[ANN][AUTO-SWITCH] Profit-switch auto-exchange pool: CleverMining.com

[gtraah]

Funny thing is I was actually getting shares also, But I could not see my stats on the stats page.. And when I saw DDOS attack message I freaked out thinking all those shares are going to someone else so I Disconnected and joined another pool instantly.

[1714534241]

1714534241

[Catswold]

That may be and we won't know until the website recovers, but--If I am getting new blocks from the servers and sending accepted to the server, then until I find out otherwise, I will assume that my miners remain mining productively.

Yes, I am certain I am still mining at Clevermining--unless someone has managed to reroute my connection without resetting it.

Why so hostile?  I'm merely reporting what I'm seeing.

I'm not sure how you can do this. The servers are nullrounted by the datacenter and don't have connections to the outside world. You are either hashing at some backup pool or you are being sent some old work again and again - but I don't know how the latter could be possible - because certainly these servers are not mining anything. All blocks found and reported by our hot wallets are coming from the private pool server which is the only one still running.

If you think you are connected to CleverMining it's best to restart your miners.

I am working on launching a replacement server in another datacenter. It is already finishing syncing its wallets and I will bring up as soon as possible.

I too don't know what was occurring, but it finally broke connection at 7:07 AM CDT . . . and no, I have no failover, so it was connected to Clever.

[gtraah]

The Gridseed ASICs that can mine scrypt have been on the market for a few months already

The ASICs I was talking about are those which really CAN obliterate scrypt mining. Gridseed is in no way to do that. Just compare price to speed.
what is promised is minimum 250MHs for 15000 EUR
Counting a little we get almost a tale in performance to money - after <2 months for returning the full price start to make 20-24K USD a month.

I am not interested in Gridseeds, so I can't tell the price for a fully working unit. The web page you offered sells all the parts in separate. But price for a unit 4200$ for 8 MHs maximum is in no comparance. May be I am mistaking here and those units work much faster? But from what I see the bonus here is only size and power consumption which is rather low in comparison with GPU rigs of the same mining compability.

The numbers I found for gridseeds indicated approximately $2000 USD outlay for 3-3.4 MH/s scrypt at under 100 watts, or approximately 30w per MH/s, where GPU's require a minimum of 250w per MH/s.  For 15000 EURO (or just over 20000 USD) that would buy 30-34MH/s of gridseeds available today.  There is a possibility that other hardware may never actually be delivered though (but even if not, something else will likely arrive on the scene).

I'm not sure why anyone is interested in any of it while btc and ltc prices continue to fall...

Not only that, Just imagine spending $20000US which If everything stays exatly how it is now will get your money back in 240 days with 34MH now thats if it stays like TODAY , which we all know it wont Difficulty rises and more people get into the game etc... Anyway just imagine you borrowed the money and then everything went to shits... Say Hi to 20K of dead weight that wont resell... You just have to HOPE that BTC goes UP UP UP... But man some people like to gamble Big time I mean if you have 20K to throw away then thats a different story play away... I probably would If I was a millionaire and didnt care about risking 20k But people who borrow money are just nutz

[comeonalready]

The Gridseed ASICs that can mine scrypt have been on the market for a few months already

The ASICs I was talking about are those which really CAN obliterate scrypt mining. Gridseed is in no way to do that. Just compare price to speed.
what is promised is minimum 250MHs for 15000 EUR
Counting a little we get almost a tale in performance to money - after <2 months for returning the full price start to make 20-24K USD a month.

I am not interested in Gridseeds, so I can't tell the price for a fully working unit. The web page you offered sells all the parts in separate. But price for a unit 4200$ for 8 MHs maximum is in no comparance. May be I am mistaking here and those units work much faster? But from what I see the bonus here is only size and power consumption which is rather low in comparison with GPU rigs of the same mining compability.

The numbers I found for gridseeds indicated approximately $2000 USD outlay for 3-3.4 MH/s scrypt at under 100 watts, or approximately 30w per MH/s, where GPU's require a minimum of 250w per MH/s.  For 15000 EURO (or just over 20000 USD) that would buy 30-34MH/s of gridseeds available today.  There is a possibility that other hardware may never actually be delivered though (but even if not, something else will likely arrive on the scene).

I'm not sure why anyone is interested in any of it while btc and ltc prices continue to fall...

