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Author Topic: [1500 TH] p2pool: Decentralized, DoS-resistant, Hop-Proof pool  (Read 2029426 times)
kano
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February 18, 2012, 07:24:06 AM
 #841

No BTC Guild won with 0000000000000c163ce8827e37bb459161e6978dc1ff0c052c53dd7f5858608a
So I guess it was orphaned (it was block 167283)

From looking at the blockchain directly the P2Pool blocks I can see recently

Since: 167202 17:32:47 17-Feb-2012 UTC (0x4f3e8f3f) (which was EMC)

167248 23:29:39 17-Feb-2012 UTC (0x4f3ee2e3) 0000000000000ba9b7f34ca705e8a56ea02a8515644efd48175e157844666c5d
167271 02:29:06 18-Feb-2012 UTC (0x4f3f0cf2) 0000000000000c128adadedd348061952fa5c9bd78320ee25052d2b74a10573f
167276 03:44:22 18-Feb-2012 UTC (0x4f3f1e96) 000000000000050c941e3f8e4789b5118acf86f8b1762ab9dfd2fe8b26d2411f

Up to 07:19:03 18-Feb-2012 UTC (0x4f3f50e7) (the last block as at now)

Edit: I should add - that when there's an orphan battle, who do you think will win?
A solo P2Pool bitcoind with 8 connections or BTC Guild's bitcoind with ? connections?
If they post them very closely together the winner is usually the one with the most connections and the fastest internet.

Edit2: and if you look at the 2 block hashes, the BTC Guild one is not the one with the harder difficulty either.
000000000000079f7e918f3fba8f758383e1061c5d4eb8b3742612dedc23c00e P2P
0000000000000c163ce8827e37bb459161e6978dc1ff0c052c53dd7f5858608a BTCG

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February 18, 2012, 07:39:00 AM
 #842

Bugger Sad

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February 18, 2012, 07:53:02 AM
 #843

Edit: I should add - that when there's an orphan battle, who do you think will win?
A solo P2Pool bitcoind with 8 connections or BTC Guild's bitcoind with ? connections?
If they post them very closely together the winner is usually the one with the most connections and the fastest internet.

Edit2: and if you look at the 2 block hashes, the BTC Guild one is not the one with the harder difficulty either.
000000000000079f7e918f3fba8f758383e1061c5d4eb8b3742612dedc23c00e P2P
0000000000000c163ce8827e37bb459161e6978dc1ff0c052c53dd7f5858608a BTCG

Unfortunately, P2Pool did have an orphan block. However, P2Pool is not at a disadvantage to other pools. P2Pool not only passes block solutions to the local bitcoind, but also passes them to other P2Pool nodes so that they can spread faster. In theory P2Pool should be better for this reason. I've been working on this a bit, because right now stale shares aren't passed around, and that might have contributed to this being an orphan.

Also, keep in mind that whoever made this share had it ultimately declared as an orphan because of P2Pool's bitcoin stale rules (probably along with other shares that they mined), so they are being punished for having a too-high latency.

Last, the fact that their block's hash is lower does not make any difference at all.

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kano
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February 18, 2012, 08:07:32 AM
 #844

...
Last, the fact that their block's hash is lower does not make any difference at all.
Yes I know, that's exactly what I said means.
... I just thought I'd point it out in case anyone said othewise Smiley

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February 18, 2012, 08:15:30 AM
 #845

Edit: I should add - that when there's an orphan battle, who do you think will win?
A solo P2Pool bitcoind with 8 connections or BTC Guild's bitcoind with ? connections?
If they post them very closely together the winner is usually the one with the most connections and the fastest internet.

Edit2: and if you look at the 2 block hashes, the BTC Guild one is not the one with the harder difficulty either.
000000000000079f7e918f3fba8f758383e1061c5d4eb8b3742612dedc23c00e P2P
0000000000000c163ce8827e37bb459161e6978dc1ff0c052c53dd7f5858608a BTCG

Unfortunately, P2Pool did have an orphan block. However, P2Pool is not at a disadvantage to other pools. P2Pool not only passes block solutions to the local bitcoind, but also passes them to other P2Pool nodes so that they can spread faster. In theory P2Pool should be better for this reason. I've been working on this a bit, because right now stale shares aren't passed around, and that might have contributed to this being an orphan.
...
Actually that would only make a difference if bitcoind accepted network blocks from p2pool ...

Bitcoind accepts non-self-generated blocks from the network only.

