't ask, when we have it we will release to everyone" |
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I expect the 821 to end up being ballpark $3000, possibly as LOW as $2500, based on current S9 pricing.
Caanan/Avalon has always had a price premium compared to whatever Bitmain product they're closest too, unless they were a TON lower on hashrate, and I don't see them pricing the 821 much if ANY lower than S9 since they're fairly close on hashrate and efficiency.
They might MATCH the price of the S9 due to the hashrate difference, but they won't go lower - Bitmain will tolerate "same price" most likely because they can point at the higher hashrate AND slightly better efficiency, but a lower price would probably prompt a price war.
I mean they told us how they were formulating the price in the press release. When I plug "my opinion of the numbers" into their "formula" (which by the way their formula makes perfect business sense) I come up with a ballpark of $3500 USD at the retail/disty level. I see maybe 3k/3.25k for bulk 60 unit pallets. If coin price doesn't shrink to much farther, from what I am reading in their release that number makes sense. And honestly it will sell out FAST even at $3500, just look at the comments in some of the threads and how the newbs will pay "anything for them". If we believe they have a 10x supply/demand problem, coin price stabilizes high, they consider spot pricing of gear then $3500 would be my starting point! We're talking about millions of dollars in sales if these companies are not employing professional sales people they are making a huge mistake. If they are the price is well thought out and internal numbers are analyzed and extrapolated to project a multitude of scenarios. This information will give them the best possible chance to maximize profits. When a professional sales exec has a 10x supply/demand ratio skew he is having a wet dream, trust me! He/She will make the most of it if he/she is any fucking good! If coin price stays high expect 3k to be the best possible scenario. If coin prices go up whoa watch out, 4k will sound cheap. IMOI think your assessment is spot on. I, too, expect to see prices between $3k and $4k per unit. Anything's possible, I guess, but an ROI of 9mo-1yr isn't competitive or palatable to a lot of people. It only has to be palatable to 1 in 10 my friend (if you believe their press release)! Think like a company and not a miner and it becomes easier to understand. Besides a 1 year +ROI has been the norm MANY times before this and IS competitive and WILL be palatable to at least 1 in 10 people with current coin prices! |
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Holy shit, Notbatman is that fucking you?? ?? ?? ?? You sound exactly as crazy and delusional as him just a different topic LOL. Your post's are full of inaccuracies that you repeat ad nauseam even though more accurate information is provided again and again. As with the FE thread repeating the same bullshit over and over again doesn't make them true. The theory of Evolution is a theory because it passes the scientific requirements to be a theory (go ahead look up those requirements please). There is no theory of God because guess what, it doesn't cut the mustard... There is no theory of a ~6000 year old earth, again the mustard thing. Denying Evolution is as bad as denying gravity or denying the earth is an oblate sphere... |
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