[ActiveMining] Official Shareholder Discussion Thread [Moderated]

[pedrog]

... our shares should be listed on either havelock or CT.

Crypto-Trade, it's the obvious choice.

Obvious how? What benefits does it have over Havelock? I for one don't see any unless you think its UI is better.

I also fail to see why CT is the obvious choice...

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[noah tall]

I also fail to see why CT is the obvious choice...

We're already listed and trading on CT.  Being listed on multiple exchanges is an unnecessary distraction.  Remember the previous circus and all the time Ken lost dealing with it?  Do you want him to spend time making chips or assisting in arbitrage?

[Jasun7211]

I also fail to see why CT is the obvious choice...

We're already listed and trading on CT.  Being listed on multiple exchanges is an unnecessary distraction.  Remember the previous circus and all the time Ken lost dealing with it?  Do you want him to spend time making chips or assisting in arbitrage?

and this wisdom comes from someone fairly new.  Lets stop with the gyrations and get down to business

[GTR_JOEY]

oh wow, he's "new"... so therefore his opinion is invalid and uneducated  as he doesn't post regularly in a forum that's full of retards with high post counts...

derpa derpa derp

I thought car forums were bad, BTC is worse

[MilkyWayMasta]

... our shares should be listed on either havelock or CT.

Crypto-Trade, it's the obvious choice.

Obvious how? What benefits does it have over Havelock? I for one don't see any unless you think its UI is better.

I also fail to see why CT is the obvious choice...

The best choice would be Colored Coins so we are never NOT in possession of our shares. Then you can plug your shares into Crypto-Trade, Havelock, post up a trading thread, whatever you want because YOU are in possession of your shares, not an exchange, YOU. Just like bitcoin gives YOU the ability to control your money, Colored Coins allows YOU the ability to control your investments.

[arousedrhino]

I also fail to see why CT is the obvious choice...

We're already listed and trading on CT.  Being listed on multiple exchanges is an unnecessary distraction.  Remember the previous circus and all the time Ken lost dealing with it?  Do you want him to spend time making chips or assisting in arbitrage?

Thats a good point but Ken still hasn't done the Share verification on CT yet so it would be just as easy to do it on Havelock, that is unless he is sitting on the CT code ready to go, but I really doubt that. I really prefer Havelock's UI, and have more faith in them than CT but thats a personal opinion.

I'm with you on only having one exchange though, either CT, Havelock, or CC lets not have a bunch of different ones and people bugging Ken to perform arbitrage. Honestly any exchange that I can trade ActM shares on works for me.

[noah tall]

The best choice would be Colored Coins so we are never NOT in possession of our shares. Then you can plug your shares into Crypto-Trade, Havelock, post up a trading thread, whatever you want because YOU are in possession of your shares, not an exchange, YOU. Just like bitcoin gives YOU the ability to control your money, Colored Coins allows YOU the ability to control your investments.

Code:

Hi, I'm the lead developer of ChromaWallet, the flagship colored coins.
Current status

In the past couple of months blah blah blah
...
...

I'd like to get to a point where colored coins can evolve without my involvement. 
I've been working on various colored coins-related projects on and off for 1.5 years, 
it was fun, but I can't do this forever.

CC ain't happening, get over it.  Just list them on CT and be done with it.

sheesh.

[bigdude]

The best choice would be Colored Coins so we are never NOT in possession of our shares. Then you can plug your shares into Crypto-Trade, Havelock, post up a trading thread, whatever you want because YOU are in possession of your shares, not an exchange, YOU. Just like bitcoin gives YOU the ability to control your money, Colored Coins allows YOU the ability to control your investments.

Code:

Hi, I'm the lead developer of ChromaWallet, the flagship colored coins.
Current status

In the past couple of months blah blah blah
...
...

I'd like to get to a point where colored coins can evolve without my involvement. 
I've been working on various colored coins-related projects on and off for 1.5 years, 
it was fun, but I can't do this forever.

CC ain't happening, get over it.  Just list them on CT and be done with it.

sheesh.

Agreed, waiting for CC is nothing more than a stalling tactic now ... its not going to happen for a LONG time.

So, move on to something realistic - list the shares on CT (preferably havelock though)

[minerpart]

CC ain't happening, get over it.  

I can't see how you are getting that from killerstorms update. He actually says under Current Status - 'Now we're getting close to a usable version'.

You are quoting him in a section where he's talking about his personal long term future involvement in CC and misappropriating that to the future of the project itself. He is saying he doesn't want to be tied to it's further longterm development and would prefer it if others could come on board and for the project to become more open-source and self-funding. If he gets a few more helping hands from this request CC could move on very quickly.

[addi]

Still, from ActM's point of view, it makes way more sense to use direct shares or a centralized platform as the time frame and stability of CC is too uncertain. From what I see, and I was saying this 2 weeks ago already, sticking to CC at this point is just a stalling technique.

