Shouldn't miners act always in what is better for higher Bitcoin price (higher rewards for them)? Or is it that for some unexplained reason they think the price would react otherwise?
It's really quite simple. And actually quite obvious. If you lift a stupid production quota that artificially hard-caps the number of transactions Bitcoin is capable of to about a quarter-million per day, then more people can each make more transactions. This is by definition greater utility. Greater utility leads to greater value, and greater value leads to greater price. All boats are floated. I think that everyone agrees that the transaction limit need to grow. And that, if alone, would be a good thing for the price. I really don't care if that is achieved by segwit+LN, BU or whatever... But I do care that if it is done without an almost unanimous consensus trust and confidence could be irreparably damaged, and that leads to reduced value/reduced price. |
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Can anyone (maybe BU supporters) explain me why would miners support an action (non unanimous hard fork) that will surely result in an inmediate drop of the price and also a long term lose of trust/value of Bitcoin?
Shouldn't miners act always in what is better for higher Bitcoin price (higher rewards for them)? Or is it that for some unexplained reason they think the price would react otherwise? Is there a hidden agenda that I am not aware of?
I really can't get it.
Miners want the price to be low most of the time. They love the huge drops, because it keeps the little guys who might be competition out. They also love the pumps so they can sell, but they really don't want it to last too long. If you are counting on the price to go up it's much easier and less risky to buy coins. If you are a miner you want the price low, so you don't have too much competition. If that was the hidden agenda I could understand their motives. But I am not so sure that miners want the price low to avoid competition out from the little guys. I mean... What little guys are there still in mining? It's almost negligible. Even if it were a 20% of the mining market it would never compensate a much higher percentage in loss of price and maybe long term death of Bitcoin. I would understand that reasoning for exchanges: They profit from volatility and big market shakes, exactly what a hard fork would precipitate. Maybe again long tearm death, but big profits in the short term. But miners? It's always better a X% or XX% of market share of a huge market than a 100% share of a death market. The arbitrary prices of bitcoin are based on trust and confidence, when if that trust and confidence is lost there would be no remaining value at all. |
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Can anyone (maybe BU supporters) explain me why would miners support an action (non unanimous hard fork) that will surely result in an inmediate drop of the price and also a long term lose of trust/value of Bitcoin?
Shouldn't miners act always in what is better for higher Bitcoin price (higher rewards for them)? Or is it that for some unexplained reason they think the price would react otherwise? Is there a hidden agenda that I am not aware of?
I really can't get it.
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WTF happens with kraken? One thing is stop losses that takes ages to execute.... but now I have a market order "hanging" for minutes without execution... this is a joke!
Been happening for many months, and is even confirmed by them. Their engine is GOX-like, and their support tickets takes weeks to reply sometimes. Trust me, that market order wont execute, and the stop order can take 36 hours to execute. I kid you not. I learned to not ever use stop loss orders again in Kraken as they would either not execute or execute at the worst possible price long time after it should have executed (I even saw the price rebounding above and below my stop loss several times before execution) but... a MARKET order? This is the last straw for me... |
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WTF happens with kraken? One thing is stop losses that takes ages to execute.... but now I have a market order "hanging" for minutes without execution... this is a joke!
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Elwar, I have been reading a bit more about that "Case" hardware wallet. Definitely it's something I wouldn't recommend: It uses a multisignature requiring two of three keys, one is the case itself, another one is stored in their servers, and the third one is in a vault they have. So... They are in possesion of two of the two needed keys to access the funds. That's a no-no. I supposse I don't need to explain why. That is unless you opted to be the own in custody of the third key (as you should): Who holds the third key?
During first time setup for the device, you can choose where you want your recovery key stored. The default option is to store it in a secure vault operated by Third Key Solutions. If you wish to store your own third key, you will be prompted during the setup flow to scan the public key of your recovery private key. Please note that you will be responsible for signing a transaction with this private key if your device is lost or stolen, and we recommend this only as an advanced option for expert users.
Really, recover that 1btc and buy a proper hardware wallet. Play with it and then I bet you will like it as much as I do now  |
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I supposse you use it for storing the seed/s of a hardware wallet and not for using ever in a software wallet, right?
