[HAVELOCK] PETAMINE - 1,150 TH/S HASH RATE (1GH/S per Unit)

[tsm13]

here is my div prediction, first time im taking my high ball estimate

0.0007975188

[1715142138]

1715142138

[1715142138]

1715142138

[1715142138]

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1715142138

[dhenson]

Cryptx,

Would it be possible to get a picture of the data center?  400+TH has got to be an impressive looking setup.

All that hard work, it's time for you to show it off!

[Darkstone2]

here you can see user running scalp bot on 30s interval, it's so crude and basic yet very effective at keeping the price down combined with havelock low volume

Thanks for this. It is quite clear

I'm not sure why you should thank him. Scalping bots do various things, but 'keeping the price down' is definitely not one of them.

However, maybe someone can explain/clarify me a couple of things:

I suppose that the owner of this bot has both cash and shares to play with (assumption?)

So:
1. you have btc available, but you prefer to keep btc rather than getting dividends.
2. you have shares available, but you "use" them to lower the price.

If the above is correct, I would really really like to know "how is it going?". Did you actually increase the number of shares you own over time? How do you survive with the fees from Havelock? (with small variations from sell/buy/sell/buy, the fees should be killing you... I don't get it)
And more important, how do you keep track of all the operations and the final balance of shares/price paid?
Are you keeping track in excel or you use a small DB to extract calculations and reports?
And: are you actually profitable more in Peta/Havelock or would you have more benefit on playing your bot on a btc/fiat exchange?

Feel free to use a throwaway account to reply, but please, explain (and thanks in advance if you decide to do so).

Bonus questions:
are you playing to keep the price down to increase annual yeld? Are you trying to increase the number of shares you own or are you looking for a short term profit?

I think that the term "to play with" fits with the general idea people seem to have with bots quite well. Because if you had a lot of shares, it would be stupid to use those to 'keep the price down'. The only way to do that is by selling them under the market price. Which would be exactly opposite of what the the scalping strategy is supposed to do.

Additional, as somebody that has actual experience with this, scalping with naive algorithms is generally not profitable unless there is extreme volatility, such as when NEOBEE went first live and i increased my holdings from 0.2 BTC to 0.5 BTC in a few days (a good bunch of this can be attributed to the price rise itself). There exists more sophisticated algorithms that work in more general conditions but those require you to make good predictions of market volatility which is quite hard to without a degree in statistics.

[mikemikemike]

At this week, we should take an additional level to our betting game:

Will we hit 500TH/s before Friday - YES/NO?

I would say YES!  

Personally I hope yes, but I would say no this time.
Custom board should bring us total 250TH/s and that's all. Evan Peta deploys all custom board before Friday, we shall see around 450TH/s there. There's no way to be 500 TH/s this week. Unless Bitmine delivers those rigs to us this week but that is impossible from now to see.
So I'd vote NO. Sadly, but that's true.

I'd be very surprised if now we have our own production CryptX hasn't agreed with bitmine to swap the rigs for chips. It's a win win for both companies.

1) Bitmine can use the units they where going to send to us to clear up their customer backlog, which is killing their business. Plus, they have no problems supplying chips. This would be a massive win for them.
2)CryptX doesn't have to rely on bitmine to produce their units as we can now produce ours. This is a massive win for us.

The only reason we had unit orders was because it was going to take a couple of months before we could design snd produce our own PCBs, and Since CryptX went to see bitmine a few weeks ago, I don't think we have actually had any units from them. Everything points to the above.

I think from now onwards we are done with bitmines units and now just using them for chips.

/speculation

At this week, we should take an additional level to our betting game:

Will we hit 500TH/s before Friday - YES/NO?

I would say YES!  

And nah. This seems crazy. considering how many units we've received last week and this week, everything points to a max capacity of 100 of our own units a week. And I think we've had our batch for this week. If I'm wrong, il be really happy, but it just seems kinda excessive. I'm over the moon with 100TH a week though.

[kenmomotaro]

At this week, we should take an additional level to our betting game:

Will we hit 500TH/s before Friday - YES/NO?

I would say YES!  

Personally I hope yes, but I would say no this time.
Custom board should bring us total 250TH/s and that's all. Evan Peta deploys all custom board before Friday, we shall see around 450TH/s there. There's no way to be 500 TH/s this week. Unless Bitmine delivers those rigs to us this week but that is impossible from now to see.
So I'd vote NO. Sadly, but that's true.

I'd be very surprised if now we have our own production CryptX hasn't agreed with bitmine to swap the rigs for chips. It's a win win for both companies.

