Re: Black Arrow 28nm 100Ghash Bitcoin ASIC from $0.49/GH/s

[DebitMe]

The scam that keeps on scamming.

[DebitMe]

Isn't that what you asked people to do when you had the backplane failure?

Also Bobsag has alluded to doing some assembly and also going over to China to do just that.

I ask again, what have you actually done?  You haven't designed your own chip, the backplane was made by another party, everything you have "designed" has had to be reworked at least 3 times.  You are nothing by failure and will soon fall.  I am guessing your money supply is getting pretty low right about now, can't have any orders coming in since your selling shit and your rep has gone lower than BFL's.  Have fun living on the streets or in jail you worthless excuse for human beings.

[DebitMe]

Look at that guys, BA has enough time to get on here and delete posts, yet they don't have enough time to get anything else done.  Where you at in the shipping queue Alex Sovu?  Only 40% of the way through?  You guys are the biggest pieces of shit this side of Shenzen.  Do everyone a favor and pack it up and die you worthless pieces of shit.

[Pentax]

is this guy the owner of black arrow software ?
https://www.facebook.com/alex.sovu

According to the Articles of Association another user posted here, the name is certainly accurate. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=716310.0  There's a lot of interesting reading to be done about Black Arrow Software and their association with Alex Sovu who is rumored to have a reputation/background for fraud and scams according to this: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=193129.msg2242650#msg2242650

You can see the past and present information of the directors of one of his other companies here, which is a matter of public record:
https://www.opencompany.co.uk/company/07035674/bbyte-ltd

It's interesting to note that his partner seems to have something of an identity crisis when it comes to her name, which includes both Cristina Iulia Ixari and Mrs Iulia Cristina Ixari.

see this page. 

they have not denied to this point that this is the same guy:

http://portal.just.ro/300/SitePages/Dosar.aspx?id_dosar=30000000000012214&id_inst=300

[Pentax]

WOW. I don't know if it is good news, or bad news, but i received my two x-1 units that i ordered from black arrow, 11 months ago, today. No emails or anything about shipping. Didn't plug them in yet. Not really dying to either. Woulda been a little excited about them 4 months ago, now, blech.

How were they shipped?  by what carrier?

[SimonBeCoinin]

People that have filed with the consumer council should follow up with the cc if they have not gotten a reply. 

people need to speak up to let them know that their case is still relevant.

[SimonBeCoinin]

I've seen consumer alerts on the Consumer Council's site for companies with 70 complaints.  I do not see Black Arrow listed.

is it possible that not even 70 people filed a complaint against Black arrow after all of their actions against customers and all of this time.

the council does take action, will visit the business if it does not respond,  and has legal actions at it's disposal, but they're not going to do much if people don't actually let them know there is a problem.

stop waiting for 'someone else'

they're fucking YOU.  do something about it.

[Pentax]

When BFL starts to look good relative to Black Arrow you know they've really rung the bell of failure.

How could any company be this bad.

It's like they try to fail.

Or they're mining with the X-3's and that's why they're not going out, which seems more likely to me.

[OgNasty]

Come on BA, you're right on track for unseating BFL for being the worst shipping manufacturer!

Don't forget CoinTerra.  They shipped an underperforming power hog that is loud as hell and needs special cooling.  I'm getting 1/2 the rate I paid for at twice the power consumption and it needs it's own A/C line to stay running.  Total garbage.

[greenlion]

I've seen consumer alerts on the Consumer Council's site for companies with 70 complaints.  I do not see Black Arrow listed.

is it possible that not even 70 people filed a complaint against Black arrow after all of their actions against customers and all of this time.

the council does take action, will visit the business if it does not respond,  and has legal actions at it's disposal, but they're not going to do much if people don't actually let them know there is a problem.

stop waiting for 'someone else'

they're fucking YOU.  do something about it.

Maybe we can buy their email list like others already?

Then we could notify everyone of the complaint procedure one-shot.

[goozman96]

I've seen consumer alerts on the Consumer Council's site for companies with 70 complaints.  I do not see Black Arrow listed.

is it possible that not even 70 people filed a complaint against Black arrow after all of their actions against customers and all of this time.

the council does take action, will visit the business if it does not respond,  and has legal actions at it's disposal, but they're not going to do much if people don't actually let them know there is a problem.

stop waiting for 'someone else'

they're fucking YOU.  do something about it.