How does that work with p2pool?
Does p2pool pretend to be another bitcoind and tell the bitcoind about the block whenever it receives a block difficulty share?
Edit: which would mean the p2pool would have to be one of the 8 (or more) constant connections to the local bitcoind.
Edit2: and p2pool would have to deal with all the normal network traffic that bitcoind handles ...]

Edit3: OK, looks like I'm wrong Tongue
Maybe you can do it with getmemorypool ... is that how you do it?
Can you feed an new network block into the bitcoind with getmemorypool?
(I've never gone near that command due to the merged-mining implications it created)

If that's the method, then that would put it back to comparing the network speed of bitcoind's block-chain versus p2pool's share-chain+rpc to bitcoind.
Got any info to decide one way of the other?

Pool: https://kano.is BTC: 1KanoiBupPiZfkwqB7rfLXAzPnoTshAVmb
CKPool and CGMiner developer, IRC FreeNode #ckpool and #cgminer kanoi
Help keep Bitcoin secure by mining on pools with Stratum, the best protocol to mine Bitcoins with ASIC hardware
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February 18, 2012, 12:16:05 PM
 #846

Why does p2pool currently show "current payout: 0.0000 BTC"?  Seems a little low...

You are in a maze of twisty little passages, all alike.
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February 18, 2012, 12:16:19 PM
 #847

Edit: I should add - that when there's an orphan battle, who do you think will win?
A solo P2Pool bitcoind with 8 connections or BTC Guild's bitcoind with ? connections?
If they post them very closely together the winner is usually the one with the most connections and the fastest internet.

Edit2: and if you look at the 2 block hashes, the BTC Guild one is not the one with the harder difficulty either.
000000000000079f7e918f3fba8f758383e1061c5d4eb8b3742612dedc23c00e P2P
0000000000000c163ce8827e37bb459161e6978dc1ff0c052c53dd7f5858608a BTCG

Unfortunately, P2Pool did have an orphan block. However, P2Pool is not at a disadvantage to other pools. P2Pool not only passes block solutions to the local bitcoind, but also passes them to other P2Pool nodes so that they can spread faster. In theory P2Pool should be better for this reason. I've been working on this a bit, because right now stale shares aren't passed around, and that might have contributed to this being an orphan.
...
Actually that would only make a difference if bitcoind accepted network blocks from p2pool ...

Bitcoind accepts non-self-generated blocks from the network only.

How does that work with p2pool?
Does p2pool pretend to be another bitcoind and tell the bitcoind about the block whenever it receives a block difficulty share?
Edit: which would mean the p2pool would have to be one of the 8 (or more) constant connections to the local bitcoind.
Edit2: and p2pool would have to deal with all the normal network traffic that bitcoind handles ...]

Edit3: OK, looks like I'm wrong Tongue
Maybe you can do it with getmemorypool ... is that how you do it?
Can you feed an new network block into the bitcoind with getmemorypool?
(I've never gone near that command due to the merged-mining implications it created)

If that's the method, then that would put it back to comparing the network speed of bitcoind's block-chain versus p2pool's share-chain+rpc to bitcoind.
Got any info to decide one way of the other?

Yes, p2pool does make a regular p2p connection to your local bitcoind and pretend to be just another node.  It also makes a RPC connection.  And it uses them for different things.

If your local miners find a block, your local p2pool will return that block to the local bitcoind using RPC calls.  It will also spread that block to all of it's p2pool peers, which will then relay it to their local bitcoind using the ordinary bitcoin p2p protocol.

In other words, a block found by p2pool will spread through two different networks.

p2pcoin: a USB/CD/PXE p2pool miner - 1N8ZXx2cuMzqBYSK72X4DAy1UdDbZQNPLf - todo
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kjj
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February 18, 2012, 12:17:43 PM
 #848

Why does p2pool currently show "current payout: 0.0000 BTC"?  Seems a little low...

Have you found any shares in the last 24 hours?

p2pcoin: a USB/CD/PXE p2pool miner - 1N8ZXx2cuMzqBYSK72X4DAy1UdDbZQNPLf - todo
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February 18, 2012, 12:28:56 PM
 #849

What are your stale rates for locals and shares? I currently have 0.9% for local but a freaking 27% for p2pool shares. What does the dead-value mean btw?
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February 18, 2012, 12:30:56 PM
 #850

Why does p2pool currently show "current payout: 0.0000 BTC"?  Seems a little low...

Have you found any shares in the last 24 hours?

Yes.  I was paid out on the most recent 4 according to p2pool's block chain.

