Re: Mining pools list

[macdaddy]

I fixed your url.

So let me make absolutely sure I understand this - there is no minimum payout? Even if someone has only earned one satoshi in a block it will be paid when the block is solved?

If it is p2pool then it isn't (currently) possible to earn one satoshi, because the share difficulty is pretty high, so one share pays a lot more than that.

Yes, I'm not sure if the pool is a node or a proxy. If it's a proxy then it depends on the variable difficulty set by the proxy owner.  I thought one of the reasons for p2pool proxies was increase the usability of p2pool for miners with low hashrates, or do the proxies run at super high difficulties too?

You are right of course. Most of these new "pools" that pop up are just p2pool nodes though.

In that case they shouldn't be here, rather they should be in the p2pool node wiki.

Pool ops - please be honest: are you proxies or nodes? If you're nodes you're not really a proxy or a pool and should be listed in the p2pool node list. If someone posts the url here I'll update the op with it.

Mine is a node, I appologize if I misunderstood what you were listing as a proxy. I am already listed in the p2pool lists I found. You can remove mine from the list.

Thanks

[PublicP2poolNode]

I fixed your url.

So let me make absolutely sure I understand this - there is no minimum payout? Even if someone has only earned one satoshi in a block it will be paid when the block is solved?

If it is p2pool then it isn't (currently) possible to earn one satoshi, because the share difficulty is pretty high, so one share pays a lot more than that.

Yes, I'm not sure if the pool is a node or a proxy. If it's a proxy then it depends on the variable difficulty set by the proxy owner.  I thought one of the reasons for p2pool proxies was increase the usability of p2pool for miners with low hashrates, or do the proxies run at super high difficulties too?

You are right of course. Most of these new "pools" that pop up are just p2pool nodes though.

In that case they shouldn't be here, rather they should be in the p2pool node wiki.

Pool ops - please be honest: are you proxies or nodes? If you're nodes you're not really a proxy or a pool and should be listed in the p2pool node list. If someone posts the url here I'll update the op with it.

Mine is a node, I appologize if I misunderstood what you were listing as a proxy. I am already listed in the p2pool lists I found. You can remove mine from the list.

Thanks

The pool I listed under the proxy section was p2poolserver.us

from wiki: In computer networks, a proxy server is a server (a computer system or an application) that acts as an intermediary for requests from clients seeking resources from other servers. A client connects to the proxy server, requesting some service, such as a file, connection, web page, or other resource available from a different server and the proxy server evaluates the request as a way to simplify and control its complexity. Proxies were invented to add structure and encapsulation to distributed systems.[1] Today, most proxies are web proxies, facilitating access to content on the World Wide Web and providing anonymity.

In my case "p2poolserver.us is a proxy server (a computer system or an application) that acts as an intermediary for requests from clients (Miners) seeking resources from other servers. (Bitcoind and P2Pool). A client (Miner) connects to the proxy server (p2poolserver.us) or any other p2pool pool, requesting some service, such as a file, connection, web page, or other resource available (like getblocktemplate or stratum protocol) from a different server (or in p2pool case, different servers) and the proxy server evaluates the request as a way to simplify and control its complexity.

P2Pool server acts as an intermediary from miners who want to mine on p2pool without running a full bitcoin and p2pool node themselves.

So I would say that yes, I am a proxy pool.

A p2pool node can allow connections or not and it's up to the operator of that node to decide.

So I personally do not think that it would be fair to delete people who would like to list their p2pool pool under the proxy section.

Personally I wish that it could be listed under PPLNS, cause it is, but I understand the reasoning behind it, as anyone with the right hardware and some reading on the internet can set up their own p2pool pool and it would clutter it up for the other pools.

What would be nice would be to restructure the 1st post to show PPLNS last, then immediately under that, have the proxy pools, but rename it Public P2Pool Nodes, or P2Pool Pools.

I think the vast majority of people like what p2pool is about but either don't want to bother with learning how to set it up, or can't, and don't realize that there are a ton of p2pools out there, which are p2pool nodes that allow other miners to join them.

[organofcorti]

<snip>

I think the vast majority of people like what p2pool is about but either don't want to bother with learning how to set it up, or can't, and don't realize that there are a ton of p2pools out there, which are p2pool nodes that allow other miners to join them.

I think that you're misunderstanding me. For the purposes of this thread, a p2pool proxy does exactly what you're doing - act as a front-end to p2pool to lower the barrier of entry to p2pool for miners (either the hashrate barrier or the knowledge barrier).

A p2pool node is for p2pool miners to mine more efficiently.