Not only that, Just imagine spending $20000US which If everything stays exatly how it is now will get your money back in 240 days with 34MH now thats if it stays like TODAY , which we all know it wont Difficulty rises and more people get into the game etc... Anyway just imagine you borrowed the money and then everything went to shits... Say Hi to 20K of dead weight that wont resell... You just have to HOPE that BTC goes UP UP UP... But man some people like to gamble Big time I mean if you have 20K to throw away then thats a different story play away... I probably would If I was a millionaire and didnt care about risking 20k But people who borrow money are just nutz

If you threw money away like that, you might not be a millionaire very long!  By the way, that is exactly the flaw most people make when considering the initial outlay costs -- their computations are based upon current values and just hope that they don't decline much before any return on investment is realized.

If buying equipment to mine bitcoin directly, then perhaps I would consider investing, as among all the coins out there, BTC is the one with the most long term potential of remaining relevant.  At this point, mining anything else is just a proxy to BTC.

[Terk]

As for private server: everyone else is also welcomed to pay for his own private server which will be located close to you (low latency) and private (invulnerable to DDOS).

If I'm already have some server somewhere (HP BL***G* in basic config), what I'm need to have my personal private CM pool server?

I'm not going to install my source code at someone else's server. This needs to be a server dedicated only for the stratum endpoint and owned by me, only paid by you. No currently used for something else servers and no bring-your-own servers - you basically need to pay for a brand new server which I will purchase.

Also, there's lot of additional work in setting up, keeping up in sync, monitoring and managing another server. Either your hashrate is significant enough to justify this work (meaning: I earn a significant amount in standard fees from your miners) or you would need to additionally pay some flat-rate for this additional work with additional server.

I am happy to provide such service to anyone, but it needs to be worthwhile for both sides.

[comeonalready]

As for private server: everyone else is also welcomed to pay for his own private server which will be located close to you (low latency) and private (invulnerable to DDOS).

If I'm already have some server somewhere (HP BL***G* in basic config), what I'm need to have my personal private CM pool server?

I'm not going to install my source code at someone else's server. This needs to be a server dedicated only for the stratum endpoint and owned by me, only paid by you. No currently used for something else servers and no bring-your-own servers - you basically need to pay for a brand new server which I will purchase.

Also, there's lot of additional work in setting up, keeping up in sync, monitoring and managing another server. Either your hashrate is significant enough to justify this work (meaning: I earn a significant amount in standard fees from your miners) or you would need to additionally pay some flat-rate for this additional work with additional server.

I am happy to provide such service to anyone, but it needs to be worthwhile for both sides.

For your sake, I hope you haven't replicated all of your intellectual property onto a server located in China...

[Xenocyde]

Where's the new server situated? Is it in EU? If not, will I see higher than usual rejects?

[jpchrist]

Terk? Are you still taking a profit when we are mining <LTC. Do you think this is fair? Everyone else who mines on this pool, do you?

Short answer:  Yes, I think it's fair.  Otherwise I would have switched to another pool.

Long answer:
Despite what someone thinks, Terk does a great job with this pool. It is not Terks fault that
altcoins (usually) aren't that profitable as they were a month ago.
Over the last 14 days, we have 12 days > 100% LTC. And the two days under, is by just a few percent.

Of the 2% pool fee, there is fees to exchange altcoin to BTC, fees for paying each user, and
costs of having the pool servers running - it's not exactly an old computer under his desk.

In addition to the actual expenses to be covered, Terk have done - and still does a lot of work for us.

Firstly he has created the pool - this consists of quite a lot of code - handling mining, multi-location servers,
calculation of profiteable coins, auto-exchanging into BTC, paying each user, the very nice pool web page, and so on.

Even some of the coins we have mined (at least in the past) isn't on an exchange that has an API. Then Terk has manually to trade the coins.
And he is also constantly monitoring the market for new (good) coins and other ways to improve profit.

Terk also takes the time to read the forum, answer questions and help people.

He is doing all this while he still is working on improving the pool software, fighting DDoS and other attacks, keeping the servers running
etc, etc.

So yes, I definately think it's fair that Terk still is "taking a profit" when we're at 94% or 98% LTC in a day.
(I guess I would end up with something like 90-95% myself if I were to mine LTC directly or via a LTC pool)

Amen.

I can't believe the number of selfish, ignorant and self entitled posts on this forum. So you bought a gpu, read a few articles, amd now you think you should be a bitcoin millionaire overnight? Get over yourself, and get a life and get a clue. Trek and his crew work their balls off, no doubt. So quit your whining and leave the pool and start your own if you don't like it. I'm sure it's super duper easy.

