Butterfly Labs Forced "On Hold For Refund" for all my Single SC orders

[Xian01]

I just had to quote this from another thread.

Found this and not sure of its validity as we all know how BFL operates https://forums.butterflylabs.com/blogs/bfl_jody/165-tuesday-5-21-shipping-updates.html

COOOOOOOOOOOL, Based on that, If they keep shipping Just Japapenos, Then i'll get my SEVEN MONTH OLD preorder, shipping in Another Month, AT BEST.
What the fuck happened to the 1/3 1/3 1/3 shipping plan? What the fuck happened to the charity, What the fuck happened to EVERYTHING AT BUTTERFUCK LABS.

COME THE FUCK ON YOU ASSHOLES!, HOW DID YOU FUCK UP THIS BAD?! PEOPLE ARE GOING TO HAVE YEAR OLD PREORDERS BEFORE THEY GET A FUCKING UNIT IN THIER HANDS, YOU MOTHERFUCKING SCAMMED US INTO INVESTING IN YOUR DREAM IDEA ASIC MINER, YOU FUCKING STOLE OUR MONEY FOR YOUR DREAM, YOU FUCKING MAILFRAUD CONVITCTED FUCK

You fucking scammed us into investing!, YOU FUCKING SCAMMED US

---

From BFL's own Forums;

https://forums.butterflylabs.com/blogs/bfl_jody/165-tuesday-5-21-shipping-updates-page4.html#comment2468

RED - 05-22-2013 11:10 AM

On February 17th, my apartment burned down. A week later I sent an email to Butterfly Labs requesting them to update my address. A month went by and no response. I sent another email. Another month went by and no response. I sent a lot of emails and never ever received a response.

Word came out that people were already receiving their orders so it became critical that my address was correct, so I sent another email stating I would keep phoning until something is fixed. Still no response.

So I phoned. Dave was very rude and dismissed my complaints. Finally a couple days later Jody sends me an email to ask some questions. She starts to update my addresses but makes a mistake with one of them. I was very clear in my email, but because they are receiving so many emails they are apparently not reading the words in them. I emailed back and informed them that the address was incorrect and that they need to read the email again. This was Jody's response: "I changed the address and will not do it again. If your addresses are not correct now we will just refund the order.--Jody" Apparently insisting that my address is correct is far too much to ask of anyone there.

 I tried my best to be polite and give LOTS of time and patience because I know how busy they are. Obviously I must be selfish to ask such a thing. Life must be so horrible for these people because they are so busy. I guess I'm a fool to think that losing everything I own to fire is anywhere near as big of a hardship in my life compared to what they are going through. Thanks for the pleasant experience.

---

https://forums.butterflylabs.com/blogs/bfl_jody/165-tuesday-5-21-shipping-updates-page4.html#comment2469

Dagger75 - 05-22-2013 11:43 AM

I've worked as support and replied to 100's of emails a days for months and months and it's not "Fun" but that's the job. All you have to do is have answers to the general questions available to copy and paste and that takes care of 90% of them.

I'm not sure what they're used to but that's what Customer Service gets paid for. Maybe they are used to sitting around and talking to each other for 50% of the day and this is just a big change that they have to be busy at work, but to take it out on customers and complain and use it as an excuse is not Ok. I suggest that BFL look at RED'a message above mine and see that you are Not living up to your end of the deal AFTER Taking 100% of Customer MONEY then Refusing to put any effort into them.

This is just another sad Fail and as much as I try to just "Let it go" these issues really bother me and they Should bother us All. BFL already has our Money and now they don't feel like holding up their end of the deal w/ things like RED's experience with His apartment buring down. He should Not have to be treated like he's doing something wrong when BFL constantly keeps screwing up and he just wants to have the CORRECT Home address for the product he paid over $1000 for.

[nottm28]

Xian01 - his motive is unclear - he's lost a 2012 order - he could have sold it for 10x the price he paid if he wasn't such an idiot - to me the only thing I can think is that he's an idiot...

