Livecoin.net Scam

[babo]

i love math so much
because math can explane everything and raise logic

https://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/monacoin/ monacoin value = 2 euro

750 x 2 = 1500 euro


and, my logic said... an exchange scam 1500 euro?

@izooomrud you think we are stupids? an exchage if want do a REAL scam, do exit scam or steal MORE than 1500 euro


we can use the logic
if i'm an exchange, i do'nt steal 1500 euros and risk a scam accusation
if i want to do a scam, i'm going to exit scam (like other exchange) or simulate a fake hacker steal

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[izooomrud]

i love math so much
because math can explane everything and raise logic

https://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/monacoin/ monacoin value = 2 euro

750 x 2 = 1500 euro


and, my logic said... an exchange scam 1500 euro?

@izooomrud you think we are stupids? an exchage if want do a REAL scam, do exit scam or steal MORE than 1500 euro


we can use the logic
if i'm an exchange, i do'nt steal 1500 euros and risk a scam accusation
if i want to do a scam, i'm going to exit scam (like other exchange) or simulate a fake hacker steal

If they not a scam - where my money? You are one of those who unreasonably support livecoin, although you have concrete evidence of their deception, you write me negative reviews unreasonably, I am ashamed of you

[babo]

you TAG ME red WITHOUT reference and write

Code:

Covers thieves from livecoin who stole my money 

without post in my thread


and now, if i'm kid like you, i tag you too red.... but i'm and adult

i NEVER cover a thief, see my history of scam hunter.. kid

you write me negative reviews unreasonably, I am ashamed of you

WHERE??? WHERE IS THIS NEGATIVE REVIEW???

[izooomrud]

you TAG ME red WITHOUT reference and write

Code:

Covers thieves from livecoin who stole my money 

without post in my thread


and now, if i'm kid like you, i tag you too red.... but i'm and adult

i NEVER cover a thief, see my history of scam hunter.. kid

you write me negative reviews unreasonably, I am ashamed of you

WHERE??? WHERE IS THIS NEGATIVE REVIEW???

I mean trust. And you cover livecoin when there is evidence of their cheating

[babo]

Code:

ты в бpeдy

you are delirious, for real and for 1500 euro
if you are idiot and stock your alt in exchange not my problem... now you lost money and now you raging

explane in my topic why the russian user accuse you (and tag you red) with blackmail accusation



if you convince me, I'll give my flag support and close the topic about you

[izooomrud]

Code:

ты в бpeдy

you are delirious, for real and for 1500 euro
if you are idiot and stock your alt in exchange not my problem... now you lost money and now you raging

explane in my topic why the russian user accuse you (and tag you red) with blackmail accusation



if you convince me, I'll give my flag support and close the topic about you

thanks for the opinion

it seems that I used the wrong login when changing the trust, I'm sorry

[babo]

some other threads usefull on scam accusation against livecoin

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5161686.0 (drama thread)
|---> https://forklog.com/kriptovalyutnaya-birzha-livecoin-priostanovila-vyvod-sredstv

Due to "critical problems with servers", Livecoin cryptocurrency exchange temporarily suspended the input and output of funds from the platform. This is stated on the website of the exchange.

On October 8, Livecoin users complained about problems with access to the platform. Then the exchange team reported on Twitter that there were problems with hosting and the developers were working on solving the problem

|---> https://forklog.com/kriptobirzha-livecoin-poteryala-svyshe-1-8-mln-iz-za-uyazvimosti-v-kode-monero

Representatives of Livecoin cryptobirds with a daily trading volume of $ 25 million appealed to the ForkLog magazine, who reported that they had incurred significant losses due to a critical bug in the Monero code that allows them to manipulate transaction amounts. The total damage amounted to 15108 XMR (more than $ 1.8 million).

|---> https://www.bestchange.ru/livecoin-exchanger.html

Kira
"A group of traders is preparing for a collective appeal to a European court regarding the manipulation and conduct of dubious ICO LiveCoin exchanges.
In addition, we also want to send an appeal to regulators to take action regarding the illegal actions of this exchange, we ask all victims to leave their contact details "
I want to join the collective complaint, I have to punish them somehow newstarup@gmail.com

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1023418.0 (last pages)


---- update -----
i'm going to investigate more on livecoin and shitcoin security issue

[blurryeyed]

No surprise to see that it's only Russians & Livescam sig wearers sticking up for these scammers - I think we can assume Livescam is run out of somewhere in Russia then. Time to start tagging these scam promoters a'la Yobit style soon I think - I didn't realize there were so many cheap skate legendary members on here.

In the meantime, Flag supported.

[TMAN]

BTC-E esque, god those were the days

[posi]

Why aren't they responding? Livecoin has been online on bitcointalk and he has probably seen his this thread as it was linked to in his own topic.

I'm supporting the flag (for now).

I think they have a policy of not discussing anything like this here at bitcointalk. Just like they state in their thread that they won't respond to any questions as they only post updates.

It seems their strategy is to ignore accusations, and allow their supporters to ignore and distract from evidence of theft, and scamming.

In my opinion, I don't see that as a act of ignoring accusations since they are going to provide us an update and we can only say they are ignoring accusations if they don't respond to the accuser complain.

