[ANN] Catcoin - Scrypt meow!

[atheistftwins]

Every coins need a price which makes them profitable for miners! No more, no less.
Pizza and Subaru will come later. (Well, I don't eat crap food and I already have an Audi, but...)

If it isn't profitable than no one will mine it. If no one mines it than the coin dies. Simple as that.

So, if you deny the profitable price from a coin then you piratically just killed it at day 0.

I don't say you can't do that. If you can, by all means, do what you want. Except talking bullsh|t...

That is exactly what is happening with this coin. It isn't profitable to mine, people are jumping ship and the coin is dying. But your previous post is irrelevant. You correctly identified the price at which it would be profitable again to mine at this difficulty, but there is no reason it SHOULD go up that high. You just pointed out the obvious alternative to what can happen to the coin. It can simply die.

[1714735683]

1714735683

[1714735683]

1714735683

[1714735683]

1714735683

[1714735683]

1714735683

[1714735683]

1714735683

[kalus]

So, if you deny the profitable price from a coin then you piratically just killed it at day 0.

interesting that you feel a price for the coin should be set at day 0.  Doge sure need to: people mined doge for fucking fun.

if you read the thread, wallets were barely available on day 0.  the blockchain was forked by multiple mining pools at day 0.  

if you impose a 'profitable price' on a coin (whatever that is), you 'piratically' [sic] just killed it at day 0.

[Last1212]

Hardfork may throw coin out of exchanges.
I made some conclusions, I saw a lot of people that hates premine but this coin show me that premine is good for coin, it may keep it afloat. So many miners with so many coins... and most of them doing nothing to help it. All of them want to squeeze all the juice and migrate to others... It is a pity, guys.

[janos666]

Every coins need a price which makes them profitable for miners! No more, no less.
Pizza and Subaru will come later. (Well, I don't eat crap food and I already have an Audi, but...)

If it isn't profitable than no one will mine it. If no one mines it than the coin dies. Simple as that.

So, if you deny the profitable price from a coin then you piratically just killed it at day 0.

I don't say you can't do that. If you can, by all means, do what you want. Except talking bullsh|t...

That is exactly what is happening with this coin. It isn't profitable to mine, people are jumping ship and the coin is dying. But your previous post is irrelevant. You correctly identified the price at which it would be profitable again to mine at this difficulty, but there is no reason it SHOULD go up that high. You just pointed out the obvious alternative to what can happen to the coin. It can simply die.

But why can't the price go up?

I mean, not from this point when it looks too late...
But you seemed to suggest that CAT never deserved a ~0.002 price to begin with and thus it was a dead end from the very beginning.

[BroTroxer]

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Scrypt-Mining-Contract-40-MH-s-24-Hrs-Mining-Server-Rig-Rental-Litecoin-Bitcoin-/231126992658?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35d03e0712

If anyone is heavily invested in cat, and got the money to throw around to solve the problem this could be the quick, yet quite dirty solution if it is sustainable for a while.. A single run of 24 hours won't even touch how much work is left until the coin is stable. It could however pay of in the long run as the cat prices are likely to rise when the transactions start confirming, and that might bring some old or even new miners back to the pools.

$2200 per 24 hours @ 80 mhash (preferably split between 2 stable pools). This price is close to what would be made mining the most profitable coins. At current rates the mining would bring in ~$250 per 24h in mined cat.

If this seems to be an expensive solution, this is basically how much the current miners are losing by mining one of the currently least profitable coins compared to the most profitable ones. Everyone on the cat pools at this time is basically donating around the clock. Think they'll keep it up over the next 80-140 days?

[kalus]

But why can't the price go up?

and why can't the price go down?

[atheistftwins]

Every coins need a price which makes them profitable for miners! No more, no less.
Pizza and Subaru will come later. (Well, I don't eat crap food and I already have an Audi, but...)

If it isn't profitable than no one will mine it. If no one mines it than the coin dies. Simple as that.

So, if you deny the profitable price from a coin then you piratically just killed it at day 0.

I don't say you can't do that. If you can, by all means, do what you want. Except talking bullsh|t...

