NEM (XEM) Official Thread - 100% New Code - Easy To Use APIs

[nembit86]

I am leaning towards agreeing with everyone that this discussion should probably just be left alone. It seems like there are quite a few who do think we should change the total amount of coins, but I think that decision will ultimately undermine investor confidence, at least in the short-term. Long term, it really could go either way, but I think that the effects would be so minimal that risking short-term investor confidence is too much of a risk for a very minimal long-term gain (if any).

After thinking about it carefully for a significant amount of time since this discussion came about, I have come to the conclusion that the risk to reward ratio for this decision is simply not good enough for me to be able to support any changes.

Have you heard about the changes in companies' shares in stock markets? They usually come suddenly and then you have been given a letter, a notification that each share is splitted into 8 (for example).
In such case the value of the owner's shares is the same, but the amount of shares has increased, not doubled but 8 times.

I think that the investors do understand this kind of changes. No one has eaten his words 

crypto markets are rarely, if ever logical and most of the counterintuitive. Even though the change would have no effect on the value of stakes, can you really trust such an illogical and irrational market to make the logical and rational choice to ignore such a change?

There just doesn't seem to be enough gained from such a change to warrant making it. Like Amy said the risk:return ratio just isn't good enough for us to go ahead with this..

Why risk having a number that Asians consider unlucky or deadly? They are quite superstitious ,at least in my experience . If something negative were to happen however small they might be more likely to stay away. Isnt it a good thing that we are taking Asian beliefs , superstition and psychology into account ? Its respectful.

Now as long as we have plenty coins to cover a fantastic future does it really matter how many there are?
I will say again that Nemstakes are not a true representation of value as at the moment they fall under certain parameters and that price is not something to worry about.

If anything the change to coin amount would bring increased news coverage and interest.

[DarkhorseofNxt]

Superstition. Really NEM?

[nutildah]

I agree with the devs and community leaders present: changing the number of coins now would be silly. especially to meet the demands of a superstition.

[lordoliver]

cmon just burn one and its fine. I will do it with one of mine if you feel better then..

[DarkhorseofNxt]

I will burn mine just to "please" everyone.

[xtester]

NEM 6th newsletter is out: https://medium.com/@xtester/nem-newsletter-6-2014-10-19-6cc2c2cc99be

Enjoy! 

Some minor changes have been added to the newsletter.

[amytheplanarshift]

I am leaning towards agreeing with everyone that this discussion should probably just be left alone. It seems like there are quite a few who do think we should change the total amount of coins, but I think that decision will ultimately undermine investor confidence, at least in the short-term. Long term, it really could go either way, but I think that the effects would be so minimal that risking short-term investor confidence is too much of a risk for a very minimal long-term gain (if any).

After thinking about it carefully for a significant amount of time since this discussion came about, I have come to the conclusion that the risk to reward ratio for this decision is simply not good enough for me to be able to support any changes.

Have you heard about the changes in companies' shares in stock markets? They usually come suddenly and then you have been given a letter, a notification that each share is splitted into 8 (for example).
In such case the value of the owner's shares is the same, but the amount of shares has increased, not doubled but 8 times.

I think that the investors do understand this kind of changes. No one has eaten his words  

crypto markets are rarely, if ever logical and most of the counterintuitive. Even though the change would have no effect on the value of stakes, can you really trust such an illogical and irrational market to make the logical and rational choice to ignore such a change?

There just doesn't seem to be enough gained from such a change to warrant making it. Like Amy said the risk:return ratio just isn't good enough for us to go ahead with this..

Why risk having a number that Asians consider unlucky or deadly? They are quite superstitious ,at least in my experience . If something negative were to happen however small they might be more likely to stay away. Isnt it a good thing that we are taking Asian beliefs , superstition and psychology into account ? Its respectful.

Now as long as we have plenty coins to cover a fantastic future does it really matter how many there are?
I will say again that Nemstakes are not a true representation of value as at the moment they fall under certain parameters and that price is not something to worry about.

