[Archive] BFL trolling museum

[smoothie]

Good to see news of progress from BFL and hopefully a deliverable product some time in February. 

There is your keyword. Keep hanging in there. The marathon of waiting BFL evangelists on their pre-orders.

[Frizz23]

P.S. Avalons' device is tested to work up to 105F (ambient temperatures).

That's a good trick, since they don't even have a device to test with. But don't let facts get in the way of your bullshit, please continue.

They don't have empty boxes with fans like you have, right? 




No ASIC "vendor" has proven to have working devices yet.

The only devices you have are those in your wet dreams.

[nathanrees19]

First they (BFL) stated they were perfectly ready to ship (or so they thought) in October 2012.

It's quite embarrassing for a company when they think they're ready to ship, but then realise that they have INSERT_MAJOR_ISSUE and INSERT_MINOR_ISSUE and have to delay. Companies don't like to show off their failures, so they would (understandably) want to be light on details. If they have active competitors, they want to be very light on details so that their competitors can't learn from their mistakes. Therefore, any announcement you see will rarely be the full story; perhaps just INSERT_MINOR_ISSUE.

Apparent inconsistencies between announcements are likely in this situation.

[becoin]

Companies don't like to show off their failures, so they would (understandably) want to be light on details.

Not if they burn other peoples money!

[tbcoin]

I think that the best bet that can make all BFL haters, is that if BFL finally is not a scam and ship, leave this forum forever. I think the community will benefit considerably.

So unpleasant people only might be tolerable if they are right.

[makomk]

They did - it was in the first set of pictures they released showcasing the PCB.

Pictures:  http://bitcoinmagazine.com/butterfly-labs-releases-more-asic-photos/

We made the decision to go with QFN in December. I can't really talk about our development process itself, but we have gone through extensive design and testing phases... at one point in early December we decided to look at a worst case scenario if the chips were in a really hot environment (you can see the bubbled chip in one of the pictures, I think someone pointed it out.).

That makes no sense. Those photos were released in October and the worst-case scenario testing supposedly wasn't until December.

[CharlieContent]

I think that the best bet that can make all BFL haters, is that if BFL finally is not a scam and ship, leave this forum forever. I think the community will benefit considerably.

So unpleasant people only might be tolerable if they are right.

I agree to this, but only if you leave if they don't ship.

[becoin]

The Manual:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=136615.0

[BR0KK]

The Manual:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=136615.0

You by yourself violated rule 2 "not to be greedy"

[becoin]

You by yourself violated rule 2 "not to be greedy"

Explain? I paid X amount of bticoins and want that SAME amount refunded. How am I greedy?

[mobodick]

Once again, it's not the ASIC chips themselves that have the problem... it's the surrounding components.  The maximum temperature we saw (in simulations) in the QFN package was 95C with a max of 121C.  However, the MCU and a few other components had a ~100C maximum temp.  With 8 of these units, the heat simply builds up under the QFN plastic and sheds into the ground plane, transferring all that heat throughout the entire 92mmx92mm board.  So at least 20w or 30w of heat is being dissipated on a 92mm board that has very poor thermal dissipation properties.  

BFL's made a poor strategic choice here - they're in a market that calls for the "marginally adequate products" and they are creating something else entirely.

Possibly... but I think it's more likely that we'd be right back here in several months with people calling us all sorts of names for forcing an upgrade cycle on them again and calling us greedy assholes for forcing people to upgrade so we can grab more cash.  Instead, we chose to provide a product that will be viable for a long time, far longer than any other product.  You'll still be mining with our first gen product well into the third or fourth gen Avalon, if they ever make it that far.

Dude, you haven't even got a product on the market and here you are making promises again.
LOL at pulling more stuff out of your ass, how much space is in there anyway?

[bitmar]

What is the connection between QFN / FCBGA and Clock Buffers?
I thought they had problems with Clock Buffers.

[PuertoLibre]

First they (BFL) stated they were perfectly ready to ship (or so they thought) in October 2012.

It's quite embarrassing for a company when they think they're ready to ship, but then realise that they have INSERT_MAJOR_ISSUE and INSERT_MINOR_ISSUE and have to delay. Companies don't like to show off their failures, so they would (understandably) want to be light on details.

Wow.

Translated: "Downplay absolutely everything. When customers ask, make a fake sounding release that is light on details and even gives the customer the wrong impression so you can keep working on it for the next 2.5 months."

This is said by a self described BFL apologist (Nathan). So the question comes to mind, why is he so accepting of this type of scenario?

If they have active competitors, they want to be very light on details so that their competitors can't learn from their mistakes.

Baloney.

There worry is more about their customers than the competition. Look Nathan, I know you like the koolaid but stop proverbially drinking what comes out of Joshs' jar at the BFL afterparty.

There was almost nothing been released by BFL that any normal engineer does not already know.

BFL is using a shitload of "spin" and you are gobbling it up big time. They _say_ they are worried about the competition, as of yet they have _not released_ anything that would be considered useful. They are absolutely playing up _a mind game_ and banking on the stupidity of some to believe it.

Even now, they are still holding on to secrets. So _that right there_ gives you a broad indication that they are bullshitting everyone on this forum. Josh has stated that they believe bASIC is gone and Avalon is committed (which means they cannot change anything nor use any of that information strategically.)