Everyone is entitled their opinion, but I do think its a relevant question to ask. By paying a pool fee we are paying for a service. If your bank suddenly raised the interest rates would your response be..."but they work really really hard and seem really nice so if you dont like it sell your house".  Its nothing personal against the pool operator. I really enjoy this pool and have mining since the beginning but personal attacks like yours weaken the community as a whole and make you appear childish and rude.

[Terk]

European server is back up. Working on restoring another regions. I will point all other DNS entries to Europe temporarily.

[Xenocyde]

Yey for EU, thanks Terk

[comeonalready]

European server is back up. ...  I will point all other DNS entries to Europe temporarily.

Why would you do that?  This action benefits the lesser informed miners over more dedicated miners who already have backup servers entered into their configurations -- who if not located near the europe server, will then likely see higher rejection rates due to increased latency, and possibly lower returns than if they were hashing on their preferred backup server, even if it is from another pool.

And any changes made to dns records are not propagated immediately either.  As your dns server is configured, it could take one hour for your secondary dns server to update from the primary, and though minimum ttl is specified as one hour too, that value is treated only as a recommendation to downstream dns servers which may cache addresses for much longer, possibly days if poorly configured.

Please simply continue to tell us where your servers are and allow us to choose the manner in which we connect to them, using the functionality built into almost every mining client.  Thank you.

[Terk]

European server is back up. ...  I will point all other DNS entries to Europe temporarily.

Why would you do that?  This action benefits the lesser informed miners over more dedicated miners who already have backup servers entered into their configurations -- who if not located near the europe server, will then likely see higher rejection rates due to increased latency, and possibly lower returns than if they were hashing on their preferred backup server, even if it is from another pool.

And any changes made to dns records are not propagated immediately either.  As your dns server is configured, it could take one hour for your secondary dns server to update from the primary, and though minimum ttl is specified as one hour too, that value is treated only as a recommendation to downstream dns servers which may cache addresses for much longer, possibly days if poorly configured.

Please simply continue to tell us where your servers are and allow us to choose the manner in which we connect to them, using the functionality built into almost every mining client.  Thank you.

There are also many miners who don't have any other pool setup as backup and their rigs might stay idle if I didn't do that.

European server has currently 3.3% rejects which is the usual average. It's located in a well-connected datacenter with access to great intercontinental routes.

DNS TTL is set to 5 minutes and almost all miners are picking up quickly changed IP addresses. Poorly configured DNS servers should affect only very tiny percent of users.

This is a difficult situation and regardless of which choice I made, there will always be some miners who would be better if I made another choice. I'm trying to do what's best for average miners or for majority of miners.

[comeonalready]

European server is back up. ...  I will point all other DNS entries to Europe temporarily.

Why would you do that?  This action benefits the lesser informed miners over more dedicated miners who already have backup servers entered into their configurations -- who if not located near the europe server, will then likely see higher rejection rates due to increased latency, and possibly lower returns than if they were hashing on their preferred backup server, even if it is from another pool.

And any changes made to dns records are not propagated immediately either.  As your dns server is configured, it could take one hour for your secondary dns server to update from the primary, and though minimum ttl is specified as one hour too, that value is treated only as a recommendation to downstream dns servers which may cache addresses for much longer, possibly days if poorly configured.

Please simply continue to tell us where your servers are and allow us to choose the manner in which we connect to them, using the functionality built into almost every mining client.  Thank you.

There are also many miners who don't have any other pool setup as backup and their rigs might stay idle if I didn't do that.

European server has currently 3.3% rejects which is the usual average. It's located in a well-connected datacenter with access to great intercontinental routes.

DNS TTL is set to 5 minutes and almost all miners are picking up quickly changed IP addresses. Poorly configured DNS servers should affect only very tiny percent of users.

This is a difficult situation and regardless of which choice I made, there will always be some miners who would be better if I made another choice. I'm trying to do what's best for average miners or for majority of miners.

Many of the miners you will find right here on bitcointalk have carefully configured their miners to account for such server outages, and if they chose sf.clevermining.com as their primary server might want westcoast.anyotherpool.com as their preferred backup, as opposed to another server 6000 miles away.  For if latency does not matter, then why did you even bother creating endpoints closer to miners in the first place?

By choosing to redirect everyone to europe, you have essentially told miners that the priorities they have configured into their miners do not matter in the least to you, and that (possibly) what you are more concerned about is your own commission.  At a minimum, you need to rethink your system of host names, and what may or not be honored in the case of server outages, and post that on your web page so intelligent miners can make informed decisions in advance.  For a server named sf.clevermining.com to actually deliver miners to a server in europe is not what would be expected by most in any case.  And to unilaterally decide to override your educated miners' predetermined server priority preferences is flat out wrong.

