[ANN] Guncoin(GUN) - GUN Core V2.0 - New Exchange for Guncoin

[GuncoinInfo]

Thanks for your long term support of GUN.  First, while one option of course is to make no changes at all to GUN and just promote it big time.  That was our first choice till we started watching what these new ASICs do to hash rate and can easily take over and dominate mining on a small coin like ours.  While I high hash rate is great if it is one of us or a trader or GUN supporter.  But GUN is a coin with a cause - and an anti-cause.  The anti-cause has access to lots of money and could easily cause significant problems for us with racks of this new breed of ASICs and then dumping the coins.  To many other coins, there really is no potetential risk of this nature and they can just promote their coin and rest on their laurels. I think very few of these will survive long term.  I think a coin needs to adapt to the technology around or it could be overcome by it.  

We are interested to hear more about these other coins and what type of open source features they have created.  Anything useful that is open source, we could roll in to GUN pretty easily if it provides something useful for the end-user.

I am very short on time at the moment... but a summary...

1. Retaining scrypt and embracing ASIC's brings strength and security to a coin... read the history of BTM - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=660544.0

2. BTM is the first scrypt coin that has a difficulty retargeting algo that defeats multipools and increases the value of coin by reducing production instead of reducing cost of reduction - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=660544.msg8773105#msg8773105

3. A coin that can only buy BTC has no real value, NLG is a shining example of a coin that has real world use... you can buy a sandwich and coffee with it - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=554412.0

4. The dev team of CCN have released some very useful and handy open source software, including Cannapay, Cannatrade, a very, very clever CCN ISO, and Cannacoin V-bulletin Integration for forum(this could be a key for GUN, think AR15.com, etc.).. the thread is only 5 pages and it is all there - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=740903.0

5. CCN is planning to change to PoS(Proof of Stake) which I believe will devalue the coin, getting something for nothing, makes it worth nothing, having said that, BitCoin is proof that PoW(Proof of Work) may not infinitely sustainable.

6. BTM and NLG launched well after the introduction of ASIC miners for scrypt, but embraced the power of the ASIC and focused on adoption and acceptance. Both coins have seen their price rise by over 10 times in the past 6 weeks.

Adoption, adoption, adoption... is the only way any coin will survive... it must become a currency.

As for the anti-gun, anti-2A sector... you give them too much credit... as GUN becomes more adopted, more successful, the harder it will be to defeat it, especially if you fortify the network with ASIC firepower.

I have mined GUN since launch and Dabs who was escrow for the IPO funds is a personal friend of mine. And I have yet to sell a single GUN.

I provided the information and examples of successful coins, I encourage the dev team to research and implement as they see fit for the goals of GUN.

Thanks,

24Kilo

EDIT - to the dev team... you need to be sure to provide the basics which are missing from GUN... block explorer, seed nodes, QT-wallets for Windows, Linux and MAC, and mobile wallets, Android and iOS... and the Original ANN Post at the beginning of this thread needs to be kept update along with the title... have a look at NLG for an example of how to build a web presence that provides the tools and support the community... all thankless and tiresome work... but without it GUN cannot move ahead.

Very good - it will take me a while to absorb all this - have a lot of fires going right now.  Keep in mind, we are NOT the original developer and just took things over about a 5-6 weeks ago and we have lots of things going on in addition to GUN.  We do not have the keys to everything yet, this threads ownership for starters since we recently took over.  We did create 4 new seed nodes that helped a lot - which we are told are going away this week - so we will be looking for more.  We will eventually supply a new set of wallets, all that any one uses are already there for the current build.  Most Linux users compile their own anyway.  AFTER, our next source upgrade, we will recompile them.  We will probably put off the Android one as that is wasted today and our limited funds can be better spend elsewhere until we have more to offer.  We can have it done in a week if we need to.  The block explorer was there last week and gone now - it was not created or supported by us.  So we will have to find other avenues for that -  time and money - its all on our list....

In regards to ASICs, outgunning them with more ASICs is always an option, but taking their bullets away seems a lot simpler.  Nothing is cast in stone on that yet - still weighing our options......

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[GuncoinInfo]

We have just been informed that the group that hosts our 4 seed nodes is shutting down immediately.  We will look to find more as soon as possible.  In the mean time, if there are connectivity issues by chance, that is the reason.

That blows..

If several of us keep the wallets open for peering, that should help us get through this, correct? 

