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5261  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: June 11, 2017, 12:11:43 PM



But keep on pumping that scam! What goes up that kind of parabolic will come down as well! Extremely hard and incredibly fast!
[/quote]

Careful, we're all in the same boat, remember bitcoin has tripled in 65 days.  Shocked
[/quote]

Wrong! Bitcoin has tripled doubled in 3-4 years Wink
5262  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: BYTEBALL: Totally new consensus algorithm + private untraceable payments on: June 11, 2017, 07:03:27 AM

I don't know about your country, but in Spain if you ever get audited by TAX office for cashing out like 1 mill eur coming from "nowhere" (cryptocurrencies investments) you better have some PROOF of all the transactions ever done from beginning. Using anonymous transactions is cool but it will be better then to keep those "anonymous" coins forever in the dark and never try to cash into banking FIAT or you could even face prison for suspected money laundering. Of course I am only talking about any SUSTANCIAL ammount of money you can't prove how you did earn in the past.

Yeah, it sucks, I hate it.... whatever.... But that's how it is. Again, I don't know about your country and maybe it is different. I am just saying there are reasons, at least for some people, to avoid fully anonymous cryptocurrencies.

P.S.: I do keep old past private keys for wallets/paperwallets/etc I have ever used. It's not that I have a sustantial amount right now... but who knows if it ever will... If it does, I feel more confident if I have the ownership proof from the beginning. Just in case.....

Almost makes it not worth dealing in fiat at all...

The amount of hassle involved using fiat is going to be its downfall. And you shouldn't put into fiat that which you cannot afford to lose anyway. When you only have crypto, all of these problems disappear.

Of course, you need small amounts of fiat for daily life until more people start accepting crypto, but you can easily trade crypto for cash and use that.



YOu can of course use your coins to buy stuff, convert into cash using localbitcoins, etc.... But if you want to buy real state, a luxury car, or anything that is more than 3000€ (the legal limit for cash purchases) you need to use BANKING FIAT for that. And for any input into banking you need to pay taxes AND be able to prove its (legit) source.


Make multiple cash purchases on local bitcoins.
I know some people who even go to other countries in EU to get good deals on local bitcoins

Lot of opportunities not to fall into the traps set by banks

Hopefully soon banks are a thing of the past..

One more economic collapse and most banks will not survive I think

Yes, you can convert an almost unlimited ammount of coins into cash using localbitcoins. But that cash is USELESS to buy real state... or even a cheap car... or pay electricity, water supply, phone.. and basically anything that is paid by a bank account.
5263  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: BYTEBALL: Totally new consensus algorithm + private untraceable payments on: June 11, 2017, 06:57:18 AM

I don't know about your country, but in Spain if you ever get audited by TAX office for cashing out like 1 mill eur coming from "nowhere" (cryptocurrencies investments) you better have some PROOF of all the transactions ever done from beginning. Using anonymous transactions is cool but it will be better then to keep those "anonymous" coins forever in the dark and never try to cash into banking FIAT or you could even face prison for suspected money laundering. Of course I am only talking about any SUSTANCIAL ammount of money you can't prove how you did earn in the past.

Yeah, it sucks, I hate it.... whatever.... But that's how it is. Again, I don't know about your country and maybe it is different. I am just saying there are reasons, at least for some people, to avoid fully anonymous cryptocurrencies.

P.S.: I do keep old past private keys for wallets/paperwallets/etc I have ever used. It's not that I have a sustantial amount right now... but who knows if it ever will... If it does, I feel more confident if I have the ownership proof from the beginning. Just in case.....

Almost makes it not worth dealing in fiat at all...

The amount of hassle involved using fiat is going to be its downfall. And you shouldn't put into fiat that which you cannot afford to lose anyway. When you only have crypto, all of these problems disappear.

Of course, you need small amounts of fiat for daily life until more people start accepting crypto, but you can easily trade crypto for cash and use that.