That is exactly what is happening with this coin. It isn't profitable to mine, people are jumping ship and the coin is dying. But your previous post is irrelevant. You correctly identified the price at which it would be profitable again to mine at this difficulty, but there is no reason it SHOULD go up that high. You just pointed out the obvious alternative to what can happen to the coin. It can simply die.

But why can't the price go up?

I mean, not from this point when it looks too late...
But you seemed to suggest that CAT never deserved a ~0.002 price to begin with and thus it was a dead end from the very beginning.

I wrote earlier a rather lengthy explaination of why CAT was indeed doomed from the start with the current specs. The reason why I don't feel that CAT deserves a 0.002 price as it is now is because the block time and retarget time is so much longer than other altcoins that it looks absolutely terrible in comparison. Coin demand is intrinsically based around availability of usage. With the current block times, such usage is completely impossible.

[janos666]

But why can't the price go up?

and why can't the price go down?

It can. It already does.
But he seemed to argue that a price which was never profitable (0.001) was already too high (overhyped).

[fredeq]

And we are in 6's, nearing 5's. Cant believe I sold PPC I held for 3 months for CAT just 3 days ago. I always perfect time those things  

[kalus]

But he seemed to argue that a price which was never profitable (0.001) was already too high (overhyped).

and i agree with that.

read the thread:  when cat was released on cryptsy, the catcoin community setup a sell wall at 0.001.  

fast forward a week later, someone has setup a sell wall to tank catcoin, and everyone is now crying about it.  some people even have proposed that cryptsy stop this manipulative behaviour, ironically forgetting they were profiting off setting an initial price that was completely unsustainable.  

The catcoin community has bought into its own hype, that much i observe.

you yourself stated previously:

I guess it's a combination of both. Some people want to make too much profit from this coin but they didn't realize that they took it too far and practically killed the coin on the run.

you've written catcoin's epitaph.

[DJTrey]

my transactions haven't went through in 4 hours

[vondi1122]

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Scrypt-Mining-Contract-40-MH-s-24-Hrs-Mining-Server-Rig-Rental-Litecoin-Bitcoin-/231126992658?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35d03e0712

If anyone is heavily invested in cat, and got the money to throw around to solve the problem this could be the quick, yet quite dirty solution if it is sustainable for a while.. A single run of 24 hours won't even touch how much work is left until the coin is stable. It could however pay of in the long run as the cat prices are likely to rise when the transactions start confirming, and that might bring some old or even new miners back to the pools.

$2200 per 24 hours @ 80 mhash (preferably split between 2 stable pools). This price is close to what would be made mining the most profitable coins. At current rates the mining would bring in ~$250 per 24h in mined cat.

If this seems to be an expensive solution, this is basically how much the current miners are losing by mining one of the currently least profitable coins compared to the most profitable ones. Everyone on the cat pools at this time is basically donating around the clock. Think they'll keep it up over the next 80-140 days?

this

[janos666]

But he seemed to argue that a price which was never profitable (0.001) was already too high (overhyped).

and i agree with that.

How can a coin be overpriced on a price which is too low to make it's mining profitable?
I don't think there is a logical explanation for this statement. It's completely illogical.

[zerodrama]

I wrote earlier a rather lengthy explaination of why CAT was indeed doomed from the start with the current specs. The reason why I don't feel that CAT deserves a 0.002 price as it is now is because the block time and retarget time is so much longer than other altcoins that it looks absolutely terrible in comparison. Coin demand is intrinsically based around availability of usage. With the current block times, such usage is completely impossible.

You are ignoring the facts. This is the scrypt copy of Bitcoin. Those are the parameters of Bitcoin.

If this coin crashes, I will resurrect it myself for that purpose.

If you would like to argue based on the facts, that would be appreciated.

This situation allows me to try out some ideas.

We need a scrypt copy of Bitcoin. The market likes 10 minute confirmations and 2 week adjustments. It's the pace of the real world, with the exception of the checkout counter.

The people who are left mining this thing are the ones WHO KNOW WHAT IT IS.

