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Author Topic: Gigamining / Teramining  (Read 201393 times)
mc_lovin
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October 09, 2012, 10:03:00 PM
 #1021

Change the structure of gigamining.  Instead of it being described as a bond, have people lease the hardware indefinitely.  People transfer leases all the time.

I believe that's how Sony "sells" their PS3s as well. Just a perpetual transferable lease. It makes sense for the mining companies to take this path when and if legal issues arise.

You dont lease a PS3 with the aim of making money.
And I fear just relabeling it wont really help. I came across this, granted, for Arizona, but I suspect it will similar all over:

I. Defining a Security.
 The first step in deciding whether the securities statutes apply is to determine whether the transaction at issue actually involves a “security”. Arizona broadly defines a security as any:

[N]ote, stock, treasury stock, bond, commodity investment contract, commodity option, debenture, evidence of indebtedness, certificate of interest or participation in any profit-sharing agreement, collateral-trust certificate, preorganization certificate or subscription, transferable share, investment contract, viatical or life settlement investment contract, voting-trust certificate, certificate of deposit for a security, fractional undivided interest in oil, gas or other mineral rights, real property investment contract or, in general, any interest or instrument commonly known as a “security”, or any certificate of interest or participation in, temporary or interim certificate for, receipt for, guarantee of, or warrant or right to subscribe to or purchase, any of the foregoing.[7]

The definition for each of these securities is either listed in the Act under A.R.S. Section 44-1801 or provided by judicial interpretations and tests.[8] In determining whether a certain instrument is a security, a court will consider the substance rather than the form of the instrument.[9] “Essentially, if the purchaser will be a passive owner―relying on someone else’s efforts or conduct in order to make money on the investment―the instrument is probably a security.”[10]

http://www.mitchell-attorneys.com/legal-articles/securities-registration-and-exemption/


What I want to know is where were all these legal aids when all these bitcoin securities started up?  If you guys knew all this before why not put it out there?  So now do all of us bond holders need to pony up some dough for lawyers?   Would have been nice to know some of this before buying into these, I guess I can say it is partly my fault for not looking into all the angles but it is just strange that all these legal aids have come crawling out of the woodwork....

just my 2 bit cents.

Naelr

No shit!  A week ago it was *buy shares now!  clear upgrade path!* and now it's like *well, you didn't call your lawyer, how stupid are you*

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Naelr
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October 09, 2012, 10:15:09 PM
 #1022

What I want to know is where were all these legal aids when all these bitcoin securities started up?  If you guys knew all this before why not put it out there?  So now do all of us bond holders need to pony up some dough for lawyers?   Would have been nice to know some of this before buying into these, I guess I can say it is partly my fault for not looking into all the angles but it is just strange that all these legal aids have come crawling out of the woodwork....

just my 2 bit cents.

Naelr

Stop being so dramatic, there is nothing to be done now. I don't know why you would trust someone online, with so much a lawyer would be necessary. If you have a issue with anyone it should be Nefario, he's the one who just put the trading value to zero. A issuer can only do what they know is honest. If they wanted to be jerk's they could just repurchase the share's for next to nothing.


I am not being dramatic, I am simply saying that that everyone wants to be an armchair quarterback now that it might be possible that lawyers might be involved. 

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jamesg
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October 09, 2012, 10:42:13 PM
 #1023

Looks like day two is over and there is still nothing from GLBSE. I guess we will keep patiently waiting for Nefario to deliver what he has said he would. I still don't understand why the GLBSE application can't be brought back up with trading/transfering disabled.
silverbox
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October 09, 2012, 10:47:11 PM
 #1024

Looks like day twofive is over and there is still nothing from GLBSE. I guess we will keep patiently waiting for Nefario to deliver what he has said he would. I still don't understand why the GLBSE application can't be brought back up with trading/transfering disabled.

ftfy
mc_lovin
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October 10, 2012, 01:14:30 AM
 #1025

Looks like day two is over and there is still nothing from GLBSE. I guess we will keep patiently waiting for Nefario to deliver what he has said he would. I still don't understand why the GLBSE application can't be brought back up with trading/transfering disabled.

Yea, it would be so easy for them to do things the right way.

theGECK
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October 10, 2012, 02:33:13 AM
 #1026

You can now login and provide an email address for contact, a withdrawl bitcoin address, and a checkbox to share that information with the asset issuers. I'm assuming it will include such information as "how many shares you have" to the asset issuers.

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jamesg
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October 10, 2012, 02:34:46 AM
 #1027

You can now login and provide an email address for contact, a withdrawl bitcoin address, and a checkbox to share that information with the asset issuers. I'm assuming it will include such information as "how many shares you have" to the asset issuers.

I have complete the GLBSE AML forms to receive the gigamining coins back.
stochastic
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October 10, 2012, 02:40:18 AM
 #1028

You can now login and provide an email address for contact, a withdrawl bitcoin address, and a checkbox to share that information with the asset issuers. I'm assuming it will include such information as "how many shares you have" to the asset issuers.

I have complete the GLBSE AML forms to receive the gigamining coins back.

Did you have to provide all 3 forms of identification: photo ID, proof of address, and (the most amateurish) photo of you with hold up a piece of paper with your GLBSE username and date?

Introducing constraints to the economy only serves to limit what can be economical.
jamesg
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October 10, 2012, 02:43:58 AM
 #1029

You can now login and provide an email address for contact, a withdrawl bitcoin address, and a checkbox to share that information with the asset issuers. I'm assuming it will include such information as "how many shares you have" to the asset issuers.

I have complete the GLBSE AML forms to receive the gigamining coins back.

Did you have to provide all 3 forms of identification: photo ID, proof of address, and (the most amateurish) photo of you with hold up a piece of paper with your GLBSE username and date?