What they are doing is paying _lip service_ to the dumb who don't know jack. The guise is that we are releasing information now that the competition is committed...)oh but we aren't releasing stuff that they could actually use).

This is a staple of the gullible. (Not realizing this point!)

Therefore, any announcement you see will rarely be the full story; perhaps just INSERT_MINOR_ISSUE.

Apparent inconsistencies between announcements are likely in this situation.

OUch, the BFL apologist actually realizes there was an inconsistency. I see a crack in a facade. Josh, quickly apply crazy glue® before any more realizations break out....

[PuertoLibre]

Companies don't like to show off their failures, so they would (understandably) want to be light on details.

Not if they burn other peoples money!

Bingo!

That is why there is secrecy. Nothing being said right now is a secret to an engineer with experience.

Only the absolute dumbest people would believe that BS line.

[My joke of an imagination is written below:)
(BFL Engineer: OH SHIT!
Josh: What?
BFL Engineer: Our plastic covered ASIC just blew up with a puff of smoke!
Josh: Wait, what? Why did that happen?
BFL Engineer: Apparently plastic does not conduct as much heat as silicon?
Josh: No Shit sherlock. Ahh SHIT.... Now I have to go make some shit up and downplay this.
BFL Engineer: No wait, don't tell them anything. Our competition might find out about plastic not being a good choice we made when overclocking our chips from 40GH to 60GH. How could I possibly have known that? SHIT, do you think bASIC and Avalon and ASICMINER possibly know that?!
Josh: No man, they have too little experience in physics. I will just have to write up a delay, but I don't know what to say...
BFL Engineer: Well Shit, tell them something! Clock buffer! It was the Clock Buffer. (thats also bad...he whispers silently to himself)
Josh: What is a clock buffer?
BFL Engineer: Hold on let me get my text book. Here it is....etc.
Josh: Okay, don't worry about it, I will (re)spin this shit so we can ship in the next three months. They are too stupid to know that any retard knows this stuff. Our customers are the best!
BFL Engineer/Josh: Laugh about it over a cold bear next to a burnt and smokey ASIC.)

[PuertoLibre]

What is the connection between QFN / FCBGA and Clock Buffers?
I thought they had problems with Clock Buffers.

Shhh!!!!

[meowmeowbrowncow]

Companies don't like to show off their failures, so they would (understandably) want to be light on details.

Not if they burn other peoples money!

Bingo!

That is why there is secrecy. Nothing being said right now is a secret to an engineer with experience.

Only the absolute dumbest people would believe that BS line.

[My joke of an imagination is written below:)
(BFL Engineer: OH SHIT!
Josh: What?
BFL Engineer: Our plastic covered ASIC just blew up with a puff of smoke!
Josh: Wait, what? Why did that happen?
BFL Engineer: Apparently plastic does not conduct as much heat as silicon?
Josh: No Shit sherlock. Ahh SHIT.... Now I have to go make some shit up and downplay this.
BFL Engineer: No wait, don't tell them anything. Our competition might find out about plastic not being a good choice we made when overclocking out chips from 40GH to 60GH. How could I possibly have known that? SHIT, do you think bASIC and Avalon and ASICMINER possibly know that?!
Josh: No man, they have too little experience in physics. I will just have to write up a delay, but I don't know what to say...
BFL Engineer: Well Shit, tell them something! Clock buffer! It was the Clock Buffer. (that also bad...he whispers silently to himself)
Josh: What is a clock buffer?
BFL Engineer: Hold on let me get my text book. Here it is....etc.
Josh: Okay, don't worry about it, I will spin this shit so we can ship in the next three months. They are too stupid to know that any retard knows this stuff. Our customers are the best!
BFL Engineer/Josh: Laugh about it over a cold bear next to a burnt and smokey ASIC.)

That gave me a real lol.   nice.

[niko]

BFL never saw even one bitcoin from a customer.

This is fully under BFL control and how do they setup their account with Bitpay.

BFL creates an invoice for a price in USD

This statement does not correspond to actual situation:

Are you saying that, when buying online using a credit card, I am not paying in USD, but in "digits"? Because I need to type in my credit card number.

The product was clearly priced in USD. You didn't pay in bitcoins, you paid through bitcoin network - much like Visa network.

[BR0KK]

BFL never saw even one bitcoin from a customer.

This is fully under BFL control and how do they setup their account with Bitpay.

BFL creates an invoice for a price in USD

This statement does not correspond to actual situation:

Are you saying that, when buying online using a credit card, I am not paying in USD, but in "digits"? Because I need to type in my credit card number.

The product was clearly priced in USD. You didn't pay in bitcoins, you paid through bitcoin network - much like Visa network.

We tried , we failed !
Stahp Feeding the Troll....
Nah he's just greedy

[greyhawk]

I still want him to videotape a discussion with his lawyer for our enjoyment.

[BR0KK]

I still want him to videotape a discussion with his lawyer for our enjoyment.

That would be awesome... Imagine something like this:http://youtu.be/NmFo-LKHGY0 (poof it's gone)
He clould use this to make a case: http://youtu.be/clKi92j6eLE (chewbaka defense)