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Of the rigs I could have under power and hashing within 1 or 2 days, which ones have the best ROI.
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48 hour notice is fine, but there is no incentive for me to bid early. i'll place my bids when the 48 hours is announced!
TJ
In the off chance that the Avalon Batch #3 is re-opened for purchase, I would consider it a strong event. |
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ProfMac, Congrats on your success! You have inspired me to do the same with mine, and to auction it most similarly to how the forum auctions off advertising space: 50 slots available, 1 slot = 1% of income from the 85GH/s rig. This will allow people to get half their own Avalon for potentially as cheap as 25 BTC! Keep us posted on how well yours goes! I see a lot of potential scams going on here with these resells and I want to know just how many of them are legit. Welcome, thanks, and happy auctioneering! |
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You can't do it with Bitcoin-Qt. There is a patch but it is not tested, ask Gavin. With MultiBit, it is doable, but requires making a new wallet, sending bitcoins
to address in that wallet and then sending gathered bitcoins to auction address. Than repeat for each and all bid upping or outbidding someone else's bid. If
one is bidding on all 10 shares, that means making 10 new MultiBit wallets, each having just 1 address. I might do that actualy, since rage just went from me
to guy next door!
I'm online in #bitcoin-dev and looking at the expert console in bitcoin-qt. Sipa is commenting a bit. I'm depressed and have a thermos of coffee. I thought I had it worked out to be easy and powerful. I don't think the low level commands are safe for an auction of ordinary users, if there are ordinary users in the bitcoin community. ... I can send from the command line. The link a posting or so above tells how. I don't see how from the GUI. sipa is telling me to never reuse an address, that all the people who want to return payment are breaking the privacy structure. I am telling him that transparent auditing is equally or more important. I guess I'm gonna have to earn my easy money fixing this. I don't think I'm gonna get a custom patch from him... |
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I am corresponding in #bitcoin-dev about how to do this using bitcoin-QT. I will perfect the process with my own funds and addresses. I will return your funds, each payment back to its original address. I will write up the process. The background reading is online.There is a payment protocol document in the works. I bookmarked it, but it's not on today's list. I actually think my idea is better, and something like the PGP web of trust would also work well. I am 0x17B56C41 or so in the PGP/GPG world. |
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The block chain bidding is ideal. It makes the bids binding. In my auction for CH shares, I had a few bids that were not honored. Love the innovation profmac.
Too bad my auction took too long, I was gathering those coins to invest with you prof.
2 questions:
1) End date for the auction - there has to be one for me to bid.
2) Will there be refunds to original address for non-winning bids?
Thx TheJucie
The innovator is never properly rewarded. He is forgotten under the accolades of those who make money from his innovations. The block-chain is everything.I am willing to pre-announce an end to the auction. Will 24 or 48 hours of advance notice be enough? All non-winning auction bids will be refunded to the original payment address. |
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For that to be true, I'd need to send 1 Satoshi from each of the 9 different addresses, than send more bitcoins individually for each and all addresses where my
bid was no longer the highest one.
Yes, exactly. I will demonstrate that with 5 @ 1 Shatoshi bids in 1 transaction. Then I will have an experienced view of how difficult the task is, and whether I have misunderstood something very important. The bitcoin-qt client wants to add 0.000 5 BTC for a miner's fee. Here is the set up transaction where I am putting exact amounts into each of the addresses. What you are saying is that I don't own 5 shares for 0.1 BTC each but just 1 share for which I paid 0.5 BTC already. Unless I use some new addresses to send bitcoins, I can bid on 1 and only 1 share - the one I own right now. Or I actualy own more than 1 share now, but I'd need to figure out how many bitcoins were sent from each of addresses I've used already, else there is no way for me to figure out anything? One who has 10 BTC split on 10.000 addresses already lost the auction? Unless one uses Armory, blockchain.info wallet or some other solution, he is pretty much screwed and might actualy seriously overpay the share. [/quote When I read this, I think you have not looked at the links I provided to blockchain.info Do you mind telling me what client you are using to pay? You are correct. You have a lot of non-winning bids. We are not in a hurry here, and I think the winning bids will be higher than your bids, based on eBay bids of $20,100 or so for a batch #2 Avalon. I will send the payments back to you, but I want you to verify a 2nd time that the addresses all belong to your wallet. After I send payment to an address, I can't change it's destination. I want it to be as simple as possible, but not simpler. Most of the threads in these forums are involved in some type of dispute, and I don't want my own. Paying money back to the same address it came in from makes all of the auditing be automatic and very simple. Anyone in the world can see what I did, or did not, do.