Yea, keeping your wallets open will definitely help.  It bothers me, cause adding these 4 nodes seem to help the network a lot.  They apparently had significant server problems and are just shutting everything down.  But yes, keep your wallets open - more connections the better.  If anyone knows of a good source of at least 3 nodes - let us know.....

[seerhaad]

We have just been informed that the group that hosts our 4 seed nodes is shutting down immediately.  We will look to find more as soon as possible.  In the mean time, if there are connectivity issues by chance, that is the reason.

That blows..

If several of us keep the wallets open for peering, that should help us get through this, correct? 

Yea, keeping your wallets open will definitely help.  It bothers me, cause adding these 4 nodes seem to help the network a lot.  They apparently had significant server problems and are just shutting everything down.  But yes, keep your wallets open - more connections the better.  If anyone knows of a good source of at least 3 nodes - let us know.....

I have a cloud server, Guncoin wallet is always open. Ip address is : 191.238.100.177

[GuncoinInfo]

@24Kilo, the marketability is currently being worked on, that's the reason for the guncoin trading site.  There's POS (point of sale) equipment being developed (not centered around guncoin), that will facilitate the adoption of guncoin offnet as well, with simple software changes.  Unfortunately, the current cost of the equipment is prohibitive at around $900 per unit, but competing units will drop the price to make it manageable.

A bigger issue IMHO of adoption though, is liquidity.  Right now, even if a store had a POS unit, the store owner would have to sit on the money.  

Example:  A store owner takes in $500 worth of guncoin for sale of some products.  Assuming 30 santoshi value, that gives the store owner just under 4.2 million guncoin.  If the store owner immediately dumps that on an exchange to convert to $cash, they'll be lucky to get 1/2 of that, as there's only so much coin wanted at 30 santoshi, then some at 29, 28, 27, etc, but they will got down to the bottom soon.  

Unless they sit on the coin for later conversion, or trade it for other product or services.  Lots of places aren't going to want to do that.  The smart ones will, but even they will have a limit on how much coin they can hold if it interferes with cash liquidity to pay employees, bills, taxes, suppliers, etc.

You hit on one of the more important things that every one misses - liquidity.  If a coin owner cannot liquidate it easily, it has no value to him.  With bitcoin, you can sell something for BTC and then turnaround and buy something totally different 5 minutes later after it clears into your wallets from someone else.  With GUN, based on our user base, we limit ourselves to the firearms community. While you can sell a gun and then buy bullets with the same GUN, someone on ebay is not likely to accept GUN for a payment for anything.  That is why the exchanges play such an important role for GUN - more than other coins.  This is where the GUN users can liquidate their coins to buy OTHER STUFF, other than firearms stuff.  Maintaining a decent volume on these exchanges is essential to keeping GUN going.  With no exchanges, we have no way to convince a non-crypto user to use GUN, he has no way to spend it, except on other GUN stuff which limits his useage.  Getting kicked off of Bittrex was a killer for GUN.  That was a major exchange and excellent visibility, but no one traded us and we died there.  We cannot let that happen on the others.  We continue to buy some coins on all the exchanges each day.  With a price of 25-30 satoshi, damm315er is totally right - a firearm will cost you over 4MIL GUN or more.  I think if we can get that price up over 500 to 1000, GUN looks like a very good option at that point.  Are we there yet - no.  Can we get there - absolutely.  But not if we all sit around and watch.  We think we have done quite a few things since taking over that have had a positive effect on the coin.  Are we done yet - no.  Do we have more to do - yes.  Do we need your help - absolutely.

FYI, we just had a concealed handgun site who followed us on Twitter put an article up on his site about us today.  Once he makes some changes, we will post the links......Please keep the ideas and discussions going!

[affordableweb]

It's good to see the fresh conversation on GUN and the continued support so many have. I bought GUN while it was listed on Bittrex and I got it listed on Bleutrade because I did not want to see my investment die off. I think we are hitting on some important topics. Both liquidity and the exchanges are vital to the long term success of GUN.

I see miners or the rise of powerful asics as less important because those miners will only mine a coin of value and at current prices GUN is not worth mining. I understand there is some concern over nefarious forces out to stop GUN for political reasons and I have even seen some very strange bidding on the exchanges but I dont think Guncoin has made enough noise to be any sort of threat of interest to any organized group. Even 2A opponents have better things to worry themselves than a struggling altcoin.