Since you're a proxy, I won't be removing you from the list.

[smooth]

<snip>

I think the vast majority of people like what p2pool is about but either don't want to bother with learning how to set it up, or can't, and don't realize that there are a ton of p2pools out there, which are p2pool nodes that allow other miners to join them.

I think that you're misunderstanding me. For the purposes of this thread, a p2pool proxy does exactly what you're doing - act as a front-end to p2pool to lower the barrier of entry to p2pool for miners (either the hashrate barrier or the knowledge barrier).

A p2pool node is for p2pool miners to mine more efficiently.

Since you're a proxy, I won't be removing you from the list.

I don't see where his node is a proxy (as you define it). I clicked over to his web site and it looks just like a node to me. He certainly doesn't seem to be reducing the hash rate barrier, because it explicitly says that miners get coinbase transactions and get paid if they have one share in the share chain.

As far as the knowledge barrier, I'm not sure what you mean by that. Every public p2pool node reduces the knowledge barrier in the sense that people can use it without having to install and configure their own p2pool node and bitcoin node.

[organofcorti]

<snip>

I think the vast majority of people like what p2pool is about but either don't want to bother with learning how to set it up, or can't, and don't realize that there are a ton of p2pools out there, which are p2pool nodes that allow other miners to join them.

I think that you're misunderstanding me. For the purposes of this thread, a p2pool proxy does exactly what you're doing - act as a front-end to p2pool to lower the barrier of entry to p2pool for miners (either the hashrate barrier or the knowledge barrier).

A p2pool node is for p2pool miners to mine more efficiently.

Since you're a proxy, I won't be removing you from the list.

I don't see where his node is a proxy (as you define it). I clicked over to his web site and it looks just like a node to me. He certainly doesn't seem to be reducing the hash rate barrier, because it explicitly says that miners get coinbase transactions and get paid if they have one share in the share chain.

As far as the knowledge barrier, I'm not sure what you mean by that. Every public p2pool node reduces the knowledge barrier in the sense that people can use it without having to install and configure their own p2pool node and bitcoin node.

Well, I'm not a p2pool miner, or a p2pool proxy miner. I'll leave this up to the community to hash out; once there's a consensus I'll update the OP.

[smooth]

<snip>

I think the vast majority of people like what p2pool is about but either don't want to bother with learning how to set it up, or can't, and don't realize that there are a ton of p2pools out there, which are p2pool nodes that allow other miners to join them.

I think that you're misunderstanding me. For the purposes of this thread, a p2pool proxy does exactly what you're doing - act as a front-end to p2pool to lower the barrier of entry to p2pool for miners (either the hashrate barrier or the knowledge barrier).

A p2pool node is for p2pool miners to mine more efficiently.

Since you're a proxy, I won't be removing you from the list.

I don't see where his node is a proxy (as you define it). I clicked over to his web site and it looks just like a node to me. He certainly doesn't seem to be reducing the hash rate barrier, because it explicitly says that miners get coinbase transactions and get paid if they have one share in the share chain.

As far as the knowledge barrier, I'm not sure what you mean by that. Every public p2pool node reduces the knowledge barrier in the sense that people can use it without having to install and configure their own p2pool node and bitcoin node.

Well, I'm not a p2pool miner, or a p2pool proxy miner. I'll leave this up to the community to hash out; once there's a consensus I'll update the OP.

You have to give a clear definition.

Is a p2pool node with a fancy web site considered a proxy or is some added functionality required?

[organofcorti]

You have to give a clear definition.

Is a p2pool node with a fancy web site considered a proxy or is some added functionality required?

You miss the point of this thread. It's supposed to be informed by the community and with decisions made by the same - I don't mine p2pool, and I don't have time to try lots of new things just so I can be repository of knowledge for all things to do with BTC pooled mining.

I will abide by community decisions about what they want and why they want it if they can explain their points to me clearly.

As I said, I'm turning the decision over to the community. Please continue your discussion with them.

Also, if anyone wishes to take this thread over (smooth, I'm looking at you), please pm me.

[smooth]

Also, if anyone wishes to take this thread over (smooth, I'm looking at you), please pm me.

I do not. I'm just providing community feedback. I find it useful to differentiate on a guide between generic p2pool nodes and pools that offer something else (even if backed by p2pool). If the rest of the community does not agree with me then so be it. I'm capable of figuring out which is which, but it is somewhat tedious.

[PublicP2poolNode]

<snip>

I think the vast majority of people like what p2pool is about but either don't want to bother with learning how to set it up, or can't, and don't realize that there are a ton of p2pools out there, which are p2pool nodes that allow other miners to join them.

