[ANN] Whirlwind.money | ⚡No Fee⚡ | Ultimate Privacy | Anonymity Mining 12% APR🔥

[whirlwindmoney]

I made the following changes today, please let me know if you encounter any other issues. FAQ will be updated to include most questions a new user might have about the service.

Changelog

04.05.2023 08:00:00 PM UTC
-Address input now shows the beginning and end of your address
-Loading screen implemented
-Clearnet stability issues should be solved
-Made changes to network fee system - we will lower the costs to the end user in the next days
-Refresh captcha added for Note too
-Refresh transactions fixed

Well, I got your point. If I'm not mistaken, Notes are very much helpful in breaking the link, and as much time as we delay to withdraw from Notes along with the option to combine Notes and withdraw different amounts. Otherwise, using fast mode with almost instant payout, the process isn't that helpful I think since they can be identified with little effort with some explorer check, as it limits the address, and output to check.
Now, it also makes sense why having different fee would add a little bit extra privacy.

It may appear that this is the case at first glance, but thanks to how the system works both Fast mode and Note mode benefit from being in the same privacy set since no outside observer could tell which mode a user chose. I'll quote again from a different discussion I had in the other thread:

If we didn't have the Notes then I agree, Fast mode would have the same disadvantages as any other mixer. But since outputs from Notes and Fast look exactly the same there is no way for any outside observer to know which mode you used. So Fast mode is as secure as the Notes from a privacy set standpoint. I would still recommend using Notes regardless because they offer the end-user full control over the process.

That's a good point, and one I did not consider. For an external observer using blockchain analysis, then a fast mix appears identical to someone using notes. They can see the deposit being made, but since they don't know if the user is using fast or notes, they are unable to reach any conclusions about the time frame of when the withdrawal will be made or how much will be withdrawn. Both fast and notes users benefit from being in the larger anonymity set provided by the other type of user, and having the different process help to obfuscate what is happening.

For any questions I'm always here.

[whirlwindmoney]

Update -

Clearnet server is getting DDoS'd and is now down for maintenance. Tor version works as usual, so for the next hours please use that instead!

Since we are at the beginning I don't worry too much about the uptime for the Clearnet service, I'd rather take the time and make multiple adjustments to the proprietary DDoS protection until I get it right instead of using Cloudflare or any 3rd party.

[LeGaulois]

Update -

Clearnet server is getting DDoS'd and is now down for maintenance.

After only 1 week! That's was fast  

I'm joking, but I know it's not funny.
I guess some tumblers are not happy to see you in the industry. The positive is they're "afraid" and you're on the right road.

[AbuBhakar]

Update -

Clearnet server is getting DDoS'd and is now down for maintenance. Tor version works as usual, so for the next hours please use that instead!

Since we are at the beginning I don't worry too much about the uptime for the Clearnet service, I'd rather take the time and make multiple adjustments to the proprietary DDoS protection until I get it right instead of using Cloudflare or any 3rd party.

In an event when I deposit already money on the mixing address provided while the Ddos attack occur. Will the mixing process continue or the service will temporarily pause and resume once the update completed. I successfully mix already in the fast. I just notice that my deposit needs to have 2 confirmation before mixing will commence based on the set time and a problem like this might occur on this period. Clearnet version is always available whenever I’m visiting the mixer.

[Little Mouse]

It may appear that this is the case at first glance, but thanks to how the system works both Fast mode and Note mode benefit from being in the same privacy set since no outside observer could tell which mode a user chose. I'll quote again from a different discussion I had in the other thread:

Thanks for the explanation. I got your point and things are clear now. We just need to use the mixer in a little complicated way so it becomes harder to trace the link. Once a lot of people will start using whirlwind, it will be harder for someone to trace. Thanks a lot.