I'm not very sold on the whole hardware wallet concept. Especially after my Case wallet didn't work as I had hoped. I have the seed but am not sure how I would get my bitcoin back. I have always relied upon just storing the full private key (mixed in a way that only I know). I also was skeptical until a few weeks ago that I started doing my research and was sold on the concept. And now that I have personally tested it, I am more than sold. I didn't know about that hardware wallet you have, but I don't see any signs of a scam, so sure it must be something that can be solved. First, that hardware is different than Trezor/Ledger in that it seems to use some sort of multisignature: Case is extremely secure because it is built on top of a multi-signature, multi-factor architecture with no single point of failure. Your bitcoin wallet has three keys and two of them are needed to complete a transaction. One key is embedded on the device so it is secured by the possession factor. No one can gain access to this key without having possession of the device. However, this key isn’t enough to complete a transaction. A second key is stored on our servers and transactions are only signed by the server key if the fingerprint scan is a match so this key is secured by a biometric factor. That means even if your device is lost or our servers are compromised, your bitcoins are safe. A third key sits in an offline vault and is only used if you ever lose your Case to help you recover your bitcoins. So, I am not sure if I would recommend a device like that (sound too cumbersome... I want to control the seed MYSELF) but it looks like there are ways for you to recover your bitcoin. In the worst case they say they have "a third key in their offline vault". Maybe you should recover that bitcoin and invest 10% of it in a proper hardware wallet |
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 I am not so sure about this one. I put 1 bitcoin on it last year, checked it later and never saw the bitcoin. You say you put 1 bitcoin and never saw the bitcoin and your not sure so about it? I would be soooooo fucking sure if that happened to me. |
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I think a factor in the high price is that people who thought it would be safer to wait until an ETF was available to get in because of institutional protection, their lack of tech knowledge, whatever, have realised they don't get that luxury and have starting buying directly. This is a bit of a silk road v2 situation IMO, everyone thought the value was due to X and then X vanishes and it retains the value = collect jaw drop and then FOMO.
Yup. Hardware wallets are selling out fast. Why use an ETF when you can hodl your bitcoins at home on a Trezor? (If you can find one to buy). ^paper wallets a thing of the past? :\ I bought a few of these:  I am quite impressed. Dude tries to destroy one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u1hLFsBuDT0That's one of my next buys... I find it quite expensive for what it "does" though. I mean I can engrave the seed on some metal plate myself. But the coolness factor of cryptosteel is impressive I supposse you use it for storing the seed/s of a hardware wallet and not for using ever in a software wallet, right? |
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Yup. Hardware wallets are selling out fast.
Why use an ETF when you can hodl your bitcoins at home on a Trezor? (If you can find one to buy).
this is very true. i bought a ledger nano s the other day and it took quite some finding. amazon sold out and couldn't tell me when they were getting more in. I just bought a nano s from amazon for $69 shipped Hasn't got here yet.. TUXexchange dev miniteef said that they were the best and that I had to have one, so I popped.. I paid almost 90EUR buying it directly from Ledger + UPS shipping  Don't regret it though, but.... |
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The Bears will come. The ETF not being approved signals a new bear market. Altho many are trying to see the silver lining in the dark cloud ahead, its hard ignore the obvious; market was high on the possibly of the ETF being approved, but it was denied and we saw just how dog-eat-dog the traders became, dumping BTC SUPER-FAST down to 975 flat before letting it bounce, after that 1050 was the battle ground, bears lost, then 1100, now we are at 1150 and bulls feel they've won. I think its far from over, altho i will loss the small bet i made stating <975 before monday 00:00 EST, the bears will come, and the bulls might be exhausted from their recent run when they do. The above chart paints a bearish channel, i do expect to be trading in this channel for the next week or too. However the next 48hours are absolutely critical, if bulls can sustain price above 1120 for that time, this may signal a complete and utter failure from the bear team. but i am warning bulls to keep there cool and not go chasing magical unicorns, market ought to adjust itself before resuming full speed ahead. What a bunch of random lines you draw there! I think you are confusing the concepts of MAYBE another dump/correction incoming with a "bear market" which is much different and there is no sign/reason for that yet. |
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My trezors handle:
1) bitcoin transactions etc.
2) password manager
3) u2f 2fa
Do Nano S devices do all of these things? I might check them out one day if they do.