If anything the change to coin amount would bring increased news coverage and interest.

The superstition is real, which is why I had to really think about this for a while. And of course it is good to take the concerns of other cultures into account, especially when we are dealing with something intended for use by everyone around the globe.

However, the more I thought about it the more I realized that this is really not even a discussion worth having. Mainly because even though the supply will be 4 billion, this is only in the beginning. The total supply will not be 4 billion for very long, considering it is inevitable that some NEM will be burned for one thing or another. Therefore, to change the original plan simply so we can have something other than 4 billion in the beginning seems like a drastic measure simply to accommodate a superstition that likely will not make much of a difference in any real world scenario.

Again, I live in Asia so I am very familiar with the superstition; but, the more I think about it, the more I think nobody is really going to care and the risk of making any changes to the original plan at this point after nearly a year of nobody caring is just too high, in my opinion.

Also, I know to those of you who are not very familiar with this uniquely Asian superstition this sounds even more silly, but please understand that sometimes things that may seem strange or insignificant to one culture could be vastly important in another. So, I am glad that we are having this discussion but in the end I think we will probably be just fine with 4 billion.

[xtester]

I also think the number discussion is heading the wrong direction. This is a small matter, let's keep it simple. If you really want to be sensible and do something, well, you can burn some NEM and solve the problem. It's done.

[cryptofutureis]

Nem will be the new better nxt

No NEM will be the new better BTC

[arniebaby]

Nem will be the new better nxt

No NEM will be the new better BTC

No nem will be the New better global economic system that once and for all takes the power from the banksters.

There, thats what this is all about, putting people back in control instead of being at the mercy of heartless global financial institutions who charge us for the pleasure of giving us access to our own cash and demand we explain how and where we got it when we want to use it. It's not just about speculating on the value of pretend money to make a quick profit!! Hopefully.

[TaunSew]

Nem will be the new better nxt

No NEM will be the new better BTC

Digital currencies is a good concept which has garnered a lot of media and government attention.  Dropbox has a larger capitalization than Bitcoin and I don't see governments addressing it.

Bitcoin is only 500K-2M users.  The internet back in 1989 had more users.  We are still in the innovator stage.  Good concept but I question the execution as I'm not seeing the userbase expansion.  The social media and search engine were good concepts but it took years for alternatives to emerge who knew what they were doing.

Digital currencies will likely be $Trillions someday and NEM could be the front runner or one of the runner ups.

[KimNg]

4 billion has been advertised from the beginning and changing it now so close to launch may not produce the desired results.

The handout states NEM will be created with a maximum of 4 billion units, divisible to 6 digits. 4 billion/0.000001 is 4 x 10^15 units.
Bitcoin's satoshis is 10^-8 BTC units. 21 million/0.00000001 is 2.1 x 10^15 units.
In this area, NEM already has the advantage, 4 quadrillion is more than enough to accommodate a global economy.

The unregulated derivatives market isn't even that big. http://moneymorning.com/2014/10/01/taking-profits-in-a-1-5-quadrillion-bubble/



In the Chinese culture, 4 is an unfortunate number and 8 is a fortunate number. Multiplying our coin supply by a factor of two is a little on the
extreme side, especially on the basis of this superstition. I can see more analytic and logical minds being interested in NEM, not the superstitious
types. I like the idea of burning 1 NEM to remove the "bad" 4. It is a good compromise and the simplest solution. When generating the NEMesis
block the devs can burn that 1 NEM, then marketing can advertise that at the birth of NEM exactly 3,999,999,999 coins were created.

If we want to take that a step further, burning 2 NEM would give us 3,999,999,998 with a "lucky" 8 at the end, or burning 112 NEM would give us
3,999,999,888 with the "lucky" 888 at the end.

Even though doubling the amount of the coin supply will double the market capitalization, the effect is that it may lower it's worth. 8 billion means
greater abundance and 4 billion means greater scarcity. A lower coin supply may be perceived as more valuable. There are many factors that will
influence the value, but ultimately NEM's valuation will be determined by the concept of supply and demand.