[DireWolfM14]

Their TOS also appears to break Belize law (where their company is supposedly registered)

Their terms of service also break the laws of common sense.

The Customer guarantees not to disclose any information, obtained from the Service support operator, in any channels of communication. Violation of this rule will lead to the account termination without refunding of the remaining balance of the account.

That's illegal in every country with a civilized legal code.

The Customer agrees, that the Service may, acting at its sole discretion, suspend the Customer's access to the Website, including, but not limited to: restriction, suspension or termination of the account, a prohibition of access to the Website and to its contents and termination of providing any services.

This (presumably) gives them the authority to close your account for any reason or no reason.  Maybe they don't like your username; account closed.  Maybe they think you have too much money in your account; account closed!  WTF, over?

The Service may take technical and legal measures to prevent the Customer’s access to the Website, if the Service believes, that she/he is causing troubles and poses legal challenges, abuses intellectual property rights of third parties, or her/his actions violate the present Terms.

No causing trouble, or... you guessed it; account closed!

[Archive]

Another head-scratcher; It seems like livecoin has deleted any mention of MONA from their website, with the exception of their main exchange page.  A google search lists "news" results from livecoin.net, but when searching the linked page all mention of MONA is gone.  One page, which appears to have been the original press release at the time of the 51% attack has been completely deleted, and the link goes to a 404 error.  That link:

Code:

https://www.livecoin.net/news/view/719?lang=en

A post on github quotes the original message:

Dear clients, as you all know, MONA network has been attacked recently, and all the exchanges suffered at some point due to fake incoming transactions. The fact of attack has been publicly acknowledged by the developers.

We contacted the developers several times on the issues concerning the cancellation of fake transactions or providing compensations for the losses sustained by the exchanges as a result of the hackers' attack on MONA blockchain. Today we got an answer: the developers won't take any actions. We, in our turn, have nothing to do than keep MONA deposit/withdrawal closed, in accordance with the terms of services providing. If the developers of MONA will ever take steps to cover the losses, incurred by the attack on the blockchain, we would be glad to make this asset available again. If you want to influence the situation somehow, please, send collective claims to MONA developers.

The search settings I used:

Code:

https://www.google.com/search?q=livecoin.net+and+%22mona%22+coin

The most troubling thing about this whole event is the number of reputed member who are still supporting this exchange.  A couple of spots opened up on their signature campaign, and several people applied.  This is really disappointing, especially from those whom I respect.  It's pretty obvious livecoin is a shady outfit, hiding in the shadows with a ToS agreement that holds them unaccountable.  

Sure, the evidence of the scam claims is largely circumstantial, but in this very thread they admitted they are treating the victim as he reported.  After several claims of folks being mistreated by livecoin, and their own terms of service full of illegal business practices, I'm baffled anyone can continue to stand behind them.

[bones261]

The most troubling thing about this whole event is the number of reputed member who are still supporting this exchange.  A couple of spots opened up on their signature campaign, and several people applied.  This is really disappointing, especially from those whom I respect.  It's pretty obvious livecoin is a shady outfit, hiding in the shadows with a ToS agreement that holds them unaccountable.  

Sure, the evidence of the scam claims is largely circumstantial, but in this very thread they admitted they are treating the victim as he reported.  After several claims of folks being mistreated by livecoin, and their own terms of service full of illegal business practices, I'm baffled anyone can continue to stand behind them.

I'm going to cut the Livecoin participants some slack, for now. As I have testified before, the Livecoin signature was a hard one to drop. Part of me still even regrets my decision. While I was contemplating whether I should stay or leave the campaign, I must have come up with a thousand and one justifications to stay. However, in the end, it just didn't feel right for me.

[Hhampuz]

Tag me, flag me, any way you want me .

I'll be working towards finding a solution and trying to mend LiveCoins reputation as that seems like more of a challenge than just pointing fingers and exercising a feeling of power. But that might just be me, as long as I'm on DT (I've messaged theymos about blacklisting me) I will counter any negative given to participants in the LiveCoin campaign.

I might share any updates in this thread, the campaign thread or somewhere else but as of right now it's back to work.

[DireWolfM14]

Lol, Bones' post made me think of a Clash song, and Hh made me think of a Journey song.  I'm good with the Clash, but time out for you, Hhampuz, for shame. 

Tag me, flag me, any way you want me .

That ain't gonna happen.  I'm not tagging anyone other livecoin.  I get it, a lot of income is on the line for people who can't afford to lose it.  I empathize, and for that reason I won't be tagging anyone participating the sig campaign.  If anyone gets tagged or flagged for being on the sig campaign I'll oppose it.

I'll be working towards finding a solution and trying to mend LiveCoins reputation...

Of that I have no doubt.  If anyone is up for the challenge, livecoin has the right guy in their corner.

[Quickseller]

the evidence of the scam claims is largely circumstantial, but in this very thread they admitted they are treating the victim as he reported.  After several claims of folks being mistreated by livecoin, and their own terms of service full of illegal business practices, I'm baffled anyone can continue to stand behind them

I think they have admitted to a sufficient number of facts for someone to conclude that they have effectively scammed the OP if you only believe LiveCoin and do not believe the OP.