1) Bitmine can use the units they where going to send to us to clear up their customer backlog, which is killing their business. Plus, they have no problems supplying chips. This would be a massive win for them.
2)CryptX doesn't have to rely on bitmine to produce their units as we can now produce ours. This is a massive win for us.

The only reason we had unit orders was because it was going to take a couple of months before we could design snd produce our own PCBs, and Since CryptX went to see bitmine a few weeks ago, I don't think we have actually had any units from them. Everything points to the above.

I think from now onwards we are done with bitmines units and now just using them for chips.

/speculation

At this week, we should take an additional level to our betting game:

Will we hit 500TH/s before Friday - YES/NO?

I would say YES!  

And nah. This seems crazy. considering how many units we've received last week and this week, everything points to a max capacity of 100 of our own units a week. And I think we've had our batch for this week. If I'm wrong, il be really happy, but it just seems kinda excessive. I'm over the moon with 100TH a week though.

If we continue this 100TH a week progress, a month later we would be around 1% of total network.
By that time, div would probably be around 0.0014. Can't wait!

[Anotheranonlol]

here you can see user running scalp bot on 30s interval, it's so crude and basic yet very effective at keeping the price down combined with havelock low volume

Thanks for this. It is quite clear

I'm not sure why you should thank him. Scalping bots do various things, but 'keeping the price down' is definitely not one of them.

However, maybe someone can explain/clarify me a couple of things:

I suppose that the owner of this bot has both cash and shares to play with (assumption?)

So:
1. you have btc available, but you prefer to keep btc rather than getting dividends.
2. you have shares available, but you "use" them to lower the price.

If the above is correct, I would really really like to know "how is it going?". Did you actually increase the number of shares you own over time? How do you survive with the fees from Havelock? (with small variations from sell/buy/sell/buy, the fees should be killing you... I don't get it)
And more important, how do you keep track of all the operations and the final balance of shares/price paid?
Are you keeping track in excel or you use a small DB to extract calculations and reports?
And: are you actually profitable more in Peta/Havelock or would you have more benefit on playing your bot on a btc/fiat exchange?

Feel free to use a throwaway account to reply, but please, explain (and thanks in advance if you decide to do so).

Bonus questions:
are you playing to keep the price down to increase annual yeld? Are you trying to increase the number of shares you own or are you looking for a short term profit?

I think that the term "to play with" fits with the general idea people seem to have with bots quite well. Because if you had a lot of shares, it would be stupid to use those to 'keep the price down'. The only way to do that is by selling them under the market price. Which would be exactly opposite of what the the scalping strategy is supposed to do.

Additional, as somebody that has actual experience with this, scalping with naive algorithms is generally not profitable unless there is extreme volatility, such as when NEOBEE went first live and i increased my holdings from 0.2 BTC to 0.5 BTC in a few days (a good bunch of this can be attributed to the price rise itself). There exists more sophisticated algorithms that work in more general conditions but those require you to make good predictions of market volatility which is quite hard to without a degree in statistics.

Darkstone2, I'm aware of what scalping bots are, run them on various exchanges for last 9months, they have limited effiency as far as i saw, sometimes very small windows and their intended purpose is not to keep the price down whatsoever, they'd operate regardless of the price of this asset and have no vested interest in it being lower or higher;  however this is an (un)intended result of this bot in particular and if you'd tried to sell and buy back shares here you will notice this

[ateneto]

Cryptsy is presently able to sell 10GHs mining contracts for 0.185 BTC each.
Compared to that Petamine shares are undervalued even at the present hash rate.
I think the present price is mostly due to the few people who actually know about
this operation even in the crypto world.

[altoidmintz]

Cryptsy is presently able to sell 10GHs mining contracts for 0.185 BTC each.
Compared to that Petamine shares are undervalued even at the present hash rate.
I think the present price is mostly due to the few people who actually know about
this operation even  in the crypto world.

when we hit 1% of network or more we can celebrate with a press release and post it to reddit, maybe even get legit news hits.

If Peta doesn't write a press release for their website, I will write an unofficial one and post to mine - I might do that even if they do the official one.

[Darkstone2]

Darkstone2, I'm aware of what scalping bots are, run them on various exchanges for last 9months, they have limited effiency as far as i saw, sometimes very small windows and their intended purpose is not to keep the price down whatsoever, they'd operate regardless of the price of this asset and have no vested interest in it being lower or higher;  however this is an (un)intended result of this bot in particular and if you'd tried to sell and buy back shares here you will notice this

Not at all. If the bot tries to sell shares, The price 'stays down' as you call it. However when an bot tries to buy an share, exactly the opposite effect occurs.