[dandruff1138]

Nem will be the new better nxt

No NEM will be the new better BTC

I hope it will be a better nxt so I can get NXT client off my PC, this shit is a hog and needsa to DL a new blockchain all the R%^@#%$ time haha,,,

[Momimaus]

Nem will be the new better nxt

No NEM will be the new better BTC

I hope it will be a better nxt so I can get NXT client off my PC, this shit is a hog and needsa to DL a new blockchain all the R%^@#%$ time haha,,,

NXT is awesome, stop this shit. No need to compare NEM to any coin, especially not the bigger brother.

[solix]

On the money number thing:

You know this is a game of hearts and minds if you want adoption. Anything to that end is probably not a bad idea. Burning a few you still get the rounding issue. Who the heck is going to enunciate the whole string? Folks will say "about 4 billion", face it.

If this is a static / variable constant in a line of code, ya know... I can't imagine our devs would hard code values all over their code.

The downside I can see is the turmoil of "armchair engineering" and on the fly changes that would spook long term investors. The net net of course ought to be that you end up with the same % regardless of the number of units. The thing is so divisible up or down it seems silly to fixate on a fixed ratio.

I think it is a matter of your vision. If your vision is global adoption, be mindful of your audience at all turns, especially in a potential like Asia. That is a very long term view. If your view is that you don't want anything to destabilize the currency and send it in to a permanent spiral never to return to the depths of penny stocks and the like, then the view of irrational decisions being dangerous is probably also a reasonable view, albeit maybe more short term. The crypto world is fickle that is for sure. Success can be viral at such early stages, as can demise.

Will the average "joe" on the street give a crap about what the market cap of the currency they use is? Does the average "joe" even know what a market cap is? Does the average person today even have an idea how much circulation their bank notes have within an order of magnitude error? I bet not. I don't know...

[Trishula]

NEM has been a wild roller coaster of amusement and joy for me, i appreciate you guys very much.

[amytheplanarshift]

NEM has been a wild roller coaster of amusement and joy for me, i appreciate you guys very much.

We appreciate you too.
 
NEM -- Bringing Amusement and Joy to Personal Finance (TM)

[dandruff1138]

Nem will be the new better nxt

No NEM will be the new better BTC

I hope it will be a better nxt so I can get NXT client off my PC, this shit is a hog and needsa to DL a new blockchain all the R%^@#%$ time haha,,,

NXT is awesome, stop this shit. No need to compare NEM to any coin, especially not the bigger brother.

My comment was made in jest relax!

[nembit86]

On the money number thing:

You know this is a game of hearts and minds if you want adoption. Anything to that end is probably not a bad idea. Burning a few you still get the rounding issue. Who the heck is going to enunciate the whole string? Folks will say "about 4 billion", face it.

If this is a static / variable constant in a line of code, ya know... I can't imagine our devs would hard code values all over their code.

The downside I can see is the turmoil of "armchair engineering" and on the fly changes that would spook long term investors. The net net of course ought to be that you end up with the same % regardless of the number of units. The thing is so divisible up or down it seems silly to fixate on a fixed ratio.

I think it is a matter of your vision. If your vision is global adoption, be mindful of your audience at all turns, especially in a potential like Asia. That is a very long term view. If your view is that you don't want anything to destabilize the currency and send it in to a permanent spiral never to return to the depths of penny stocks and the like, then the view of irrational decisions being dangerous is probably also a reasonable view, albeit maybe more short term. The crypto world is fickle that is for sure. Success can be viral at such early stages, as can demise.

Will the average "joe" on the street give a crap about what the market cap of the currency they use is? Does the average "joe" even know what a market cap is? Does the average person today even have an idea how much circulation their bank notes have within an order of magnitude error? I bet not. I don't know...

a good read....keep postin' mate.........

[nzminer]

OK, im lost here, i hold a NEMstake on the NXT AE.
Do i have to claim my stake now?
I dont have a NEM address, as ive only got the test NEM account on my computer.