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Author Topic: Vertcoin - First Scrypt N | First Stealth Address - Privacy without mixer  (Read 1232679 times)
Vertcoin (OP)
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February 08, 2014, 04:48:43 PM
 #4441

At the moment, the top dev priorities are:

1. Zerocoin

2. Android wallet

This is what I found about Zerocoin & Zerocash: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXU65XsLiFk
As far as I have read on reddit, Zerocash is a more viable option for VTC.

Thank you

VTC Stealth Address : vJmt8sF4iySr2RnJdZJdqk7CbJMQzwPwQwUsQwKF27qPE7qv9gfhjYqD6VapALi6jv8j6VKUvXYEto6 xmtxoq9oUyBXbV9XsYdt6sA
Please contact us via contact[at]vertcoin.org only, do not PM.
BorisTheSpider
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February 08, 2014, 04:57:49 PM
 #4442

I'm seeing where the confusion is here. Not everybody knows what Zerocoin is. So could you please talk a little about this development would do for Vertcoin, without mentioning Zerocoin in the description?

OK, thanks for the pointer - I guess it was a little unclear. Here's what zerocoin does:

At the moment, every transaction you make on a blockchain is public. People may not know that ViPBVm4sbXT38h9J23GkAWfNKiuPwVUYQX == BorisTheSpider, but they know that at some point ViPBVm4sbXT38h9J23GkAWfNKiuPwVUYQX sent money to VpFumv3VWir4bczH1CVgatrZ7wJLLXauMR who then sent it to a shady organisation, or used it to buy rotten vegetables to pelt Ben Bernanke with.

This exploitation of connectedness to build a picture of what a network of individuals/addresses are doing is exactly what we have seen with the NSA doing traffic analysis and looking for patterns in who is linked to who, extending that to multiple levels, so not only do you now lose all privacy, but you also can get connected with stuff that you know absolutely nothing about and are not involved with. For example, when you send your VTC to an address that later funds a crime, you come under scrutiny even if you are entirely innocent.

Mixing services let you get rid of the linkage between particular pairs of addresses. For example, if we say that Alice wants to send some VTC to Bob, in a way that doesn't let people know anything about that transaction, then Trent can offer to act as a middle-man. Alice sends VTC to Trent, who then sends it on to Bob. To increase the degree to which this process unlink Alice and Bob, Trent can offer this service to lots of people, then he can wait a while after getting Alices VTC, and send it out to Bob in several transactions of different sizes which add up to the correct amount, so now it's even tougher to know whether the VTC that Trent sent to Bob came from Trent himself, from Carol (another user of Trents services), or from Alice.

BUT

How do we know Trent is on the level? Trent could run off with Alices VTC and never send anything to Bob. Trent could be an NSA shill. Trent could be keeping a log of who sent who what, so he can later use this log to extort the participants in the scheme. Trent could be on the level but still have someone come round his house one day and put a gun to his head demanding to know what he knows, and even if he doesn't keep logs, at least his current transactions in-transit would be compromised since he can't discard the information about who needs to receive what immediately - they have to be sent it first.

The existing mixing services are very trustful - they require a third party to act in a trustworthy way, and expose that third party to being threatened, bribed or otherwise manipulated into giving up information.

What if, instead, there was a way, right on the VTC blockchain, to mix coins, so that Alice could make a transaction (or set of transactions) that sent coins to Bob, without any third party being involved, and in a way that makes it impractical to trace that transaction. That's Zerocoin.



TotalPanda
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vertex output parameter not completely initialized


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February 08, 2014, 05:01:49 PM
 #4443

mmihai1978
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February 08, 2014, 05:03:44 PM
 #4444

using coin mixing may turn vtc in the most technically inovative coin on the market. i understand no fork is needed but the mixing services must be funded.

no other coin has this yet.

it was planned for sbc but never happened
it is planned for tips but tips may not survive the multipool rape.
agilityvision
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February 08, 2014, 05:04:49 PM
 #4445

Is cryptsy still having deposit issues with VertCoin? I made a deposit 10 hours ago and it hasn't even showed up in 'pending' yet. What are other people's current experience?
steve_abel
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February 08, 2014, 05:07:04 PM
 #4446

In the AMA the term Zerocash is mentioned a few times.

A quick google search returned mostly usernames, does anyone have a link to read up on that?

This gives more details on both zerocoin and zerocash: http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=q3rgh5ZY
Fastpow
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February 08, 2014, 05:10:42 PM
 #4447

Boris/vert, check pm's please Smiley
Trokhon
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February 08, 2014, 05:11:19 PM
 #4448

Is 330-340 khash/s okay for a 280x?
It's ok, maybe you could get a little bit more, I get on one of my 280x 360-370 khash/s (vertminer 0.5.2)
can you please post your config .

