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Author Topic: [XMR] Monero Speculation  (Read 3200390 times)
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explorer
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March 15, 2018, 10:58:16 PM
 #37421

If the ASIC miners were mining for quick profit they may have consumed a lot of buy pressure the last 6 months by selling as they mined it
If more "holder types" mine Monero after the fork  it could change the price a bit, less than 5 XMR reward for each block now. The asics could have been taking up to half of available mined coins


<5 XMR and dropping faster.  And faster.  I think a lot (most?) don't understand the XMR emission curve...
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March 15, 2018, 11:03:00 PM
 #37422

If the ASIC miners were mining for quick profit they may have consumed a lot of buy pressure the last 6 months by selling as they mined it
If more "holder types" mine Monero after the fork  it could change the price a bit, less than 5 XMR reward for each block now. The asics could have been taking up to half of available mined coins

Or they hodled their monero with plan to pump it like bitmain did with bitcoin cash and then pasted their bags to others to keep them for long period of time...Really currious to know how many xmr was mined with those asics,anyone did the math already?

Without looking anything up,

100 days x 24 hours x 30 blocks/hr x 5 XMR=360 000

I'm on a boat, with too many distractions, so that may be fucked up...

Damn, there went my last paper wallet overboard!   Now see what you've done!
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March 15, 2018, 11:06:52 PM
 #37423

Monero is a cryptocurrency who really cares about privacy. I believe in the long term that it will be much more valuable than the present. It's the right time to buy Monero.
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March 15, 2018, 11:13:23 PM
Merited by Anon136 (1)
 #37424

Monero is good because people like privacy and privacy is good.  A good coin is private so this is good.
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March 15, 2018, 11:23:28 PM
 #37425

Monero is good because people like privacy and privacy is good.  A good coin is private so this is good.

Cheesy

Rep Thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=381041
If one can not confer upon another a right which he does not himself first possess, by what means does the state derive the right to engage in behaviors from which the public is prohibited?
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March 15, 2018, 11:40:32 PM
Merited by Globb0 (2)
 #37426

A nice picture from the net:


.BitDice.               ▄▄███▄▄
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[/]
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March 16, 2018, 12:33:37 AM
 #37427

A nice picture from the net:



If that's for real... Then the 2 ledgers I bought waiting for this moment can see some use soon...

Delicious!

我想要火箭和火车
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March 16, 2018, 12:36:25 AM
Last edit: March 16, 2018, 01:03:01 AM by kurious
 #37428

Brilliant.
Thanks for all the replies (and friendly PMs too...what a lovely bunch you are!).

So, does this airdrop thing mean I'm suddenly going to have a huge pile of coins appear from nowhere (ala BCH)...I imagine not since this would have pushed demand and the price wouldn't be going south.

Anyway, I'll keep HODLing and try not to get too depressed looking at teh charts.

Hey nano... good to see you back, and yep - keep the faith.  Hope it's not been too chilly up there for you?

Ok - with fears of a crypto winter possibly in force, alts are taking a beating all round, but a shakeout only means the cream will rise.

The airdrop was (temporarily?) pulled - got too much (justified) flak for looking decidedly iffy.  Sure, airdrop junkies probably did push things up and then drag it down, but XMR's fundamentals are as good as ever.  Keep calm and wait - Monero isn't going anywhere but up. 

It's a real coin, no ICO, no dev premine, real community, real use cases and as always... vastly superior tech.  Dash fared far worse, as you will probably have noted - Monero even pipped their market cap a week ago and I am sure will soon do so permanently.

And best of all - the real deal?  True privacy matters - it's precious.  You know it. So IMHO... hodl and be patient.  No one who has been around here for a while is remotely worried, nor should you be. 

我想要火箭和火车
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March 16, 2018, 01:56:23 AM
 #37429



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Monero
"I just opened a 2004 barolo in your and all the devs honour"  eyejay:  Decemeber 22nd, 2016

"Don't buy Monero, join our new ICO: 'The Monero Enterprise Alliance"  fluffypony:  May 24th, 2017
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March 16, 2018, 02:11:44 AM
 #37430

Did you guys realize that we are THE top thread in altcoin speculation? Take a look https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?board=224.0;sort=replies;desc Not just a little bit. By a fucking mile. 37k replies to 8k runner up. Shocked

It's easy to forget. Smiley

Brilliant.
Thanks for all the replies (and friendly PMs too...what a lovely bunch you are!).

So, does this airdrop thing mean I'm suddenly going to have a huge pile of coins appear from nowhere (ala BCH)...I imagine not since this would have pushed demand and the price wouldn't be going south.

Anyway, I'll keep HODLing and try not to get too depressed looking at teh charts.

Meh, we all know the charts change with the wind. Tongue

I didn't hedge XMR specifically. I hedged my whole crypto portfolio in a way by selling my bitcoin when it started falling hard and putting in a stop order at the price that I sold it at. So worst case scenario, if it stops falling and going back up the exchange will automatically buy it back at the same price that I sold. No fancy contracts or anything. I cant even get on bitfinex being an american. Either way though it makes me feel so much less stressed about both the decline in bitcoin and monero.

