[ActiveMining] The Official Active Mining Discussion Thread [Self-Moderated]

[mainline]

re: friedcat 40nm


Thats not hard news - far from it. The opening disclaimer says specs and cost and delivery dates are subject to change. In other words this is a theorhetical chip. It hasn't been taped out and he has no funding to have is produced.

Keep bringing up the 'hard news'. lol Its far less substantial than Kens release from last week but lets ignore that shall we?

Compared to the promises made by Ken, friedcat at least bothers to spice his with numbers & stuff, so his shareholders don't have to constantly pick their sphincters for numbers to plug into their smartiferous maths.  
As i said in my post, "As far as promises go, I like Friedcat's better."

The only thing you know about Ken's "theoretical chips" is the ones he has promised you in the past never materialized
Happy trading!

[neilol]

re: friedcat 40nm


Thats not hard news - far from it. The opening disclaimer says specs and cost and delivery dates are subject to change. In other words this is a theorhetical chip. It hasn't been taped out and he has no funding to have is produced.

Keep bringing us the 'hard news'. lol Its far less substantial than Kens release from last week but lets ignore that shall we?

So many misinformed posts ITT in general, as a reminder take everything with a grain of salt:

Bitfountain (ASICMiner and its employees) is one of the largest BTC holders in the world. AND has been holding back the majority of dividends for months.. they have funding

They have also already shipped multiple PH of miners so i wouldn't take their projections too lightly

[VinceSamios]

Some hard news 4 Bob:

...
Specification
Process node: 40nm
Package type: QFN64 8mmx8mm (with another option of QFN64 7mmx7mm possible)
I/O: Standard SPI protocol with clk, in, out and cs.
Rated Hashrate: 12.8GHash/s per chip, with a wide range of overclock/downclock options
Rated Voltage: 0.72V, recommended voltage range is 0.55V-1V
Power Consumption: 0.2J/GHash low voltage, 0.35J/GHash rated voltage
...
Price range
0.49$/G-0.99$/G, depending on order size and delivery speed of choice.
...

As promises go, I like friedcat's better.

0.2w/GH at 40nm... wow... let's hope Ken can get proportionally efficient chips at 28nm... 0.1w/gh should be possible if friedcat can get 0.2w/gh on a 40nm

[mainline]

Some hard news 4 Bob:

...
Specification
Process node: 40nm
Package type: QFN64 8mmx8mm (with another option of QFN64 7mmx7mm possible)
I/O: Standard SPI protocol with clk, in, out and cs.
Rated Hashrate: 12.8GHash/s per chip, with a wide range of overclock/downclock options
Rated Voltage: 0.72V, recommended voltage range is 0.55V-1V
Power Consumption: 0.2J/GHash low voltage, 0.35J/GHash rated voltage
...
Price range
0.49$/G-0.99$/G, depending on order size and delivery speed of choice.
...

As promises go, I like friedcat's better.

0.2w/GH at 40nm... wow... let's hope Ken can get proportionally efficient chips at 28nm... 0.1w/gh should be possible if friedcat can get 0.2w/gh on a 40nm

It doesn't work like that.  Bitfury's 55nm chips aren't half as efficient as today's 28nm chips.  They're *more* power-efficient

[breadcrumbs]

1) What will be reveal today in the weekly PR posting?

2) Will the CEO of Active Mining say that trading will begin?

3) Will the CEO of Active Mining say that there are new delays for trading to begin?

[minerpart]

Exactly right. The nm figure has been misunderstood by the entire investing community. There is no guarantee that a smaller die size is reflected in a more efficient chip. 20nm (KnC Neptune) in my view is a step too far and it's cost of production will not be justified by it's meagre if any improvements over top-spec 28nm.

Again, there is nothing more in friedcats release than in Ken's from last week (plus his posts) except I/O standard (as investors do we need to know that!) and a price point that has a variability of 100%.

Now some people may think a theorhetical chip that hasn't been taped out with a cost per chip prediction that ranges by 100% from a proposer who does not have the funds available to produce that chip is hard news but I would wonder at their sanity.