It is only possible to affect the price if different algorithms are used for buying and selling, which a scalping bot does not do. If i create an bot that sells at the current market price and buys when the price drops a certain amount of points below the average, then you have an bot that pushes the price down. Of course it is trivially possible to do the same thing in reverse and push the price up.


For anyone thinking to create such a bot now, it is not that hard to prove that such behavior is suboptimal for the bot owner.

[E f f e c T]

Yea I'd happily do some stuff too. If we could get a rough list of what should be delivered for the next few months ill draw up some accurate projections with multiple scenarios, the sort of detailed projections that cover all of the factors in high detail

[kenmomotaro]

The other thing we cannot control is Bitcoin's price. If bitcoin's price keeps around USD$500, and network hashrate keeps going up to 200PH/s, by that time we shareholders would receive nothing as dividends. Unless Cryptx starts to deploy better GHs/Watts miners. So it's necessary to start next gen custom boards research/production, using better chips like AM gen3 chips or something else.

[Anotheranonlol]

Darkstone2, I'm aware of what scalping bots are, run them on various exchanges for last 9months, they have limited effiency as far as i saw, sometimes very small windows and their intended purpose is not to keep the price down whatsoever, they'd operate regardless of the price of this asset and have no vested interest in it being lower or higher;  however this is an (un)intended result of this bot in particular and if you'd tried to sell and buy back shares here you will notice this

Not at all. If the bot tries to sell shares, The price 'stays down' as you call it. However when an bot tries to buy an share, exactly the opposite effect occurs.

It is only possible to affect the price if different algorithms are used for buying and selling, which a scalping bot does not do. If i create an bot that sells at the current market price and buys when the price drops a certain amount of points below the average, then you have an bot that pushes the price down. Of course it is trivially possible to do the same thing in reverse and push the price up.


For anyone thinking to create such a bot now, it is not that hard to prove that such behavior is suboptimal for the bot owner.

'scalping' is the wrong word. it is not even selling these shares. if the bot is yours you will already know the behavior well, if not just take a look at the orderbook and try and sell say; 2 shares for a better understanding

[rdyoung]

The other thing we cannot control is Bitcoin's price. If bitcoin's price keeps around USD$500, and network hashrate keeps going up to 200PH/s, by that time we shareholders would receive nothing as dividends. Unless Cryptx starts to deploy better GHs/Watts miners. So it's necessary to start next gen custom boards research/production, using better chips like AM gen3 chips or something else.

At that point though, the network hashrate will stagnate or start dropping in which case our dividends will increase.
I do agree with you though that if the connections and funds are available starting research into 20nm or smaller now will only help us down the road.
Slightly off topic, but you triggered a geek moment. I wonder if anyone is looking into the fiber optic switching for chips.

Edit: I was correct.
http://www.intel.com/pressroom/archive/releases/2010/20100727comp_sm.htm
In 2010 they had an experimental chip that could do 50gbps.

[twentyseventy]

The other thing we cannot control is Bitcoin's price. If bitcoin's price keeps around USD$500, and network hashrate keeps going up to 200PH/s, by that time we shareholders would receive nothing as dividends. Unless Cryptx starts to deploy better GHs/Watts miners. So it's necessary to start next gen custom boards research/production, using better chips like AM gen3 chips or something else.

At that point though, the network hashrate will stagnate or start dropping in which case our dividends will increase.
I do agree with you though that if the connections and funds are available starting research into 20nm or smaller now will only help us down the road.

The hashrate will stagnate / drop only if BTC remains stagnant/dropping over a prolonged period of time (I would say 12+ months). For any time period less than that, there is still mining equipment already being funded/manufactured.

Once the mining equipment is being manufactured/shipping, someone is going to use to for its one and only purpose. BTC would have to be down and stay down for a long time for the difficulty to actually stagnate. Decreasing is even more unlikely, as all profitable hashpower (with respect to electricity cost) would be kept online since it would be making the same amount of / more BTC compared to its previous difficulty period's outputs.

[rdyoung]

The other thing we cannot control is Bitcoin's price. If bitcoin's price keeps around USD$500, and network hashrate keeps going up to 200PH/s, by that time we shareholders would receive nothing as dividends. Unless Cryptx starts to deploy better GHs/Watts miners. So it's necessary to start next gen custom boards research/production, using better chips like AM gen3 chips or something else.

At that point though, the network hashrate will stagnate or start dropping in which case our dividends will increase.
I do agree with you though that if the connections and funds are available starting research into 20nm or smaller now will only help us down the road.