I believe that Guncoin will need to first be accepted by the crypto marketplace before it gains any value and is of interest to anyone who does not already understand Bitcoin or crypto currencies. I think talking to gun shops and show vendors about Guncoin is a wasted opportunity to talk to them about Bitcoin and crypto currency in general. Having a small local gunshop acccept Guncoin when they have nowhere to convert it to cash easily is a deal killer for a majority of the industry. Margins in the gun business are abysmal and cash flow is inmportatnt to any gun dealer. A gun shop would be better served to accept Bitcoin at this point and there is little incentive or reason to take GUN other than the novelty of its name.

I think we should focus on making Guncoin more accepted and valuable to the crypto marketplace first and foremost so that when we do have the opportunity to speak with new potential vendors there is something there to talk to them about. If changes are going to be made to Guncoin it needs to be changes that the crypto marketplace would want to see. The type of changes that will boost the exchange price and volume, increase liquidity, attract new miners and new exchanges like Cryptsy which offer conversion to USD.

I think without broader support and recognition by the crypto markets it will be far more difficult to attract new vendors willing to accept Guncoin. Volume on all exchanges has been weak and we risk being delisted again which at this point in development could be a fatal blow.

So whats the solution? Well, Guncoin is looked at as an old style coin with Scrypt PoW. It's been suggested we convert to x13/Neoscrypt and I think that is an excellent idea because it is a more efficient algo. PoS or Proof of Stake is very popular as well and would certainly do something for the coins value. I think the biggest thing we could do was adopt some form of coin mixer or anonymity but that would require a dedicated development team which this coin lacks.

Is there a development fund so people can support the coins development?

[damm315er]

It's good to see the fresh conversation on GUN and the continued support so many have. I bought GUN while it was listed on Bittrex and I got it listed on Bleutrade because I did not want to see my investment die off. I think we are hitting on some important topics. Both liquidity and the exchanges are vital to the long term success of GUN.

I see miners or the rise of powerful asics as less important because those miners will only mine a coin of value and at current prices GUN is not worth mining. I understand there is some concern over nefarious forces out to stop GUN for political reasons and I have even seen some very strange bidding on the exchanges but I dont think Guncoin has made enough noise to be any sort of threat of interest to any organized group. Even 2A opponents have better things to worry themselves than a struggling altcoin.

I believe that Guncoin will need to first be accepted by the crypto marketplace before it gains any value and is of interest to anyone who does not already understand Bitcoin or crypto currencies. I think talking to gun shops and show vendors about Guncoin is a wasted opportunity to talk to them about Bitcoin and crypto currency in general. Having a small local gunshop acccept Guncoin when they have nowhere to convert it to cash easily is a deal killer for a majority of the industry. Margins in the gun business are abysmal and cash flow is inmportatnt to any gun dealer. A gun shop would be better served to accept Bitcoin at this point and there is little incentive or reason to take GUN other than the novelty of its name.

I think we should focus on making Guncoin more accepted and valuable to the crypto marketplace first and foremost so that when we do have the opportunity to speak with new potential vendors there is something there to talk to them about. If changes are going to be made to Guncoin it needs to be changes that the crypto marketplace would want to see. The type of changes that will boost the exchange price and volume, increase liquidity, attract new miners and new exchanges like Cryptsy which offer conversion to USD.

I think without broader support and recognition by the crypto markets it will be far more difficult to attract new vendors willing to accept Guncoin. Volume on all exchanges has been weak and we risk being delisted again which at this point in development could be a fatal blow.

So whats the solution? Well, Guncoin is looked at as an old style coin with Scrypt PoW. It's been suggested we convert to x13/Neoscrypt and I think that is an excellent idea because it is a more efficient algo. PoS or Proof of Stake is very popular as well and would certainly do something for the coins value. I think the biggest thing we could do was adopt some form of coin mixer or anonymity but that would require a dedicated development team which this coin lacks.

Is there a development fund so people can support the coins development?

The DEV has a guncoin donation address on his posts, although seriously gun donations are pretty much useless besides a feel good measure.  He can only hold them or sell at a low market rate, at several thousand guncoin to a USD, that's not much.  Especially since programmers that take coin for payment want BTC.  Perhaps a BTC donation address addition is in order?

