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5021  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: BFL announces 28nm 600GH/S blade for $4680 on: August 17, 2013, 09:32:22 PM


Really?  Why would it be PCIex16.  I get the idea of making it PCIe so using standard motherboards to densely rackmount.  By why PCIex16?  Using a x1 slot would allow more cards per mother board.
People still have those riser cable from GPU mining rigs Grin

PCIE x1 would work fine with riser cables.  BTW it appears it is PCIe x1 their photoshop artist just doesn't know what that looks like.

Quote
3 of these cards will make it 1.8T,  almost 1000x faster than a 2.1GH 3x5970 rig, is it really possible? Both 28nm tech, why kncminer consumes 1KW for 400GH while they can make it 4x more efficient???

BFL has been pretty consistently wrong about power consumption.  Every estimate of every product has been low and later revised to more realistic power consumption numbers.  Of course this has also resulted in numerous delays, incorrect parts, and redesigns too.

KNC simply says less than 1KW.   
5022  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: BFL announces 28nm 600GH/S blade for $4680 on: August 17, 2013, 09:02:15 PM
Look at that beauty !

The power of photoshop.
5023  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: BFL announces 28nm 600GH/S blade for $4680 on: August 17, 2013, 08:54:51 PM
Here's an idea to explore if you want a refund: Upgrade via a bank transfer, then the next day claw back all the funds.

It is bank wire (a specific banking term) not a bank transfer (a consumer term with no specific meaning which covers anything from ACH to SEPA to billpay, p2p banking, and bank wires).  Bank wires are generally irreversible.  I would recommend nobody try that.
5024  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: BFL announces 28nm 600GH/S blade for $4680 on: August 17, 2013, 08:50:17 PM
I don't understand how they expect to cool 6 asics in that form factor. Smells like utter bullshit to con more money before the disappearing act.

The form factor is the same as a high end GPU and it uses roughly the same wattage.  It might not be quiet, a HD7970 at max fan isn't either but is "possible" to remove that level of heat load if designed properly. 

It certainly is "possible".  This shouldn't be taken as a statement that BFL will be successful.  The biggest risk is BFL can't deliver on time.  The potential for thermal complications only increase that risk.  A smaller card, say 4 chips and TDP of <250W would give them some breathing room if the "real deal" ends up hotter and more power hungry than the guesstimate.
5025  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: Incoming Avalon News 8/9/2013 on: August 17, 2013, 08:36:16 PM
Next gen that comes from Avalon or BFL... BOYCOTT.

Here is your chance.  BFL just announced 28nm pre-orders.  I am sure Avalon will too eventually.
Maybe all maybe by KnC? Cheesy

Wouldn't that be ironic, especially after all the fudding Inaba did about 28nm chips being unrealistic.
5026  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: Incoming Avalon News 8/9/2013 on: August 17, 2013, 08:33:09 PM
Next gen that comes from Avalon or BFL... BOYCOTT.

Here is your chance.  BFL just announced 28nm pre-orders.  I am sure Avalon will too eventually.

Interesting. You want to know what would help BFL right now? If they started to upgrade certain orders delivered a bit late. Like barely profitable or unprofitably late. Just an idea and it won't cost them any more unless they got the old chips stacked up.

Any links?

You can upgrade an existing order but
1) you lose your place in line
2) have to pay the difference if product price
3) this is just the punch in the gut, there is a 10% fee for upgrades.  