In an event when I deposit already money on the mixing address provided while the Ddos attack occur. Will the mixing process continue or the service will temporarily pause and resume once the update completed. I successfully mix already in the fast. I just notice that my deposit needs to have 2 confirmation before mixing will commence based on the set time and a problem like this might occur on this period. Clearnet version is always available whenever I’m visiting the mixer.

If you are using Fast mode and have assigned/set everything accordingly, you have nothing to worry about. Your BTC will arrive at your desired address at your pre-set desired time/delay time. This means the mixing process will continue for sure.

[whirlwindmoney]

In an event when I deposit already money on the mixing address provided while the Ddos attack occur. Will the mixing process continue or the service will temporarily pause and resume once the update completed. I successfully mix already in the fast. I just notice that my deposit needs to have 2 confirmation before mixing will commence based on the set time and a problem like this might occur on this period. Clearnet version is always available whenever I’m visiting the mixer.

There is no issue in case you deposit during a DDoS attack or at any other point really. If you made it to the step where you receive the deposit address from us you have nothing to worry about. Even if the the whole backend goes offline after you deposited, the system will automatically process the withdrawals afterwards, so worst case scenario there might be a 1-2 hours delay in case we are doing maintenance.

Also a few other things I've seen on the forum that I want to address, I will make it clear on the website too when I update the FAQ:

-You can withdraw as many times as you want from a single Note, you don't have to spend its whole balance at once.
-The 24 hour limit for deposit addresses is only valid if you didn't send any transaction to it yet. If you sent it during the first 24 hours, but it's stuck because of congestion, it will still be processed automatically whenever it's confirmed.
-We do not use Cloudflare or any 3rd party for ddos protection, it's our own proprietary system.

After only 1 week! That's was fast  

I'm joking, but I know it's not funny.
I guess some tumblers are not happy to see you in the industry. The positive is they're "afraid" and you're on the righ road.

I see this as a very good sign, very early indeed. I was expecting it though so no issues from my side, I just need a bit more time to arrive at a more permanent setup but it will be done.

Thanks for the explanation. I got your point and things are clear now. We just need to use the mixer in a little complicated way so it becomes harder to trace the link. Once a lot of people will start using whirlwind, it will be harder for someone to trace. Thanks a lot.

If you have other questions let me know! I think that after about 500-1000 deposits it will already be close to impossible to link transactions (beyond any doubt), just consider how challenging it would be to do it after we have 10,000 deposits or more for example.

but if it happens then I'll be obliged to look for ways to offer what they want while not making compromises on privacy.

It's impossible for a fungibility-preserving service to comply with anti-fungibility. And you also can't offer such thing without compromising privacy; AML score is without doubt resulted from the ability to trace the coin's origins. If you want low risk, you need to provide low quality product.

To avoid derailing this thread, if you want to respond, quote me on your ANN service thread.

Consider the existing services that offer this: you send them the funds -> they send you funds back from centralized exchanges. In our case it would look like this: you deposit the funds using Note/Fast -> they get sent to the same pool as all other deposits so you benefit from exactly the same privacy-> when you withdraw you receive funds back from centralized exchanges instead of the normal pool. So it's the same but you'd have the added privacy benefits of using our system.

I gave this a good thought and I don't think it's worth it to even attempt to offer this service, even though it's definitely possible and it would bring a lot of users. I believe that in the current form Whirlwind does nothing illegal, and if we were to offer that service this won't be valid anymore and I don't think this risk is worth it.

[JollyGood]

I have no idea how I managed to overlook this when I tested the Whirlwind website for my review.

There is no mention of this in the changelog so was that feature always there from day one since the Whirlwind website went live? I cannot understand how I missed that part of the functionality where multiple withdrawals of varying amounts can be made from a single Note. This was one of two recommendations I made in my review but it was there and somehow I missed it during my testing for my review.

Also a few other things I've seen on the forum that I want to address, I will make it clear on the website too when I update the FAQ:

-You can withdraw as many times as you want from a single Note, you don't have to spend its whole balance at once.

