It's all about managing your customers investors victims.
If the people that they've ripped off would just stop trying to vocalize about it...
Thats how I see it as well. |
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Some of the latest tripe from the BFL Shoutbox. (Sunday Night)
Seems BFL does not work weekends, but Just Saturdays and those numbers are rolled up into Monday Numbers.
"We make and ship stuff on Saturday but it all gets rolled into Mnday" (sic)
So when Josh said we work weekends, he meant Saturdays. (off by 50% imagine that)
Also interesting to note that in sheer Pay dates shipped, lately Mondays numbers are equal in pay dates to any other day, there is not a doubling effect on Monday's stats due to some huge volume that went out Saturday. (wonder why)
When asked whether she lacked parts or assemblers, she ignored the question.
When asked "Backlog cleared in 22 days??"
She replied "If we ship everything by the end of September, the backlog will be cleared. If we don't, I won't be."
I'd call that a "no', just my opinion however.
The OP must really have nothing better to do with his time seeing as he has to disect everything that comes out of BFL down to the point all you have is utter nonsense. Obviously he is so wise he can infer things from minimal data. I'd bet Charles Schwab would love to hire someone with his keen skills. Just like you have nothing better to do than to respond to BFL related posts within a very hostile environment. You've gone out of your way just to do that. Your reward for wasting time is? |
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The supply chain issues would also not work. Chip technology today is in many different sizes. 180nm, 150nm, 110nm, 90nm, 65nm, 55nm 28nm. I doubt you could send the same specs to 2 different foundries and get the same results. I could be wrong. But from the foundries they have to be sent to a bumping facility. Somewhere in there the chips have to be 'binned'. I asked a question about binning and was told Grade B and lower were only used on Jalapenos. Grade A normally encompases only 60% of a wafer of chips, however I was also told that a majority of the Grade B were testing out at Grade A, so it sounds like they had a good FAB there. From there you need to populate the boards. Unless foundries have bumping facilities, you already have 4 different companies working together between the foundry, bumping fac, PCB manufacturer and the Assemblers. And the product isn't even to BFL yet.
Your foundry is simplicity indeed when compared to a chip foundry.
You can't "send specs" to multiple foundries. You have to choose a foundry before you even begin a project, because each foundry has their own tools, methods and expectations. Once you choose a foundry, the only way you can switch is to basically start from scratch for the most part. What many people seem to overlook is that BFL started out at 130nm (at one foundry), switched to 110nm, then to 90nm then to 65nm, with three foundry changes along the way. The design process for the current generation chip started long before pre-orders were taken. The comparison of Ridicuss' company and BFL is impossible on almost every level. BFL did not have the resources, supply chain, personnel, etc... of a 60 year old company, nor does the established industry even exist that the mill enjoys. 65nm was brand new, state of the art just 7 years ago, not only is there not enough time to develop an industry similar to a steel mill around the 65nm node, the technology moves so fast that a robust industry like that would never even have time to develop. It's very easy to claim that "BFL should have done this. BFL should have done that. I would never do this. I would never do that," but the simple fact of the matter is, pretty much any technology company that deals with end user customers on the scale of BFL or more has very little direct customer communication. Why do you think this is? It's not because they can't hire people to deal with them, it's because it's counterproductive, as we have now learned. BFL is easily one of the most open privately held technology companies in operation today and by far and away the most open bitcoin ASIC developer and it's proven to be nothing but a detriment to our core business model. The reason you don't see the likes of Sony, Toshiba, Samsung, et al communicating with their customers is because it's harmful to their business (I'm not saying BFL is in the leagues of the above companies, by any means, just using them as an example). They have the money and resources to engage their customers but they don't... they've already learned that customer engagement just leads to what we see here today. Irrational, angry people lashing out as a coping strategy. I tried and use a different tact when dealing with the exceptionally irrational person (usually not a customer), and it actually has it's merits but it's incredibly time consuming and probably on balance as a company grows I can't imagine it being a viable method as the customer base grows. I do find it fascinating to watch the exaggeration, fabrication and misrepresentation of nearly every aspect of BFL grow almost daily. Ridicuss' is a good example of either parroting what he's "heard" or exaggerating/fabricating imagined transgressions so that he can justify his actions to himself. I have been impolite to very few actual customers, the majority of my ire has been directed at non-customers who are pot stirrers. The few "customers" that have been the focus of my ire are the ones who are the most vocally irrational, rude and unacceptable of the bunch. Again, I do enjoy pointing out the fact that I never start a vitriolic exchange, merely respond to it. I've challenged every single nay-sayer to provide evidence that I've started an angry exchange and to date not a single person has been able to come up with the smoking gun. The simple fact of the matter is, politeness and respect get the same in return. Rude, irrational and angry gets what it deserves. Be an adult and you'll be treated like one. Be a spoiled, tantrum throwing child and you'll be treated like one. Quoted for future references of false statements. |
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OK so i ordered a Jall base model on the 23rd of june 2013 and i ordered the upgrade a week later.