Maybe we can buy their email list like others already?

Then we could notify everyone of the complaint procedure one-shot.

Lol that'd be really genius actually. I wouldn't mind seeing someone do that

[notbatman]

[Shipping product]

   BFL: Yes (Monarchs)
   BA: No (Prospero X3)

[Power at the wall]

   BFL: 0.7W/Gh
   BA: 1W/Gh

[Refunds]

   BFL: Yes
   BA: No

[notbatman]

I noticed BA deleted the entire REFUNDS thread on eCoinTalk.

[Craige288]

Quoted by Waramp22 in another thread - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=681965.40
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Just pasting this in here, as I imagine BA will delete it from the self moderated thread.

The company is registered in Hong Kong, so the proper agency from what I have been able to find out so far is the Hong Kong Consumer Council.

They request some documents and need to establish that this is a Hong Kong registered company  before they will agree to pick it up, therefore:

Send the annual report http://www.kiwi.nz/blackarrow/PS300015776549_01.pdf

along with the documents they have requested.  Those documents are:

1.  The invoice showing you paid
2   your bank or payment records showing the payment
3.  any e-mail or support discussions  you've had
4.  The annual report referenced above.

Here's the link to file a complaint if you decide you want to do that.

https://www.consumer.org.hk/cc-complaint/index.php?lang=en

Also indicate that their TOS indicates Hong Kong law and paste that in to your message.

http://www.blackarrowsoftware.com/store/terms-and-conditions-en.html#purchase

15.2 Applicable law and dispute resolution
16.2 1 This Agreement shall be interpreted and applied in accordance with the law of Hong Kong S.A.R. of PRC.

This is all the information they will need to pick this up.  They have been very helpful and responsive.  If that goes nowhere, Shenzhen Consumer Group, with which I have also been talking and then the lawyers will be next.

[Pentax]

I noticed BA deleted the entire REFUNDS thread on eCoinTalk.

yep.   good thing someone already printed much of it out to pdf.....

[notbatman]

I think all the "USED" 1Th/s BitFury units BA has for sale speaks volumes about why they haven't gone bankrupt. Must have been nice cashing out at $1100 during December.

Has BA mined and are they continuing to mine a fantastic amount of money all on our dime?

[Pentax]

I think all the "USED" 1Th/s BitFury units BA has for sale speaks volumes about why they haven't gone bankrupt. Must have been nice cashing out at $1100 during December.

Has BA mined and are they continuing to mine a fantastic amount of money all on our dime?

I'm going with yep, probably.  X-3's started going out to resellers weeks ago.  did they just stop building them?   or is it more likely they're mining with them.

their used bitfuries have probably gotten to the point where they're no longer profitable, so they're trying to sell useless junk to people.  you know, in the same way that they're selling useless junk as their primary products right now in the X-1 and X-3.

[DebitMe]

Wow, just wow, these sorry excuses for human beings won't just die will they?  I will be the first to call Bull Shit on a 14nm node process ASIC chip used for SHA-256 hashing!  There is simply no way.  How could BA do that when successful Bitcoin ASIC companies can't yet, and for that matter, any other chip producer such as Intel!  They are just lying to get more money.

Although notice that with their Scrypt ASIC chip and now this one, they are no longer taking preorders and instead are looking for funding from individuals or even other ASIC manufacturers!  There is no way they have the money to do another tape out.  They are scrounging for scraps and I doubt anyone will throw them any given their history of being complete fuck ups.

Justification for having no more money...
Why would you seek partners or investors if you could tape it out yourselves?  Unless you aren't confident in your own product and don't want to sustain a huge loss yourselves.

Either way, this company has proven incompetence time and time again.  In fact, incompetence is putting it too nicely.  They have lied, scammed, and cheated their way through this entire production run of miners, which barely function according to roughly half the people who received them.

It will be a beautiful day when the authorities catch these fuckers and karma gets its sweet sweet revenge.

[Pentax]

But wait, there's more!

http://www.blackarrowsoftware.com/store/14nm-bitcoin-asic-announcement.html

So ... do we get some free units of these for our trouble??  We paid "helped" to pay for this development after all.....