[whirlwindmoney]

I have no idea how I managed to overlook this when I tested the Whirlwind website for my review.

There is no mention of this in the changelog so was that feature always there from day one since the Whirlwind website went live? I cannot understand how I missed that part of the functionality where multiple withdrawals of varying amounts can be made from a single Note. This was one of two recommendations I made in my review but it was there and somehiow I missed it during my testing for my review.

This feature was there from day one, it's actually one of the strongest selling points of Whirlwind. You could deposit 1BTC today and get a Note, withdraw 0.1BTC tomorrow and the rest during the next 3 months in 0.01BTC increments daily. There are no time limitations/ maximum number of withdrawals from a Note or anything really, so you are in full control over the process. This makes it impossible for outside observers to link your transactions beyond any doubt.

It's also very important to keep in mind that since Fast and Note outputs are identical, Fast mode is as secure as the Notes from a privacy standpoint. Even if for example you deposit 0.1BTC using Fast mode, and withdraw everything (0.1BTC - fee) to a single address 1 hour later, it might seem like it's easy to link the 2 transactions, but it's merely an illusion. That output could have originated from any deposit.

The fact that you didn't know these things is definitely not your fault, I'm guessing most people in here are not yet aware. I should have done a better job explaining all these details, but everything will become clear after some more time of receiving and answering questions and concerns.

Update
-Clearnet is back online with improved DDoS protection and stability
-Added "You can withdraw as many times as you want from a single Note." on the Withdraw Note page
-Added "All deposits made within 24 hours will be considered valid, regardless if they are still pending or confirmed." on the Deposit page

[LeGaulois]

...Just crossposting...

For information, it's a very very low percentage. To make a comparison, Chipmixer was at ~30% IIRC

 

I used the same tool used by small and medium companies such as Gate.io, LocalBitcoins, to comply with international regulations. It checks wallets and transactions for "dirty money" with several databases such as Crystal

With the Fast option

[Agbe]

I have not used any mixer to mix coin but I have been seen them in the forum since from Chipmixer campaign. So when Whirlwind.money (bitcoin mixer), I tried to mix coins and at first the site was not opening in the browser and from other users direction I used Tor Network (onion browser) to access the site and when I visited the site, I was thinking that I would signed up and login to process the mixing but little did I know, there was no such of sign up and sign in. All what I saw was deposit and withdraw, and I became wondering what to do. When I click the deposit, there were two options. Fast and Note. It became more complicated.

Therefore, I would want OP to guide me in a simple way to mix coin. And I believed this guide will help a lot of people who are new like me in the mixing sites to start mixing.

[whirlwindmoney]

I'm working on a big update that will be live sometimes in the next 24 hours. During this time the service may experience some downtime, but you can safely use it whenever it's working. I apologise in advance for any withdrawal delays that may happen.

I will update the changelog as soon as I'm done and I will explain the decision I made, for now I only have 1 thing to say, 0% fees are on the way!

I have not used any mixer to mix coin but I have been seen them in the forum since from Chipmixer campaign. So when Whirlwind.money (bitcoin mixer), I tried to mix coins and at first the site was not opening in the browser and from other users direction I used Tor Network (onion browser) to access the site and when I visited the site, I was thinking that I would signed up and login to process the mixing but little did I know, there was no such of sign up and sign in. All what I saw was deposit and withdraw, and I became wondering what to do. When I click the deposit, there were two options. Fast and Note. It became more complicated.

Therefore, I would want OP to guide me in a simple way to mix coin. And I believed this guide will help a lot of people who are new like me in the mixing sites to start mixing.

After the update the FAQ should contain answers to most of the questions you may have, but if you're still unsure contact me in DM or email and I'll guide you.

[LeGaulois]

I was thinking that I would signed up and login to process the mixing but little did I know, there was no such of sign up and sign in.