just checked the BFL Blog and....
Jalapenos 4.5 and 5 gh/s: Feb 12-14, 2013 no Jallys shipped today
have they halted production on the upgraded units?
Good news is that you will have a package under the tree for Christmas and it will be from BFL. Open it, sigh and throw it away because it will cost you more to plug it in than throw it out. If you paid with Paypal, say so and we will show you how to get your money back Best post in this thread! |
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Will it work like this?
Alice Ellen Krauss (AEK) pays 20 BTC ($12 USD each) in September of 2012 for a 5Gh/s miner preorder.
Tired of waiting in September of 2013, AEK sells her preorder to Carol Grace Miller (CGM) for 3BTC ($120 each), figuring she's $100 ahead, or so.
So AEK gives 20 BTC to the middleman in 9/12.
CGM gives 3 BTC to AEK in 9/13, and AEK calls it quits.
Who's the middleman between AEK and CGM that keeps the other 17 BTC, which are now worth about $2000 total?
Pretty much. Except that whoever invented this gamble of a strategy must also know there are very grave, potentially fatal (to BFL as a business) problems. The first problems is obvious, this could accelerate refunds rather than slow them down! ------------------------ Let me explain, If people like CGM in your recent example can't sell off their September 9/2013 paydate on the very same market, then they are 10 times more likely to ask for a refund (and actually get it). They are probably still within the refund window which paypal or CC companies will still take them seriously. ------------------------- Another gamble that opens the door to a refund "double tap": The other gamble is that BFL must realize that payment processors like Visa, Mastercard, AmEx etc, won't stand for BFL's reshuffle of orders. A CC company expects BFL to keep accurate records on customer orders. If AEK (Order date 9/2012) sells to CGM her order spot (Order date 9/2013) and BFL changes the name AND Address of the order to CGM's name. (Which you shouldn't do because a CC company won't protect you if you do this!) Well....after receiving payment from CGM...AEK could ask for her refund from her CC company and leave CGM without both her money and a legitimate order spot. When BFL has to respond to the CC company about the chargeback they will have to announce that the payment on file now belongs to CGM and not AEK. The CC company is going to be bewildered as to how BFL expects a payment to be switched over to another customer. What will likely ensue is that the CC company will say that they don't give a damn who the order was transferred to in BFL internal order system, they have AEK as the payment and they will issue AEK a refund at BFL's expense. Leaving CGM without her order spot, minus a large amount of $$$. CGM will then probably seek a refund from BFL for her own order paydate (9/2013) and BFL will get a second chargeback. The only one who would come out ahead in the double tap scenario will be AEK. Who got her ROI the instant she sold her order and then asked for a refund regardless for the 9/2012 pay date. BFL won't really have much of a defense about shuffling their payment processors orders. ========================= It is all a gamble that hinges on no one figuring out these vulnerabilities. Quite the gamble!
Not trying to pick your post apart. Actually just wondering if I am wrong about this.
Regards,Previously, BFL was allowing customers to exchange their orders informally. Which means they (BFL) didn't have to change their pre-order books nor the names or the addresses. It was an informal agreement between one customer to another that when BFL sent the order to the re-seller, they (the reseller) would take it upon themselves to forward the order to the new customer. Now in this recent change, BFL is actively (formally) changing their database and allowing customers access to change the address and name of the order to someone else. See the previous post as to why this is problematic. |
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The third vulnerability is just like the second scenario:
CC companies do not allow you to send a product to another unregistered address. BFL stopped giving people address changes for that specific reason.