The hashrate will stagnate / drop only if BTC remains stagnant/dropping over a prolonged period of time (I would say 12+ months). For any time period less than that, there is still mining equipment already being funded/manufactured.

Once the mining equipment is being manufactured/shipping, someone is going to use to for its one and only purpose. BTC would have to be down and stay down for a long time for the difficulty to actually stagnate. Decreasing is even more unlikely, as all profitable hashpower (with respect to electricity cost) would be kept online since it would be making the same amount of / more BTC compared to its previous difficulty period's outputs.

Just did some math, thanks to thegenesisblock.
Cointerra's terraminer IV becomes an immediate loss at 164090MM with $/kwh at 12c which is what I pay. I live near a nuclear plant.
At 30c/kwh it becomes a net loss at 66570MM. I define loss as not mining enough to pay for its own power.

I don't know what KNC, CEX, or any others actually pay per kwh, but I would bet that if the btc/usd exchange rate flatlines for just another 6 months at most we will start see small to medium miners shutting down their rigs.

We do indeed have a LOT of hardware in research/design and production stages worldwide, but just because they are being built doesn't mean they have to turned on if someone can't afford to at the least pay the powerbill from what they mine.
Some hobby miners might be able to foot the power bill for a few months giving the price time to recover, but it will likely happen faster than you think it will. You can't count out other sha coins as a target for that hashing power. PPC seems to be getting quite the boost as of late, 50% or so increase in the last couple of weeks.

To clarify, I don't believe that the price will stay this low for much longer. We may see another dip testing the 350$ range, but if it holds and rebounds from that for a 4th time all is well. IMO there is too much interest in BTC from both the services IE exchanges/businesses, etc and the BTC as a commodity to invest in angles that there is no good reason for it not to start climbing again.

[nwfella]

My official next dividend guess: 0.00076564

*Some pic's of the datacenter would be pretty neat if you get some free time cryptx

[EdoBcn]

Thanks for this. It is quite clear

I'm not sure why you should thank him. Scalping bots do various things, but 'keeping the price down' is definitely not one of them.

I think that the term "to play with" fits with the general idea people seem to have with bots quite well. Because if you had a lot of shares, it would be stupid to use those to 'keep the price down'. The only way to do that is by selling them under the market price. Which would be exactly opposite of what the the scalping strategy is supposed to do.

Additional, as somebody that has actual experience with this, scalping with naive algorithms is generally not profitable unless there is extreme volatility, such as when NEOBEE went first live and i increased my holdings from 0.2 BTC to 0.5 BTC in a few days (a good bunch of this can be attributed to the price rise itself). There exists more sophisticated algorithms that work in more general conditions but those require you to make good predictions of market volatility which is quite hard to without a degree in statistics.

My thanks was referred to the time spent to reply to my question. I tend to be over-polite sometimes.

Assuming the bot is run by someone who has buying capabilities (funds available), he may want to keep the price down to purchase more shares, even if the bot makes him lose some little money. Or, assuming a long term shot, keeping the price down may attract more investors who see the high yearly interest, creating the opportunity to sell his ipo purchased shares.
There are many different scenarios involve here. Guessing is just a fun game for now.

Market cap is over 5000 btc now, I feel like a really small fish and there must be some really big whales out there playing with small losses today, with an eye on the future of this. And at the same time, it is fairly possible that they are "betting" on them being smarter than others.... and they could be wrong.

For sure, Cryptx knows who are the big whales and with minimum analysis find out how they are playing with their shares. Confidential info, for sure, not asking anything here!

[millenium]

Next dividend will be higher than 0.0008 

[Darkstone2]

'scalping' is the wrong word. it is not even selling these shares. if the bot is yours you will already know the behavior well, if not just take a look at the orderbook and try and sell say; 2 shares for a better understanding

You run a bot that creates supply but not demand, and now you're arguing that that 'keeps the price down'

Edit: that statement is wrong. Your bot creates demand, not supply. The question still stands though.

Assuming the bot is run by someone who has buying capabilities (funds available), he may want to keep the price down to purchase more shares, even if the bot makes him lose some little money. Or, assuming a long term shot, keeping the price down may attract more investors who see the high yearly interest, creating the opportunity to sell his ipo purchased shares.
There are many different scenarios involve here. Guessing is just a fun game for now.

that sounds really cool, but it just doesn't work. The effect of buying will cancel out the effect of the bot. The only one that will profit from such a move is havelock.

[EdoBcn]

that sounds really cool, but it just doesn't work. The effect of buying will cancel out the effect of the bot. The only one that will profit from such a move is havelock.

Follow the money = then it's a bot from havelock?
This would be an interesting twist!!!