You don't need to create an account to mix your bitcoins. Hence no sign up option or something like that.
It works like this for any mixer...

I became wondering what to do. When I click the deposit, there were two options. Fast and Note. It became more complicated.

uh. A teennager can use it. There is nothing complicated and everything is explained in the FAQ. As for this question on what to do:

To use the "Fast" option



To use the "Notes" option




and if you trully need more
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5447322.0

[whirlwindmoney]

Changelog

04.09.2023 00:00:00 AM UTC
-Fee is now optional and will be treated as a donation, you can choose any amount between 0% and 4%
-Withdraw fee for each output address was lowered by another 25% from 0.0001BTC to 0.000075BTC
-Most of clearnet stability issues solved - still actively monitoring and testing
-Frontend responsive on mobile
-Backend-signers connection issues solved (the reason some withdrawals were delayed)
-FAQ updated

Update completed - everything is back online working in normal conditions | Please keep in mind that if you experience issues with the Clearnet version it's most likely because of our DDoS protection system, I am still tweaking it while we are under attack continuously. I'll sort it out without a doubt but it takes some time to do that, so until everything is set please use the Tor version if you experience any issues on Clearnet, that will most likely work without any issues at all.

I am working on displaying the anonymity set on the main page for each one of your selected outputs (number of deposits it could have originated from), so users know exactly how anonymous their bitcoin really is after using our service. I still feel like most users are not yet aware of how Whirlwind actually works and why it's the superior choice from a privacy perspective, so understanding what anonymity set means and seeing it grow each time you enter the website should make it easier for everyone to grasp the concept. It's just a matter of time until everyone gets used to the system and understands the undeniable advantages it offers.

I believe the decision to make the fees optional is wise for 2 reasons:
1. The only disadvantage of Whirlwind's mechanism is that at the start of the service the privacy set is weak due to the fact that there are few deposits. Making the fees optional should encourage more users to give the service a try, and by doing this they are helping all future users by increasing the anonymity set, making everything more secure.
2. A donation based business model was already proven to work before

The current plan is to leave the fees optional indefinitely, but if we won't generate enough revenue to be sustainable after the first 3 months we will have to implement a minimum fee again.

I'll answer any question or concern you might have!

[cremole10]

I have emailed twice about an issue with no response. I can't PM cause whirlwindmoney has disabled PMs from newbies. Help please.

I replied to your email a few minutes ago - please check.

Thank you so much.

I pasted in an address in my clipboard for a withdrawal without checking (I know I know!) and it was not the address I thought it was. Emailed the owner and he sorted it out for me so I did not lose my coins, even though the issue was all my fault. Lesson to everyone to make sure you save the guarantee letter in case you make a stupid mistake like me!

[JollyGood]

If your clearnet website has been under almost continuous DDoS then most probably the only beneficiaries from would be competitors. You have only recently launched your business and it has already been coming under sustained DDoS.

From a business perspective, having any donation based as a sole source of income at the core is something not recommended, while many have succeeded many have not ( and I am not referring to wider business not mixers).

As you have increased the optional fee to 0% it should act as a mechanism for users to increase anonymity as they mix in greater numbers increasing deposits but with that being said I would expect the subsequent 3 months of trading to bring you very little (if any) income via transaction fees.

Changelog

04.09.2023 00:00:00 AM UTC
-Fee is now optional and will be treated as a donation, you can choose any amount between 0% and 4%
-Withdraw fee for each output address was lowered by another 25% from 0.0001BTC to 0.000075BTC
-Most of clearnet stability issues solved - still actively monitoring and testing
-Frontend responsive on mobile
-Backend-signers connection issues solved (the reason some withdrawals were delayed)
-FAQ updated

Update completed - everything is back online working in normal conditions | Please keep in mind that if you experience issues with the Clearnet version it's most likely because of our DDoS protection system, I am still tweaking it while we are under attack continuously. I'll sort it out without a doubt but it takes some time to do that, so until everything is set please use the Tor version if you experience any issues on Clearnet, that will most likely work without any issues at all.