[minerpart]

Still, from ActM's point of view, it makes way more sense to use direct shares or a centralized platform as the time frame and stability of CC is too uncertain. From what I see, and I was saying this 2 weeks ago already, sticking to CC at this point is just a stalling technique.

Yes you may be right as the timeframe could still be quite extended. But CC are certainly going full implementation at some point.

[zumzero]

Still, from ActM's point of view, it makes way more sense to use direct shares or a centralized platform as the time frame and stability of CC is too uncertain. From what I see, and I was saying this 2 weeks ago already, sticking to CC at this point is just a stalling technique.

Let's not overlook the uncertainties that plague the centralised exchanges as well.  If recent history is anything to go by there's a strong case against them.  Did I read somewhere that Havelock have been granted a money transmitting license?  If true, surely they are the safest bet if we go centralised.  Would we not also benefit from increased liquidity if we are listed alongside assets like NeoBee and Asic miner?  Can this last point be underestimated?  Personally I no longer have a view one way or the other, I just want to see us able to trade again as soon as is humanly possible.

[iSnow]

So I have been out of the loop for some days and come back to discover:

• The 55nm project was a non-starter as a lot of the more tech-savvy here predicted, still ate up time and resources
• Ken spent time day-trading on Gox and got goxxed in the process. A quarter of the companies money goes MIA, either pocketed by Ken or Karpeles
• Shares are still not trading anywhere, no dividends, not roadmap.
• Ken is trying to augment bitcoin address security by some mysterious creation of his - of course closed source and never audited. This is a fatal thing in crypto and information security.
• The Intellihash nonsense that promised a 20% performance boost is also MIA. The rest of the world now enjoys 300% more performance since Intellihash was announced
• The company business plan seems based on a XBT target price of $10,000 where in reality it is hovering between $500 and $700. This makes the 28nm chips a non-starter too.

At this point I pity anyone who put more than a few hundred bucks into this - you won't see your money back, let alone see dividends. With the dwindling cash and bitcoin reserves, this whole venture will enter into its endgame in about two months and it ain't going to be pretty.

I could write if off as a failed investment, but what is really galling is that Ken seemingly took preorder money to gamble on Gox. For this, you deserve to go to jail, old buddy.

[themagicdrake]

Still, from ActM's point of view, it makes way more sense to use direct shares or a centralized platform as the time frame and stability of CC is too uncertain. From what I see, and I was saying this 2 weeks ago already, sticking to CC at this point is just a stalling technique.

Let's not overlook the uncertainties that plague the centralised exchanges as well.  If recent history is anything to go by there's a strong case against them.  Did I read somewhere that Havelock have been granted a money transmitting license?  If true, surely they are the safest bet if we go centralised.  Would we not also benefit from increased liquidity if we are listed alongside assets like NeoBee and Asic miner?  Can this last point be underestimated?  Personally I no longer have a view one way or the other, I just want to see us able to trade again as soon as is humanly possible.

100% agree. So, I say get us on Havelock

[damiano]

... our shares should be listed on either havelock or CT.

Crypto-Trade, it's the obvious choice.

Obvious how? What benefits does it have over Havelock? I for one don't see any unless you think its UI is better.

I also fail to see why CT is the obvious choice...

Plus Havelock has quite a few listings already from btco.co and bitfunder...I would love the volume havelock has to offer.  CT looks dead. 

[tempestb]

Ken said the news is a financial report.  I don't see how anyone gives a crap about this if you don't have access to your shares.  Whether suddenly ActiveMining has earned millions of dollars or it's in the toilet, either situation doesn't do anyone any good if we don't have access to the shares.  In fact, if the news is glorious then all the more reason why people should have access to their shares because their value should, in theory, go up!

No shares means the news is just fluff and again falls into two camps.  Those that believe Ken is telling the truth and those who do not.  Then we'll be kept waiting and asking for when we can have access to our shares or if ActiveMining is solvent.

[addi]

Havelock is the better choice, they have the most volume and are the most "reputable" of all current centralised exchanges out there.

We purchased those shares. To hold them hostage any longer is just ethically unacceptable. I am not sure how illegal it is but I guess it's better we leave that can of worms unopened for now.

[noah tall]

...I would love the volume havelock has to offer...

Havelock is the better choice, they have the most volume ...

Spoken like true opportunists.  If all you want is to be able to try and make money churning shares then this is a valid argument.  If this is what you want, go ahead and day trade ASICMINER or whatever is on Havelock.  Nothing stopping you.

I would rather see the shares on an exchange where they can be traded and dividends dispersed with MINIMAL use of Ken's time and effort.  Better to have him spending time getting these chips to market instead of facilitating day traders.  CT is already set up, why re-create the wheel?


< big sigh >
volume...
< /big sigh >

[funkymunky]

Ken said the news is a financial report.  -snip-
-snip-

Sorry I missed this but where/when did he state this?

[JoTheKhan]

Ken said the news is a financial report.  -snip-
-snip-

Sorry I missed this but where/when did he state this?

He said a Financial report for Y2013 by the end of march and an update/announcement within the next two weeks.