I think that you're misunderstanding me. For the purposes of this thread, a p2pool proxy does exactly what you're doing - act as a front-end to p2pool to lower the barrier of entry to p2pool for miners (either the hashrate barrier or the knowledge barrier).

A p2pool node is for p2pool miners to mine more efficiently.

Since you're a proxy, I won't be removing you from the list.

I don't see where his node is a proxy (as you define it). I clicked over to his web site and it looks just like a node to me. He certainly doesn't seem to be reducing the hash rate barrier, because it explicitly says that miners get coinbase transactions and get paid if they have one share in the share chain.

As far as the knowledge barrier, I'm not sure what you mean by that. Every public p2pool node reduces the knowledge barrier in the sense that people can use it without having to install and configure their own p2pool node and bitcoin node.

Well, I'm not a p2pool miner, or a p2pool proxy miner. I'll leave this up to the community to hash out; once there's a consensus I'll update the OP.

You have to give a clear definition.

Is a p2pool node with a fancy web site considered a proxy or is some added functionality required?

From the wiki definition of a proxy server, I think that  any p2pool node that is accessible for anyone to join
fits the definition of a proxy server.

As far as "every public p2pool node reduces the knowledge barrier in the sense that people can use it without having to install and configure their own p2pool node and bitcoin node." I argue that most people don't know that, and by clicking on most nodes, should they even know to look for them, the user will see something that does not make any sense to them and will move on.

The problem I see with many of them is exactly what your griping about be a fancy website.

I think that is what p2pool lacks.

Most people look into mining have a hard enough time getting the miner to work, let alone setting up a full bitcoin node and p2pool node.

When they search for bitcoin pools, they may come across p2pool, see that it's the only one that is PPLNS, Solo Mining.

The sound of solo mining might just scare them away, because they want a guaranteed return on their investment.

However for those that look further, find that it's a pool where you solo mine with other solo miners, and their interested.

But trying to figure out how to get it all working looks way too confusing, or they simply don't have the hardware needed to run their own node.

At this point, they look no further and go to a big centralized pool, because it is easy.

However a few, may look a little deeper and find the sites i listed earlier that tell you other p2pool nodes that are online.

Even then, if a person were to click on one of the ip addresses, they would probably still be confused and not understand how to join or anything else.

That is why I decided to make a website for my p2pool pool that helped gather information together and make it easy to understand what p2pool is as well as make it as user friendly as possible for anyone to join who didn't have the previous know how.

I vote, let p2poolserver.us stay under the proxy list, and think other p2pool operators should be able to list theirs as they wish.

Of course it's up to the community and organofcorti makes the decision based on that  

I hope the community let's me stay, because I want p2pool to stay in the game, and I'm trying to help that out by making it easier for people who don't understand what it is, to give it a try.

Hopefully, they'll decided to run their own pool some day

[smooth]

The problem I see with many of them is exactly what your griping about be a fancy website.

I think that is what p2pool lacks.

I agree with you entirely. I see a lot of value in user-friendly p2pool nodes. That is not the issue I'm raising.

The issue is whether there should be a separate list or section for pools that offer distinct functionality from what every other p2pool node offers. I believe there should be such a list. Perhaps improved web site or better stats is enough to be on that list. Maybe a sentence or short phrase describing what is unique about the node is a good compromise

[PublicP2poolNode]

The problem I see with many of them is exactly what your griping about be a fancy website.

I think that is what p2pool lacks.

I agree with you entirely. I see a lot of value in user-friendly p2pool nodes. That is not the issue I'm raising.

The issue is whether there should be a separate list or section for pools that offer distinct functionality from what every other p2pool node offers. I believe there should be such a list. Perhaps improved web site or better stats is enough to be on that list. Maybe a sentence or short phrase describing what is unique about the node is a good compromise

Here is why, This thread is for BTC Mining Pool List.

Some guy just got his shiny new miner and is interested in joining a pool.

He stumbles across bitcointalk.org and finds his way to "BTC Mining Pools List"

Under the PPLNS section he sees P2Pool and clicks on it. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=18313.0
He freaks out and says whoah, nevermind, and joins another pool.

Later he reads about p2pool nodes and does a search on google for "list of p2pool nodes", and comes up with http://p2pool-nodes.info/

He clicks on the link and sees a list of ip addresses.

Now, please, go click on a few of them and think about if you knew nothing about p2pool and had come this far, would you know how to make sense of what you were looking at?

That leaves p2pool in the dust for many people.