[kalus]

The following is why short of someone seriously manipulating the prices upward, CATcoin will continue its death spiral. There are many die hard optimists in this thread who don't use logic and invest purely based on emotion or some arbitrary libertarian ideal. Those people will say things along the lines of "The difficulty retarget and block times are perfect because it's the same as bitcoin" or "CAT is an alternative to bitcoin which is more decentralized and combats the increasing levels of bitcoin regulation by governments". In reality, however, CAT is not operating under the same environment as BTC and treating them the same is a mistake...

I wrote earlier a rather lengthy explaination of why CAT was indeed doomed from the start with the current specs. The reason why I don't feel that CAT deserves a 0.002 price as it is now is because the block time and retarget time is so much longer than other altcoins that it looks absolutely terrible in comparison. Coin demand is intrinsically based around availability of usage. With the current block times, such usage is completely impossible.

You are ignoring the facts. This is the scrypt copy of Bitcoin. Those are the parameters of Bitcoin.

read his post, comprehend his post, then reply.  do it in that order please.  

[kalus]

The people who are left mining this thing are the ones WHO KNOW WHAT IT IS.

the people who are left mining this thing took the holidays off and forgot to switch their rigs over to more profitable coins.  

[atheistftwins]

I wrote earlier a rather lengthy explaination of why CAT was indeed doomed from the start with the current specs. The reason why I don't feel that CAT deserves a 0.002 price as it is now is because the block time and retarget time is so much longer than other altcoins that it looks absolutely terrible in comparison. Coin demand is intrinsically based around availability of usage. With the current block times, such usage is completely impossible.

You are ignoring the facts. This is the scrypt copy of Bitcoin. Those are the parameters of Bitcoin.

If this coin crashes, I will resurrect it myself for that purpose.

If you would like to argue based on the facts, that would be appreciated.

This situation allows me to try out some ideas.

We need a scrypt copy of Bitcoin. The market likes 10 minute confirmations and 2 week adjustments. It's the pace of the real world, with the exception of the checkout counter.

The people who are left mining this thing are the ones WHO KNOW WHAT IT IS.

I have written out many "facts" in my previous posting including a detailed explaination about why CAT can not compete with other altcoins at the current specs.

You are free to do whatever you want, including throwing a lot of good money after bad towards this coin in an attempt to "resurrect" it.

Your claim that this rate is what the market likes is simply pulled out of thin air. The market likes the fastest possible error free transaction time. Ideally in a perfect world transaction time would be instantaneous. In fact, the market has very clearly spoken in this matter and is reflected by the price of the coin.

You are quite wrong. The ones who "KNOW WHAT IT IS" are the ones who have stopped mining it. They are not deluded and see it for what it really is. A coin with outdated specs that can not hope to compete in a modern crypto environment.

[etblvu1]

I respectfully suggest we may benefit from setting up an organized way by which Catcoin supporters who have switched to mining more profitable coins can systematically convert the profits into Catcoins through exchanges and/or donate some of the profits to Catcoin miners. Maybe this can be done at the pool level. Is there anyone out there with pool who would be willing to set up a hybrid pool, where we can assign a percentage of miners to mine CATs, and another percentage to mine whatever is profitable right now, then automatically convert the non-CATs mined into CATs through exchanges, and aggregate all the profits and distribute evenly across the entire pool base on shares / gigahash-seconds contributed? Such a setup would create the effect a higher payout for Catcoin mining, and higher hashes going into Catcoin mining, even if 75% of the hashing goes to a profitable coin, and only 25% is mining Catcoins - because the entire proceeds would be converted to CATs (through Exchanges), and costs distributed throughout the entire pool. This would in effect allow Catcoin supporters to do something akin to mining Catcoins at higher profitability, and make this difficulty phase go more smoothly. How complicated would it be to set up a pool to do something like this? Or does anyone have creative input on some similar or alternative way to easily accomplish something similar (systematically subsidize CAT mining, by Catcoin supporters who perhaps have left Catcoin mining, but would be willing to help)?