Thanks for the precision. So if I understand correctly you simply:

1- hodl when you think it will go up
2- sell your coins and buy them back (if they return to previous level) when you think it will go down
advantage = you don't lose if the coin never recovers. You can still change your buy order if you think the coin bottomed
?

I thought you were opening short positions which is common on FOREX. I have searched for solutions but I never found a cheap/convenient way to do that with cryptocurrencies.

I would recommend to never short XMR, it's real easy way to lose, when it spikes it will smack you every time. In the long run you will do much better holding, even longing is dangerous.

...
Also, unrelated, apparently halong had one too:
https://twitter.com/HalongMining/status/974189005712576512?s=19

Vaporware me thinks. Smiley

10x airdrop, >5% premine


so extrapolating, 5%*10=50% (it says greater than too  Shocked)

a dev pre mine of half the size of monero in total.
[Garbage Image}


This sounds about right, excellent representation but I think this shot may be more representative (hint: where's waldo).



If the ASIC miners were mining for quick profit they may have consumed a lot of buy pressure the last 6 months by selling as they mined it
If more "holder types" mine Monero after the fork  it could change the price a bit, less than 5 XMR reward for each block now. The asics could have been taking up to half of available mined coins


2True, I think we all knew this was going on just from the hash rate increase.

Without looking anything up,

100 days x 24 hours x 30 blocks/hr x 5 XMR=360 000

I'm on a boat, with too many distractions, so that may be fucked up...

Damn, there went my last paper wallet overboard!   Now see what you've done!

Just Lol...




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March 16, 2018, 09:47:24 AM
 #37431

Next week the G20 is coming up and they will also talk about crypto. As stated in the public document of the G20(: https://back-g20.argentina.gob.ar/sites/default/files/media/finance_ministerial_highlights.pdf) they understand that crypto has the potential to promote financial inclusion but at the same time they will try to analyse implications to financial stability, tax evasion and financing illegal activities. These statements are nothing new and very similar to what was said previously at the US senate hearings.

Could this have implications on Monero?
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March 16, 2018, 12:29:41 PM
 #37432

...so let me get this right.

The biggest claim with regards to monerov being a scam are that they are having people enter their private key in a closed source wallet?

Correct me if I'm wrong what what's the harm in waiting for an open source one?

Also, being given the option to sell/monetize personal transaction histories at will en masse seems like a major opportunity I would think?

The biggest concern for Monero is the potential damage of privacy via an on chain fork that requires private key use to claim an airdrop. Private key reuse is a new-ish attack vector on the network.

My guess is that they could care less whether or not its a scam.
However, claims regarding a scam revolve around the unknown team, closed source software, 10x airdrop, >5% premine, questionable claims on finite supply, coin serves a duplicate or unknown purpose and despite being made aware how their on chain fork damages the privacy of both networks they're moving forward.

It will be interesting to see who or if any exchange supports them.

Wouldn't the potential 'damage to privacy' claim necessarily be dependent on whether or not the pk is actually shared publicly, or rather with someone collecting many? Is it being implied that a closed source wallet would automatically upload your private keys to some tla database is a little much I think. Especially if anyone is running Windows, operating over a WiFi connection, etc... I mean chances are they already got the data if they want it.

So aside from that, the concern i can discern would be more toward an unaffiliated third party (utp) like a marketing agency having the ability to monetize transaction data, if they obtained the private key of a wallet through this means. Alternatively, the tax man could also purchase such data from the utp. For one - there are a series of legal precedents that need to be considered before that could happen which I haven't had much thought on, and have not read much.

Over the next few months, monerov and it's affilitates (provided this isn't some elaborate scalping) will be filling this role. From there onwards, others may likely do the same.

My point here is that regardless of what monerov is doing now - years down the line what's stopping literally anyone from forking monero and actually releasing a closed source wallet with published capacity to add your pk to a database and use said information for whatever purpose they wish? What if some utp decides to put up a market peg of a million dollars bid in exchange for as many pk's as will fill the order?
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March 16, 2018, 02:39:08 PM
 #37433

Just finished Reading my Financial magazine ( same magazine that advised me to buy Monero ) said we could see higher usd prices but if we keep going down, we could see 80 , even 16 usd by year end... this actually scares me a bit.
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March 16, 2018, 02:47:50 PM
 #37434

Just finished Reading my Financial magazine ( same magazine that advised me to buy Monero ) said we could see higher usd prices but if we keep going down, we could see 80 , even 16 usd by year end... this actually scares me a bit.

All that and $400 bitcoin. 
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March 16, 2018, 02:48:56 PM
 #37435

Just finished Reading my Financial magazine ( same magazine that advised me to buy Monero ) said we could see higher usd prices but if we keep going down, we could see 80 , even 16 usd by year end... this actually scares me a bit.

All that and $400 bitcoin. 

Thats what u really believe? Smiley
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March 16, 2018, 02:50:27 PM
 #37436

No, the wallet is not the only issue.

Much more fundamental stuff here, spends on different chains could reveal things about the other.


