Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[gentlemand]

https://medium.com/@bitfinexed/the-bitfinex-dilemma-blow-up-now-or-try-a-hail-mary-to-retain-in-business-10b9d989359f

Thoughts??

That fella would still be writing stuff like that if Gandhi was personally issuing each and every dollar with a handwritten note of authenticity and a wink.

Despite that I think it's still possible. The truly powerful bull run beyond $1000-1200 dovetailed precisely with their loss of banking and I don't think it's unrelated. BFX is still the exchange every other one looks to.

Their past track record is gross in terms of opaqueness and it hasn't let up one bit. We can either hope that they're swept up in general mania and become irrelevant or their magical audit finally arrives and puts all of this to bed.

[600watt]

Why would lightning layer not be for the average Joe? It could be literally without fees if he and Starbucks agree there should be no fees. What would be the incentive for any of sides, he and Starbucks, not to do it?

It is certainly possible and might even happen for a while but you don't need the worlds most secure network to secure coffee funds. Opening a lightning channel could still cost Starbucks or the customer $10-$100 in fees to open or close on the bitcoin network. More likely Starbucks would open a channel with your bank and it's suppliers and close the channel each day, week, month to settle the account.

I disagree. As far as i understood the Lightning protocol, although it's not easy and maybe I'm mistaken, if millions of customers open long lasting channel with Sturbucks there is no need to close all of them to bring funds back to fiat. Lighning channels can transfer the funds between each another, and in the end of the day Starbacks can transfer the funds from all daily transactions to "closing" channel (to call it that way) and confirm all of them from arbitrarily large number of customers with paying one single transaction fee for closing the "closing" channel. I believe they would gladly pay one opening/closing fee for each day, regarding the potential number of transactions.

I don't think opening a channel with Starbucks and every other company you deal with is going to be the most efficient use of LN. If the average Joe does use LN, he will open channels with a bank or service provider like Coinbase. That provider will have open channels with major companies like Starbucks and your employer so that there are payments being made in both directions. The companies are paying out to some people and being paid in by others but only the net difference is recorded to the blockchain periodically. However, most people will just leave their coins with the bank/provider to handle the details so I still don't think the average Joe will use LN. The average person reading this thread might though.

you guys just don´t get it: by the time core´s bitcoin plans come into fruition when an average bitcoiner goes to a Starbucks and wants a coffee, the staff will always serve him/her first and bow to him/her, because they know that this bitcoiner may use his bitcoin und just fuckin buy the whole Starbuck place. 

[jojo69]

OT, but worth a watch...slaughterbots

https://youtu.be/9CO6M2HsoIA

[CristiTCM]

https://www.coindesk.com/survey-plurality-of-bitcoin-users-think-it-can-change-world/
looks like people won't sell bitcoin any time soon 

[WhatsBitcoin]

Saw this in a 4chan /pol/ thread.

https://boards.4chan.org/pol/thread/149690394



http://omnichest.info/lookupadd.aspx?address=3MbYQMMmSkC3AgWkj9FMo5LsPTW1zBTwXL

whatever works.

[jbreher]

Where are the BCH boyz ? They seem quiet lately

<<raises hand>>

Hey guys, maybe someone can make me understand
Do you think we will be able to use BTC in a couple of years to buy for example coffee?
The real question is, the minimum fee we can pay is 1 sat, there is nothing less than 1 sat, right? but if in the next years 1 sat = $2/3, the fee will be as expensive as the thing you wanna buy (coffee). I don't like this BTC = Gold/store of value, I want to use BTC for my everyday expenses.

If lightning ever works as claimed, then probably. If not, you might want to look into Bitcoin Cash. At this moment, fees on Bitcoin Cash are 2350 times (!) less than those on Bitcoin Segwit (cashvscore.com). Less than a half-cent per average transaction.

Find me even 10 coffee shops on the planet that accept bitcoin and then we can start talking.

They used to be around. Then fees rose. And people stopped using Bitcoin for day-to-day purchases. Shame, that.

https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/7dd43h/bch_has_a_problem_clashic_is_alive_replays/

bcash might have a little problem.

Precisely. A little problem. Will it be ongoing? Magic 8 Ball says 'ask again'.

https://www.cnbc.com/2017/11/15/thomas-peterffy-keep-bitcoin-away-from-the-real-economy.html

The chairman of Interactive Brokers is saying that futures trading of Bitcoin through CME could be the cause of the next financial collapse. He took out a full page ad in the Wall Street Journal to warn about it.

Though to be clear, his worry is not in regards to Bitcoin trading, nor trading of Bitcoin derivatives. He took great care to drive home the point that he thinks those are fine, and that he is even enthused about them. His worry is specifically that a single trading house might carry both those products, as well as more traditional derivatives, within the same business unit. For technical reasons that I am not sure I understand, he thinks that short positions might get in a state where they cannot buy to close their short (i.e. for a loss), and that this will spillover into the tradtional trading side, causing insolvency of the brokerage.

Why would lightning layer not be for the average Joe? It could be literally without fees if he and Starbucks agree there should be no fees.

No. It absolutely could not. The channel must be funded. This requires at least one on-chain transaction.

There is no way the bitcoin network could ever scale (even with LN) to accommodate every person on the planet

Got any analysis to go with that bald assertion?

[yonton]

Is the 2x hardfork called off? I'm hearing they will fork today as planned?

[mymenace]

Saw this in a 4chan /pol/ thread.

https://boards.4chan.org/pol/thread/149690394



http://omnichest.info/lookupadd.aspx?address=3MbYQMMmSkC3AgWkj9FMo5LsPTW1zBTwXL

whatever works.