One of the original dev's sticking points was keeping the Scrypt/POW, and non-anonymizing it has, to offer the coin legitimacy by not appealing to people that would want to use it anonymously for nefarious purposes.  I understand the reasoning behind that, but, the coin didn't explode on it's name alone like the original dev expected it to, so at this point with all the other coins offering anonymity I don't really feel as that's much of a sticking point anymore. 

We do have to keep our noses clean to a certain extent though, as the simple name and wrath it can bring from a certain segment of the population, can still cause issues in coin success at this point.  A friend of mine regularly complains that he's one flat tire away from bankruptcy. That's similar to the situation we have here, very weak, and nothing buy a handful of users supporting it.  One good hiccup, and guncoin goes belly up. 

But, we've got a fairly dedicated group, and the group is slowly expanding.  At some point, a critical mass will be hit, that day I will be very happy as I've made this coin's success sort of a personal crusade.    I also stand to profit, but realistically don't expect to do much more than break even.

[GuncoinInfo]

It is good to see some of the original supporters reappear here.  We are happy to be here and happy for your support.  To address a few comments in different posts......

1) We are reviewing and considering several upgrades for the coin - we are convinced that it needs a serious upgrade to make it more noticeable to crypto users, pools, exchanges, etc. and also to protect against anti-gun folks who may eventually target us - although maybe not now.  With things changing so fast in crypto - staying stagnant is a killer I think.  While we have not officially chosen a direction, the creator of Neoscrypt has agreed to work Guncoin if that is the direction we want to go.  Our concern is the limited support system around this algorithm today - although the good news is that it is growing every day.  If we go this direction, it kills the two birds we just listed with one stone.  That being said, everything will NOT happen at once.  Too many changes could be a disaster.  An iterative approach that all can easily see and adapt to is the path we will most likely take.

2) In regards to Development funds, the original developer passed on some GUN to me, I have also been buying and mining it like crazy for two months.  That being said, any support or work I get done by outsiders costs me $$$ or BTC, not GUN. I am happy to create a separate BTC address dedicated to GUN Dev.  Websites, nodes, etc all cost $$$/BTC every month as well.  Likewise, if anyone has services they can provide, that will expedite the process or save money.  We do have a plan and we are moving on it - like I said before - time and money and we will get there.

3) While I agree that talking to a gun shop owner about GUN today is probably a waste of time, we still need to put that as the end-goal here and move that direction.  With that in mind, that is why I created the Users Guide and Classified Ad site for GUN users and have a few other things in work.  Anyone new to crypto will be drawn by these types of things rather than what Algo we use. 

There are a lot of moving parts to getting GUN moving again.  Now that we are moving, it is even more difficult to keep it moving and on the right track.  Good discussions here help give us new ideas, stimulate conversations among users and choose the direction to make GUN a long term success.  Thank you all for your support!

[24Kilo]

Briefly...

1. Liquidity is a result of adoption.

2. Adoption does not equal higher BTC price or increased attention by the crypto community.

3. Adoption can only happen if the needed tools are in place... web-site, tutorials, wallets, explorers, etc, etc...

4. The value of a currency is built by its circulation, not by speculation or accummulation...

5. Volatility is the enemy of a working currency...(read how the core NLG supporter are upset about the recent price rise and fall... it has actually done more harm than good to NLG as a currency)

5. Creating a currency is hard, tiresome, thankless work...

6. Too many folks in crypto equate high BTC value with being a successful coin when true success is when a coin becomes a currency.

One of the greatest hindrances to the success of GUN is its name. If I in fact wanted to purchase or sell firearms with a crypto currency, why would I attract attention myself by using a currency named GUN? That would be painting a bulls-eye on my forehead. I would choose to use a currency that is benign and unsuspecting.

The niche for GUN is as a novelty coin for forums and etc to use as rewards and points system. That is why I am referred to the CCN V-bulletin integration open source project. Also the BTM 'Marking Project' needs to be considered.

Regarding funding development... the dev team needs to publish a prioritized road map with the funding needed.

and...

7. How did I get dragged into this?

EDIT - to be honest... any real consideration of an algo change will result in losing my support for GUN... not a threat or blackmail... simple fact... changing algos is an unneeded expenditure of resources that need to be focused on adoption and promotion. There is no long-term proof that changing the mining algo of a coin has done anything but produced a brief pump, dump and then death of a coin. This forum is littered with a carcasses of re-algo'ed and refactored coins in a vain attempt to survive. The only thing that will ensure the survive of a coin is adoption.

