Butterfly Labs Forced "On Hold For Refund" for all my Single SC orders

[pikeadz]

Apparently BFL has now entered the business of... reading minds!  

Don't bother asking for refunds people.  They already know which of you want them and which of you don't.  Those of you who do will be automatically refunded, even if you don't know it yet.  What customer service!

"Mind readers"? Nope, how about just "readers"? You think that the crap you plaster all over the internet isn't available for them to read as well? They don't have to read his mind, they just have to read what he wrote.

Is she wrong that he's "Unhappy with the company"? Everything I've seen him post leads me to agree with that assessment. Normal people don't talk shit about companies that they're happy with.

This all stinks of a company that is trying to censor their customers from interfering with their steady supply of preorder money.  They can keep the stench under wraps from current customers.  Luckily, I am not a customer and have nothing to fear by pointing out what stockholm syndrome has blinded all of you to.  BFL is a scam that is bleeding money every day, and will go bankrupt within a few months.  Good luck getting your vaporware!

There's nothing wrong with discontinuing a toxic business relationship. You have every right to talk all the shit you want. And they have a right to end the business relationship. It's not "censorship" to say, "If you trash our company, we won't do business with you anymore." You're still free to say whatever you want. Their response will be to simply put your money where your mouth is, on your behalf. Don't trust the company? Don't like the company? Think it's a scam? Thinking about suing if you don't get your order next week?

"Fine. Here's your money. Fuck off."

 

You are singing the tune quite well.  I predict your order doesn't get cancelled.  Nice work soldier!

I predict it doesn't as well. In fact, I predict that anybody who isn't dedicating time toward trashing BFL doesn't get their order canceled. There's no "tune" to sing. Just don't spew garbage at every opportunity. There are plenty of people who have expressed frustration, who won't get their orders canceled either, because simply expressing frustration isn't the same thing as accusing a company of being a scam, etc, every time said company is mentioned in a new thread...  

Purging the occasional toxic customer will be better for everybody. Maybe he can go buy some more USB sticks from ASICMINER now. Those seem like a totally solid investment...

Different philosophy I suppose.  I see a dissatisfied customer as an opportunity to win them over.  Then you have a customer for life, and they will speak well of you toward others.  On the other hand, if you're incompetent, don't have the resources, broke, and want to censor those customers for fear that they might inform the uninformed, then yeah, I suppose "purging" them is the next best option.  

[bassclef]

This all stinks of a company....

The whole company stinks to high heaven. Sonny Vleisides, a smart, slippery con artist who ran a mail order scam for six years, stealing $20 million from the elderly and naive with no sense of remorse, stinks. The people he surrounds himself with stink: Dennis Emmet, his associate in the mail order scam, killed a guy in an argument. He's in a Costa Rican prison for murder. It's all in the affidavit, go read it.

Imagine what goes through a guy like Sonny's head when he sees an opportunity like bitcoin. Now he's running Butterfly Labs. Perhaps it's a natural evolution of The Shamrock Agency and Old Amsterdam, his two other scam companies.

Even if it is somehow legitimate, imagine what is happening behind closed doors with these people. Get your money out while you still can.

[Malawi]

All he seems to do is bitch and moan about BFL. Suddenly he has "faith" that they'll deliver?

 Let me stop you right there. If I did not have faith they would not ship, I would have asked for a refund on my orders long ago instead of placing TWO ADDITIONAL orders for product this year.

 Furthermore, am I not justified to bitch-and-moan about waiting 11 months and having to endure one broken promise after another about this entire development process ?!

 So their answer is "This customer is upset because we can't provide accurate information. Lets fire them because they are manifesting their frustration at our inability to ship the product they have asked and paid for"

 I'm just hoping this all gets resolved as a "misunderstanding" and my orders are reinstated posthaste. I really don't want to escalate this and take the next steps to protect my investment.

You say that they are scammers, and when they want to return your money you ask them not to do so?

According to your post-history you should take your money and run.

[Tehfiend]

Wow, this is extremely unethical IMO. The only saving grace for BFL's extreme delays is the potential profit when they do finally ship. I find it mind-boggling that they would tell their customers who placed their trust in them back in June "just a few more weeks" over and over month after month only to involuntarily cancel their order after they've waited almost a year simply because they are unhappy with the delays. June customers have a lost a lot of opportunity because of these delays and canceling their order now turns that into a complete loss. Unbelievable...

Just because an airline passenger is unhappy that their flight is delayed doesn't mean they don't want to return home!

