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Author Topic: Gigamining / Teramining  (Read 201694 times)
dottom
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June 15, 2012, 07:12:20 AM
 #441

It is STILL overpriced. 

I disagree. Keep in mind the cost of hardware, electricity, and most prominently, time.
The increasing hashing capacity is a much more significant factor that hardware cost, electricity and time.  A bond issuer can recover the entire cost of the bonds in months and have a much higher capacity hashing capability for same dollar.

A bond holder can lose money as a result of market drop & buy back.  Bond holders hold a lot of risk for paying 0.24 to 0.30 BTC per MH/s

See this thread (before the price drop): https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=85525.0
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June 15, 2012, 10:39:14 AM
 #442

Great way of making profits:
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The issuer can buy back the bond at any time at a price equal to 1.05 times the highest price the asset was traded on GLBSE over the prior 360 hours.

Sell bonds for 1.50, sell later for ~1, wait until the price tanks + 360 hours, buy back for ~1.05. 45 bitcents per bond profit - mining payouts (which are ~20 bitcents) - 5 bitcents per share sold at 1 (guessing equal amounts of shares sold at 1.50 and 1) = ~20 bitcents per share sold at 1.50 profit. Not pirate rates, but not a bad deal by far either.

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June 16, 2012, 06:01:03 PM
 #443

Anyone has any idea why Gigamining and other major mining bonds (Bitbond, Yabmc) just crashed on the GLBSE?
I am now buying, but maybe there is something I do not know?

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June 16, 2012, 06:02:35 PM
 #444

Anyone has any idea why Gigamining and other major mining bonds (Bitbond, Yabmc) just crashed on the GLBSE?
I am now buying, but maybe there is something I do not know?

Why wouldn't they crash ?

Asic release makes all fpga/gpu worthless
btc value rise to 6.5 and $10 soonish
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June 16, 2012, 06:02:45 PM
 #445

Anyone has any idea why Gigamining and other major mining bonds (Bitbond, Yabmc) just crashed on the GLBSE?
I am now buying, but maybe there is something I do not know?
It's probably because of the announcement from BFL:
http://news.yahoo.com/butterfly-labs-announces-next-generation-asic-lineup-054626776.html

They said in the press release that they would be selling "3.5 GH/s, priced at under $149" - so nobody cares anymore about the pity 5 MH / $10 or $6 from GIGAMINING.

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sunnankar
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June 16, 2012, 06:31:25 PM
 #446

Anyone has any idea why Gigamining and other major mining bonds (Bitbond, Yabmc) just crashed on the GLBSE?
I am now buying, but maybe there is something I do not know?
It's probably because of the announcement from BFL:
http://news.yahoo.com/butterfly-labs-announces-next-generation-asic-lineup-054626776.html


I have been unable to find an official announcement from Butterfly Labs that is both credible and verifiable. Can you please provide a URL hosted on their domain with the appropriate news announcement?

Until then, I would urge caution with regards to this Internet rumor whose veracity is in question with an unverified source as it may be a hoax aimed at causing people to devalue their mining shares/bonds, equipment, etc. in an attempt to get them to sell them at a lower price.

Also, someone should let Butterfly Labs know about the press release since if someone is using their name without their consent then Butterfly Labs may want to proceed with legal action as there are several actionable torts if that is the case.

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June 16, 2012, 06:43:04 PM
 #447

Anyone has any idea why Gigamining and other major mining bonds (Bitbond, Yabmc) just crashed on the GLBSE?
I am now buying, but maybe there is something I do not know?
It's probably because of the announcement from BFL:
http://news.yahoo.com/butterfly-labs-announces-next-generation-asic-lineup-054626776.html


I have been unable to find an official announcement from Butterfly Labs that is both credible and verifiable. Can you please provide a URL hosted on their domain with the appropriate news announcement?
No I cannot and I also haven't seen it on their webpage.
But obviously it doesn't seem to really matter - the rumor is all around the internet and the mining bonds are falling down like stones.
Even though there are no dates in this announcement  - so even if it's all true, they may as well start selling this new hardware in like 12 months from now...

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redbeans2012
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June 16, 2012, 06:51:44 PM
 #448

Anyone has any idea why Gigamining and other major mining bonds (Bitbond, Yabmc) just crashed on the GLBSE?
I am now buying, but maybe there is something I do not know?
It's probably because of the announcement from BFL:
http://news.yahoo.com/butterfly-labs-announces-next-generation-asic-lineup-054626776.html


I have been unable to find an official announcement from Butterfly Labs that is both credible and verifiable. Can you please provide a URL hosted on their domain with the appropriate news announcement?

Until then, I would urge caution with regards to this Internet rumor whose veracity is in question with an unverified source as it may be a hoax aimed at causing people to devalue their mining shares/bonds, equipment, etc. in an attempt to get them to sell them at a lower price.