I have only been using it for a week so maybe there is more that I don't know but: 1) Yes, and ethereum (eth/etc), litecoin, dash, and some others 2) I think it doesnt but I read it is in the works or something. Not sure. 3) Yes, FIDO U2F I did a pretty extensive comparison on both before ordering the Nano S and found them to be very similar but in the end I ordered the Nano S because: 1) It was a bit less expensive (69 vs 99). 2) Trezor was out of stock 3) Trezor V2 is said to be in the works I was more inclined to the Trezor at first, but after the features comparison and those three points above the choice was clear for me, and my second device will be a Trezor V2 in the future. One thing I liked about the Nano S is the seed is stored in a secure chip while a microprocessor in the Trezor.... Worth to mention, but minor point as I don't expect anyone to get posession of my device and do pro reverse engineering with it anyways. Maybe the only advantage Nano S has over Trezor is that the seed doesn't ever need to be input using a computer as it can be introduced directly in the device. (one less possible attack vector). And the Trezor, well, it was the first and most well known and also has the password manager. It also had some other advantages like an additional passphrase but that changed in the latest firmware: https://medium.com/@Ledger/a-short-guide-to-nano-s-firmware-1-3-features-b92c939e7c9f#.ef0xxe87xAs i don't have a Trezor myself I can only talk about what I researched about it. |
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I use Nano S and Trezor. I like Trezor better because I can use it with one hand but that is a minor quibble. It is a good idea to keep a portable copy of latest Electrum on your desktop if you are using the Chrome apps for Nano S; once in a while the Ledger servers have a problem usually on a weekend. If you trade Ether you can use MyEtherWallet as a backup to the Ledger Ether Chrome app. Yes, I have started using the chrome apps and found them to be extremely straightforward to use while having the basic features. I tried using electrum with it but the version I am running seems to be missing some libs/modules for the nano (Linux). I will try updating soon, but no hurry. I am much more happy with the hardware wallet concept than I could possibly expect. In fact I will also buy Trezor V2 when it is out to have a second device. Then I will decide if I congure both the same seed or as independent wallets. |
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I think a factor in the high price is that people who thought it would be safer to wait until an ETF was available to get in because of institutional protection, their lack of tech knowledge, whatever, have realised they don't get that luxury and have starting buying directly. This is a bit of a silk road v2 situation IMO, everyone thought the value was due to X and then X vanishes and it retains the value = collect jaw drop and then FOMO.
Yup. Hardware wallets are selling out fast. Why use an ETF when you can hodl your bitcoins at home on a Trezor? (If you can find one to buy). ^paper wallets a thing of the past? :\ paperwallets have several attack vectors that hardware wallets don't have. Main ones during generation and during redeeming while hardware wallets never expose the private keys to another computer/device as the signing is done in-device. So maybe not a thing of the past, and also have its usage case for sure, but I bet they will be being replaced by hardware wallets for the most part. |
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I think a factor in the high price is that people who thought it would be safer to wait until an ETF was available to get in because of institutional protection, their lack of tech knowledge, whatever, have realised they don't get that luxury and have starting buying directly. This is a bit of a silk road v2 situation IMO, everyone thought the value was due to X and then X vanishes and it retains the value = collect jaw drop and then FOMO.
Yup. Hardware wallets are selling out fast. Why use an ETF when you can hodl your bitcoins at home on a Trezor? (If you can find one to buy). No kidding. After long time considering buying one I finally did past week and I couldn't be happier now. Way better and more secure than my previous mess of having some in exchanges, some in software wallets and some in paperwallets. Now I can only recommend to anyone that doesn't have one to buy one asap. It's a whole new dimension. There's really no reason not to have one except maybe for someone with less than 1btc. I did buy a Ledger Nano S though, which is mostly the same than Trezor. |
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More time for accumulation before $2000 at the end of this year. And at some point in time there might be a bitcoin ETF, we've seen what this can do with the price.
But... But... where is the dip we are waiting for more accumulation? This is getting scary. |
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ETF failed and we're still at the price we were in Feb? I was told there would be a crash  is it still coming once the BU decide to fork? The price we were in Feb? It was lower than this TWO days ago. |
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So... Where are all the huge dumps and bounces? Only one?
I guess this a much smaller impact than everyone was predicting. Maybe the big correction and pump before the decision contributed to clear a lot of leverage and cushioned the dump?
it's gonna take a while to digest. i think there are some big bags waiting to unload. maybe they're waiting for bids to build up again and some false security to develop. Maybe. But the fact is that we are right now at the same level of the bottom of the correction we were... just two days ago! Add that many people already dumped or were already out before the decision and waiting for reentry. Who knows... but it doesn't look terribly ugly to me. |
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So... Where are all the huge dumps and bounces? Only one?
I guess this a much smaller impact than everyone was predicting. Maybe the big correction and pump before the decision contributed to clear a lot of leverage and cushioned the dump?
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Is anybody here buying with leverage pre decision?
leverage buying or selling, pre decision, is kinda like going all in on black at the roulette table the idea is to secure profits / take a hedging position. I will probably use leverage if the ETF is rejected and the price drops. Doing it before knowing would be a too risky bet. |
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