[Malawi]

Wow, this is extremely unethical IMO. The only saving grace for BFL's extreme delays is the potential profit when they do finally ship. I find it mind-boggling that they would tell their customers who placed their trust in them back in June "just a few more weeks" over and over month after month only to involuntarily cancel their order after they've waited almost a year simply because they are unhappy with the delays. June customers have a lost a lot of opportunity because of these delays and canceling their order now turns that into a complete loss. Unbelievable...

Just because an airline passenger is unhappy that their flight is delayed doesn't mean they don't want to return home!

No, but if they are screaming and yelling, they will not get into the plane.

[Xian01]

No, but if they are screaming and yelling, they will not get into the plane.

 What if you got on the plane nice and calm and rational, and instead of the flight taking 6 months, you are still on the plane, 11 months in the air, with no idea when you are going to land ?

[miter_myles]

just pop the emergency exit door.. 

[Malawi]

No, but if they are screaming and yelling, they will not get into the plane.

 What if you got on the plane nice and calm and rational, and instead of the flight taking 6 months, you are still on the plane, 11 months in the air, with no idea when you are going to land ?

And they then offer to place you at your departure point and gives you a refund so that you can buy a ticket with another company?

Maybe you should have taken that offer a long time ago?

[SLok]

You think Bitcointalk is still relevant to mining hardware.

 Fuck you asshole. Where the fuck do you think your first customers came from ?

 Eat a bag of dicks.

What did you expect Xian, love? It is almost as if you wanted it to end like this and steered into this direction. Rereading some of your posts prior to this event, I think a lot of companies would've acted like this. On the bright side, kncminer might be real and seems to give more bang for your bucks.

[volosator]

Well well. What do we have here. You've been waiting for 11 month. You were posting negative things about BFL and they found out about this. Now the order is due for cancel & refund and you started to whine like a little girl. We all so brave on the internet, as long as our identities are kept confidential, right?

BFL: please go ahead and refund that idiot. Make an example of him so the rest of the crowd will think twice before they post. 4 singles to be removed from the queue - that means that majority of folks will get their hardware faster (assuming the order is 11 month old).

Way to go!

[Tehfiend]

No, but if they are screaming and yelling, they will not get into the plane.

 What if you got on the plane nice and calm and rational, and instead of the flight taking 6 months, you are still on the plane, 11 months in the air, with no idea when you are going to land ?

And they then offer to place you at your departure point and gives you a refund so that you can buy a ticket with another company?

Maybe you should have taken that offer a long time ago?

Except there are no other airliners with open flights for months. He bought his ticket 11 months in advance yet now has to swim home...

[eroxors]

Antics aside, money changed hands and BFL appears to have reneged on terms of the sale. My guess is that the Missouri AG consumer complaints dept. would be a good avenue to pursue if you aren't satisfied with your purchase and negotiations fall through. I have worked with them in the past and they are very fastidious about consumer complaints.

I have no strong feelings about BFL other than they seem to be terrible at PR, have missed several deadlines, but have very attractive products from a price/performance and aesthetic POV.

Disclaimer: I do mine on EMC but I have no connection w/BFL other than almost making a pre-order.

[matthewh3]

Apparently BFL has now entered the business of... reading minds!  

Don't bother asking for refunds people.  They already know which of you want them and which of you don't.  Those of you who do will be automatically refunded, even if you don't know it yet.  What customer service!

"Mind readers"? Nope, how about just "readers"? You think that the crap you plaster all over the internet isn't available for them to read as well? They don't have to read his mind, they just have to read what he wrote.

Is she wrong that he's "Unhappy with the company"? Everything I've seen him post leads me to agree with that assessment. Normal people don't talk shit about companies that they're happy with.

This all stinks of a company that is trying to censor their customers from interfering with their steady supply of preorder money.  They can keep the stench under wraps from current customers.  Luckily, I am not a customer and have nothing to fear by pointing out what stockholm syndrome has blinded all of you to.  BFL is a scam that is bleeding money every day, and will go bankrupt within a few months.  Good luck getting your vaporware!

There's nothing wrong with discontinuing a toxic business relationship. You have every right to talk all the shit you want. And they have a right to end the business relationship. It's not "censorship" to say, "If you trash our company, we won't do business with you anymore." You're still free to say whatever you want. Their response will be to simply put your money where your mouth is, on your behalf. Don't trust the company? Don't like the company? Think it's a scam? Thinking about suing if you don't get your order next week?

"Fine. Here's your money. Fuck off."