How would you even know what the 'majority of miners' want anyway?  All you can see from your perspective is whether they connect or disconnect from your servers.  You have no idea if they are going to mine at other pools during their disappearance.  I am.  And I am certain others are too, we want to choose how and where to mine.

[Burnie]

Amen.

I can't believe the number of selfish, ignorant and self entitled posts on this forum. So you bought a gpu, read a few articles, amd now you think you should be a bitcoin millionaire overnight? Get over yourself, and get a life and get a clue. Trek and his crew work their balls off, no doubt. So quit your whining and leave the pool and start your own if you don't like it. I'm sure it's super duper easy.

Everyone is entitled their opinion, but I do think its a relevant question to ask. By paying a pool fee we are paying for a service. If your bank suddenly raised the interest rates would your response be..."but they work really really hard and seem really nice so if you dont like it sell your house".  Its nothing personal against the pool operator. I really enjoy this pool and have mining since the beginning but personal attacks like yours weaken the community as a whole and make you appear childish and rude.

I have no recollection of anyone suggesting increasing the pool fee. So I really think your anology is way off.
- If Terk suddenly increased the pool fee to 3-4%, I'd be sceptical and expect a very good reason to why.
I'm not loosing sleep wondering why he is not lowering the fee...

IDK, but perhaps you rather would have a dynamic pool fee, let's say 1-1.5% on "bad" days and 4-5% on "good" days?

BTW: I don't think MinorError were attacking you or your post in specific.

[dddbtc]

 I really want to use this pool, however I recieve a significant amount of rejected shares with the following error:

Code:

Rejected untracked stratum share from pool

Is there any way to remedy this situation?

[Burnie]

I really want to use this pool, however I recieve a significant amount of rejected shares with the following error:

Code:

Rejected untracked stratum share from pool

Is there any way to remedy this situation?

If you see at the top right corner of this forum, there's a search box.

When you enter "Rejected untracked stratum share from pool" in the search field and click "Search", one of the first responses is this one:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=448649.msg5579078;topicseen#msg5579078

Quote from: Orpheeus on March 08, 2014, 12:18:18 AM
  I have many many Rejected untracked stratum share from pool 0, is it normal ?
  When i say many it's 1x Rejected untracked stratum share from pool 0 for 1x accepted

False rejects.  They can be safely ignored.  Tons of posts about it on almost every page for the last 40 pages.

Terk - you may want to stick this on top of your site with the new server announcements since you can't find the cause yet. It'll help keep this repetitive question to a minimum.

edit. top right corner, not left  

[Terk]

New server has been setup in Montreal, Canada: stratum+tcp://ca.clevermining.com:3333

It has all US traffic redirected (SF and NY server subdomains pointing there).

[Terk]

European server is back up. ...  I will point all other DNS entries to Europe temporarily.

Why would you do that?  This action benefits the lesser informed miners over more dedicated miners who already have backup servers entered into their configurations -- who if not located near the europe server, will then likely see higher rejection rates due to increased latency, and possibly lower returns than if they were hashing on their preferred backup server, even if it is from another pool.

And any changes made to dns records are not propagated immediately either.  As your dns server is configured, it could take one hour for your secondary dns server to update from the primary, and though minimum ttl is specified as one hour too, that value is treated only as a recommendation to downstream dns servers which may cache addresses for much longer, possibly days if poorly configured.

Please simply continue to tell us where your servers are and allow us to choose the manner in which we connect to them, using the functionality built into almost every mining client.  Thank you.

There are also many miners who don't have any other pool setup as backup and their rigs might stay idle if I didn't do that.

European server has currently 3.3% rejects which is the usual average. It's located in a well-connected datacenter with access to great intercontinental routes.

DNS TTL is set to 5 minutes and almost all miners are picking up quickly changed IP addresses. Poorly configured DNS servers should affect only very tiny percent of users.

This is a difficult situation and regardless of which choice I made, there will always be some miners who would be better if I made another choice. I'm trying to do what's best for average miners or for majority of miners.

Many of the miners you will find right here on bitcointalk have carefully configured their miners to account for such server outages, and if they chose sf.clevermining.com as their primary server might want westcoast.anyotherpool.com as their preferred backup, as opposed to another server 6000 miles away.  For if latency does not matter, then why did you even bother creating endpoints closer to miners in the first place?