Don't complain about the floods, floods happen. Be a boatbuilder.
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March 16, 2018, 02:56:53 PM
Last edit: March 16, 2018, 04:37:44 PM by Shnikes101
Merited by explorer (1)
 #37437

...so let me get this right.

The biggest claim with regards to monerov being a scam are that they are having people enter their private key in a closed source wallet?

Correct me if I'm wrong what what's the harm in waiting for an open source one?

Also, being given the option to sell/monetize personal transaction histories at will en masse seems like a major opportunity I would think?

The biggest concern for Monero is the potential damage of privacy via an on chain fork that requires private key use to claim an airdrop. Private key reuse is a new-ish attack vector on the network.

My guess is that they could care less whether or not its a scam.
However, claims regarding a scam revolve around the unknown team, closed source software, 10x airdrop, >5% premine, questionable claims on finite supply, coin serves a duplicate or unknown purpose and despite being made aware how their on chain fork damages the privacy of both networks they're moving forward.

It will be interesting to see who or if any exchange supports them.

Wouldn't the potential 'damage to privacy' claim necessarily be dependent on whether or not the pk is actually shared publicly, or rather with someone collecting many? Is it being implied that a closed source wallet would automatically upload your private keys to some tla database is a little much I think. Especially if anyone is running Windows, operating over a WiFi connection, etc... I mean chances are they already got the data if they want it.

So aside from that, the concern i can discern would be more toward an unaffiliated third party (utp) like a marketing agency having the ability to monetize transaction data, if they obtained the private key of a wallet through this means. Alternatively, the tax man could also purchase such data from the utp. For one - there are a series of legal precedents that need to be considered before that could happen which I haven't had much thought on, and have not read much.

Over the next few months, monerov and it's affilitates (provided this isn't some elaborate scalping) will be filling this role. From there onwards, others may likely do the same.

My point here is that regardless of what monerov is doing now - years down the line what's stopping literally anyone from forking monero and actually releasing a closed source wallet with published capacity to add your pk to a database and use said information for whatever purpose they wish? What if some utp decides to put up a market peg of a million dollars bid in exchange for as many pk's as will fill the order?

Outside of the general phishing risk that occurs with private key reuse - I'd agree that scale most likely matters on the transaction Key Image attack vector. From what I've read though, I'm leaning towards that information isn't private. Please someone correct me if I'm wrong.

From the SerHack article that I posted above:
"Each Monero transaction generates a “key image” that secretly encodes the amount of Monero transferred and the public address of the true sender. These key images typically protect transaction anonymity while preventing “double-spending” attacks and illegitimate attempts to inflate the Monero supply with fake coins. It is dangerous to claim MoneroV because these key images will be identical on both chains, which can be exploited to reveal the true sender of both transactions. This reduction in privacy allows Monero (and MoneroV) transactions to be linked in a manner that is not typically possible. The negative ramifications extend far beyond the individuals that use both chains, since any user on either chain may unknowingly employ compromised transactions as decoy ring members."

I'd disagree with "Chances are they already got it." I'd also disagree that there are legal precedents in this space. Please provide sources and/or an explanation for your reasoning.

I'm confused on what role you think MoneroV and it's affiliates will be filling? (and who MoneroV and its affiliates are). Are you implying that MoneroV main purpose is marketing Monero transaction data? A quest to destroy Monero's privacy?

If future parties present new on chain forks that require your private keys in a blatant phishing attempt or attack on the network, the community will do exactly what they are doing now. Make people aware of the risks and build tools to help protect the network in the future.

Look, myself and I'm assuming many others in this thread are more than willing to support a new coin that introduces new and better privacy technology. In fact, I'd almost wager that it is inevitable for a better product to eventually come to market. The fact is MoneroV doesn't introduce any new tech and potentially harms the privacy of both networks. Despite being made aware of their flawed approach, MoneroV pushes forward with no new technology to speak of. I'd agree that the only value add MoneroV has presented is introducing a new attack vector that needed to be solved - which Monero Devs are actively working to mitigate. There's a chance some new tools make it into the next release that will further mitigate this attack and types like it in the future.

For fun - another one of my favorite MoneroV claims is that the MyMonero wallet not only supports but is the best wallet to use to claim your shitdrop.
Of course, MyMonero has to then write a post saying that is false: https://medium.com/@tweetingpauls/beware-of-non-native-forks-of-monero-6f5a0bf1fccf
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March 16, 2018, 02:58:51 PM
 #37438

No, the wallet is not the only issue.

Much more fundamental stuff here, spends on different chains could reveal things about the other.


I should have just replied with this. Oh well
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March 16, 2018, 03:19:58 PM
 #37439

Mind sharing what kind of a hardware wallet that is? It looks really interesting, but I have a feeling it's also really expensive...

I'm starting a technology blog T4CH.top, check it out!
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March 16, 2018, 03:22:10 PM
 #37440

Mind sharing what kind of a hardware wallet that is? It looks really interesting, but I have a feeling it's also really expensive...

It's a ledger nano s. Support is coming soon
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