When he's selling the chip in bulk, selling 10TH/s mining rigs (55nm chip only) with it and running a substantial farm with his chip maybe we can pay him due respect as a competitor. Till  then we just get on with our own projects.

[minerpart]

1) What will be reveal today in the weekly PR posting?

2) Will the CEO of Active Mining say that trading will begin?

3) Will the CEO of Active Mining say that there are new delays for trading to begin?

Most pointless post I've seen in ages.

[JimmyJazz]

Now some people may think a theorhetical chip that hasn't been taped out with a cost per chip prediction that ranges by 100% from a proposer who does not have the funds available to produce that chip is hard news but I would wonder at their sanity.

When he's selling the chip in bulk, selling 10TH/s mining rigs (55nm chip only) with it and running a substantial farm with his chip maybe we can pay him due respect as a competitor. Till  then we just get on with our own projects.

As previously said AM do have the funds to carry out such a project. They have been holding back dividends for some time and have been successful in the past and have most probably saved for a rainy day.

Pay him due respect as a competitor? We are talking about a company which within the BTC securities has actually produced and exceeded expectations. It is with out a doubt the most successful security out there.

However, that being said I do not own any shares - and do own ACTM. So this is where my priorities/hope is.

So.. How will Ken react to his biggest competitors latest update? What will he announce?
We say he holds his cards to his chest due to the competition etc.
Now its time to show the Royal flush.. if he has one.

[mainline]

...
So.. How will Ken react to his biggest competitors latest update? What will he announce?
We say he holds his cards to his chest due to the competition etc.
Now its time to show the Royal flush.. if he has one.

Wouldjabelieve Five Aces?

[VinceSamios]

Some hard news 4 Bob:

...
Specification
Process node: 40nm
Package type: QFN64 8mmx8mm (with another option of QFN64 7mmx7mm possible)
I/O: Standard SPI protocol with clk, in, out and cs.
Rated Hashrate: 12.8GHash/s per chip, with a wide range of overclock/downclock options
Rated Voltage: 0.72V, recommended voltage range is 0.55V-1V
Power Consumption: 0.2J/GHash low voltage, 0.35J/GHash rated voltage
...
Price range
0.49$/G-0.99$/G, depending on order size and delivery speed of choice.
...

As promises go, I like friedcat's better.

0.2w/GH at 40nm... wow... let's hope Ken can get proportionally efficient chips at 28nm... 0.1w/gh should be possible if friedcat can get 0.2w/gh on a 40nm

It doesn't work like that.  Bitfury's 55nm chips aren't half as efficient as today's 28nm chips.  They're *more* power-efficient

Yes because bitfurys chips have been designed better, hence my hope that ken can make the most of the power efficiency benefits of a smaller process and get down to the theoretical level of about 0.1w/gh

[minerpart]

As previously said AM do have the funds to carry out such a project.

Agreed, to get the chip production-ready by March we have to assume they do, but they are now actively looking for customers (or Partners as they say) to fund chip runs. Any order will have a 2 or 3 month wait so if a customer decides to wait until the chip is batch-ready i.e. March before they hand over their cash, they will then have a further 2 or 3month wait untill delivery. That's beginning of June.

Chips will be available for ordering once the functionality and yield rate are confirmed with testing on actual chips.

Orders are not yet being taken. Lets get back to this project once they actually start taking orders. They do not have enough funds from reading between the lines/do not wish to commit to funding production past batch 1. Further batches will arrive May or June - or probably beginning of Q3.

[sparky999]

AM have something in the order of $5-$10mill in bitcoins don't they? Whatever their reason for looking for partners is, it's most certainly not a funding issue.

[minerpart]

AM have something in the order of $5-$10mill in bitcoins don't they? Whatever their reason for looking for partners is, it's most certainly not a funding issue.