Also important we must prevent the difficulty level from dropping too low at the next difficulty adjustment. Having a difficulty level that is 6x too high, I believe is less detrimental to the coin than having a difficulty level that is 6x too easy - as the former only lasts for a fixed duration of time and has the side-benefit of temporarily reducing coin inflation - while the latter attracts miner-dumpers who get the stock of cheap coins replenished to continue dumping (which prolongs the problem).

Let us also not waste time on talk of hard forking the coin, which is a desperation measure, akin to shooting yourself in the foot, in the hopes of raising adrenaline levels, in the hopes of jump-starting the heart, because one is panicking that one may be in the middle of a heart attack in the middle of a desert - versus relaxing a bit and taking stock of the situation, and considering how it may not be a heart attack at all but merely a self-induced panic attack.

Let us not forget that a million coins got mined in the first few days of the coin's existence, and how few coins are being sold in the exchanges is a remarkable testament to how many people are holding onto the coin for long-term prospects. As long as we don't allow dumpers to replenish their stock of cheap coins at the next difficulty adjustment, this situation will inherently run itself out, and when demand outstrips supply, prices rise.

The least helpful thing to be doing right now is panicking and scaremongering about how the coin is going to "die." It is time for deliberation and planning. I would assume that there are Doge supporters and supporters of other altcoins who have hurt feelings or jealously about CAT's prospects, and would choose to spread fear and chaos here, perhaps out of a desire for revenge or desire to prove their coin choices right. There may be others who are not prepared for spectacular financial success, who are subconsciously trying to sabotage things because they have too many CATs and if prices went up too much, they'd be uncomfortable - to those people I respectfully suggest you put away your CAT wallet, consider the money lost so you can stop worrying about prespects of having too much money, and when/if CATs become valuable, find some other way to sabotage yourself by spending the newfound wealth on frivolous luxury things, until you are back to being broke where you are comfortable.

Thank you,

Etblvu1

[kalus]

How can a coin be overpriced on a price which is too low to make it's mining profitable?

day 0 = coin started overpriced due to rampant market speculators and catcoin fanboys.  

day 0 = complexity was low, skyrocketed because coin was overpriced.  

within one week, the coin tanked after the initial pump-and-dump.  coin value crashed, and the miners left.

Catcoin can be, and is overpriced because the community refused to let it float from day 0. if catcoin is not overpriced, then the price should go up.  instead, it's going down. 

Catcoin can also simultaneously be too low a return on profit, because there are OTHER CRYPTOCURRENCIES THAT CAN BE MINED FOR MORE MONEY

take a look at today's profitability.  catcoin is 4th least profitable coin to mine:  http://www.coinwarz.com/cryptocurrency

per 1MH, a miner stands to make $3/day from CAT, or $10/day from DOGE.  if you had 10,000 worth of mining equipment, decide where to turn your attention.  

[rentarocker]

http://weknowmemes.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/grumpy-catdoge.jpg

Altcoins have gotten big enough in the past month or so to attract investors from the general public.  These potential Catcoin holders will be less computer-savvy than most folks currently on this forum.  I'd wager that most won't know or care anything about hashrates or that they can't pick up a Latte at Starbucks with CAT 'cause the confirmation will take hours.  They're not going be doing that kind of thing for a few years even with BTC and they know that.  These investors will be only interested in returns.  CAT is set up to offer stable mid to long term growth.  It has a good community.  It has a good name.  And it has an official tie to DOGE in the form of a trading pair on Coinedup.com. This is another thing that builds legitimacy and value in the mind of a mainstream investor.

In summary:

DOGE and CAT should be considered as collaborators rather than competitors in the mainstream eye.  This relationship is similar to the LTC/BTC relationship where CAT is the high value 'reserve' currency (BTC) and DOGE is the 'everyday' currency (LTC).  The CAT and DOGE communities should both be working towards developing this relationship.  It will only serve to elevate both coins. 

Collaboration, not competition.

Get this thing mainstream.  Trade your DOGE for CAT!  Your CAT for DOGE!  Screenshots of Coinedup.com  Send it to the Associated Press.  Someone will pick it up.  It's a great story!