[24Kilo]

One more thing...

Stop viewing ASIC's as threat... you are doing the same thing that the anti-gun and anti-2A crowd is doing... those people have guns... those people must be dangerous, so let's outlaw and remove them from society.

Just a few posts up in this thread is the discussion about recent rulings regarding the ATF, Hugh's Ammendment, and machine guns. As firearms owners, we are the 'ASIC's' that society fears and wants to remove, when in fact we are law-abiding citizens that would stand up for them and fight for their rights, not just the 2nd Ammendment, but the entire bill of rights. They look at us as the enemy, while we are actually their allies and friends.

ASIC's are not different... build a coin that ASIC miners want to mine... as more miners come onboard, the greater the strength of the network with the benefit of the natural response by miners to protect their coin. ASIC's are the machine guns of mining... so are we going to cow down to an assumed and hyped threat or embrace the strength of ASIC miners?

ASIC will never be the enemy of GUN... at the moment... no one is going over mine GUN because there is no value or market... as GUN gains value naturally and organically the network will get stronger and stronger... sure there are going to be hiccups along the way... NLG has had to negotiate with a multi-pool operator and is upgrading its diff algo, but in the end, NLG will have stronger network as result.

As firearms owners and protectors of the 2nd Ammendment, we are the target of hype, scare tactics, and manipulated media every day. I would think we would be able to see through the hype and misinformation surrounding ASIC's.

Create adoption and  circulation and GUN will become a currency with enough strength to stand on its own.

[Dabs]

In regards to ASICs, outgunning them with more ASICs is always an option, but taking their bullets away seems a lot simpler.  Nothing is cast in stone on that yet - still weighing our options......

This statement ... makes you sound like the anti-gunners. Don't put serial numbers and micro-stamp the brass, it won't work.

(I'm trying to be funny.)

[24Kilo]

In regards to ASICs, outgunning them with more ASICs is always an option, but taking their bullets away seems a lot simpler.  Nothing is cast in stone on that yet - still weighing our options......

This statement ... makes you sound like the anti-gunners. Don't put serial numbers and micro-stamp the brass, it won't work.

(I'm trying to be funny.)

Dabs,

My sentiment as well... my first response was... 'is GuncoinInfo actually an anti-gun supporter'... the rhetoric sounded so familiar and wearisome. Thus my reply...

24Kilo

[GuncoinInfo]

In regards to ASICs, outgunning them with more ASICs is always an option, but taking their bullets away seems a lot simpler.  Nothing is cast in stone on that yet - still weighing our options......

This statement ... makes you sound like the anti-gunners. Don't put serial numbers and micro-stamp the brass, it won't work.

(I'm trying to be funny.)

Dabs,

My sentiment as well... my first response was... 'is GuncoinInfo actually an anti-gun supporter'... the rhetoric sounded so familiar and wearisome. Thus my reply...

24Kilo

LOL, guess you could twist it that way - but not quite.  Search back to find my introductory post - that should give you all you need on me....The original developer sought me out to take over, not the other way around and he is a first class guy for all he did to get the coin this far and swore me to keep going - which I did.  Nuff sed on that....

FYI, have two replacement nodes going up this evening.  They are transparent to you since we just list them as seed2, seed3 etc.  We will probably fall back to just two seed nodes instead of the original 4 with everyone having wallets open - we should be fine.  We may not need any of them, but having 4 dead ones makes me a bit nervous.  Will let you know once they are switched over - sorry for hassle.  My node host just went belly up and left a lot o people hanging - it happens.....

[GuncoinInfo]

One more thing...

Stop viewing ASIC's as threat... you are doing the same thing that the anti-gun and anti-2A crowd is doing... those people have guns... those people must be dangerous, so let's outlaw and remove them from society.

Just a few posts up in this thread is the discussion about recent rulings regarding the ATF, Hugh's Ammendment, and machine guns. As firearms owners, we are the 'ASIC's' that society fears and wants to remove, when in fact we are law-abiding citizens that would stand up for them and fight for their rights, not just the 2nd Ammendment, but the entire bill of rights. They look at us as the enemy, while we are actually their allies and friends.

ASIC's are not different... build a coin that ASIC miners want to mine... as more miners come onboard, the greater the strength of the network with the benefit of the natural response by miners to protect their coin. ASIC's are the machine guns of mining... so are we going to cow down to an assumed and hyped threat or embrace the strength of ASIC miners?

