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Author Topic: Nefario  (Read 198249 times)
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October 10, 2012, 01:45:08 AM
 #801

Are people seriously thinking Nefario is the good guy in this?  Are you all sheep?  This has got to be some troll bait, no one can be that stupid...

In no way is Nefario anything but a crook, its just a matter of if the thief stole from his fellow thieves or if the other parties are innocent.

Nefario is the one with all the money and not talking.  This was far too quick for a government agency to get involved any more than a very tip of a start of an investigation, there was no time for gag orders or imprisonment or anything even close to causing Nefario to only have communication via his index.html page which he failed to meet his own deadline.

Come on sheep, wake up, he took your money, he is a thief and we will only see more of the truth in the coming days/weeks....

Nobody is a good guy here, but all sides have admitted Nefario is the one thief who was willing to blow the whistle and contact the authorities.  Punishing the whistleblower will only promote more scams.  Punish instead the folks who have been going out of their way to stop him by trying to extort him using his wages and launching this public smear campaign full of selective leaks of information. 

He may have contacted a lawyer, I didn't see anywhere it said he contacted the authorities or any proof of that at all.  Who knows if he was being honest about contacting a lawyer or just giving himself an excuse for needed time without talking.... regardless his deadlines are up and there is nothing that should be preventing him from explaining what is going on, if he was able to update his webpage and able to log into the forums he can comment.

Please do show me where he contacted the authorities?

We have received no proof at all that he did or that he even spoke to a lawyer.

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There are several different types of Bitcoin clients. Hybrid server-assisted clients like Electrum get a lot of their network information from centralized servers, but they also check the server's results using blockchain header data. This is perhaps somewhat more secure than either server-assisted clients or header-only clients.
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October 10, 2012, 01:48:27 AM
 #802

Are people seriously thinking Nefario is the good guy in this?  Are you all sheep?  This has got to be some troll bait, no one can be that stupid...

In no way is Nefario anything but a crook, its just a matter of if the thief stole from his fellow thieves or if the other parties are innocent.

Nefario is the one with all the money and not talking.  This was far too quick for a government agency to get involved any more than a very tip of a start of an investigation, there was no time for gag orders or imprisonment or anything even close to causing Nefario to only have communication via his index.html page which he failed to meet his own deadline.

Come on sheep, wake up, he took your money, he is a thief and we will only see more of the truth in the coming days/weeks....

Nobody is a good guy here, but all sides have admitted Nefario is the one thief who was willing to blow the whistle and contact the authorities.  Punishing the whistleblower will only promote more scams.  Punish instead the folks who have been going out of their way to stop him by trying to extort him using his wages and launching this public smear campaign full of selective leaks of information.  

Nefario set the whole thing up in the first place so dont go bullshitting that anyone else put him up to it.

Exactly and he didn't blow any whistle.   He went to try to make his exchange legit and his illusions of grandeur disappear.  The FSA was probably SO HAPPY his lawyer made it so easy for them to shut down GBLSE they were like, "fuck it, tell him if he does like like NOW, we won't even through him in jail".   Regardless of your opinion, running an unlicensed equity exchange is highly illegal in just about everywhere.

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October 10, 2012, 01:49:52 AM
 #803

I am also confused by this:

Nefario encrypted his entire password database with a shared key using Shamir's secret sharing. 4 out of the 5 shareholders Nefario selected would need to agree in order to access the database at all. There aren't enough people in agreement.

Then later theymos said:

I doubt the contingency plan which would have allowed shareholders to access the database still works. The plan allowed shareholders to get passwords (to the server and maybe the off-site backup service), but Nefario changed his passwords if he has any sense whatsoever. And to even try this I'd need to convince one of Nefario's two strongest supporters among the shareholders.

So the contingency plan was a password to log into the database was encrypted by 4 people but no one was backing up a database to an another server, computer, or cloud?  If this is correct?  Who are the 5 people?

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October 10, 2012, 01:50:28 AM
 #804

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So he "blew his whistle" and ended the scam by taking our funds, in effect scamming us?  That's a good one.  I guess you consider the Greater Good to have been served by this?

Part of going to authorities is that he has to follow the law as he moves forward or risk incriminating himself even more.  The legal system will handle the funds, he can't just send them back to the scammer investors.  Talk to a lawyer and handle it properly.  

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Except that theymos seemingly was not made responsible for holding those funds.  If he were, he should have them in hand right now.

He was the Treasurer, if someone is stealing the funds from him he should take the matter to the police.

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Is it illegal or criminal now?  

Running an unregulated securities market is a violation of the law, yes.

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Scam people out of wages, your the 2nd person to put this on here, where is the backup to this calm, I read the details just released, I didn't get that sense?