Lets say you moved to another house in the same city, you then contact BFL with your new address that you have moved to, but you fail to contact your CC company with the new address to have it registered on file at the CC company.
When BFL ships you your product to this alternative address, they open themselves up to a dispute that you can then file after you have received your product in hand.
You can simply call the CC company and claim you never received it or that it was sent to the wrong address.
That is why some buyers send items to their friends house. So they can then use this as an excuse to defraud a company with an unregistered address and claim non-receipt.
-----------------------------------------
This very same hole is being opened up by BFL intentionally by shuffling around orders and changing things.
It would probably be very hard to deal with a CC company who rightfully states that their order Payment system shows something entirely different from BFL's ordering system.
BFL saying anything about shuffling orders around won't really hold any water. (IMO)
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Will it work like this?
Alice Ellen Krauss (AEK) pays 20 BTC ($12 USD each) in September of 2012 for a 5Gh/s miner preorder.
Tired of waiting in September of 2013, AEK sells her preorder to Carol Grace Miller (CGM) for 3BTC ($120 each), figuring she's $100 ahead, or so.
So AEK gives 20 BTC to the middleman in 9/12.
CGM gives 3 BTC to AEK in 9/13, and AEK calls it quits.
Who's the middleman between AEK and CGM that keeps the other 17 BTC, which are now worth about $2000 total?
Pretty much. Except that whoever invented this gamble of a strategy must also know there are very grave, potentially fatal (to BFL as a business) problems. The first problems is obvious, this could accelerate refunds rather than slow them down! ------------------------ Let me explain, If people like CGM in your recent example can't sell off their September 9/2013 paydate on the very same market, then they are 10 times more likely to ask for a refund (and actually get it). They are probably still within the refund window which paypal or CC companies will still take them seriously. ------------------------- Another gamble that opens the door to a refund "double tap": The other gamble is that BFL must realize that payment processors like Visa, Mastercard, AmEx etc, won't stand for BFL's reshuffle of orders. A CC company expects BFL to keep accurate records on customer orders. If AEK (Order date 9/2012) sells to CGM her order spot (Order date 9/2013) and BFL changes the name AND Address of the order to CGM's name. (Which you shouldn't do because a CC company won't protect you if you do this!) Well....after receiving payment from CGM...AEK could ask for her refund from her CC company and leave CGM without both her money and a legitimate order spot. When BFL has to respond to the CC company about the chargeback they will have to announce that the payment on file now belongs to CGM and not AEK. The CC company is going to be bewildered as to how BFL expects a payment to be switched over to another customer. What will likely ensue is that the CC company will say that they don't give a damn who the order was transferred to in BFL internal order system, they have AEK as the payment and they will issue AEK a refund at BFL's expense. Leaving CGM without her order spot, minus a large amount of $$$. CGM will then probably seek a refund from BFL for her own order paydate (9/2013) and BFL will get a second chargeback. The only one who would come out ahead in the double tap scenario will be AEK. Who got her ROI the instant she sold her order and then asked for a refund regardless for the 9/2012 pay date. BFL won't really have much of a defense about shuffling their payment processors orders. ========================= It is all a gamble that hinges on no one figuring out these vulnerabilities. Quite the gamble! |
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[Crazy Speculation]
MOTHERFUCKERS!
It was bullshit that was ssssooooo well crafted. That even my BS detector couldn't understand the scope of the scam.
Holy shit, BFL figured out a way to have [newer] customers pay for the refunds.
========================
The Scam Defined (IMO):
They (BFL) don't even have to touch their own bank to set this up. It is genius, true scam genius.
They open up "a marketplace" for old pay date holders and newer pay date holders to get together and send money to each other. (thereby keeping BFL out of the refund loop). Later pay date holders source $$$ and send the refund money to early pay date holders.
The newer customers under the illusion that they still want [nearly obsolete] hardware earlier than their current pay date (April 2013 for example) will go into the marketplace and therefore will seek an "Early Pay Date" in the market place (lets say October 2012). They will opt to send money (the disguised customer-to-customer refund process) to the buyer with an earlier pay date (october 2012). Thereby moving themselves up in the queue.