 

You are singing the tune quite well.  I predict your order doesn't get cancelled.  Nice work soldier!

Yep. For every post you make singing the praises of BFL, they raise you 1 spot in the order queue.

BFL = Buy Fricken Loads 

[volosator]

It has been relayed to me...

What a level of professionalism!

It only means they read the forum. That is very good, at least they know what is going on with the community. У cтeн тoжe ecть yши, right?

[Bitcoinorama]

Sorry, even with the missed deadlines, poor project management, and laughable engineering design which led them to create the casing before knowing the size required for the actual working product, I cannot believe they are trolling the boards. Let alone dedicating time to determining who said what, and which of those abusing their company are their customers to offer refunds to so as to silence them!?

That's a ridiculous assumption. The lady has months of emails to for through, and reply to. I very much doubt she's filtering dissent on Bitcointalk and other associated media. There's no way she has the time to do that. Yet this entire thread assumes they have picked upon the OP for that reason? That's nuts!

[Xian01]

Antics aside, money changed hands and BFL appears to have reneged on terms of the sale. My guess is that the Missouri AG consumer complaints dept. would be a good avenue to pursue if you aren't satisfied with your purchase and negotiations fall through. I have worked with them in the past and they are very fastidious about consumer complaints.

https://www.consumer.ago.mo.gov/

 Thank you for this recommendation. I'll drop them a line and see how things go.

Edit:

Confirmation Number:   914077
Confirmation Time:   2013-05-16 15:58:20

[pikeadz]

Well well. What do we have here. You've been waiting for 11 month. You were posting negative things about BFL and they found out about this. Now the order is due for cancel & refund and you started to whine like a little girl. We all so brave on the internet, as long as our identities are kept confidential, right?

BFL: please go ahead and refund that idiot. Make an example of him so the rest of the crowd will think twice before they post. 4 singles to be removed from the queue - that means that majority of folks will get their hardware faster (assuming the order is 11 month old).

Way to go!

Yeah!  Hooray for squelching the truth and censorship!  All of you vile truth-spreaders shall think twice before speaking ill about the almighty Butterfly Labs, or you shall experience the iron fist of the paypal refund nazi, BFL-Jody!

[wrenchmonkey]

Antics aside, money changed hands and BFL appears to have reneged on terms of the sale. My guess is that the Missouri AG consumer complaints dept. would be a good avenue to pursue if you aren't satisfied with your purchase and negotiations fall through. I have worked with them in the past and they are very fastidious about consumer complaints.

I have no strong feelings about BFL other than they seem to be terrible at PR, have missed several deadlines, but have very attractive products from a price/performance and aesthetic POV.

Disclaimer: I do mine on EMC but I have no connection w/BFL other than almost making a pre-order.

The Missouri AG Consumer Complaints Dept will give exactly as many fucks as his complaint warrants: 0.

Most state laws actually REQUIRE you to offer a refund if you are unable to deliver within 30 days of your initial targeted delivery date (backorders included), alternately, you may offer to extend the time limit, with confirmed consent from the customer, but you're not required to offer the extension. You ARE required to offer the refund.

Go into an AG office and complain that, "A company 'unethically' refunded my money when I complained about the wait time for my order." Be sure to take a video camera, and post the video of their reaction on Youtube for us all to watch!  

[SLok]

Well well. What do we have here. You've been waiting for 11 month. You were posting negative things about BFL and they found out about this. Now the order is due for cancel & refund and you started to whine like a little girl. We all so brave on the internet, as long as our identities are kept confidential, right?

BFL: please go ahead and refund that idiot. Make an example of him so the rest of the crowd will think twice before they post. 4 singles to be removed from the queue - that means that majority of folks will get their hardware faster (assuming the order is 11 month old).

Way to go!

Yeah!  Hooray for squelching the truth and censorship!  All of you vile truth-spreaders shall think twice before speaking ill about the almighty Butterfly Labs, or you shall experience the iron fist of the paypal refund nazi, BFL-Jody!

Fuck off, go read the guy's messages back through his profile. He made his discontent personal towards people instead of the company. Fail, and a godwin for you for the nazi trolling, you just lost.

[Xian01]

Fuck off, go read the guy's messages back through his profile. He made his discontent personal towards people instead of the company. Fail, and a godwin for you for the nazi trolling, you just lost.

 Respectfully, I learned of Butterfly Labs on these forums. When their COO says these forums are not important to their business, how are the early, loyal customers supposed to feel ?