I get it, a lot of income is on the line for people who can't afford to lose it.  I empathize, and for that reason I won't be tagging anyone participating the sig campaign.

I would think this would be exactly why someone should get tagged— they are receiving money in order to effectively vouch for someone they know to be a scammer. They have been pointed out that they are advertising for a scammer and have not disagreed with the conclusion.

I fail to see how this is difficult from someone vouching for someone asking for a loan they know has no intention of repaying, in exchange for a percentage of the loan received.

It would be different if they were disputing that LiveCoin is scamming, but for the most part they are not.

[DireWolfM14]

I get it, a lot of income is on the line for people who can't afford to lose it.  I empathize, and for that reason I won't be tagging anyone participating the sig campaign.

I would think this would be exactly why someone should get tagged— they are receiving money in order to effectively vouch for someone they know to be a scammer. They have been pointed out that they are advertising for a scammer and have not disagreed with the conclusion.

I think it's worth giving people some time to come to those conclusions for themselves.  I may change my mind about this in the future, but for now I am not tagging the participants of the sig campaign.  Many have been participating for weeks, and jumping in and tagging them this early in the process would be heartless, and very likely counter productive to the overall health of the community.  It's not my intention to bash people over the head for promoting something that weeks later turns out to be a fraud.

The first step to an amicable resolution is to convince LiveCoin to make things right with their clients, and revise their terms of service to comply with the laws of the countries where they operate.  If LiveCoin refuses to make these concessions then it's time to request that the signature campaign be put to rest.  Only then would it be right to start tagging people who continue to promote known fraudsters.

[suchmoon]

The first step to an amicable resolution is to convince LiveCoin to make things right with their clients, and revise their terms of service to comply with the laws of the countries where they operate.  If LiveCoin refuses to make these concessions then it's time to request that the signature campaign be put to rest.  Only then would it be right to start tagging people who continue to promote known fraudsters.

I'm rooting for Hhampuz, not holding my breath though. For Livecoin there is more money in exit scamming than making it right and they don't strike me as honest actors.

I've skimmed through some of Livecoin's Russian posts as well - they're much more eloquent there. They're in denial and going full Yobit (coincidentally another Russian scam exchange).

The practice of allowing to trade fake coins seems similar to Bitcoin shitforks pretending to be Bitcoin (and I'm not talking about merely shilling for BCH/BSV/etc, but actually selling them as the real Bitcoin) however Livecoin is still insisting that developers should cover their self-inflicted losses and they're not halting trading.

[malevolent]

I'll be working towards finding a solution and trying to mend LiveCoins reputation as that seems like more of a challenge than just pointing fingers and exercising a feeling of power.

You could to explain to them how businesses are supposed be run in 1st world countries, you don't freeze assets a customer has deposited with you just because you disagree with what they write online about your business.

[Blacknavy]

When the Dayun Zig Z1 was produced for the Lyra2Rev2 algorithm, I was an investor of crypto currency called Hdac that used L2R2 algorithm.

At that time, we warned both Hdac and Monacoin about this, but both crypto currencies didn’t change their algorithm despite the increased HashRate and allowed 51% attack.

Mona’s developers were very irresponsible, they didn’t take any action to prevent this. If necessary, I can prove that I was an investor of Hdac. I think, Livecoin is not guilty. For now I will continue to wear Livecoin's signature.

And, i'm so sorry about you. I will share percent of 10% my signature earnings with you, if you can’t solve this.

[bones261]

When the Dayun Zig Z1 was produced for the Lyra2Rev2 algorithm, I was an investor of crypto currency called Hdac that used L2R2 algorithm.

At that time, we warned both Hdac and Monacoin about this, but both crypto currencies didn’t change their algorithm despite the increased HashRate and allowed 51% attack.

Mona’s developers were very irresponsible, they didn’t take any action to prevent this. If necessary, I can prove that I was an investor of Hdac. I think, Livecoin is not guilty. For now I will continue to wear Livecoin's signature.

And, i'm so sorry about you. I will share percent of 10% my signature earnings with you, if you can’t solve this.

     What on Earth are you talking about? Every single POW algorithm is vulnerable to a 51% attack.  Also, that still does not excuse Livecoin from continuing to keep the exchange open for business on an asset that they had a fractional reserve on. Who cares if the Mona development team is somehow at fault. It was obvious that the Monacoin development team was not going to compensate Livecoin for this attack. After over a year, Livecoin should have come up with another solution, so they were no longer insolvent with regards to the Mona asset.  Also, profiting from exchange fees for an asset that may never be directly redeemable, without dumping it at a deep discount, is reprehensible. Furthermore, to add to their problem, they are doing the same thing with the Monero asset. Perhaps they are not as bad as Yobit, but running an exchange this way is not acceptable. Moreover their TOS is bullshit. If I am an unsatisfied customer and I bitch about them, they can just freeze my account and confiscate my assets?
    It's good of you to be willing to donate 10% of your proceeds to the victim. However, Livecoin should make their client as close to whole as possible, not you.