By choosing to redirect everyone to europe, you have essentially told miners that the priorities they have configured into their miners do not matter in the least to you, and that (possibly) what you are more concerned about is your own commission.  At a minimum, you need to rethink your system of host names, and what may or not be honored in the case of server outages, and post that on your web page so intelligent miners can make informed decisions in advance.  For a server named sf.clevermining.com to actually deliver miners to a server in europe is not what would be expected by most in any case.  And to unilaterally decide to override your educated miners' predetermined server priority preferences is flat out wrong.

How would you even know what the 'majority of miners' want anyway?  All you can see from your perspective is whether they connect or disconnect from your servers.  You have no idea if they are going to mine at other pools during their disappearance.  I am.  And I am certain others are too, we want to choose how and where to mine.

I'm willing to discuss it when the dust settles and brainstorm some preferable way of handling server outages. Right now I don't have time for chatting.

I have setup another North America based server in Montreal, Canada and it has all the US subdomains pointed to.

[comeonalready]

European server is back up. ...  I will point all other DNS entries to Europe temporarily.

Why would you do that?  This action benefits the lesser informed miners over more dedicated miners who already have backup servers entered into their configurations -- who if not located near the europe server, will then likely see higher rejection rates due to increased latency, and possibly lower returns than if they were hashing on their preferred backup server, even if it is from another pool.

And any changes made to dns records are not propagated immediately either.  As your dns server is configured, it could take one hour for your secondary dns server to update from the primary, and though minimum ttl is specified as one hour too, that value is treated only as a recommendation to downstream dns servers which may cache addresses for much longer, possibly days if poorly configured.

Please simply continue to tell us where your servers are and allow us to choose the manner in which we connect to them, using the functionality built into almost every mining client.  Thank you.

There are also many miners who don't have any other pool setup as backup and their rigs might stay idle if I didn't do that.

European server has currently 3.3% rejects which is the usual average. It's located in a well-connected datacenter with access to great intercontinental routes.

DNS TTL is set to 5 minutes and almost all miners are picking up quickly changed IP addresses. Poorly configured DNS servers should affect only very tiny percent of users.

This is a difficult situation and regardless of which choice I made, there will always be some miners who would be better if I made another choice. I'm trying to do what's best for average miners or for majority of miners.

Many of the miners you will find right here on bitcointalk have carefully configured their miners to account for such server outages, and if they chose sf.clevermining.com as their primary server might want westcoast.anyotherpool.com as their preferred backup, as opposed to another server 6000 miles away.  For if latency does not matter, then why did you even bother creating endpoints closer to miners in the first place?

By choosing to redirect everyone to europe, you have essentially told miners that the priorities they have configured into their miners do not matter in the least to you, and that (possibly) what you are more concerned about is your own commission.  At a minimum, you need to rethink your system of host names, and what may or not be honored in the case of server outages, and post that on your web page so intelligent miners can make informed decisions in advance.  For a server named sf.clevermining.com to actually deliver miners to a server in europe is not what would be expected by most in any case.  And to unilaterally decide to override your educated miners' predetermined server priority preferences is flat out wrong.

How would you even know what the 'majority of miners' want anyway?  All you can see from your perspective is whether they connect or disconnect from your servers.  You have no idea if they are going to mine at other pools during their disappearance.  I am.  And I am certain others are too, we want to choose how and where to mine.

I'm willing to discuss it when the dust settles and brainstorm some preferable way of handling server outages. Right now I don't have time for chatting.

I have setup another North America based server in Montreal, Canada and it has all the US subdomains pointed to.

Fine, later on then, but when does the dust ever settle around here?!  In the meantime I offer this suggestion.  General region based host names that average miners would typically use could redirect in the case of server outages (eu, us, na-north america if including canada I suppose, whatever)  More specific city, state, or country server host names stick to their respective servers (ny, sf, nl, montreal, etc.)  Just post the expected behavior for each host name on the web page server list.

Or give us alternate sticky server location host names if that's preferable to you.  It's obviously a bad practice for us to hard code ip addresses into our configurations as in light of ddos attacks they might need to be changed with little notice, but there is a comfortable middle ground somewhere to allow informed miners the ability to choose their own destiny during server outages, while simultaneously moving the rest of the herd over to a functional clevermining server.

[closesat315am]

Terk! A+ job on communication and taking steps to restore services. Some people will always be unhappy but I just wanted to add my voice as another satisfied miner.