I've submitted all of the info requested.
mtbitcoin
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October 10, 2012, 03:06:00 AM
 #1030

You can now login and provide an email address for contact, a withdrawl bitcoin address, and a checkbox to share that information with the asset issuers. I'm assuming it will include such information as "how many shares you have" to the asset issuers.

I have complete the GLBSE AML forms to receive the gigamining coins back.

Did you have to provide all 3 forms of identification: photo ID, proof of address, and (the most amateurish) photo of you with hold up a piece of paper with your GLBSE username and date?

I've submitted all of the info requested.

Giga,

Are your bondholders also required to submit the identifcation details in order to receive the allocated bonds or will the list of this information be provided to you directly?

Thanks

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Shadow383
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October 10, 2012, 03:08:37 AM
 #1031

You can now login and provide an email address for contact, a withdrawl bitcoin address, and a checkbox to share that information with the asset issuers. I'm assuming it will include such information as "how many shares you have" to the asset issuers.

I have complete the GLBSE AML forms to receive the gigamining coins back.

Did you have to provide all 3 forms of identification: photo ID, proof of address, and (the most amateurish) photo of you with hold up a piece of paper with your GLBSE username and date?

I've submitted all of the info requested.

Giga,

Are your bondholders also required to submit the identifcation details in order to receive the allocated bonds or will the list of this information be provided to you directly?

Thanks
I doubt anyone knows right now - technically if Nefario's going for full AML compliance it's likely to be the former.
stochastic
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October 10, 2012, 03:10:38 AM
 #1032

Before anyone gives up personal information to a stranger and registered scammer, they should ask what legal authority BitcoinGlobal has in requesting this information:

Haven't seen that request, but if they're requesting personal information there's a few points they need to clear up first:

1.  If the information is for AML purposes then which AML supervisor are they registered with?  In the uK there's about 8 different supervisors, depending on the nature of your business (IF your business is one subject to the AML legislation).  The obvious one for them would be the FSA (which covers financial service providers) but there ARE others (e.g. casinos have the gambling/gaming commission).  If they're requesting information for AML purposes then they need to be registered with one of the designated supervisory bodies.

2.  If it's for AML purposes then a link please to their AML compliance policy.

3.  If not for AML purposes then what is this information going to be used for?  And how long will it be retained for?  This is information they're obligated to provide under the Data Protection Act.

4.  Irrespective of the answers above, link please to their DPA compliance policy/statement?

5.  Can GLBSE please confirm that they have professional indemnity insurance covering them against loss or misuse of clients' data.

6.  What is their intention in respect of anyone who refuses to provide the documents but requests their funds returned?  Will they just keep the money?  Report them as a suspected money launderer?  Turn their BTC over to the police?

As soon as I receive the request referred to in OP I'll be emailing requesting the above information (can't check my email right now - assume that's where it is).  If they refuse to answer the questions but persist in requesting the information then I will next send a formal request for my funds (providing my name/address but not giving any documents which would allow identity theft).



Introducing constraints to the economy only serves to limit what can be economical.
BurtW
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October 10, 2012, 05:10:23 AM
 #1033

Now what?

Quote
Update:we are currently unable to process account closures, and will inform our users when this service resumes.

Our family was terrorized by Homeland Security.  Read all about it here:  http://www.jmwagner.com/ and http://www.burtw.com/  Any donations to help us recover from the $300,000 in legal fees and forced donations to the Federal Asset Forfeiture slush fund are greatly appreciated!
stochastic
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October 10, 2012, 05:12:28 AM
 #1034

Now what?

Quote
Update:we are currently unable to process account closures, and will inform our users when this service resumes.

surprise, surprise.  Roll Eyes

Introducing constraints to the economy only serves to limit what can be economical.
johnlu
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October 10, 2012, 11:57:13 PM
 #1035

gigavps, I checked "Share with issuers? Check this box if you wish to share the above information with issuers for assets you have bought." checkbox to let you know how many bonds I bought from your assets, I hope this to be enough to help you.

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jamesg
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October 11, 2012, 12:03:25 AM
 #1036

gigavps, I checked "Share with issuers? Check this box if you wish to share the above information with issuers for assets you have bought." checkbox to let you know how many bonds I bought from your assets, I hope this to be enough to help you.

Hi johnlu,

I will notify everyone in this thread when I have received the list of asset holders and the BTC that was in GLBSE. Without the list of asset holders, it will be tough to do much of anything. I am also continuing to work with counsel to find a way forward without an exchange.

Best,
gigavps
johnlu
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October 11, 2012, 12:22:42 AM
 #1037

I'd like that you can continue with gigamining and teramining.

Thanks for all the extra work you are doing.

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Puppet
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October 11, 2012, 07:14:40 AM
 #1038

Make sure you counsel looks in to the newly voted crowd sourcing law H.R.2930:
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/D?c112:4:./temp/~c112dITQd0::

Its not going to make everyone happy since bonds would no longer be tradable directly among investors and its not clear to me if investors could remain anonymous, but it could provide a legal framework to operate within.
Otoh
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October 11, 2012, 11:24:48 AM
 #1039

I'd like that you can continue with gigamining and teramining.

Thanks for all the extra work you are doing.

+1 & to the other helpful comments, I've logged in to GLBSE site & registered my email address, bitcoin address & checked the box for requesting that the list of my assets are shared with the issuers of these assets.

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October 11, 2012, 02:34:34 PM
 #1040

Now what?

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Update:we are currently unable to process account closures, and will inform our users when this service resumes.

Last night, I had trouble logging in, but it's working now.  Don't know how long it'll take for them to kick my balance loose...it's less than BTC1, so it's not a huge loss if it doesn't, but it'd be nice if they did.

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