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Author Topic: Religious beliefs on bitcoin  (Read 22247 times)
neurobox
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May 29, 2013, 05:30:37 PM
 #301

It kinda makes me sick too. Remember, correlation is not causation. You can call me a religious fanatic (perhaps I've demonstrated that), but I've never preached conquest like that. The only problem I have with the present anti-war movement is an inherent ignorance of certain major geopolitical realities, disposed of in favor of details which suit the cause.

We all do well to evaluate each message we hear for it's motive.

My own motive is simply to share the few things that I've found true after decades of wandering, exploring, testing, and evaluating. The lowest common denominator is this: My faith is weak, but my saviour is faithful.
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May 29, 2013, 06:11:12 PM
 #302

In my opinion religion is a mutated form of spirituality, mutated into a system usually designed to oppress or instill a central authorities rules on everyone else. New cults still plague 21st century nations today, like popular religions the cult leader teaches rules to abide, ways the dress, rituals and so on. Humans are easily led and conditioning from childhood pretty much multiplies that effect. I would much rather meditate and find out about my own existence rather than rely on some passed down 51% attacked scripture. The funny thing is I would say the most peaceful kind of people are those who are left living in jungles and other remote areas unaffected by any of our popular religious/cultural systems.

Also lol at that premise of the op, you could liken the concept to not being able to play a PS3 or sending emails.  Cheesy
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May 29, 2013, 07:05:10 PM
 #303


Do I have no idea what right or wrong is without God? 

Personally, I do think that God or more precisely, the Holy Spirit (or our "conscience" as some people call Him) does speak to us and tell us what "right and wrong" is.  Where does our sense of compassion come from? 
I have to be honest here. You lost me at "Him." I can't wrap my head around the need to externalize my emotions into the form of a man. I feel this is degrading, disempowering. It makes me feel inadequate to care for myself- like I ought to be ashamed of being a her, not even capitalized H.
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Most would say from parents or society or it has "evolved" but I believe God puts that in our hearts and speaks to us.  Also, I use the Bible as my moral compass as well when my own selfish desires get in the way of what really is the right thing to do. 
I am a librarian. I love books. Looking to a book for advice and guidance is what literate people must do. Limiting yourself to one book is bad. A variety of voices will give you a well rounded outlook on every subject.
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The Bible says "There is a way that seems right to a man but it leads to death."   That is why I need to read the Bible and make sure I am not just making up my own ideas of what right an wrong are. 
When someone reads a beautiful book, old, new, technical manual, autobiography, novel, whatever it is, that someone grows. No matter how hard.anyone studies anything,.at the end of the day we have our prejudices, biases, ideas, interpretations, revisions and opinions about our reality, all influenced only in part by what we have read, heard, seen, felt. There can never be a way to not trust yourself to decide right and wrong.
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 The more I listen to Him, the more compassionate I can become.  The more loving I can be.  The more I can care about others, regardless of their beliefs, be it atheist, Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, etc.  I don't have to agree with people that think differently than I do, but I  need to love them and try to show them that God loves them too.  The difficulty is that in "loving" them, I often feel a compelling sense of showing them that they are on a destructive path.
You are deciding to listen. You are the one making choices about what ideas influence you. It is imperative that you take responsibility for your own mind, your own taste and broaden your horizons.
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Let's imagine this.  Hundreds of people are on the top of plateau with a huge cliff all around.  They are all blindfolded.  However, you are not.  The people are walking towards the edge of the cliff.  Do you just let them walk off to their death or would you try to stop them from going over the edge?  Probably the best thing to do would be to try and convince them that they are wearing a blindfold!  But in a strange way many don't even realize they have one on at all and they do not listen, or even argue with you.  You care deeply about them so you get more and more intense.  Maybe one or two take off their blindfold and then see that they almost plunged to their death without even realizing it.

