BitMarket.Eu has closed down

[tacoexperience]

Can someone tell me if my thoughts are correct?

Here it goes: If he says that he traded all our BTCs at Bitcoinica, then the BTC address that the outgoing 18,000 BTCs would have gone out from would be the same, right? Or at least there will be very few, right?

For example: I had 34BTC on my address at bitmarket. He would had transferred that to his BTC account, then traded it out.. even if he used few different "wallets" or whatever..

IF this is correct.. then how come he won't give us the address, so we can check on blockchain all the BTC going out..?

Further to that.. because once he lost all the money it then became a ponzi scheme, where he would have to get new BTC coming in to give to people that withdrew their coins, would still have gone through the same address or a new address that he used for the ponzi part?

(if it doesn't make sense, just read it again slowly..)

Just trying to figure it out..

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[mralbi]

i am quite sure the admin messed around with other people's bitcions for quite a while without telling anyone, even after they were already lost and I am also sure that it was not a "single" transaction from his wallet to bitcoinia or so.

But I would be quite sure in the fact that the coins are simply gone and no matter what kind of evidence and criminal investigation we will demand it will not bring any coins back, so my proposal is to "force" him to give up the site and lets start a new project from scratch where he will be "forced" to clean up the mess and implement the features we want to see. I think even after all mess he created he is willing to help cleaning up and we should use this offer

[tacoexperience]

I understand that all of it didn't go in one transaction.. because he has confessed that he was gambling with the coins.. my question is: each coin would have to have gone out from "a" wallet/address.. what is the address of that wallet so we can see the coins going out? It doesn't matter that it was 2 billion transactions.. blockchain should have the record of the money coming off his "pocket"..

Do you know what I mean?

A lot of people post their bitcoins addresses up there for everyone to see.. and it's also all there for everyone to see.. I'm just asking: what is the address so we could see the coins going out?

Hope that makes sense...

[mentore]

if I choose to decide later, this choice does it involve?

-a new questionnaire is done to make a final decision ? or automatically lose all my BTC ?

[mralbi]

well mentore,
no matter what you chose your bitcoins ARE already lost, in that sense yes it it automatic ;-)

I think when you put "decide later" it is interpreted as "some" kind of cooperation, as you did NOT click that you do not want to cooperate. I think you would be contacted separately, but it is assumed that you are not against any restoration plans.

[Bitmarket.eu-victim0815]

What if I chose not to cooperate? Will I still get reimbursement or does it mean, I get nothing and need to go to court?

[mralbi]

if FEW people would chose not to cooperate we could go on with the restoration plan and the non-cooperative persons would be dealt with individually. (Possible solutions: A partial payout,provoking a court case , full payout in Euro where the bitcoins are valued at the time when they were bought or frozen, or whatever, it really depends on the amount of coins frozen and other factors like how much investment capital is available).

If MANY people chose not to cooperate the investors (me and others) would not see any chance to go on with the idea of a restoration plan, as cooperation is required for that (reopening the website etc.) and the "official liquidation" would be required. With current Bitcoin prices of 24 USD it is quite tricky already with FEW people not willing to cooperate.



My opinion on this is clear, i would prefer to reopen and run a site that belongs to "everyone" with frozen coins, separated from the old admin where we have a chance to get coins back. I would not prefer the liquidation, as it is costly, takes long time, is inefficient and we would get a quite small share of the frozen coins, like few percent.

[BCB]

I can see no financial incentive for mralbi and "others" to "invest" in this essentially insolvent, indebted company. But then again this is bitcoin and it doesn't have to make financial sense. You just need a bunch of dumb suckers to buy your scammy plan. Plenty of those types on this forum. This has stunk as a scam from the beginning.

Mrabli are you willing to post personally identifying info?  I can't think of a LEGITIMATE bitcoin business owned and operated anonymously.  

[bitdragon]

I kindly request that you show the pointless transaction details and that you own indeed the from address as you mention. And from my humble understanding of bitcoin, it should be very possible to prove the beneficiary was bitcoinica, not even mentionning the über talented people on this forum which will make it very clear.

Even if you were malicious, you cannot redo the past transactions to suit some kind of show now.

Considering your statement of willing to make things right, it is extremely pertinent and relevant to respond with actions and put the light on and alleviate further concerns.

[mralbi]

Indeed, i do NOT have any financial incentive to invest. With 618 frozen bitcoins i am a victim of the misbehaviour as anyone else. But complaining does not help, i would like to do something.