He threatened to withhold wages in response to Nefario's desire to cease breaking the law.  That is extortion.

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Until the exchange shutdown, the shares had value.

The exchange itself was illegal and it was known the shutdown was imminent, there was no value in owning it.  

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Nefario set the whole thing up in the first place so dont go bullshitting that anyone else put him up to it.

He and his partners are all responsible for their actions.  Nefario's decision to go the legal route now is one of those actions.  Informers get treated lightly all the time, you have to do so or they never come forward and you can't stop crime and scams.

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We have received no proof at all that he did or that he even spoke to a lawyer.

Of course we have proof.  We have his testimony that he was doing so and we have the extreme reaction of his partners in crime who have tried to scam and extort their way out of this in response.  The SEC is not going to publicly announce their response until they are ready to.  



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October 10, 2012, 01:50:33 AM
 #805

Nefario set the whole thing up in the first place so dont go bullshitting that anyone else put him up to it.

Still we don't know the entire situation at this point. Additional information may surface soon. I would encourage all people involved to present evidence of the entire chain of events leading up to the closing of site. Barring that, since I've now written off my losses, I'm going to stop caring what happens here.

P.S. Thanks for the prev. edit you adjusted it to say what I meant.


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October 10, 2012, 01:57:04 AM
 #806

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We have received no proof at all that he did or that he even spoke to a lawyer.

Of course we have proof.  We have his testimony that he was doing so and we have the extreme reaction of his partners in crime who have tried to scam and extort their way out of this in response.  The SEC is not going to publicly announce their response until they are ready to. 


Was he under oath?   


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Until the exchange shutdown, the shares had value.

The exchange itself was illegal and it was known the shutdown was imminent, there was no value in owning it. 

If my memory serves me right, the sales of the shares were before the lawyer or FSA was brought into it.  Some people might of even thought it would succeed and they would have even more value.

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Scam people out of wages, your the 2nd person to put this on here, where is the backup to this calm, I read the details just released, I didn't get that sense?


He threatened to withhold wages in response to Nefario's desire to cease breaking the law.  That is extortion.

Can you post and quote the "threat" for me, maybe I am missing something. 

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October 10, 2012, 01:57:37 AM
 #807

A major complicating factor in all of this is that without the database, there is no way to prove ownership of any assets or BTC that were held on GLBSE.  Even if someone trustworthy had control of all of the user funds and was willing to repay everyone right now, without that database, there is no way to pay them out to users without blindly trusting all of the claims made.

Getting that database is imperative in order to have any hope of resolving this mess.

To all you Nefario supporters who are blocking access, show yourselves.  To you honest shareholders who know their identities, please reveal them to us.

"All safe deposit boxes in banks or financial institutions have been sealed... and may only be opened in the presence of an agent of the I.R.S." - President F.D. Roosevelt, 1933
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October 10, 2012, 02:00:28 AM
 #808


GLBSE was a product created by BitcoinGlobal. BitcoinGlobal is an "Internet corporation" not registered anywhere. I believe that from the standpoint of the law, Nefario is sole proprietor of GLBSE and BitcoinGlobal doesn't exist. But BitcoinGlobal's bylaws can be enforced by this community.

CEO: Nefario
Secretary: ColdHardMetal
Accountant: ColdHardMetal
Treasurer: Me

Nefario's supporters are decent enough people. I don't want to open them up to harassment by releasing their names.

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October 10, 2012, 02:03:24 AM
 #809

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Was he under oath?  

This is not relevant.  None of the evidence against Nefario was presented under oath and thus by your standards none exists.  

Quote
If my memory serves me right, the sales of the shares were before the lawyer or FSA was brought into it.  Some people might of even thought it would succeed and they would have even more value.

Theymos has admitted that his actions were in response to Nefario's desire to cease lawbreaking.  Trying to monkey around with the timeline will not obfuscate that.

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Can you post and quote the "threat" for me, maybe I am missing something.  

It was the context of the previously quoted interaction on the topic of wages.  

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To all you Nefario supporters who are blocking access, show yourselves.   To you honest shareholders who know their identities, please reveal them to us.

Do not attempt to intimidate people into illegally returning funds to scammers.  

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We have received no proof at all that he did or that he even spoke to a lawyer.

Of the underlying ironies of this statement is that it supposes that this organization fell apart purely because of the threat the criminal nature would be revealed to the authorities.  A company so vulnerable it was killed by a rumor is not worthless?  Of course, Nefario did in fact go to the authorities but even had he not all it shows is Theymos was willing to dump worthless shares on this forum at even a rumor that his lawbreaking will be revealed.  

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October 10, 2012, 02:05:34 AM
 #810

To all you Nefario supporters who are blocking access, show yourselves.  To you honest shareholders who know their identities, please reveal them to us.