Replace "blindfold" with "book." This is precisely what I feel when I see someone letting tradition and a single collection of books that have been more extensively rewritten and resold, mistranslated, butchered and mangled from a not actually THAT old original text think for them. I hope you can see that the point Im trying to make is that the bible is only one book in a countless sea of deeply moving literature.
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This is how it feels as a Christian. 
You have no idea how much worse it feels to disagree with your Jesusfreak peers about such basic stuff in the way a non christian does in a predominantly christish context. Check your privilege before you start feeling like you need to save those you do not even claim to understand.
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We believe God has miraculously helped us "see" (we once were blind but now we see).  Out of. compassion for those that cannot see we try desperately to get others to see the truth (sometimes people who say they are Christians do not do this in a loving or compassionate way I admit!  This angers me more than anything too BTW! Also, Jesus got more angry at people like this too than any others) So it is a problem for sure.  How to love without offending.  How to care without coming across as pushy, arrogant?  Should we just let others choose their own path without doing anything at all?  It seems that is what most people want us to do.  "Live and let live."  But is that the "moral" thing?  Is that the right thing? 
Coming back around we are left with our own personal, private moral dillemas that no amount of focused, unquestioning, faithful self indoctrination can ever facilitate without our own being to make the final judgement.
In conclusion, You are your own God, you should feed your god the gods of the past, and not only feed it The Bible's cocacola and mcdonalds. Your god will get very sick if you only feed it one meal, and meals based around a happymeal.

Wit all my solidarities,
-ktttn
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neurobox
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May 29, 2013, 07:45:08 PM
 #304

...

In conclusion, You are your own God, you should feed your god the gods of the past, and not only feed it The Bible's cocacola and mcdonalds. Your god will get very sick if you only feed it one meal, and meals based around a happymeal.

Does it not take more pure, unaided ego-centric faith to believe that one is god than to take it on authority of scripture that God is external and sovereign, albeit arbitrary?

I suspect I know the books you wish others to read, and given what I've seen and been through, I can tear them apart from cover to cover. They certainly did more harm than good. Do be careful what you choose to read, it can become a regrettably inextricable part of you.
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May 29, 2013, 09:11:26 PM
 #305


Do I have no idea what right or wrong is without God? 

Personally, I do think that God or more precisely, the Holy Spirit (or our "conscience" as some people call Him) does speak to us and tell us what "right and wrong" is.  Where does our sense of compassion come from? 
I have to be honest here. You lost me at "Him." I can't wrap my head around the need to externalize my emotions into the form of a man. I feel this is degrading, disempowering. It makes me feel inadequate to care for myself- like I ought to be ashamed of being a her, not even capitalized H.
Quote

 The more I listen to Him, the more compassionate I can become.  The more loving I can be.  The more I can care about others, regardless of their beliefs, be it atheist, Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, etc.  I don't have to agree with people that think differently than I do, but I  need to love them and try to show them that God loves them too.  The difficulty is that in "loving" them, I often feel a compelling sense of showing them that they are on a destructive path.
You are deciding to listen. You are the one making choices about what ideas influence you. It is imperative that you take responsibility for your own mind, your own taste and broaden your horizons.

Many people refer to the Holy Spirit as "It".  The problem is that in scripture the Holy Spirit is referred to as a person.  I am perfectly fine if for whatever reason you feel the Holy Spirit is a "She."  The point is that the Spirit is not a "thing" that is manipulated or used but He/She is a person that speaks to us, comforts us, and walks with us.  According to the Bible, there is neither male nor female in heaven so this is a non-issue to me.  Of course, men might want to disagree. Wink

Also, you are right. I am deciding what to listen to and what influences my mind.  I have found I need to have a filter on at all times.  I go about this by using this verse: "Whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable--if anything is excellent or praiseworthy--think about such things."   I try to use this yardstick for everything that I spend time on.    So applying this to Bitcoin:  I think it is true, right, can be used for noble things if the person decides to and is excellent.  Smiley 

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May 29, 2013, 09:20:56 PM
 #306

So... How 'bout them bitcoins?

Selling out to advertisers shows you respect neither yourself nor the rest of us.
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May 29, 2013, 09:22:21 PM
 #307

I'm not so sure there is any such thing as a person.  The thing we call "I" and "Me", is nothing more that a thought. And since we cant control our thoughts, we have no free will.
We are nothing but robots, following out our programming with the belief we are someone.  All part of evolution.

All this religious stuff, is just another layer of belief.
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May 29, 2013, 09:40:50 PM
 #308

...

In conclusion, You are your own God, you should feed your god the gods of the past, and not only feed it The Bible's cocacola and mcdonalds. Your god will get very sick if you only feed it one meal, and meals based around a happymeal.

Does it not take more pure, unaided ego-centric faith to believe that one is god than to take it on authority of scripture that God is external and sovereign, albeit arbitrary?

I suspect I know the books you wish others to read, and given what I've seen and been through, I can tear them apart from cover to cover. They certainly did more harm than good. Do be careful what you choose to read, it can become a regrettably inextricable part of you.
It takes far more self righteous ego to project God as the undeniable universal absolute known only to your particular favored translation, upbringing and adult experience than it takes to allow yourself to take sole responsibility for your own life, values, and perception of reality. In my opinion, of course- to answer your question.