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February 18, 2012, 01:17:37 PM
 #851

For those interested, I imported the blockchain data into Excel from http://blockchain.info/address/1Kz5QaUPDtKrj5SqW5tFkn7WZh8LmQaQi4 (the block chain from p2pool) and found the average time between payouts starting 1/1/2012:

0.46 days between payouts on average for 2012

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February 18, 2012, 03:23:32 PM
 #852

Why does p2pool currently show "current payout: 0.0000 BTC"?  Seems a little low...
You've recently restarted p2pool, and it's got a new address from your bitcoind.

Please feel free to cut and paste this when someone asks the same question in 14.36 hours:
Quote
Your previous address will still receive any payouts if a block is found within 24 hours, your new address will also receive it's share of any payouts. Your expected payout will be spread across both addresses. If a block is found now, the old will get the bigger share. If a block is found in 20 hours, the new will have a much larger share. If you want to keep the same address (so you can keep an eye on things), specify it with the "-a" option.
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February 18, 2012, 03:40:00 PM
 #853

Edit: I should add - that when there's an orphan battle, who do you think will win?
A solo P2Pool bitcoind with 8 connections or BTC Guild's bitcoind with ? connections?
If they post them very closely together the winner is usually the one with the most connections and the fastest internet.

Which is why every p2pool node should use port forwarding.  My bitcoind has 208 connections granted maybe BTC Guild would have still won the orphan battle but at least it would be a fighting chance.

On edit: hey is you use the add node command for bitcoind is that node guaranteed to be used?  Even if the person is limited to 8?

The reason I ask is I (and others) could setup a high connection relay server with low latency and 200+ connections.  For people who can't get port forwarding figured out they could add that node and be 1 hop away from 200+ nodes. 
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February 18, 2012, 03:42:36 PM
 #854

Why does p2pool currently show "current payout: 0.0000 BTC"?  Seems a little low...
You've recently restarted p2pool, and it's got a new address from your bitcoind.

Please feel free to cut and paste this when someone asks the same question in 14.36 hours:
Quote
Your previous address will still receive any payouts if a block is found within 24 hours, your new address will also receive it's share of any payouts. Your expected payout will be spread across both addresses. If a block is found now, the old will get the bigger share. If a block is found in 20 hours, the new will have a much larger share. If you want to keep the same address (so you can keep an eye on things), specify it with the "-a" option.

I'll keep the copy/paste in mind for the future, but I definitely have the same payout address as before.

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February 18, 2012, 03:46:31 PM
 #855

I definitely have the same payout address as before.
Can you see your address on this page?
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February 18, 2012, 03:50:58 PM
 #856

No, but I went to http://127.0.0.1:9332/payout_addr and it says the address I've been seeing for the last week.

OK, rather than mess with changing payout addresses I just switched to using -a with the payout address I was using with deepbit.
This should keep things simpler anyway.

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February 18, 2012, 04:21:24 PM
 #857

Good, setting an address removes one of the variables, & makes life easier all round.

Right now it's taking an average of 384 minutes to find a share with 100MH/s (ie 38.4 mins with 1GH/s, and 3.84 mins with 10GH/s, and 3840 mins with 10MH/s). So work out how long it'll take you to find 5 shares. Check back after that amount of time. You should see your address in the page I mentioned before.

It takes a bit of getting used to - with a pps pool, you can see your balance increase with every page refresh, with p2pool things tend to work in hours & days, rather than seconds! The result (earnings) is the same, you just have more time for other things. I know how addictive a pool stats page can be!
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February 18, 2012, 04:30:12 PM
 #858

OK 1 last noob question and I'll wait 5 hours before posting again.
If I don't show up on http://yat.uukgoblin.net/p2pool-stats/current_payouts.html, yet my cgminer is clearly working hard on solving something, what am I really accomplishing?  I'm being told to solve hashes but I'm not in line for any payment at all is how it seems.

Or is it that copy/paste snippet you wanted me to remember?  It's still using an address that bitcoind assigned (and I can't find) and I'll get paid something eventually on that address for my current efforts?

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February 18, 2012, 04:51:13 PM
 #859

Frizz23 and anyone else having problems with apparent forks, upgrade to this and follow the above advice.

What happens to all those shared that have been submitted to a forked pool?

I haven't gotten any credit for those - so I assume they are lost.


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February 18, 2012, 05:09:09 PM
 #860

Frizz23 and anyone else having problems with apparent forks, upgrade to this and follow the above advice.

What happens to all those shared that have been submitted to a forked pool?

I haven't gotten any credit for those - so I assume they are lost.

Yes, they're gone now; However, they had some value when you created them. The forked pool could have found a block and paid you a handsome amount, but you just didn't have great luck. (Kind of like solo mining for a while and then giving up.)

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