 Not sure I would go so far with the idiot classification. Disgruntled and bitter, sure. Idiot ? Yeah, I guess I was an idiot holding out for 11 months, being strung along, and being OK with taking abuse from their COO.

 Except for that whole part where I was not OK with taking the abuse and constant delays, and expressed my displeasure in a pretty harsh way.

 In retrospect, I should have just taken a refund and bought Avalon or ASICMiner.

 I'm sure one day BFL will ship and I'll look at all you with your BFL rigs and I'll feel a pang of regret. It's too bad for me I can't keep my cool and bite-down hard on the ball when I'm getting it from behind.

So you take (were forced to take due to the abuse you were throwing about) approx $4000 refund for an early 60 GH/s bfl asic.
Then you spend approx $3000 dollars on 300MH/s usb's which will give you about 6 GH/s.

I'd love to see your business plan if you ever set up on your own...

Not that I'm against 300MH/s usb's - I have 2 on order myself...

[wrenchmonkey]

1. Somebody asked why anybody would do business with BFL, knowing Sonny was involved, and knowing the history of Sonny.
2. I responded that I didn't believe that the case really consisted of much more than an IRS witch hunt (answering the question as to why I don't have any major reservations in dealing with him.
3. You try and distort things and pretend that the IRS wasn't involved.
4. You accuse me of ripping off old ladies of their pensions (or at least supporting it), since you don't have an acutal arguemnt.
5. You continue to try and distort.
6. You dig up some random post I made on a precious metals thread about having used copper as a sort of 'poor mans gold' because base metal costs are rising, and try and twist it into an association with some obscure correlation with some alleged "penny scheme" because pennies are ALSO made of copper.

6: That was me, and "penny scheme had nothing to do with Sonny. It was his real dad in the 80's.

Then, I redirect my sarcasm in YOUR general direction..

1: It has nothing to do with Sonny as an (ex)felon, and everything to do with similarities being repeated at BFL.

What are you talking about here, exactly? Are you still stuck on the "pennies are made of copper" line of "logic"? SOMEBODY ASKED THAT QUESTION, and I answered, idiot!

2: Maybe the IRS witch hunt is true, but even if Sonny was never arrested, his history is more than enough to raise red flags.

Fair enough. But somebody asked why anybody would buy from BFL in light of that, and I answered accordingly as to why I had proceded. I didn't feel that the allegations against one officer of the company were enough to disuade me from placing an order with said company. It was a direct answer to a question. Nothing more. But you people LOVE to twist words and facts around, and pretend that I'm suddenly denying his entire history, on behalf of the world. I was answering a question. I don't personally put a whole lot of stock in what the IRS/State Department/Postal Service/Justice Department says. They're professional thieves and liars in their own right.

3 & 5: I'm not in this race.

You're not? Then why do you keep distorting what I say, and trying to come up with the most INANE theories about how owning base metals is somehow related to some obscure penny scheme?

Which brings us to numero quatro (4, for those who needed watch Dora the Explorer as kids--which I didn't, for I'm 53).

4. You accuse me of ripping off old ladies of their pensions (or at least supporting it), since you don't have an acutal arguemnt.

You spelled acutal & arguemnt incorrectly. Did you know there's an app for that if you're using a smartphone? But that's not what's important, for I don't believe there's an app to correct what you MIGHT claim to be an error. Allow me to quote it again:

4. You accuse me of ripping off old ladies of their pensions (or at least supporting it)

Is it just me, or is that something Sonny would say, and not wrenchmonkey? The keyword is "me" oppose to "him" or "sonny", for I don't recall anybody accusing you (wrenchmonkey) of ripping off old ladies of their pensions.

Up to this point, it never occurred to me that you're Sonny, though Josh may have crossed my mind a time or two. But now I'm thinkin' differently.

More mental acrobatics on your part... Apparently you've decided to ignore the entire conversation up to this point, including this little tidbit:

For starters, the charges you're referencing appear to have been little more than an IRS witch hunt. Maybe he voted Republican?  