The 10 incoming addresses that send the most total bitcoin will each have 1 share (1% of the mining income)
N.b. it does not matter how much the total of payments is, 1 address gets 1 share. It is a multiple winner auction.
I can't tell if 1 person sends payments from several addresses. Just letting you know that I know. I think focus is a better strategy.
@ theGECK
You and Prof must be right, that is why there is incredible amount of interest in this offer. There are five pages of posts already not because it is unclear what
is offer about or because the deal is overcomplicated but because people just love to post, they do it for fun or to increase post count.
You want to attract as many people as possible and have fun but you are making managing the offer convenient for you only, at all costs it seems. What a joke!
You stand to gain something like BTC 5 per share in this deal. I walked to an ATM on a bank holiday in -26°F wind chill in blowing and drifting snow to move USD into bitcoin, and spent at least 6 hours trying to figure out the WalletBit web site while racing the clock and the other purchasers. I was successful, and I am offering a second chance with more convenience, less time pressure, and less total funds to you and anyone. I will try to help you through this process, and I am sure that others will also offer help. |
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You are funny. Unless one has 10 different addresses, each holding more bitcoins than bids aimed to be outbidden, there is no way he can own 10 shares.
When the auction opened, you could own 9 shares for 9 Satoshis. Of course, when you split your bid, it is easy for each one to be outbid. That is why I made a recommendation against it. If you would like to help out the Sons of ProfMac, you could of course make 10 bids of BTC 100 each. I would be very grateful. |
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At this point I just lost it. What exactly buys one share? Transaction or total sum of bitcoins sent from one address? If it is the later, it won't work
since only few use Armory wallet, which allows picking address or addresses that will be used as a source for bitcoins. For anyone else, sending more
bitcoins as a way to outbid some previous bid means high chance already used address will be used again, and that means new bitcoins sent will be
used to pump already placed bid instead of outbidding some other bid. I don't wanna end up paying 5 BTC for one share and some other guy getting
1 share for 0.1 BTC or less.
Let's not overcomplicate. 10 transactions which placed the most bitcoins own 1 share each. Don't bring addresses in, it will be a horror to manage bids.
Hmmm. http://blockchain.info/ will let you import your wallet. They will let you pick which address you make payment from. They have 2 factor authentication. Let me know what client you are using, I'll explore it. |
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1) Are bids tied to addresses, such that each address' total bid is compared against every other addresses' total bid? 2) When are the bids tallied and we find out who won the auction and what address has the share? For the auction, the following list of definitions may help. Share --- what you buy. Equivalent to 1% of the machine income. Bid --- offer to buy 1 share. Payment --- transfer of bitcoin from 1 single address to address 17DCms43Vu2yusDjmpjHJuZihSSWkNzgSHBids are tied to payment addresses. A standard bid has 1 incoming and 1 outgoing address. One address may make additional payments to increase the amount of that bid. Transaction --- a bundle of 1 or more payments. I might have a transaction for "band payment" that includes inputs from bar regulars Bob, Ted, Sue, and Alice, and outputs for guitar, vocalist, drummer, fiddler (I'm from Texas, ya gotta have a fiddle in the band.) There is a mess with some bids coming from several incoming addresses. The actual rule that I published is per address, and not per transaction. Complex Nerd & Administrative Stuff that you can skip:Here is an example of using that rule: I start a new wallet with bitcoin-QT, and create 11 addresses with it. I deposit BTC 55.005 as follows: 1 coin to address 1, 2 coins to address 2, 3 coins to address 3 ... 10 coins to address 10, and 0.005 coins to address 11. I send a BTC 55 payment from my wallet to the bidding address with a 0.005 Miner's fee. This 1 transaction makes 10 separate bids. |
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That means total number of shares might become more than 100, or it just means you might opt to administer less than 10 addresses on your side? If it is the
former, it breaks the most important setting in this deal. One can't make any calculations or predictions if number of shares can change - increase - on your will.