This is a perfect example of how to play the market.

Every market is manipulated by someone somehow - human greed

Find out how they do it

Play the scam

Has been working this way for centuries with stock, gold, real estate etc etc etc


Do you really think bitcoin is the real thing - Yes for the current economic climate, but for apocalyptic scenarios NO!


The big scam is, simply put, bitcoin is the answer for the current time - play the scam

[realsteelboy]

Take a moment gentlemen 


https://g.co/kgs/FxnK85

[becoin]

Saw this in a 4chan /pol/ thread.

https://boards.4chan.org/pol/thread/149690394



http://omnichest.info/lookupadd.aspx?address=3MbYQMMmSkC3AgWkj9FMo5LsPTW1zBTwXL

LOL

This guy is mad because of what?
Bitfinex is doing with their tethers exactly the same what Fed is doing with their Fed Reserve notes. Both are backed by thin air...

[Dabs]

The real question is, the minimum fee we can pay is 1 sat, there is nothing less than 1 sat, right?

No one answered this question. The minimum fee that is less than 1 sat is zero.

That doesn't help much unless the scaling issue has been fixed at that point where zero fees ends up confirming within a day or two and people only pay fees for faster transactions.

The current minimum relay fee is 0.0001 for any transaction.

I used to send zero fee transactions, but that was 5 years ago.

[mymenace]

The real question is, the minimum fee we can pay is 1 sat, there is nothing less than 1 sat, right?

No one answered this question. The minimum fee that is less than 1 sat is zero.

That doesn't help much unless the scaling issue has been fixed at that point where zero fees ends up confirming withing a day or two and people only pay fees for faster transactions.

The current minimum relay fee is 0.0001 for any transaction.

Zero cost is the lowest transaction fee for bitcoin, there is a choice of transactions fees for bitcoin determining on how you want your transaction processed.



remember bitcoin works, maybe slow, may take a long time but it works and is the most transparent currency there is, it is up to us to apply the right software to get the right outcome

you want faster transactions - build on top of the blockchain something that can do that

many developers are doing this now

time will tell if this new software can turn, a trial currency that bitcoin is, into being adopted as a viable financial service




For example:
http://www.rsk.co/

RSK is the first open-source smart contract platform with a 2-way peg to Bitcoin that also rewards the Bitcoin miners via merge-mining, allowing them to actively participate in the Smart Contract revolution. RSK goal is to add value and functionality to the Bitcoin ecosystem by enabling smart-contracts, near instant payments and higher-scalability.

[Ibian]

You have no idea how hard it is trying to work today, with this giant throbbing erection I have right now.

Wish I had time to Photoshop today

You have fucktons of money, why are you still working? Spend your time productively, by making shops for us!

[bitserve]

The real question is, the minimum fee we can pay is 1 sat, there is nothing less than 1 sat, right?

No one answered this question. The minimum fee that is less than 1 sat is zero.

That doesn't help much unless the scaling issue has been fixed at that point where zero fees ends up confirming within a day or two and people only pay fees for faster transactions.

The current minimum relay fee is 0.0001 for any transaction.

I used to send zero fee transactions, but that was 5 years ago.

It is perfectly possible to add more decimals so that 1 sat is not the minimun fraction of BTC. No problem there.

[becoin]

The real question is, the minimum fee we can pay is 1 sat, there is nothing less than 1 sat, right?

No one answered this question.

This question was answered few years ago when Lightning Network was proposed. If 1 sat is too expensive for you just cooperate with others to pay 1 sat when LN channel is opened and closed.

[Imbatman]

Can someone let me know if BCH's difficulty is scheduled to reduce any time soon?

I'm trying to target a date that might happen to be on the alert for a new pump/dump in case we get a round 2 of what we experienced this past weekend.

[marcus_of_augustus]

https://www.cnbc.com/2017/11/15/thomas-peterffy-keep-bitcoin-away-from-the-real-economy.html

The chairman of Interactive Brokers is saying that futures trading of Bitcoin through CME could be the cause of the next financial collapse. He took out a full page ad in the Wall Street Journal to warn about it.

What's he, the father of high freq trading, really concerned about? That the 'real economy' is just a sham of made up numbers on trader's screens? The whole thing sounds very fragile if it cannot handle being linked to bitcoin through cash-settled futures trading.

[Dabs]

I'm not exactly sure how Lightning is going to work, but I am almost certain that most people or entities that will open channels will close them within the day, probably a few times a day, or twice a day. So settle twice a day.

If it were like one of my transactions, that's maybe $1m "settled" paid with $100 fee. Even if it were $1000 fee because of more inputs.

as a multi-coiner...with over 100k in networth in coins...

let me enlighten you.

Who here isn't a multi-coiner with over 100k (USD I presume) in networth in coins ... even if unrealized. All I did was join a half dozen ICOs last year and now I have 100k. (again, unrealized, but who cares, just HODL right...)


noobs. hehehehe.

[Syke]

The real question is, the minimum fee we can pay is 1 sat, there is nothing less than 1 sat, right?

No one answered this question. The minimum fee that is less than 1 sat is zero.

Yes, zero fee is a valid transaction, but very few nodes will relay the transaction, and very few miners will include it in their blocks, so you almost never see them these days.

[gentlemand]

I'm not exactly sure how Lightning is going to work, but I am almost certain that most people or entities that will open channels will close them within the day, probably a few times a day, or twice a day. So settle twice a day.

I get the total opposite impression myself. Mechanisms will evolve that mean once you're in you can stay in for good if you wish. But what do any of us know at this point?