It takes a special kind of person to defend a felon convicted of scamming millions of dollars from senior citizens.

Perhaps Wrenchmonkey and Mr. Vleisides have more in common than we thought.  

Which was the segue into you going full-retard with your bizzarre rantings about pennies and storage space, and acrylic cases, which was an ASTRONOMICAL reach at tying something as inconsequential as some light trading in the base metals market and thinking you'd uncovered some secret tie between me and Sonny.  

So not only have I been passive-aggressively accused of having stolen from old people, I've also been passive-aggressively accused/insinuated to be involved with, and even a few times accused of BEING, Sonny himself.

Didn't anybody tell you you should never go full retard?

Now get back to cleaning your room, you imbecile. You're 53 goddamn years old, and your parents let you live in their basement. All they ask is that you keep your room clean. Is that so much too ask?

[PuertoLibre]

3) Don't want anyone else to get an ASIC because it will slow your hash rate down (like puerto).

A new level of stupidity has just been achieved.

Moron thinks that my hashrate will "slow down" because more ASICs are involved?

[PuertoLibre]

Here is you making more things up. My post history speaks for itself. Yours speaks of a BFL sycophant desperate to deflect criticism and the disclosure of facts. For anyone else interested in the facts you can read them here: http://www.plainsite.org/flashlight/case.html?id=1500526

K9 Said it best.

Folks if you have doubts as to the people running BFL. Go read the links.

If not, sink your head in the sand.

If you don't want to know, just believe whatever BFL sycophants tell you and let it end at that. You can't later turn around and say you didn't know or weren't informed.

http://askville.amazon.com/sycophant-examples/AnswerViewer.do?requestId=32699572

[nottm28]

3) Don't want anyone else to get an ASIC because it will slow your hash rate down (like puerto).

A new level of stupidity has just been achieved.

Moron thinks that my hashrate will "slow down" because more ASICs are involved?

You know what I meant Puerto - you will earn less because your percentage of the overall hash rate will decrease. Idiot comment.

I'd like to give you at least some credit for the double face palm pic because I love that pic - but you pinched that too  - off loads of other people using it - I wonder if you have anything original about you at all...

[EDIT]

Xian01   20   42.02600000   payment/shipping recieved

20 units = 6GH/s - this guy had a 2012 order and blew it big time

[wrenchmonkey]

3) Don't want anyone else to get an ASIC because it will slow your hash rate down (like puerto).

A new level of stupidity has just been achieved.

Moron thinks that my hashrate will "slow down" because more ASICs are involved?

You know what I meant Puerto - you will earn less because your percentage of the overall hash rate will decrease. Idiot comment.

I'd like to give you at least some credit for the double face palm pic because I love that pic - but you pinched that too  - off loads of other people using it - I wonder if you have anything original about you at all...

LOL, there's a reason I have that idiot on ignore. The best thing he can do is pretend he doesn't understand what you were saying, so he can paint himself as more intelligent than he is.

You were CLEARLY saying that his relative hashing power would decrease, in proportion to the network. He knows you're correct, so he tries to nitpick and dismiss your statement on a matter of semantics. Weaksauce. 

[PuertoLibre]

Is this a new kind of maneuver where idiot A says something stupid, and idiot B backs him up, on said stupidity being essentially valid??

Whatever happened to just admitting you said something incredibly stupid and working on the next stupidity to come in the near future?

[nottm28]

Is this a new kind of maneuver where idiot A says something stupid, and idiot B backs him up, on said stupidity being essentially valid??

Whatever happened to just admitting you said something incredibly stupid and working on the next stupidity to come in the near future?

Xian01   20   42.02600000   payment/shipping recieved

20 units = 6GH/s - this guy had a 2012 order and blew it big time

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjCZrDbAiz_PdE4tbDR3X3owMHNMb1NyekJGWHN4QlE#gid=0

[k9quaint]

Is this a new kind of maneuver where idiot A says something stupid, and idiot B backs him up, on said stupidity being essentially valid??