But, it VERY important for me that the debts are formally separated from the new site and this is why i do NOT want to take over the site but REOPEN it. BUT, it would require cooperation from most people with frozen coins, because i cannot take the site out of the liquidation mass on my own. This is why i would propose this plan to reopen the site where many people CAN be stakeholders. We have some interested persons that would also invest "NEW" money into the site but of course it is by far not enough to pay out high sums.

I am not selling any plan, i do not even profit myself, it just costs MORE of my money, but i HOPE that i have a chance to see part of my frozen coins back in the future. I do not even say that this is a good plan, i just say, this is a better plan than the official liquidation where no one would see anything as everything goes to the lawyers.


As to my person, i would not run the site anonymously. If you need more info about me, just google me,  there is lot of info about me in the internet:

Here is my facebook (feel free to add me to access my "full" profile):
https://www.facebook.com/mralbi

This is my own youtube channel where you can also see me in person and listen to some stupid bitcoin-talk in german:
http://www.youtube.com/channel/UCUTlkLNbn5Y93r5X9F8SBag?feature=watch

This is my xing profile where you can see my "professional" background and where i am working:
https://www.xing.com/profile/Martin_Albert4

and here is my "private" (and indeed outdated) collection of blogs:
mralbi.blogspot.com
mralbihelsinki.blogspot.com
and many more linked from there

[BCB]

M4v3r. Are you able to be as transparent as mrabli?

[mentore]

I would like to get 30% now , but at the same time I want the remaining 70% is invested in the new site ... is that possible?

[mralbi]

well, i dont think this particular option would be possible, since it would be discriminating against the others.

[defxor]

I can see no financial incentive for mralbi and "others" to "invest" in this essentially insolvent, indebted company.

Agreed. While mralbi supplies personal information all posts reads like a bitmarket.eu admin sockpuppet. Even going so far as trying to explain away why we can't see blockchain transactions.

To repeat: If the official story is true there's no reason whatsoever to not show those transactions.

I'm now quite convinced that the official story isn't true, mralbi knows this, and I still believe the best action for bitmarket.eu users as well as for Bitcoin as a whole is to press legal charges.

(It's a clear cut case, the admin has confessed and Dutch jurisdiction will convict)

[mralbi]

lol, I myself don't know anything about if the "official story" is true or not, fullstop. Prove would be nice, if thats possible, but it is at least not MY priority to fiddle around when and how which individual bitcoin was lost.

[SgtSpike]

I find it fascinating that M4v3r is refusing to release the transaction(s) related to the Bitcoinica debacle.  This is indicative of guilt.  I would not be surprised to learn that he took those coins for himself at this point, never gambling with them at Bitcoinica but simply using that as an excuse.  Hopefully he can prove me wrong on that...

[mentore]

my idea is this, I will choose the last option and that means I will choose later ...

regarding my idea is to ask the 30% immediately, and the remaining 70% is returned to me slowly ...

I know that this idea may not be possible, but what happens if I choose the last option, entering my idea?

-immediately lose all my BTC?

-I am given the chance to do it again in the questionnaire?

-choose the last option I can not go back?

-What exactly happens if I choose the last option?



p.s.  You must excuse my English, but I have great difficulties to understand, because I use a simple translator, I hope you help me to understand, please be patient with me

[unixdude]

I find it fascinating that M4v3r is refusing to release the transaction(s) related to the Bitcoinica debacle.  This is indicative of guilt.  I would not be surprised to learn that he took those coins for himself at this point, never gambling with them at Bitcoinica but simply using that as an excuse.  Hopefully he can prove me wrong on that...

Wouldn't surprise me ( no offence intended to M4v3r nothing personal) he was either extremely stupid and naive which is a possibility but what you stated above is more probable since he has not provided proof to the contrary.

I do like bitmarket and prefer it to mt.gox but I am not confident enough to use the site with any large sums of coins while he has  any significant involvement.

I also don't mind waiting to get my on hold balance back - which is the option I chose because this is the best exchange for me personally and I don't want to see it disappear.

[mralbi]

Well, chosing the last option means nothing in particular. It just means you do not demand back your coins immediately (since you did NOT chose the non-cooperation) but on the other hand you cannot be counted as cooperative.

Regarding the question if your coins are immediately lost.... YES! Your coins are ALREADY lost, no matter which option you chose. The question is simply what do you think is the best way out of the mess. Official liquidation or reopening the site under new ownership to pay back coins.


The questionnaire is held only once and the result is taken as of 15.2.2013 as a decision basis which way to go forward. This does not mean that you cannot change your opinion anymore, but there will not be another questionnaire.

[mentore]

if I choose the option of immediate repayment of the 30%? I receive now?