Also, someone should let Butterfly Labs know about the press release since if someone is using their name without their consent then Butterfly Labs may want to proceed with legal action as there are several actionable torts if that is the case.

What about the bfl thread in the mining hardware forum?

Is that the normal bfl pr account?

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June 16, 2012, 07:04:20 PM
 #449

What about the bfl thread in the mining hardware forum?

Is that the normal bfl pr account?

This is the closest URL that has been provided that is credible and verifiable (standard Wikipedia rules/terms).

Quote

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June 17, 2012, 07:17:12 AM
 #450

Anyone has any idea why Gigamining and other major mining bonds (Bitbond, Yabmc) just crashed on the GLBSE?
I am now buying, but maybe there is something I do not know?
It's probably because of the announcement from BFL:
http://news.yahoo.com/butterfly-labs-announces-next-generation-asic-lineup-054626776.html

They said in the press release that they would be selling "3.5 GH/s, priced at under $149" - so nobody cares anymore about the pity 5 MH / $10 or $6 from GIGAMINING.

Uhm. I keep buying. Sounds bollocks.
BTW: Did anyone notice that FPGAs had zero impact on the network up to now?
Total network hashing rate is still way below the top of 2011.


Garr255
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June 17, 2012, 07:43:21 AM
 #451

Anyone has any idea why Gigamining and other major mining bonds (Bitbond, Yabmc) just crashed on the GLBSE?
I am now buying, but maybe there is something I do not know?
It's probably because of the announcement from BFL:
http://news.yahoo.com/butterfly-labs-announces-next-generation-asic-lineup-054626776.html

They said in the press release that they would be selling "3.5 GH/s, priced at under $149" - so nobody cares anymore about the pity 5 MH / $10 or $6 from GIGAMINING.

Uhm. I keep buying. Sounds bollocks.
BTW: Did anyone notice that FPGAs had zero impact on the network up to now?
Total network hashing rate is still way below the top of 2011.

http://bitcoin.sipa.be/speed-small-lin-ever.png

ASICs (probably) won't be released for a significant amount of time. I'm taking advantage of the low prices and buying a bit.

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June 17, 2012, 02:14:32 PM
 #452

If I understand correctly, the price of all mining bonds should fall slowly when either the price of BTC rises or the difficulty keeps increasing (or both). You can't really influence the price of BTC at will and the price of mining bonds should more or less move in proportion to the amount of movement in the BTC-price. So not much anyone can do there.

But what I guess a bond issuer can influence is the price-retention of the bonds when the diffeculty keeps increasing by revising the terms of the bonds to keep up with changing relation of what 1 or 5 Mh is actually worth when produced by a GPU, BFL-Single ,  a mini-rig or a ASIC board. Is Gigamining going to change in any way to reflect this?  Smiley

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June 17, 2012, 02:28:32 PM
 #453

Is Gigamining going to change in any way to reflect this?  Smiley
I don't think so.

If you go few pages back you can read that I actually proposed such a solution, to increase the hashrate/bond as the difficulty grows and Gigamining is buying more efficient hardware for the same price...
But all I got in reply, was a bunch of furious "economy experts" jumping onto me and shouting "that these are bonds!" and so they are meant to be worth zero in awhile... Smiley
Well, if they are meant to be worth zero, then they obviously will - so just deal with it! Smiley

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jamesg
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June 17, 2012, 02:32:18 PM
 #454

To all gigaminers:

There has been a lot of news / discussion in recent days regarding new equipment coming out from Butterfly Labs. I have confirmed with BFL that this information is indeed correct and have submitted an order for 4 more mini rigs. This will bring gigamining up to a total of 8 mini rigs (204Gh/s), 14 BFL Singles (12Gh/s) and around 90 GPUs (36Gh/s).

There have also been multiple requests regarding whether the terms of the gigamining contract will change. This will not be a possibility until BFL is ready to deliver their new ASIC products. I am considering what should be done in this area, but for now the contract will stay at 5Mh/s. BFL has not given any public time frames around delivery of these products so I feel it's best to take a wait and see approach.

In the interim, gigamining is still fulfilling its contract to it's bondholders and this will continue. Mini rigs will be arriving this week (how many times have I heard this already) so expect to see pictures and video of them in the DC if they arrive.

Best,
gigavps
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June 17, 2012, 02:50:56 PM
 #455

To all gigaminers:

There has been a lot of news / discussion in recent days regarding new equipment coming out from Butterfly Labs. I have confirmed with BFL that this information is indeed correct and have submitted an order for 4 more mini rigs. This will bring gigamining up to a total of 8 mini rigs (204Gh/s), 14 BFL Singles (12Gh/s) and around 90 GPUs (36Gh/s).