Whatever happened to just admitting you said something incredibly stupid and working on the next stupidity to come in the near future?

Xian01   20   42.02600000   payment/shipping recieved

20 units = 6GH/s - this guy had a 2012 order and blew it big time

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjCZrDbAiz_PdE4tbDR3X3owMHNMb1NyekJGWHN4QlE#gid=0

Unless BFL never ships. Then he comes out ahead.
Especially if there are not enough funds left in the BFL coffers to refund everyone.

[nottm28]

Is this a new kind of maneuver where idiot A says something stupid, and idiot B backs him up, on said stupidity being essentially valid??

Whatever happened to just admitting you said something incredibly stupid and working on the next stupidity to come in the near future?

Xian01   20   42.02600000   payment/shipping recieved

20 units = 6GH/s - this guy had a 2012 order and blew it big time

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjCZrDbAiz_PdE4tbDR3X3owMHNMb1NyekJGWHN4QlE#gid=0

Unless BFL never ships. Then he comes out ahead.
Especially if there are not enough funds left in the BFL coffers to refund everyone.

His 2012 order would have sold on here (and has done) for at least 5 times what he paid. Just sell it on here if he wasn't happy. Now, instead of having potential $20k he has spent $3-4K and ends up with 6 GH/s

Correct me if I'm wrong but that is a fail...

[Xian01]

Is this a new kind of maneuver where idiot A says something stupid, and idiot B backs him up, on said stupidity being essentially valid??
Whatever happened to just admitting you said something incredibly stupid and working on the next stupidity to come in the near future?

Xian01   20   42.02600000   payment/shipping recieved
20 units = 6GH/s - this guy had a 2012 order and blew it big time
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjCZrDbAiz_PdE4tbDR3X3owMHNMb1NyekJGWHN4QlE#gid=0

Unless BFL never ships. Then he comes out ahead.
Especially if there are not enough funds left in the BFL coffers to refund everyone.

* Tries to figure out why it's anyone's business what I spend my Bitcoins on *

[nottm28]

Is this a new kind of maneuver where idiot A says something stupid, and idiot B backs him up, on said stupidity being essentially valid??
Whatever happened to just admitting you said something incredibly stupid and working on the next stupidity to come in the near future?

Xian01   20   42.02600000   payment/shipping recieved
20 units = 6GH/s - this guy had a 2012 order and blew it big time
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjCZrDbAiz_PdE4tbDR3X3owMHNMb1NyekJGWHN4QlE#gid=0

Unless BFL never ships. Then he comes out ahead.
Especially if there are not enough funds left in the BFL coffers to refund everyone.

* Tries to figure out why it's anyone's business what I spend my Bitcoins on *

I can help you figure that out - because you created this thread out of sour grapes and now encourage other bfl customers to get a refund.

Your 2012 order would have sold on here (and has done) for at least 5 times what you paid. Just sell it on here if you weren't happy. Now, instead of having potential $20k you have spent $3-4K and end up with 6 GH/s

Correct me if I'm wrong but that is a fail...

[PuertoLibre]

Is this a new kind of maneuver where idiot A says something stupid, and idiot B backs him up, on said stupidity being essentially valid??
Whatever happened to just admitting you said something incredibly stupid and working on the next stupidity to come in the near future?

Xian01   20   42.02600000   payment/shipping recieved
20 units = 6GH/s - this guy had a 2012 order and blew it big time
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjCZrDbAiz_PdE4tbDR3X3owMHNMb1NyekJGWHN4QlE#gid=0

Unless BFL never ships. Then he comes out ahead.
Especially if there are not enough funds left in the BFL coffers to refund everyone.

* Tries to figure out why it's anyone's business what I spend my Bitcoins on *

I can help you figure that out - because you created this thread out of sour grapes and now encourage other bfl customers to get a refund.

Your 2012 order would have sold on here (and has done) for at least 5 times what you paid. Just sell it on here if you weren't happy. Now, instead of having potential $20k you have spent $3-4K and end up with 6 GH/s

Correct me if I'm wrong but that is a fail...