YOu can of course use your coins to buy stuff, convert into cash using localbitcoins, etc.... But if you want to buy real state, a luxury car, or anything that is more than 3000€ (the legal limit for cash purchases) you need to use BANKING FIAT for that. And for any input into banking you need to pay taxes AND be able to prove its (legit) source IF a tax audit happens.
5264  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: BYTEBALL: Totally new consensus algorithm + private untraceable payments on: June 11, 2017, 06:52:36 AM
I got a crap ton of black bytes, but you have to trade them P2P? So they are basically worthless. Is there any expectation that Black Bytes will be on a real exchange any time soon?

Also, why have two coins--> black bytes and bytes? Nobody would choose to use traceable money over untraceable money, so why not just add that as a feature to Bytes? So confusing to me this coin.

There are reasons to do public transactions anyone can check. Imagine you have a fucking ton of byteballs and some day decide to convert them to FIAT. You better have the full trace of them in case of an audit.

Also, for contracts, etc.... How could someone prove he delivered with an untraceable transaction?

Both have their usages.

Audits up until maybe 20 years ago were almost exclusively done with paper so I think have a distributed digital ledger is only a nice to have. Any paper trail is going to stand up in an audit, especially since your holdings\purchases must eventually move in and out of KYC institutions, even for anonymous currencies.

I don't know about your country, but in Spain if you ever get audited by TAX office for cashing out like 1 mill eur coming from "nowhere" (cryptocurrencies investments) you better have some PROOF of all the transactions ever done from beginning. Using anonymous transactions is cool but it will be better then to keep those "anonymous" coins forever in the dark and never try to cash into banking FIAT or you could even face prison for suspected money laundering. Of course I am only talking about any SUSTANCIAL ammount of money you can't prove how you did earn in the past.

Yeah, it sucks, I hate it.... whatever.... But that's how it is. Again, I don't know about your country and maybe it is different. I am just saying there are reasons, at least for some people, to avoid fully anonymous cryptocurrencies.

P.S.: I do keep old past private keys for wallets/paperwallets/etc I have ever used. It's not that I have a sustantial amount right now... but who knows if it ever will... If it does, I feel more confident if I have the ownership proof from the beginning. Just in case.....


In Spain you will most likely get a suspended sentence for money laundering. Very few go to prison for money laundering

Other places in EU  its much more strict



Btw, anyone knows if blackbytes can be traded now?

Very good point. Most probably no prison but... all your money gone and in debt to the tax agency forever. No good either.

I don't know any echange that trades blackbytes. I have suggested someone makes a blackbytes trading bot the same as there is a Byteballs one.
5265  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: BYTEBALL: Totally new consensus algorithm + private untraceable payments on: June 11, 2017, 03:30:35 AM
I got a crap ton of black bytes, but you have to trade them P2P? So they are basically worthless. Is there any expectation that Black Bytes will be on a real exchange any time soon?

Also, why have two coins--> black bytes and bytes? Nobody would choose to use traceable money over untraceable money, so why not just add that as a feature to Bytes? So confusing to me this coin.

There are reasons to do public transactions anyone can check. Imagine you have a fucking ton of byteballs and some day decide to convert them to FIAT. You better have the full trace of them in case of an audit.

Also, for contracts, etc.... How could someone prove he delivered with an untraceable transaction?

Both have their usages.

Audits up until maybe 20 years ago were almost exclusively done with paper so I think have a distributed digital ledger is only a nice to have. Any paper trail is going to stand up in an audit, especially since your holdings\purchases must eventually move in and out of KYC institutions, even for anonymous currencies.

I don't know about your country, but in Spain if you ever get audited by TAX office for cashing out like 1 mill eur coming from "nowhere" (cryptocurrencies investments) you better have some PROOF of all the transactions ever done from beginning. Using anonymous transactions is cool but it will be better then to keep those "anonymous" coins forever in the dark and never try to cash into banking FIAT or you could even face prison for suspected money laundering. Of course I am only talking about any SUSTANCIAL ammount of money you can't prove how you did earn in the past.

Yeah, it sucks, I hate it.... whatever.... But that's how it is. Again, I don't know about your country and maybe it is different. I am just saying there are reasons, at least for some people, to avoid fully anonymous cryptocurrencies.