ASIC will never be the enemy of GUN... at the moment... no one is going over mine GUN because there is no value or market... as GUN gains value naturally and organically the network will get stronger and stronger... sure there are going to be hiccups along the way... NLG has had to negotiate with a multi-pool operator and is upgrading its diff algo, but in the end, NLG will have stronger network as result.

As firearms owners and protectors of the 2nd Ammendment, we are the target of hype, scare tactics, and manipulated media every day. I would think we would be able to see through the hype and misinformation surrounding ASIC's.

Create adoption and  circulation and GUN will become a currency with enough strength to stand on its own.

All good points and I appreciate the input.  I fully understand and am frustrated with all the anti-gun hype, BS, etc too. Fortunately I live somewhere where it is not a big deal and there is no threat to our freedoms at the state or local levels.  That being said, while the ASIC threat against GUN now is minimal, long-term if GUN grows to what we all hope it will, ASICs at that time, could be a real threat.  I have a room full of ASICs now mining GUN and others, so no one looses more than I do if we switch. And it is my BTC that gets spent to upgrade GUN.   All your points are excellent observations today, but maybe not 6 months from now.  So, when GUN is going for 1000 satoshi, has 10,000 Twitter followers, tables at gun shows, trading on all the major exchanges, even though we are all rich - ASICs then could take that away or at least make our life very difficult.  Of course, if our group continues to match their ASICs with our ASICs, we hold them off, right? Kind of......The little guy just coming in looses, unless he buys the big ASICs too, he cannot mine or compete.  Now I recognize, that we should be so lucky if all this comes to pass.  If I have my way, it will with all your help.  But when all is said and done, eliminating ASICs from the equation for a very long time and leveling the playing field with all current and future miners has a certain attraction and equitable ring to it.  I hate to say, even a Liberal tone to it although that is not the intent.  Like I said, if we can get the price up to a reasonable amount, telling a gun shop owner that he can let his laptop run over night and make a few GUN while he sleeps is a heck of a selling point - something you sure cannot do with paypal or BTC.

[Dabs]

Two choices here:

1. Don't change the algo.

2. Change the algo.

If you do this, make sure it stands on it's own, and ... well I don't know enough, but my idea is to make it a CPU coin. Otherwise that gun shop owner isn't going to mine much if it requires a high end Nvidia or AMD chip on his laptop (which he can't easily upgrade.)

[GuncoinInfo]

Two choices here:

1. Don't change the algo.

2. Change the algo.

If you do this, make sure it stands on it's own, and ... well I don't know enough, but my idea is to make it a CPU coin. Otherwise that gun shop owner isn't going to mine much if it requires a high end Nvidia or AMD chip on his laptop (which he can't easily upgrade.)

Appreciate the input.  Sooner or later, it will have to change - Except for its niche market, there is nothing attractive about it for the crypto community in general.  I recognize that whatever path we go down, not everyone will be happy with - just not possible.  That is why we are interested in all the feedback we can get and looking at lots of options trying to keep focused on the big picture here and the long term - not just our wallet today.  Thanks again!

[GuncoinInfo]

FYI, have two replacement nodes going up this evening.  They are transparent to you since we just list them as seed2, seed3 etc.  We will probably fall back to just two seed nodes instead of the original 4 with everyone having wallets open - we should be fine.  We may not need any of them, but having 4 dead ones makes me a bit nervous.  Will let you know once they are switched over - sorry for hassle.  My node host just went belly up and left a lot o people hanging - it happens.....

OK, as promised two seed nodes have been replaced and should be fully operational now.  We used "seed.guncoin.info" and "seed2.guncoin.info" as the two new ones.  Again, you should need to change nothing in your config files as it is transparent to you.  Just letting you know about a network change.

[Dabs]

There is always POS (Proof of Stake), which essentially turns every wallet into a miner. Everyone with any GUN will want to keep their wallet online, (or the incentive to do so is there). This will make the PoW (Proof of Work) miners upset, since their hardware will either become useless, or have to be pointed at something else.

Anything lower than 5% (per year) isn't going to work though, but that's just an opinion.

[GuncoinInfo]

There is always POS (Proof of Stake), which essentially turns every wallet into a miner. Everyone with any GUN will want to keep their wallet online, (or the incentive to do so is there). This will make the PoW (Proof of Work) miners upset, since their hardware will either become useless, or have to be pointed at something else.