So Nottm28,

You advocate the "sell it to the greater fool" theory.

If it is not good enough for you, sell it (offload it) unto someone else who is stupid enough to not ask why you are offloading it in the first place.

Transfer the bad buying opportunity to someone else?

Correct me if I'm wrong but that is a fail...

You sir, have the heart of a scammer...

[nottm28]

Is this a new kind of maneuver where idiot A says something stupid, and idiot B backs him up, on said stupidity being essentially valid??
Whatever happened to just admitting you said something incredibly stupid and working on the next stupidity to come in the near future?

Xian01   20   42.02600000   payment/shipping recieved
20 units = 6GH/s - this guy had a 2012 order and blew it big time
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjCZrDbAiz_PdE4tbDR3X3owMHNMb1NyekJGWHN4QlE#gid=0

Unless BFL never ships. Then he comes out ahead.
Especially if there are not enough funds left in the BFL coffers to refund everyone.

* Tries to figure out why it's anyone's business what I spend my Bitcoins on *

I can help you figure that out - because you created this thread out of sour grapes and now encourage other bfl customers to get a refund.

Your 2012 order would have sold on here (and has done) for at least 5 times what you paid. Just sell it on here if you weren't happy. Now, instead of having potential $20k you have spent $3-4K and end up with 6 GH/s

Correct me if I'm wrong but that is a fail...

So Nottm28,

You advocate the "sell it to the greater fool" theory.

If it is not good enough for you, sell it (offload it) unto someone else who is stupid enough to not ask why you are offloading it in the first place.

Transfer the bad buying opportunity to someone else?

Correct me if I'm wrong but that is a fail...

No, that's just what the market is willing to pay Puerto - he's lost $15k by bitching - address that fail - to me that's epic

[EDIT] And over-using LARGE size fonts is a sign of a weak argument

[PuertoLibre]

Is this a new kind of maneuver where idiot A says something stupid, and idiot B backs him up, on said stupidity being essentially valid??
Whatever happened to just admitting you said something incredibly stupid and working on the next stupidity to come in the near future?

Xian01   20   42.02600000   payment/shipping recieved
20 units = 6GH/s - this guy had a 2012 order and blew it big time
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjCZrDbAiz_PdE4tbDR3X3owMHNMb1NyekJGWHN4QlE#gid=0

Unless BFL never ships. Then he comes out ahead.
Especially if there are not enough funds left in the BFL coffers to refund everyone.

* Tries to figure out why it's anyone's business what I spend my Bitcoins on *

I can help you figure that out - because you created this thread out of sour grapes and now encourage other bfl customers to get a refund.

Your 2012 order would have sold on here (and has done) for at least 5 times what you paid. Just sell it on here if you weren't happy. Now, instead of having potential $20k you have spent $3-4K and end up with 6 GH/s

Correct me if I'm wrong but that is a fail...

So Nottm28,

You advocate the "sell it to the greater fool" theory.

If it is not good enough for you, sell it (offload it) unto someone else who is stupid enough to not ask why you are offloading it in the first place.

Transfer the bad buying opportunity to someone else?

Correct me if I'm wrong but that is a fail...

No, that's just what the market is willing to pay Puerto - he's lost $15k by bitching - address that fail

Alright, I will address it.

Your intention is, if someone is unhappy with their purchase because:

--BFL failed to deliver.
--Within a reasonable timeframe.
--Don't have any info on when it might even ship.

etc.

Then,

Sell it to someone who thinks they will someday get the miner. But make them pay 15 to 25 times the price for the "opportunity" to own one. Your apparent loss is somehow their certain gain (?).

------------------------

Explain this to me:

Why would the above scenario (as a transaction) be completed in good faith? Ok, go.

[nottm28]

Alright, I will address it.

Your intention is, if someone is unhappy with their purchase because:

--BFL failed to deliver.
--Within a reasonable timeframe.
--Don't have any info on when it might even ship.

etc.