Now, click on http://www.p2poolserver.us and ask yourself, if you just found this thread on bitcointalk and were interested in p2pool, would my site be beneficial to you?

If this answer is yes, then my site should stay.

[smooth]

If this answer is yes, then my site should stay.

I agree, as I said.  My only question is one of organization.

It is actually bad for you -- and for the novice miners to which you refer -- if your site is in a section with 100 other p2pool nodes.

There needs to be some sort of organization to it.

[PublicP2poolNode]

If this answer is yes, then my site should stay.

I agree, as I said.  My only question is one of organization.

It is actually bad for you -- and for the novice miners to which you refer -- if your site is in a section with 100 other p2pool nodes.

There needs to be some sort of organization to it.

I would agree if it was in a section with 100 other pool nodes.

Right now, there's only four listed, and their not listed as IP addresses like most nodes are that have no interest in attracting other miners, and may or may not be publicly available, or list the fees that they charge.

Rather the four pools listed were made specifically to attract other miners to the pool. Not just a node that comes on and off all the time with no intentions of letting other people use their node to hash on, and they may not even allow it anyway.

If the proxy pools one day turned into a list of hundreds of ip addresses that were p2pool nodes and were not user friendly then I would suggest a change.

as far as wanting some sort of organization to it, a suggestion would be not to list any proxy pools that don't provide any extra service than a basic p2pool node. For example: http://72.14.191.28:9332/static/


To list hundreds of these here would not be very beneficial as that's what a basic p2pool node looks like if you were to locate one and the average user would hit the back button and find a pool that makes sense to them and they understand the fees and payment structures e.t.c.

[organofcorti]

What I'm reading is that if a p2pool proxy (or any proxy for that matter) provides a front end with statistics and a service to which a novice can connect his miner in the same way he or she would connect his or her miner to any other pool, then they belong in the BTC Mining pools list.

Is that agreeable to both of you?

[PublicP2poolNode]

Yes

[PublicP2poolNode]

From the first topic of this thread.

PROXY MINING POOLS

Note: If you are interested in p2pool specifically, there maybe useful information here: http://poolnode.info/

Suggested change:

PROXY MINING POOLS

P2Pool Servers:

         Pay Tx                  Pay     
Pool   Fee   reward?   Variable difficulty?      Local work?   orphans?       Min withdrawal   Merged mining?






Other related sites for proxy mining on p2pool:
http://p2pool.hostv.pl/
 http://poolnode.info/



Other Proxy mining pools:

Pay Tx                  Pay     
Pool   Fee   reward?   Variable difficulty?      Local work?   orphans?       Min withdrawal   Merged mining?







And also, under Min withdrawal for p2poolserver.us, can you change the "Min withdrawal" to "1 valid share"

Since it can't be determined how much 1 share is worth, because it changes almost every minute of the day depending on the hashrate of p2pool at the time, i think it would be more accurate to word it that way.

I originally posted the min withdrawal on p2poolserver to be .0001 because, if you have a valid share when a block is found you get an immediate payment no matter how small or big it is, based on how many shares you have and how much they are worth. But anything under .0001 would most likely be dust. In reality shares differ in value and there is no way to determing the Min withdrawal.

[pinkfloyd11]

Hello

I'm developing a USB MINING DEVICE with BITFURY ASIC CHIP.

I would suggest at my clients good pool but I don't have this kind of knoledge.

Could you help me and explane in simply word why one is better than other?

I would use your reply like help in my installation program

Thanks

[nopedope89]

Hello Organofcorti,

Please add new BTC pool - Minergate.com

PPS

Name: Minergate (link: minergate.com)
Fee: 2.5%
Local work: Stratum
Variable difficulty: dynamic
Min withdrawal: 0.01 BTC
Merged mining: No.

Thank you, have a nice day.

[organofcorti]

Hello Organofcorti,

Please add new BTC pool - Minergate.com

PPS

Name: Minergate (link: minergate.com)
Fee: 2.5%
Local work: Stratum
Variable difficulty: dynamic
Min withdrawal: 0.01 BTC
Merged mining: No.

Thank you, have a nice day.

No BTC stats?

[nopedope89]

Hello Organofcorti,

Please add new BTC pool - Minergate.com

PPS

Name: Minergate (link: minergate.com)
Fee: 2.5%
Local work: Stratum
Variable difficulty: dynamic
Min withdrawal: 0.01 BTC
Merged mining: No.

Thank you, have a nice day.

No BTC stats?

Pool just opened recently. So no stats yet. Or did you mean something else?