Do you suspect ALL OF THE BOOKS EVER?
Take a quick look at the dewey decimal system up to the fourth decimal place. The religion section alone is humongous due to the dominant christian urge to monopolize ideology.
Please don't tear every book ever written apart cover to cover. Nobody would ever see you finish.
The bible did more good than harm because books don't do harm. Books only codify ideas. People, however, got lots of terrible ideas from lots of terrible books.
You could argue the bible is not one of those terrible books, but even you wouldn't believe you.

Wit all my solidarities,
-ktttn
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ktttn
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May 29, 2013, 09:47:18 PM
 #309

So... How 'bout them bitcoins?
They'd be a tad more popular if tons upon tons of people didn't associate them with the mark of the beast and evil.
Talking about my reactionary religions in a thread about religion, and how it slows btc adoption, and how to work around folks taking the bible as bald truth.

Wit all my solidarities,
-ktttn
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May 29, 2013, 09:53:04 PM
 #310

anyone who is religious is deluisional and desperate for an answer
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May 29, 2013, 09:57:27 PM
 #311


Do I have no idea what right or wrong is without God? 

Personally, I do think that God or more precisely, the Holy Spirit (or our "conscience" as some people call Him) does speak to us and tell us what "right and wrong" is.  Where does our sense of compassion come from? 
I have to be honest here. You lost me at "Him." I can't wrap my head around the need to externalize my emotions into the form of a man. I feel this is degrading, disempowering. It makes me feel inadequate to care for myself- like I ought to be ashamed of being a her, not even capitalized H.
Quote

 The more I listen to Him, the more compassionate I can become.  The more loving I can be.  The more I can care about others, regardless of their beliefs, be it atheist, Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, etc.  I don't have to agree with people that think differently than I do, but I  need to love them and try to show them that God loves them too.  The difficulty is that in "loving" them, I often feel a compelling sense of showing them that they are on a destructive path.
You are deciding to listen. You are the one making choices about what ideas influence you. It is imperative that you take responsibility for your own mind, your own taste and broaden your horizons.

Many people refer to the Holy Spirit as "It".  The problem is that in scripture the Holy Spirit is referred to as a person.  I am perfectly fine if for whatever reason you feel the Holy Spirit is a "She."  The point is that the Spirit is not a "thing" that is manipulated or used but He/She is a person that speaks to us, comforts us, and walks with us.  According to the Bible, there is neither male nor female in heaven so this is a non-issue to me.  Of course, men might want to disagree. Wink

Also, you are right. I am deciding what to listen to and what influences my mind.  I have found I need to have a filter on at all times.  I go about this by using this verse: "Whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable--if anything is excellent or praiseworthy--think about such things."   I try to use this yardstick for everything that I spend time on.    So applying this to Bitcoin:  I think it is true, right, can be used for noble things if the person decides to and is excellent.  Smiley 
A literary personification of your own psyche is not a person. You are a person. I gave you enough respect to analyse what you have to say, I might expect the same. Speaking of pronouns goddammit, why draw the line at she? Why not "me" or "you?" Those pronouns do not require that you point into the depths of space, but at living, breathing human beings that measurably.affect reality.
We know we are real, we know we affect our own lives. No guesswork, no tithing, no filter, no handing your mind over to someone else.

Wit all my solidarities,
-ktttn
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May 29, 2013, 10:09:57 PM
 #312

It takes far more self righteous ego to project God as the undeniable universal absolute known only to your particular favored translation, upbringing and adult experience than it takes to allow yourself to take sole responsibility for your own life, values, and perception of reality. In my opinion, of course- to answer your question.

Heard. If you think you're god, your argument is with God.

Do you suspect ALL OF THE BOOKS EVER?
Take a quick look at the dewey decimal system up to the fourth decimal place. The religion section alone is humongous due to the dominant christian urge to monopolize ideology.

Really I was talking about the kind of books that lead one to where you are at now, and where I used to be. I'm not a book-burning kind of person, but I've learned: It's garbage in, garbage out.

Please don't tear every book ever written apart cover to cover. Nobody would ever see you finish.

Figurative! Translated: If I had the time, I could analyze and refute the statements, premises and intentions of the above mentioned categories of books, at least the ones I have read and are aware of. Work with me here.

The bible did more good than harm because books don't do harm. Books only codify ideas. People, however, got lots of terrible ideas from lots of terrible books.
You could argue the bible is not one of those terrible books, but even you wouldn't believe you.