Then,

Sell it to someone who thinks they will someday get the miner. But make them pay 15 to 25 times the price for the "opportunity" to own one. Your apparent loss is somehow their certain gain (?).

------------------------

Explain this to me:

Why would the above scenario (as a transaction) be completed in good faith? Ok, go.

You think I will not get my BFL order.
I think I will.
You hope I will not get my BFL order.
I hope I do.

Over-using LARGE size fonts is a sign of a weak argument

[EDIT] you didn't address this guys $15k fail

[PuertoLibre]

The good faith sell:

If I sell you 25 DVD players. I do it because I am looking to sell you something you want and I have faith that each unit works and is functional.

You get something that works right and I am happy to make a profit from selling it to you. (not offloaded)

The bad faith sell is:

If I sell you 25 DVD players because I think something in them is broken but your willing to pay for it, so why the hell not? (I am offloading it on you)

I thought I was going to get burned, but instead you got burned for me. I don't care because I got mine!

[ThatDGuy]

Is this a new kind of maneuver where idiot A says something stupid, and idiot B backs him up, on said stupidity being essentially valid??
Whatever happened to just admitting you said something incredibly stupid and working on the next stupidity to come in the near future?

Xian01   20   42.02600000   payment/shipping recieved
20 units = 6GH/s - this guy had a 2012 order and blew it big time
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjCZrDbAiz_PdE4tbDR3X3owMHNMb1NyekJGWHN4QlE#gid=0

Unless BFL never ships. Then he comes out ahead.
Especially if there are not enough funds left in the BFL coffers to refund everyone.

* Tries to figure out why it's anyone's business what I spend my Bitcoins on *

I can help you figure that out - because you created this thread out of sour grapes and now encourage other bfl customers to get a refund.

Your 2012 order would have sold on here (and has done) for at least 5 times what you paid. Just sell it on here if you weren't happy. Now, instead of having potential $20k you have spent $3-4K and end up with 6 GH/s

Correct me if I'm wrong but that is a fail...

So Nottm28,

You advocate the "sell it to the greater fool" theory.

If it is not good enough for you, sell it (offload it) unto someone else who is stupid enough to not ask why you are offloading it in the first place.

Transfer the bad buying opportunity to someone else?

Correct me if I'm wrong but that is a fail...

No, that's just what the market is willing to pay Puerto - he's lost $15k by bitching - address that fail

Alright, I will address it.

Your intention is, if someone is unhappy with their purchase because:

--BFL failed to deliver.
--Within a reasonable timeframe.
--Don't have any info on when it might even ship.

etc.

Then,

Sell it to someone who thinks they will someday get the miner. But make them pay 15 to 25 times the price for the "opportunity" to own one. Your apparent loss is somehow their certain gain (?).

------------------------

Explain this to me:

Why would the above scenario (as a transaction) be completed in good faith? Ok, go.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=212673.0 - looks like this guy's selling 2 units from 6/23/12, buyers willing to pay 23-25btc currently.  These are for Jalapenos.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=211350.0 - This one is an august pre-order for a single.  Current bid at 45 btc.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=89685.0 Xian had orders at 6/24/12 and 6/25/12 for two singles.  

It seems like the demand is there for units ordered this early.

[Xian01]

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=212673.0 - looks like this guy's selling 2 units from 6/23/12, buyers willing to pay 23-25btc currently.  These are for Jalapenos.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=89685.0 Xian had orders at 6/24/12 and 6/25/12 for two singles.  
It seems like the demand is there for units ordered this early.

 Of course there is demand. I'm not sure what your point is. You assume Single's are going to be shipping imminently. My patience was running out, and BFL made the decision for me.

 If Butterfly Labs delivered in a reasonable amount of time or effectively communicated with their (formerly) loyal ASIC customers who invested a couple thousand dollars in their first two days after product announcement, we would not be in this thread today.

 I'm sorry that I'm not the type of person who keeps his mouth shut when he is getting figuratively sodomized.