Haha what a fuckin' joke!

"Black Arrow Ltd has already a proven track record in successfully manufacture Bitcoin mining hardware at extremely competitive prices using shorter full lifecycle than their competition without compromising the top quality required the highly-competitive niche market."

Are these dicks on the same planet as us? Successfully manufacture? Extremely competitive prices? Just piss off and go bankrupt already you criminals

proven track record?   of what, exactly?  their miners are now 6 months late because they had one issue after the next, they're no longer price competitive at time of delivery and have a snowball's chance in hell of ROI'ing.


what they have proven is that they will tell people anything to get their money and then break those promises when it suits them.

remember this one?

If you are guaranteeing prices then what's the point of preorders?  Basically the people preordering now are giving you a free loan because come february everyone gets the same price anyways.  The only benefit of preordering now is if the buyer thinks that you won't have to lower prices and the current price will end up being less then market prices for similar devices at the time of shipping.

Customers who pre-order and pay now have 25% discount. Our promise is that we will ensure that customers who preorder now will always get a better deal than customers who order later.

At the same time we promise that our prices will be below market price at the time we ship.

This means that customers that preorder now will have considerable lower market prices by the time that we ship which puts them in advantage towards anybody else.

Unless Bitcoin mining stops because it becomes unprofitable for everybody else in February, our customers WILL make profit.

or this?

After a whole year of this ASIC preordering phenomenon/fiasco somehow it's starting to feel like the companies will promise you anything and everything just to get your money.  Even if it makes no sense.  What's the point of them getting capital now if they guarantee to drop the prices to whatever the market price will be in the future and have to return most of that capital?  I don't mind gambling but when the gamble is just some vague guarantee promise that isn't rooted in reality that's just one more hurdle to overcome besides the fact of sending non refundable to btc to some outfit in china and hoping for the best on a proposition that's many months away.

Everybody until now sold you hardware that they knew that you're going to loose money because 1 month later they announced something faster at a better price.
We are guaranteeing that this won't happen with us: If we drop the price you'll get even faster hardware, keeping you in front of everybody else.

or this?

I'd like to make sure I understand what you are guaranteeing.  You are saying that if I preorder now I am guaranteed a price 25% below market price.  How will market price be defined?  

Yes, you are guaranteed to get a price 25% below the market price ($/ghash) at the time of shipment.
And yes, we will keep our prices below every other company.

Bottom line is, whoever trusts us now, we promise that will help them to mine profitably after February as well. If you keep supporting other companies who have ripped you off until now, you'll barely get your ROI back.

[Pentax]

Wow, just wow, these sorry excuses for human beings won't just die will they?  I will be the first to call Bull Shit on a 14nm node process ASIC chip used for SHA-256 hashing!  There is simply no way.  How could BA do that when successful Bitcoin ASIC companies can't yet, and for that matter, any other chip producer such as Intel!  They are just lying to get more money.

Although notice that with their Scrypt ASIC chip and now this one, they are no longer taking preorders and instead are looking for funding from individuals or even other ASIC manufacturers!  There is no way they have the money to do another tape out.  They are scrounging for scraps and I doubt anyone will throw them any given their history of being complete fuck ups.

Justification for having no more money...
Why would you seek partners or investors if you could tape it out yourselves?  Unless you aren't confident in your own product and don't want to sustain a huge loss yourselves.

Either way, this company has proven incompetence time and time again.  In fact, incompetence is putting it too nicely.  They have lied, scammed, and cheated their way through this entire production run of miners, which barely function according to roughly half the people who received them.

It will be a beautiful day when the authorities catch these fuckers and karma gets its sweet sweet revenge.

Intel just released a 14nm, I think.

http://chipdesignmag.com/sld/blog/2014/08/29/deeper-dive-intels-14nm-august-29-2014/

But that's Intel.   And they've just recently accomplished it.  first devices with it to come out towards the end of this year.  devices for OEMs in the first half of next year.

and BA is going to ship in the first half of next year also? 


yah I don't think so.  you'd have to be drunk as a monkey on a rum boat to think they could successfully accomplish this within any  reasonable time or best the competition in getting there when it does happen.