I have defined 1 share as 1% of the machine's earnings. I have purchased 10 shares, and I will pay electricity, cooling, and other costs out of that dividend stream. It does not matter how many shares I sell, the return per share is not diluted by other sales. Unsold income, er, isn't sold. I hope to have ฿72.36 or ฿99.14 in hand, I hope that the Batch #3 Avalons will open for a 2nd round of sales the same way that Batch #2 did, I hope BFL does not ship today, I hope that Batch #14 Avalon is on 14 nm ASICS and is a freestanding a solar powered sculpture, and I hope to successfully buy another mining rig. With two machines, I can sell 175% of my first unit, and everything will be transparent, add up correctly, and work under the originally published Offer. It may convince the casual onlooker into thinking I knew what I was doing all along. |
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Oh well. Part of the fun is dealing with uncertainty. I'm a happy camper. Let Yifu ship, I suspect he's doing the best he can.. the shipping company maybe fucked it up.
Some day, I will dye a blue streak in my beard, and change all my nicks to ChaosSurfer. |
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I got it, finaly!
Yeah!! Care to help the other folks get it? |
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Prof: your terms are quite complicate indeed. Just an advice: the simpler, the better.
That is very good advice. The difficulty is in making it so. Check this deal, it worked flawlessly so far. I bought 1 module, that will be hosted in China. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=158986.0That is a great deal. My electricity cost is much lower than his, perhaps you will have him ship his unit to my location. It would save $950 / year. 365 * 24 * 0.650 * ((25-8.2)*0.01) |
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I went through all 3 pages of this thread but the more I read the less I understand the deal here. What I need to know is this:
1. If I send you 10 BTC, what exactly do I get? If I understood right, I get shares.
2. If at some point I decide to sell shares - cash out - I'd need to find a buyer for those shares, or you would buy them?
In other words, unless deal is as simple as me investing 10 BTC and getting 10+ BTC out of the deal easily, I don't see anything worth investing in there.
If you buy 1 share, you get 1% of the bitcoin from my batch #2 Avalon. Some people think the payout will be large. The only action on your end is to make 1 payment, with careful attention to both the paying and the receiving address. If you set your price right, you will automatically get more back than you put in, no additional action from you. All things end, and in time this rig will be decommissioned. You will automatically get your original coin back at that time, with no additional action on your part. I don't know how to make it simpler than a 1 payment action.This 2nd phase is not a fixed price purchase, it is an auction. No matter what size payment you send, you are buying 1 share, 1%, only. A 10 BTC purchase for 1 share only makes sense if you believe that the rig will mine more than 1,000 BTC during it's lifetime. If you are outbid, you will be paid back, no additional action required on your part. A day or so delay in payout will give you time to up your bid, and me time to handle my other life. |
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Prof: your terms are quite complicate indeed. Just an advice: the simpler, the better.
That is very good advice. The difficulty is in making it so. |
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That's a lot of scenarios. Given #2, you should just set a minimum bid. People have already bid, but still, if you aren't going to accept low bids, might as well clear that up now with a minimum. Speaking for myself, having a fixed end time is necessary and would encourage participation.
I don't like changing the rules after people are using them. The low bid stands, since I have already published it. Are you saying you would not even bid 1 Satoshi if the auction does not have a fixed end time? |
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I can't understand why anyone thinks this is Yifu's problem.
Someone posts enough information here to be social engineered at DHL - definitely not Yifu's fault.
Then you're foolish enough to announce it here so that the thief won't show up for pickup at the bar they rerouted it to. Why didn't you get DHL security to ship an empty box and have the cops waiting for whoever claimed it?
After the shooting, I learned how detectives think. Few people here think that way. It is not natural to us. Who did you shoot?  I started with lawyers and bankers.... No wait. That was a dream. My daughter's boyfriend shot us. The EMS team was all concerned that "he's mottled." Which my vet. friends say is a sign that circulation has stopped. I woke up in the ICU with the detective asking to get a statement before I died. But detectives basically build paperwork. The remember everything, they give away nothing. They don't stop crime, they document it's progress well enough to survive a courtroom battle. I would know not to let the thief know that I knew that he existed. |
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