P.S.: I do keep old past private keys for wallets/paperwallets/etc I have ever used. It's not that I have a sustantial amount right now... but who knows if it ever will... If it does, I feel more confident if I have the ownership proof from the beginning. Just in case.....
5266  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: June 11, 2017, 01:23:08 AM
Please cite names. I'd love to know who you're talking about.

it's probably gonna curse us to say his name. the guy was relentless.

but here it is - jorge stolfi.

FIFY

He has his own show now.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Buttcoin/comments/6fmutm/learn_how_to_buy_bitcoin/dik9rto/?context=3

I really can't understand someone wasting so many time in something he is not invested in. If instead he would have invested when he decided to start his campaign against Bitcoin he would be somewhat rich now and could just go living its life. But no, he chose to keep living a frustrated pointless life for no reason.

I have heard that about 5% of the population has some degree of mental issues.... But I don't think there's one out of 20 with his rating. No way.
5267  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: June 11, 2017, 12:49:10 AM
Please cite names. I'd love to know who you're talking about.

it's probably gonna curse us to say his name. the guy was relentless.

but here it is - jorge stolfi.

FIFY
5268  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: June 11, 2017, 12:47:42 AM
they lost $14 million of ethereum recently so maybe he's watching to see whether it'll implode. they say they're doing fine. how many places have 14 million going spare?

Ouch, that hurts... more so if you are an insignificant exchange and.... the price of the lost coins doubles after the theft. Not looking good.

5269  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: June 11, 2017, 12:30:02 AM
What's up everyone? You guys still observing walls around here?

 165 btc buy wall on Quadrigacx right now! https://twitter.com/theshmadz/status/873688936912109568  (please excuse the shameless plug, but it's easier to post pictures on twitter)

Does anyone know how to figure out what that would do to the price if he got tired of waiting and did a market buy?



I donno. That exchange is not among the ones I do observe. I don't think it will have any significant impact on global price.

What's the reason to use that exchange instead of one of the main ones?
5270  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: June 10, 2017, 11:40:59 PM
OKCoin on ATH clearly above $3000.

Bitstamp on its way.

Kraken struggling due to lack of FIAT. The margin pool is empty.


I guess people are avoiding Kraken since they started to charge 0.0025 BTC for withdraws

YUp, I got hit by that fee a couple days ago. Today I received an email stating that they are reducing it again.

If ETH doesn't start to dump into BTC in the next minutes for a new ATH I will feel very confussed.
5271  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: June 10, 2017, 11:14:49 PM
OKCoin on ATH clearly above $3000.

Bitstamp on its way.

Kraken struggling due to lack of FIAT. The margin pool is empty.
5272  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: June 10, 2017, 11:03:41 PM
Some ICOs seem to make sense. I can't tell you which ones, but from the 700 out there, at least 7 of them (about 1%) have "something", whatever that is, and not just for pure speculation.

As for me, I'm trying to trade my way up.

I am having a hard time doing that. Any time I pick up a coin or ICO and do some research about it all that I found out is rubbish behind it. Yet they still keep rising. It looks like a fucking gamble to me.
5273  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: June 10, 2017, 11:00:16 PM
I think we need to do a little pause here and evaluate what is hapenning here with the altcoins market.

but the conclusion is that some time in the future those ICO's will need to develop or die, and most probably will die. I can't see any reason why that castle won't start crumbling, I just don't know when will that happen.


This is entirely true but a collapse does not happen over night, and for just one company can take years, in ETH case you have 50 startups all with their own dreams of world domination.

Also, The difference between a ponzi scheme and a legit business model is not as bright and clear of a line as everyone would like to believe. A company can survive for a decade on selling just its vision. Even longer if you have a strong enough visionary model. Just look at Amazon, Uber, and even Facebook the first few years. All of them initially huge money losers but their vision of the future was so strong that investment dollars came in for a decade. That is happening now to crypto companies.