I would post the names if I thought getting the password database was likely to help. But Nefario almost certainly changed the passwords.

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October 10, 2012, 02:06:00 AM
 #811

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So he "blew his whistle" and ended the scam by taking our funds, in effect scamming us?  That's a good one.  I guess you consider the Greater Good to have been served by this?

Part of going to authorities is that he has to follow the law as he moves forward or risk incriminating himself even more.  The legal system will handle the funds, he can't just send them back to the scammer investors.  Talk to a lawyer and handle it properly.

Right.  I'm a scammer because I opened an account, deposited, and then had the site shut down and my funds become inaccessible to me.

I had planned to buy some shares of ASICMINER.  This makes me a "scammer investor"?

Your solution of "hire a lawyer" is a non-solution.  The costs would severely outweigh the 50 BTC I seek to recover, even if the effort did manage to recover them, which I doubt it would.

"All safe deposit boxes in banks or financial institutions have been sealed... and may only be opened in the presence of an agent of the I.R.S." - President F.D. Roosevelt, 1933
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October 10, 2012, 02:06:22 AM
 #812

on GLBSE you can log in and put email and payout address....and give up your identity.
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October 10, 2012, 02:08:44 AM
 #813

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Right.  I'm a scammer because I opened an account, deposited, and then had the site shut down and my funds become inaccessible to me.

I had planned to buy some shares of ASICMINER.  This makes me a "scammer investor"?

Your solution of "hire a lawyer" is a non-solution.  The costs would severely outweigh the 50 BTC I seek to recover, even if the effort did manage to recover them, which I doubt it would.

I did not say you were, but many of the customers are scammers.  There is no way to tell you from a scammer account without verifying your identity. 

"Money is like manure: Spread around, it helps things grow. Piled up in one place, it just stinks."
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October 10, 2012, 02:17:46 AM
 #814

on GLBSE you can log in and put email and payout address....and give up your identity.

That ain't acceptable to me.  I never agreed to give that kind of information.

http://i.imgur.com/CiDfd.png

"All safe deposit boxes in banks or financial institutions have been sealed... and may only be opened in the presence of an agent of the I.R.S." - President F.D. Roosevelt, 1933
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October 10, 2012, 02:18:47 AM
 #815

on GLBSE you can log in and put email and payout address....and give up your identity.

After an email and payout address screen, the next asks for:

Quote
To comply with money laundering regulations we must ask you to submit documents for proof of your address and identity.

1.  Please provide a clear picture of your photo ID. For France, Germany, Spain, and English speaking countries ID cards, Passports and drivers licences are accepted, for everywhere else only passports are accepted.

2.  Please provide a clear picture of you, holding a piece of paper with your GLBSE username and the date written on it.

3.  Please provide a clear(unaltered) picture of proof of address. Tax statements or utility bills are accepted. This must clearly show your name (same as that on your ID) and address, it must also be dated within the last 3 months.

Not accepted are bank statements or bills issued electronically

Introducing constraints to the economy only serves to limit what can be economical.
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October 10, 2012, 02:21:35 AM
 #816

To all you Nefario supporters who are blocking access, show yourselves.  To you honest shareholders who know their identities, please reveal them to us.

I would post the names if I thought getting the password database was likely to help. But Nefario almost certainly changed the passwords.

Will you post all personal information on Nefario that you have then?

Introducing constraints to the economy only serves to limit what can be economical.
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October 10, 2012, 02:23:03 AM
 #817

Will you post all personal information on Nefario that you have then?

I don't have any personal info. ColdHardMetal has his phone number and address, I think. This info might also be public somewhere.

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October 10, 2012, 02:30:12 AM
 #818

on GLBSE you can log in and put email and payout address....and give up your identity.

That ain't acceptable to me.  I never agreed to give that kind of information.

http://i.imgur.com/CiDfd.png

What do you expect from a scammer.  I can't wait until GLBSE legit comes out.  I will make it my part-time mission to talk trash about it.

Introducing constraints to the economy only serves to limit what can be economical.
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October 10, 2012, 02:35:09 AM
 #819

I'll be curious to see if anyone foolhardy enough to submit all this data actually gets a payout.

"All safe deposit boxes in banks or financial institutions have been sealed... and may only be opened in the presence of an agent of the I.R.S." - President F.D. Roosevelt, 1933
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October 10, 2012, 02:36:22 AM
 #820

on GLBSE you can log in and put email and payout address....and give up your identity.

That ain't acceptable to me.  I never agreed to give that kind of information.

http://i.imgur.com/CiDfd.png

Trying not to enjoy the lulz...and having some trouble...

But certainly the defunct GLBSE will have retained top talent to design a secure repository for this data.  Like Bitcoin Consultancy or something.  So what could go wrong?


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