The original buyer with the *Early pay date* then steps out of line and drops out of BFL as a customer. (they got their refund from another customer...not BFL)
Then the buyer with the later pay date (April 2013) is then going to sells his/her *Later pay date* (April 2013) on the very same market place to someone with an even later pay date (lets say another pay date holder for July 2013).
======================
In effect, BFL has found an ingenious way to keep the apparent ponzi going without putting their own bank accounts as the source of the funds.
Newer Customers now refund older customers in their bid to get an early spot in this ongoing ponzi-like structure!
Madoff would be damn proud!
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Sociopathic Personality Traits- Sociopaths are very manipulative and conning. They never respect or recognize the rights of others. Instead, they consider their selfish nature as the right behavior.
- Sociopathic people display superficial charm and charisma, but underneath they are extremely hostile and domineering. They consider other people just as instruments to be used for their purpose. As such, they tend to dominate and humiliate others.
- Another very interesting characteristic of sociopaths is that they consider the things they want as their right to have. As such, they have a very grandiose sense of their self. Even the luxury items which they crave for is believed to be a need rather than a treat.
- Sociopaths are pathological liars. They tend to lie, just for the heck of it, even when it is not necessary. They can lie quite easily. With time, lying becomes a habit and it becomes very hard for them to speak the truth. In most cases, lying boosts their ego and leads to a high belief in their powers and abilities. Due to frequent lying, sociopaths become so apt in it that they seem to be very convincing.
- They do not exhibit any shame, remorse or guilt. This can mostly be due to their repressed rage that is at the core of many sociopaths.
Sociopaths do not or are not able to cultivate friends, as they consider other people as opportunities. The nearest that they come to friendship is having accomplices. - Sociopaths allow nothing to stand in their way of attaining their goals. They always use the wrong method of achieving this, as they consider the end always justifies the means.
- Sociopaths are very shallow people. They do not or cannot portray genuine emotions. Even if they show love and compassion, then it is feigned rather than experienced and they do so to serve an ulterior purpose. Their every act and thought is driven by falsehoods. Because of their lack of emotions they are also incapable of loving others.
- Sociopaths remain unmoved by anything that would upset a normal person. Yet they get outraged by very insignificant matters that would not even cross the mind of a normal human being.
- Sociopaths live on the edge and do not shy away from risks and dangers, because it provides the stimulation that they need. As such, most sociopaths are addicted to gambling and are also promiscuous. For them, brawling, punishments and fights are a daily part of the routine.
- Sociopaths are very impulsive and cannot control their behavior. They cannot sympathize with the pain that their victim feels. Instead, they feel only contempt and take advantage of their victims’ distress.
- Unreliability and irresponsibility are other characteristics that define sociopaths. Since they are constantly lying and exhibit self centered behavior, relying on them for some work or giving them a responsibility would not solve the purpose.
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I dont understand why they would need any of this
Are they not clearing all back orders in the next 2 weeks ....??
Are these assholes so bad that they are now creating s/w to help maintain the LONG CON....
Expect the SQL and DB server to be powered by a used Beowolf cluster. |
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I thought those PSU's were automatic/detect type  Far as I know most are nowadays................  Yeah it perfectly clear from the OP but it would appear the power supply is standard ATX PSU. right? I haven't seen a manually switched ATX power supply in about ten years. Power supply companies hate them because you know some x% will forget to switch it and that just means x% more RMAs. IF BFL is actually shipping manually switched (god I would hate to see how inefficient those low end pieces of garbage are) power supplies to customers in Europe without either setting them to 110V or putting a warning sticker on the plug connector well that is just sad. Sounds like a fire hazard with a potential for the loss of human life. (in my opinion) Hope it fails gracefully....then again...apparently not. |
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Speculatively Translated:
We have a retention problem. People aren't willing to wait until the order queue is fully processed. So they are "bailing on us" for other companies with better offers and forcibly pulling money out of our bank accounts.
We couldn't figure out a way to keep them waiting in line and leaving with their money. We are letting people with spots closer to being serviced in the backlog to sell off their order numbers for some monetary sum. Which means we will keep our newer customers and give "added" value to those who no longer want their orders. (thereby circumventing the forced refund process)
So go along with us. We need this cash. We need to keep our newer customers and our cash flow is probably running real low.