I have always contended that these ICO assets are simply a modern security. I actually think much, much better at passing the good fortune of a company's success on to early investors than a stupid Stock. If the economy of the company is driven by the asset, then anyone that owns the asset will reap a reward as that company's economy grows. It is the future of securities in my opinion and makes owning stock feel stupid in comparison.

That said the part you are missing is that 1) it takes years for phony business models to crash, we are in year 1 of ICO insanity, this could go on for five more years and that is if they ALL failed 2) not all of these will fail, some will succeed dramatically, validating the model and supporting the platform (ETH), 3) the only real risk to ETHs platform is regulation, however, that only slows the model and doesn't destroy it in my opinion.

So crashes will happen, but unless a flaw in ETH exposes an across-the-board ownership weakness this train is not stopping and each crashed coin will be replaced by 10 new startups.

Yes, I think you are right. It will take some time until the bubble pops. Plus I guess most people don't really care what they are "investing" as long as it keeps rising. The rise will have a limit, but maybe its nowhere near yet.

I just hope that when that happens there is still a store of value that is not heavily affected by that crash. And I hope that is Bitcoin. BUt who knows anything....
5274  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: BYTEBALL: Totally new consensus algorithm + private untraceable payments on: June 10, 2017, 09:54:39 PM
I got a crap ton of black bytes, but you have to trade them P2P? So they are basically worthless. Is there any expectation that Black Bytes will be on a real exchange any time soon?

Also, why have two coins--> black bytes and bytes? Nobody would choose to use traceable money over untraceable money, so why not just add that as a feature to Bytes? So confusing to me this coin.

There are reasons to do public transactions anyone can check. Imagine you have a fucking ton of byteballs and some day decide to convert them to FIAT. You better have the full trace of them in case of an audit.

Also, for contracts, etc.... How could someone prove he delivered with an untraceable transaction?

Both have their usages.
5275  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: BYTEBALL: Totally new consensus algorithm + private untraceable payments on: June 10, 2017, 09:44:43 PM
I have to thank for the free coins. I will hold them.

I have some suggestions though:

- Transition bot should display the total of BTC linked. That way it would be easier for people with funds in multiple addresses to check if all the addresses with funds in a wallet have correctly linked. It would be a 10 min code change.

- It could also give an estimation of how many coins will be received in next airdrop. I don't need it as it is very easy to calculate, but after seing the huge amount of post just asking that it would be better if transition bot informed them about that too. A couple of minutes code change if the previous item is already implemented.

- I have seen there's a Byteball trading bot.... Good. But I think a Blackbytes trading bot, considering there's no exchange right now trading them, will be much more useful atm.

Again, thanks.
5276  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: June 10, 2017, 08:37:31 PM
I think we need to do a little pause here and evaluate what is hapenning here with the altcoins market.

It seems that one of the reasons behind the crazy surge of ethereum have been the ICO's. Please someone correct me if I am wrong, but this is my view of it:

- There have been lots of ICO's based on ethereum, so that means people need to buy ethereum to join the ico's. That, obviously, pumps the price.

- Previous ICO's have been such sucessfull (not in developing anything of real usage, but in price surge, speculation) that everybody wants to be part of ANY ICO to replicate those incredible price increases.

- Most ICO funders have almost no special knowledge in the area of expertise needed for the future project that are suppossed to develop. Ie: Look at the board members of Primalbase.

- I have tried to analise some of the ICO's in offer (or past ones) trying to find some fundamentals and all I find is vapoware.

- Also, I find nowhere in the terms any protection for the "investor". Unlike when you invest on a business and you have some specific legal rights, in these ICO's it's all nonsense wording. In most cases, nothing stops them for not developing, for just spend the money on their salaries or even for developing a profitable business and those gains not be directly related to tokens pricing nor dividends. They are totally separate things no matter what they "promise".

- There's no point in using the ICO funds on developing any business while the best business atm would be just to hold the coins and sell them afterwards.

- So noone is selling in order to develop the business... maybe just a little part to pay for the funders salary.