Anything lower than 5% (per year) isn't going to work though, but that's just an opinion.

Yep, that has already been brought up to use - has its positives and negatives.

[damm315er]

Lots of discussion while I was sleeping...  Valid points on both sides, and I'll offer one point of contention.

Asics are a tool.  The most common users of them, are those seeking to mine and dump for profit.  Another point of asics, is that they increase a lot faster than the rest of the community.  Yes, CPU's get faster, but it's single digit percentage points per year with a very high cost.  GPU's increase at a slightly higher percentage rate, but are also prohibitive to increasingly replace to chase the best.  Asics have increased nearly 750% just in 2014 (400 kh/s to 300 mh/s), and don't even show that they are reaching a point of slowing down, while they keep getting cheaper.  The largest issue with this speed increase is power consumption, the next few generations of asics are going to take the ability to feed them the power they need out of the hands of the consumer and into asic farms like there are for bitcoin.  At that point any coin mine-able by asics will be out of reach of the hobbyist as the farms will mine any profitable coin.

At this point, gun is low enough it's not profitable enough to mine with an asic for sale, but at the point that it does, the farms will take over mining.  A perfect example of this, is try mining doge or litecoin.  Don't bother with a CPU or GPU, and a 6 month old asic isn't even going to get you much.


Let's look into the future for a projection.  Keeping gun scrypt, and assuming success in reaching the level where it hits the radar of the mining farms, and they bump the hashrate to several gigahash:

Will it be good for me personally?  I will be upset about losing my ability to mine it as I won't be able to compete.

The real question is, will an asic farm taking over mining of gun be good or bad for the coin?  I can see both sides.  If only 1 farm starts mining and dumping without the adoption in the gun community, it hurts coin value.  If the outside community has adopted gun, it doesn't hurt the coin at all, but it won't make the coin any more stable, it simply takes the profit of mining from the hobbyist to the farmer.


But, one thing that I'm thinking has been fending off larger asic adoption of gun so far, is the instability and lack of promise of gun coin.  The original DEV assumed that it would take off on it's own, but being released alongside a flood of other coins it really didn't stand out, and pretty much just floundered.  Now, it's has proven it has a following to support it, but currently there's no clear direction of the coin.  (coins like SYS have a dev team and a schedule to make certain achievements by, they also have 1,500 btc IPO backing to fund it)  Now, with gun, there's also the threat of farmers getting all their mining equipment setup for gun, only to have gun switch to neo-scrypt so they can no longer mine it.  That would be a pretty strong deterrent if I was a farm owner.

[24Kilo]

In reply to 'damm315er',

1. We cannot tar all miners with the same brush... CPU, GPU, ASIC... Botnet, GPU farm, ASIC farm... all are used for mining... any highly profitable and successful coin will quickly be out of reach of the hobby miner... whether CPU(think XMR), GPU(think DRK), or ASIC(think LTC)... the only coins that have ever been for the hobby miner are the coins that are not a success or viable.

2. ASIC's gives power to the community...they provide the best hash-rate to power consumption to equipment cost... there has never been a better time for a community to own a network.

3. GUN will not be remotely successful until the network is sustained by at least 100GH/s... no matter what equipment is used to mine it.

4. Most folks do not understand mining and coin dynamics at a large scale... no coin will ever be mined below its true value... and the biggest challenge facing any miner with any sizable farm, botnet, GPU or ASIC is ensuring that the coin he or she mines has enough volume and liquidity for a reasonable return.

I am not expending any more time or energy on the subject of an algo change... waste of time and resources... GUN will not need to concern itself with any threat from any botnet, GPU farm, or ASIC farm if there is no improvement in adoption and progress to becoming a working currency.

The simply fact is that right now GUN is worthless... the only thing that can be bought with GUN is BTC... and there are 100's of useless coins competing for the BTC. I mine GUN for a bit of fun now and then... but do not honestly ever expect to see any real return on my investment.

The only way to achieve value in GUN is build circulation and adoption... the dev has indicated he is working several projects... so I am being patient will hold my GUN for the long-term.

I have already listed in previous thread several new scrypt coins that are very successful in harnessing the power of the ASIC as well as building a large user base, which has incidentally raised the value of the coin as well.

EDIT - I did not intend this post as a personal attack on 'damm315er', so I have made appropriate changes to the post.