If that's true and the chip has those specs they surely would throw all of that money into it. Something doesn't add up imho. Or maybe they are accepting that even their own plans for their own chip can run into delays and stumbling blocks and (some of) that money could be lost? Success in this industry is not as easy to pull off as some people would hope.

[mainline]

...
Orders are not yet being taken. Lets get back to this project once they actually start taking orders. They do not have enough funds from reading between the lines/do not wish to commit to funding production past batch 1. Further batches will arrive May or June - or probably beginning of Q3.

Orders are not yet being taken for the simple reason that friedcat is not willing to scam as hard as Ken.
Ken sold pre-orders in his nonexistent 28nm chips like a boss.
Not just chips, completed miners, lol.

[drawingthesun]

AM have something in the order of $5-$10mill in bitcoins don't they? Whatever their reason for looking for partners is, it's most certainly not a funding issue.

For AM yes, however the owners (Friedcat, etc..) have closer to $50 - 100 million in Bitcoins, if they need to reinvest they certainly can.

[mainline]

...
0.2w/GH at 40nm... wow... let's hope Ken can get proportionally efficient chips at 28nm... 0.1w/gh should be possible if friedcat can get 0.2w/gh on a 40nm

It doesn't work like that.  Bitfury's 55nm chips aren't half as efficient as today's 28nm chips.  They're *more* power-efficient

Yes because bitfurys chips have been designed better, hence my hope that ken can make the most of the power efficiency benefits of a smaller process and get down to the theoretical level of about 0.1w/gh

Please.  Let's keep one foot in reality.  The guy can't open his eyes for a publicity shot, can't write above grade-school level, and you think he'll hit the theoretical process efficiency?
ROFL.

[MrTeal]

Yes because bitfurys chips have been designed better, hence my hope that ken can make the most of the power efficiency benefits of a smaller process and get down to the theoretical level of about 0.1w/gh

Out of curiosity, why would you think that Ken would be able hit those kinds of numbers? So far every manufacturer of ASICs has been off on their specs and Friedcat hitting those numbers would be extremely impressive. So far on the 28nm process we've seen chips by Cointerra, KnC and HashFast, and all those companies are hitting around 1J/GH at the wall. It's not like those outfits are filled with incapable people, either.
From AnandTech

Coming into the ASIC market is CoinTerra, headed up by Ravi Iyengar, former CPU Lead Architect at Samsung’s Austin Research Center (SARC).  Ravi’s focus at SARC was on the CPU Mid-Core, including integer execution and special purpose registers (good for Bitcoin).  His history also includes helping design chips for the SGS4, as well as stints at Intel, Qualcomm and NVIDIA.  At CoinTerra he is joined by Jim O’Connor, VP of Engineering with a history of SOC design and Dr. Naveed Sherwani, CEO of Open Silicon.

Those guys haven't been able to hit 1J/GH at the wall on 28nm. 0.1J/GH even at the chip level would require a minor miracle.

[minerpart]

Please.  Let's keep one foot in reality.  The guy can't open his eyes for a publicity shot, can't write above grade-school level, and you think he'll hit the theoretical process efficiency?
ROFL.

Reality is Ken has taken on 2 in-house engineers who have already proven their metal with a taped out 55nm with excellent specs. So get back into your chair.

[mainline]

Please.  Let's keep one foot in reality.  The guy can't open his eyes for a publicity shot, can't write above grade-school level, and you think he'll hit the theoretical process efficiency?
ROFL.

Reality is Ken has taken on 2 in-house engineers who have already proven their metal with a taped out 55nm with excellent specs. So get back into your chair.

Discovered his limitations a bit late, huh?  About half a year too late, from the looks of it

And ... Did you mean: "proved their mettle"?  Or "proved they're metal"
Just trying to figure out what you're trying to say, since the first would be proven when the chips hash, and the second brings us back to moar Wizard of Oz quotes.

[minerpart]

Discovered his limitations a bit late, huh?  About half a year too late, from the looks of it

No it's a brand new project - 55nm full custom.

no, metal - they are cyborgs.