- When the pump stops, they will need to finally spend some of the ICO funds to finally develop the intended business.

- When that happens, and many of the ICO's sell, the price will drop as a stone. All the gains vanished.


The case of Primalbase makes for a good example of all this. It's basically a "real state" investment. Usually those have an expected annual return of around 10% when in the hands of real experts. They basically plan to start with the office they themselves are using/are renting/own. What does this tell me?

a) In case they own the office, they will probably buy it from themselves using the ICO money. Do you think they will negotiate hard to get a great price for their investors?

b) In case they are renting it.... don't you think they will use their own tokens to pay for the renting and basically not having to pay for it anymore (basically the ICO funds will pay for it).

c) Why nowhere in the whitepaper are ANY of the data that would be requiered to do due diligence before investing in any business?

d) Do people know that MANY "real life" investments simply fail? Are investors really aware of that? I don't see the usual investment disclaimers and if they are there, they are not front page, but negligently hidden. Do they know they are in a EXTREMELY HIGH risk investment for a theoretical expected return (in best case) of a mere 10%?

I could go on... but the conclusion is that some time in the future those ICO's will need to develop or die, and most probably will die. I can't see any reason why that castle won't start crumbling, I just don't know when will that happen. And I hope that when that happens it will be positive for Bitcoin and not carry it with ethereums doom.

Please someone correct me if I am wrong in my view of current scenario.
5277  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: June 09, 2017, 05:32:59 PM
I could use some of dat parabolic movement in BTC



Jimbo, please never ever use charts in linear instead of logarithmic mode. It gives some false sense of proportions.
5278  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: June 09, 2017, 05:27:50 PM
I just noticed mooncoin is at $60mil market cap.

I was gonna invest in that coin when it was at $22k market cap.

That is a ROI of 2,700. Absolutely ludacris.

Yes, but lets supposse you would have "invested" on it? How much were you considering... I am almost sure it wasn't a sizeable amount anyways, am I wrong?
5279  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: BYTEBALL: Totally new consensus algorithm + private untraceable payments on: June 09, 2017, 05:06:22 PM
The linked address is not an exchange, exchanges arent allowed.

The dude who is loaded with 54k deserves his bytes just as you do. Stop being jelly.

Exchanges are allowed. What's not allowed is exchange users pretending to own exchange hot wallet addresses by making withdrawals from the exchange hot wallet to the transition bot.


What about this? It is very deceitful and honestly just seems like fraud to me. For those that don't think it is:

Quote
fraud
frôd/
noun
noun: fraud; plural noun: frauds

    wrongful or criminal deception intended to result in financial or personal gain.
    "he was convicted of fraud"
    synonyms:   fraudulence, cheating, swindling, embezzlement, deceit, deception, double-dealing, chicanery, sharp practice

It looks ok to me. Business as usual. I don't like that in order to pay them he is going to sell the byteballs inmediately but anyways its according to the rules.

On the other hand, calling fraud something that isn't is not good behaviour.
5280  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: June 09, 2017, 04:45:42 PM
I shoud've just converted all my BTC to ETH...

easy to say in retrospect. and who knows what tomorrow brings? ethereum is storing up plenty of its own problems for the future. bitcoin might well be in the clear by then.

going all in during any pump doesn't make sense. the time to do it was in 2015 when everyone was at maximum indifference.

Another very good moment was when it started pumping from $7 until now. In fact I did buy some at around 15 but sold them all at around 50. The thing is you never know when something is gonna start pumping and, more importantly, it's hard to hold when you don't really believe in that shit and have already got enough profits. I considered it was way overpriced at 40, so i better don't say anything about 250+

Talking about profits, it would have been way better to buy Ripple a couple of months ago when the market cap was below 200 mill and sell them when it reached 10 billion for a 50x increase... But who would have expected that shit to do that?

THere have also been many other shitcoins doing that or even bigger ratio of growth but... Who in their right senses would have bought any sizeable amount of it?

I still think that the altcoin crazyness will come to an end and most of the funds will come back to Bitcoin... but the rally is extending way longer than I expected.
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