I am working on displaying the anonymity set on the main page for each one of your selected outputs (number of deposits it could have originated from), so users know exactly how anonymous their bitcoin really is after using our service. I still feel like most users are not yet aware of how Whirlwind actually works and why it's the superior choice from a privacy perspective, so understanding what anonymity set means and seeing it grow each time you enter the website should make it easier for everyone to grasp the concept. It's just a matter of time until everyone gets used to the system and understands the undeniable advantages it offers.

I believe the decision to make the fees optional is wise for 2 reasons:
1. The only disadvantage of Whirlwind's mechanism is that at the start of the service the privacy set is weak due to the fact that there are few deposits. Making the fees optional should encourage more users to give the service a try, and by doing this they are helping all future users by increasing the anonymity set, making everything more secure.
2. A donation based business model was already proven to work before

The current plan is to leave the fees optional indefinitely, but if we won't generate enough revenue to be sustainable after the first 3 months we will have to implement a minimum fee again.

I'll answer any question or concern you might have!

[whirlwindmoney]

If your clearnet website has been under almost continuous DDoS then most probably the only beneficiaries from would be competitors. You have only recently launched your business and it has already been coming under sustained DDoS.

From a business perspective, having any donation based as a sole source of income at the core is something not recommended, while many have succeeded many have not ( and I am not referring to wider business not mixers).

As you have increased the optional fee to 0% it should act as a mechanism for users to increase anonymity as they mix in greater numbers increasing deposits but with that being said I would expect the subsequent 3 months of trading to bring you very little (if any) income via transaction fees.

There is only one way to find out if the optional fee could work and that is to try it out for a while. 3 months is a decent timeframe and should be more than enough to convince ourselves if this is viable or not,  and even if it's not the money would not be wasted as profits are not the only goal of this trial.

At worst after 3 months we lost a bit of money, but the anonymity set and security of the entire service will be so strong that there won't be a single reason that would make it worth it for someone to use a competitor instead of us. You would get provable and undeniably better privacy at a much lower price.

[Agbe]

If your clearnet website has been under almost continuous DDoS then most probably the only beneficiaries from would be competitors. You have only recently launched your business and it has already been coming under sustained DDoS.

Exactly, this is what I also thought of. There are many mixers that are in the globe at large and the forum in particular. But the activeness and the services rendered by the mixer will determine the number of visitors in the mixing site. If the Op site engineers are experts of developing site, they can be working while the site is running, what they have to do is to work on the the backup file either in HTML code or the software backup and when they have finished the additional information then they upload it without shutting the site down. Shutting down a site for maintenance is not a good idea. Work anything you want to add behind the scene and add it up. That is my little contribution to OP.

[nioctib_100]

Going to need to update the signatures to reflect the 0% fee now! A 0% fee is a huge draw over other more traditional mixers, and the word needs to get out there that Whirlwind has a 0% fee vs. the current .25 - 4% fee detailed in the current signatures.

[whirlwindmoney]

Going to need to update the signatures to reflect the 0% fee now! A 0% fee is a huge draw over other more traditional mixers, and the word needs to get out there that Whirlwind has a 0% fee vs. the current .25 - 4% fee detailed in the current signatures.

Thank you for the suggestion! It's already WIP, jayce was away for Easter until today.

Latest service update:

Changelog

04.10.2023 00:02:00 AM UTC
-Anonymity set is now displayed on the website
-DDoS protection parameters adjusted, clearnet should be more stable now
-Edited menu and footer

[NotATether]

If your clearnet website has been under almost continuous DDoS then most probably the only beneficiaries from would be competitors. You have only recently launched your business and it has already been coming under sustained DDoS.

Why the hell have all mixers gone under DDoS attacks these days?

There must be a mixer grinch lurking about here.