There have also been multiple requests regarding whether the terms of the gigamining contract will change. This will not be a possibility until BFL is ready to deliver their new ASIC products. I am considering was should be done in this area, but for now the contract will stay at 5Mh/s. BFL has not given any public time frames around delivery of these products so I feel it's best to take a wait and see approach.

In the interim, gigamining is still fulfilling its contract to it's bondholders and this will continue. Mini rigs will be arriving this week (how many times have a heard this already) so expect to see pictures and video of them in the DC if they arrive.

Best,
gigavps

Will more bonds be on the market to cover the cost of the new hardware?

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June 17, 2012, 02:53:33 PM
 #456

Will more bonds be on the market to cover the cost of the new hardware?

Hi redbeans2012,

I will not be issuing anymore bonds to make these purchases. It seems the recent price rise along with a couple other events have led to instability in the price of mining bonds. I will continue to make coupon payments and release news of new gigamining happenings when the time is appropriate.

Best,
gigavps
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June 17, 2012, 03:06:57 PM
 #457

Is Gigamining going to change in any way to reflect this?  Smiley
I don't think so.

If you go few pages back you can read that I actually proposed such a solution, to increase the hashrate/bond as the difficulty grows and Gigamining is buying more efficient hardware for the same price...
But all I got in reply, was a bunch of furious "economy experts" jumping onto me and shouting "that these are bonds!" and so they are meant to be worth zero in awhile... Smiley
Well, if they are meant to be worth zero, then they obviously will - so just deal with it! Smiley

I see, if that is going to be the case, I feel that's kind of dissapointing to be honest. And this would certainly not provide the best value for money Gigamining strives to represent. I don't see any compelling reason to adhere strictly to these "bonds should be bonds rules". I would say Gigamining would be free to "invent" a kind of financial product that would suit the operation and stakeholders best.

And
To all gigaminers:

There has been a lot of news / discussion in recent days regarding new equipment coming out from Butterfly Labs. I have confirmed with BFL that this information is indeed correct and have submitted an order for 4 more mini rigs. This will bring gigamining up to a total of 8 mini rigs (204Gh/s), 14 BFL Singles (12Gh/s) and around 90 GPUs (36Gh/s).

There have also been multiple requests regarding whether the terms of the gigamining contract will change. This will not be a possibility until BFL is ready to deliver their new ASIC products. I am considering was should be done in this area, but for now the contract will stay at 5Mh/s. BFL has not given any public time frames around delivery of these products so I feel it's best to take a wait and see approach.

In the interim, gigamining is still fulfilling its contract to it's bondholders and this will continue. Mini rigs will be arriving this week (how many times have a heard this already) so expect to see pictures and video of them in the DC if they arrive.

Best,
gigavps

That is great to hear!  Can't wait to see the pictures. Thanks for keeping us informed.

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June 17, 2012, 03:18:12 PM
 #458

To all gigaminers:

There has been a lot of news / discussion in recent days regarding new equipment coming out from Butterfly Labs. I have confirmed with BFL that this information is indeed correct and have submitted an order for 4 more mini rigs. This will bring gigamining up to a total of 8 mini rigs (204Gh/s), 14 BFL Singles (12Gh/s) and around 90 GPUs (36Gh/s).

There have also been multiple requests regarding whether the terms of the gigamining contract will change. This will not be a possibility until BFL is ready to deliver their new ASIC products. I am considering was should be done in this area, but for now the contract will stay at 5Mh/s. BFL has not given any public time frames around delivery of these products so I feel it's best to take a wait and see approach.

In the interim, gigamining is still fulfilling its contract to it's bondholders and this will continue. Mini rigs will be arriving this week (how many times have a heard this already) so expect to see pictures and video of them in the DC if they arrive.

Best,
gigavps

Finally, a voice of reason Smiley Thank you, Giga.
Congrats on the new rigs as well.
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June 17, 2012, 03:27:36 PM
 #459

Thank you Giga.

Your words sounds like fresh air here, you know how to transmit confidence to your investors. Right now, I am investing heavily on your bonds putting my money where my mouth is.

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June 17, 2012, 11:17:59 PM
 #460

I see, if that is going to be the case, I feel that's kind of dissapointing that gigavps is honest. And this would certainly not provide the best value for money Gigamining strives to represent. I don't see any compelling reason to adhere strictly to these "contracts should be contracts rules". I would say Gigamining would be free to break its contract and do whatever it likes.
FTFY.

Really, people, you can't have a contract that you enforce when it suits you, and whinge and complain about and asked to be changed when it doesn't suit you. If you think the contract should be different, make an asset with a different contract, but don't expect contracts to be changed after the fact. Only governments do that.

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