I am only able to get 230 Sad with I 12 I 13 gives me only HW errors
Xperianz
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February 08, 2014, 05:20:21 PM
 #4449



turtoro
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February 08, 2014, 05:24:09 PM
 #4450

using coin mixing may turn vtc in the most technically inovative coin on the market. i understand no fork is needed but the mixing services must be funded.

no other coin has this yet.

it was planned for sbc but never happened
it is planned for tips but tips may not survive the multipool rape.

I came to vtc after waiting for Artos to deliver the coin mixing for months. If he would have implemented it (he still might if he ever reappears) it would have been a huge deal. Anonymity is one of the the 3 central areas that cryptos need to work on. If we have any sort of movement towards anonimity on top of what vert already is it would be cement Vtc as king of the hill. This is certain. Wow, I didnt even know the devs were looking into this. I just got goosebumps  Shocked.

This is Artos' announcement on the mixing service if anyone wants to know how it would work in theory:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=353971.msg3788636#msg3788636

Ps: I wouldnt worry too much about Fedoracoin in this regard, they have a lot of other issues they need to sort out
tifozi
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February 08, 2014, 05:30:13 PM
 #4451

When ASICs take over traditional scrypt coins like LTC, DOGE and other clones, the market will

1) Dump a lot of GPUs in the market in the hands of smaller miners who will eventually mine GPU-affinity/ASIC resistant coins only.
2) GPU farms will point to VTC making difficulty soar and prices rocket.

Both of the above scenarios will result in VTC going up and up. If you are a fan of VTC, you want scrypt ASICs to invade the market.

boubou
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February 08, 2014, 05:32:45 PM
 #4452

But Scryp Asics with real improvement over Gpu may not happened in a close future.

May be Vertcoin can have some success anyway.

BEHNZiP6UZunp41vurNaQi4r2hvgG57yzi : BdG
user871710
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February 08, 2014, 05:34:29 PM
 #4453

Ty Boris for explaining.

About scrypt Asics i heard and read a bit about them. So if i understand they are already being shipped, but did any1 actually receive it ?
boubou
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February 08, 2014, 05:36:36 PM
 #4454

The Scrypt Asics that are shipped deliver less Hashpower per dollar, but did not use much power. Far from a revolution from now.

BEHNZiP6UZunp41vurNaQi4r2hvgG57yzi : BdG
tifozi
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February 08, 2014, 05:37:02 PM
 #4455

But Scryp Asics with real improvement over Gpu may not happened in a close future.

May be Vertcoin can have some success anyway.

I was under similar impression, but we have folks on this very forum with greedseeds already. More and more will get their hands on it after Feb 10.

http://hashra.com/gridseed-6000-kh-s-asic-scrypt-sha-miner/
Basnoff
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February 08, 2014, 05:42:47 PM
 #4456

Boris and ieatm3s,

Thanks for those! I wasn't aware of those techniques.

Mostly because I underestimated the importance of enhanced privacy, I didn't care about who knows where my coins go.
But indeed, considering the recent attention to the criminals using cryptocurrency I'd prefer not to be linked to them.
iron_monkey
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February 08, 2014, 05:45:28 PM
 #4457

Is cryptsy still having deposit issues with VertCoin? I made a deposit 10 hours ago and it hasn't even showed up in 'pending' yet. What are other people's current experience?

Im still waiting too. Sent vert at 9am.I guess they havent finished trading all the profits out of my coins yet. Sad
BorisTheSpider
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February 08, 2014, 05:53:19 PM
 #4458

Yes and just to clarify, I was being dumb - it's actually ZeroCash we're looking at, not ZeroCoin.

boubou
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February 08, 2014, 05:55:34 PM
 #4459

But Scryp Asics with real improvement over Gpu may not happened in a close future.

May be Vertcoin can have some success anyway.

I was under similar impression, but we have folks on this very forum with greedseeds already. More and more will get their hands on it after Feb 10.

http://hashra.com/gridseed-6000-kh-s-asic-scrypt-sha-miner/

I did not see a huge improvement in hashing power with thoses modules. Of course it's smaller, quiter, and less consuming, but I'm not sure I'll go this way if I'll have to chose right now between thoses chips and a traditional rig.

The asics revolution seems not so close.

BEHNZiP6UZunp41vurNaQi4r2hvgG57yzi : BdG
ieatm3s
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February 08, 2014, 06:00:13 PM
 #4460

Yes and just to clarify, I was being dumb - it's actually ZeroCash we're looking at, not ZeroCoin.
Yep. ZeroCash. Man. This is going to be huge. Even huger-(er?) if Vertcoin will be the first to implement it.
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