Sorry, you honestly kinda lost me there.

EDIT: If you don't believe a thing in the book, of course you're going to think the derived ideas are terrible. I just happen to have more to go on now than the book itself.
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May 29, 2013, 10:24:01 PM
 #313

anyone who is religious is deluisional and desperate for an answer

I follow Bitcoin religiously Smiley my wife thinks Bitcoin is more than a religion, she thinks it's a mistress.

Thank me in Bits 12MwnzxtprG2mHm3rKdgi7NmJKCypsMMQw
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May 29, 2013, 10:38:06 PM
 #314

I have actually had 2 random older folks mention this as I rant and rave religiously and barely listen. But yup, i've heard and made a mental note of it.

Its also fits perfectly in my scifi vision of the future dark horible world we face.
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May 29, 2013, 10:39:51 PM
 #315

anyone who is religious is deluisional and desperate for an answer

I follow Bitcoin religiously Smiley my wife thinks Bitcoin is more than a religion, she thinks it's a mistress.

My pick-up line at the bars now,

"I am never going to get laid again."

She asks "why?"

"Because all I do is talk about and think about bitcoin!"

And then she reassures me I am wrong.... AWESOME!!! I get to talk and think only about bitcoin and still get laid!!!!
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May 29, 2013, 11:04:35 PM
 #316

My religion is logic; my Lord is reason.

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May 29, 2013, 11:13:07 PM
 #317

It takes far more self righteous ego to project God as the undeniable universal absolute known only to your particular favored translation, upbringing and adult experience than it takes to allow yourself to take sole responsibility for your own life, values, and perception of reality. In my opinion, of course- to answer your question.

Heard. If you think you're god, your argument is with God.

Do you suspect ALL OF THE BOOKS EVER?
Take a quick look at the dewey decimal system up to the fourth decimal place. The religion section alone is humongous due to the dominant christian urge to monopolize ideology.

Really I was talking about the kind of books that lead one to where you are at now, and where I used to be. I'm not a book-burning kind of person, but I've learned: It's garbage in, garbage out.

Please don't tear every book ever written apart cover to cover. Nobody would ever see you finish.

Figurative! Translated: If I had the time, I could analyze and refute the statements, premises and intentions of the above mentioned categories of books, at least the ones I have read and are aware of. Work with me here.

The bible did more good than harm because books don't do harm. Books only codify ideas. People, however, got lots of terrible ideas from lots of terrible books.
You could argue the bible is not one of those terrible books, but even you wouldn't believe you.

Sorry, you honestly kinda lost me there.

EDIT: If you don't believe a thing in the book, of course you're going to think the derived ideas are terrible. I just happen to have more to go on now than the book itself.
My argument is against an externalized god. Satanism is a better argument against theism than atheism is, because satanism exists only to address such foolishness on its own terms. You presume to know what kinda books led me here, huh? Neat. I'm not quoting verses here, youre not debating with books. Youre debating with a person. Referencing book burning in even the most indirectly vague implictly favorable light is enough to get my blood boiling.
( against burning "but" garbage)
Claiming you can somehow refute specific sets arguments, premises, and implications from varieties of categories of books, the identities of which you presume to be able to infer from implications made by me because youve got 'more to go on', and then sitting there pretending not to know exactly what I'm saying when I called some of the decisions made by people based on interpretations of some versions of the bible, 'Terrible' actions, makes my blood boil just a little hotter.
I forgive you though for the moment.
Not because Jesus, but because I GET that you have the capacity to rise above this horrid mire and leave behind the backward slave mentality espoused by countless hordes of insipid, zombified Soldierz of jeesus or whatever.

Wit all my solidarities,
-ktttn
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May 29, 2013, 11:17:13 PM
 #318

Well thank you for your patience. I notice in your response a couple places where I may have miscommunicated. Perhaps we should leave it there.
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May 29, 2013, 11:18:53 PM
 #319

I'm not so sure there is any such thing as a person.  The thing we call "I" and "Me", is nothing more that a thought. And since we cant control our thoughts, we have no free will.
We are nothing but robots, following out our programming with the belief we are someone.  All part of evolution.

All this religious stuff, is just another layer of belief.
ANDNOWFORSOMETHINGCOMPLETELYDIFFERENT.JPY

Tor, onion layers
fractalized identity
where are MY brackets?

Macro and Micro
intestinal sentience
which atoms are mine?

Wit all my solidarities,
-ktttn
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May 29, 2013, 11:21:52 PM
 #320

ffs

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