Transfer your unwanted position in line for some cash and keep us solvent, pretty please!
(This is my personal interpretation behind the bullshit.)
You speak fluent BFL... amazing where did you study PuertoLibre? At the Inaba institute of higher learning. We get our PHD with professor Inaba. |
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Speculatively Translated:
We have a retention problem. People aren't willing to wait until the order queue is fully processed. So they are "bailing on us" for other companies with better offers and forcibly pulling money out of our bank accounts.
We couldn't figure out a way to keep them waiting in line and leaving with their money. We are letting people with spots closer to being serviced in the backlog to sell off their order numbers for some monetary sum. Which means we will keep our newer customers and give "added" value to those who no longer want their orders. (thereby circumventing the forced refund process)
So go along with us. We need this cash. We need to keep our newer customers and our cash flow is probably running real low.
Transfer your unwanted position in line for some cash and keep us solvent, pretty please!
(This is my personal interpretation behind the bullshit.)
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Only 1 person was sufficiently "moved" or "motivated" enough to leave a review for BFL today: https://plus.google.com/108957607274308601800/about?gl=us&hl=en&review=1If this shows little motivation behind BFL's customers, then they (BFL) should probably not have much fear of any repercussions. I encourage people to leave feedback so that BFL takes notice of what they are doing that is upsetting or pleasing their customer base. I just saw your post for this............DONE!!!!!!!!!!  So far 12 reviews and the only person who has given a positive is seemingly clueless as to whether he will or will not make back his cash using a Jally. Yikes...idiots in every corner. |
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I want to catch the Yifu and give his bum the drilling of a life time
we will have a steamy romp whereby i will force my anaconda like whopper into his bum
and request where is my 10pc avalon order, tell me before i whisk you off to police station
but not before i finish uploading this sperms into your butt
i can tell the officer you send me a faulty microwave instead of batch 3 avalon i didnt manage to mine any blocks or cook up breakfast
its not fit for purpose and need hashing power or a refund asap
yifu i love you but this shits gotta stop
where is mine order!?
Man-Rape, perversion and beastiality all mentioned in one paragraph post. A new achievement has just been achieved. |
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Yifu just keep doing what you're doing, all these complaints are just wasting their own time. You're fulfilling your legal duties and fulfilling orders to the best of your ability unless proven otherwise. Apart from the B3 refunds which was a 'it happens' script error. I personally lost 5 figures on B3, but hey what can you do.
Sell ASICMiner hardware to fools and make it back? (Sorry, it was begging to be typed) Yifu just keep doing what you're doing ........... I personally lost 5 figures on B3, but hey what can you do.
that's why noone should listen to anything you say from now on - fyi, if yifu released the manufacturing info from TSMC showing what's actually going on i'm sure he may gain his respect somewhat back. this info will likely come out with his assistance or without. if it's not his fault people are more forgiving. his image and his reputation going into the future is in his own hands. to improve his chi and mend thigns with the community - only the truth can save him some dignity His Chi? Is he in need of spiritual body repairs? |
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Good job Unacceptable,
Your feedback at BFL was much appreciated. It was accurate, thorough and factual.
It appears that BFL just "fixed" the first reviewers order and shipped it out early. It seems they are being mindful about the reviews on Google Plus.
So if you have a defunct order (or are happy with your order) write in and let them know. I am sure they will be happy to get on your order as quickly as possible.
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I will be repeating this post into A LOT of bfl threads now...If you are MAD at BFL, then "wreak havok on the lives of the persons mentioned"
I don't stand for nor support for "wreaking hovok on the lives of the persons mentioned". A mod should probably look over the above post and delete it at their discretion. |
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Only 1 person was sufficiently "moved" or "motivated" enough to leave a review for BFL today: https://plus.google.com/108957607274308601800/about?gl=us&hl=en&review=1If this shows little motivation behind BFL's customers, then they (BFL) should probably not have much fear of any repercussions. I encourage people to leave feedback so that BFL takes notice of what they are doing that is upsetting or pleasing their customer base. |
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