So people who's gear is now obsolete because they waited a year for delivery, get to lose 10% more for the priveledge of joining the end of the line for "delivery" in December.  It would be hard to make this stuff up.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=276692.0;topicseen
5027  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: BFL announces 28nm 600GH/S blade for $4680 on: August 17, 2013, 08:29:50 PM
Someone should let them know their mockup photo doesn't match that description.  That is clearly a x16 edge connector.
5028  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: BFL announces 28nm 600GH/S blade for $4680 on: August 17, 2013, 08:25:51 PM


Really?  Why would it be PCIex16.  I get the idea of making it PCIe so using standard motherboards to densely rackmount.  By why PCIex16?  Using a x1 slot would allow more cards per mother board.
5029  Bitcoin / Mining speculation / Re: Why is the demand still so high for Miners with returns like these? on: August 17, 2013, 08:21:35 PM
I paid cash for a BFL 60 gh/s unit at a pretty heavy markup in USD. While I don't think the unit will ever generate the number of bitcoins I could have bought by investing that money directly in bitcoins instead of the unit, I do expect the USD value of my BTC will eventually exceed what I paid.


So you will lose funds.  You could have bought BTC instead.

If you buy a miner (a device which produces BTC) it doesn't matter what currency you spend it has an equivelent price in BTC.

If the price if 1 BTC and over the life of the miner (becomes becoming obsolete and going dark) it produces 0.99 BTC net (after electrical cost) then you lost.   You could have instead just held or bought 1 BTC and had 1 BTC.  The future exchange rate can't improve your return.

Simple version:
you always have the option of simply buying Bitcoins so for a miner to be more profitable it has to return MORE bitcoins than it purchase price.
5030  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: Incoming Avalon News 8/9/2013 on: August 17, 2013, 08:02:31 PM
Next gen that comes from Avalon or BFL... BOYCOTT.

Here is your chance.  BFL just announced 28nm pre-orders.  I am sure Avalon will too eventually.
5031  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: BFL announces 28nm 600GH/S blade for $4680 on: August 17, 2013, 07:58:28 PM
How long until the first 20nm pre-announcement?  14nm in 2014 has a nice ring.
(in case anyone doesnt get that, I believe 28nm is the smallest die shrink currently available for ASICS. like any ASIC--they aren't just for bitcoin)

20nm is available today at incredibly high NRE costs and in limited capacities.  14nm will be available in 2014/2015.  Intel is dumping $5B into their new FAB42 plant which will produce nothing but 14nm processors on 300mm wafers. If Intel can do it surely some Bitcoin ASIC company can get enough preorders to build their own fab.  Look at Intel that is where the money is at. Smiley

I don't think a 14nm or 20nm SHA-2 ASIC is a realistic idea but we went from 130nm to 28nm in the span of a couple months so I just wonder what will be the next hype to drive in sales.
5032  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: BFL announces 28nm 600GH/S blade for $4680 on: August 17, 2013, 07:51:35 PM
How long until the first 20nm pre-announcement?  14nm in 2014 has a nice ring.
5033  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: Mandatory Update to Nuggets (NUGs) 1.0.1! Get your VGB - Vlad Golden Blocks on: August 17, 2013, 06:58:37 PM
Did vlad get his GPU farm online?!   Because someone just broke the difficulty barrier and is finding blocks again.

Nope, that wasn't me but I'm seeing 4 connections now.  Man, this would be so easy to mine right now.


So is dirt from your backyard.  It doesn't mean it has any value.
5034  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Is New York Going too far? on: August 17, 2013, 06:56:38 PM
China and Russia are the key to US regulation being pitched at a reasonable level, after the NY and Senate investigations are finished.

Once the regulators learn how much is being done in the bitcoin space in these countries, and that crippling US-based Bitcoin (and all crypto) businesses, will leave an empty highway for the foreign domination of this internet-based revolution in finance. The only way to have influence in the direction of this technology is to allow local companies to compete worldwide.

That assumes governments are informed, rational, and make logical decisions.   Take a look at online poker.  A nearly useless series of laws simply drove the money, jobs, tax revenue, and innovation overseas.   The key word in your conjecture is "learn" and historically regulators haven't been very interested in learning.  It is entirely possible they won't learn, and will stiffle/cripple innovation in the US and the money, jobs, tax revenue, and innovation will simply flow overseas.  The good news is Bitcoin is global and it will adapt around a broken US regulatory structure.  The bad news for entrepreneurs in the US (myself included) is that Bitcoin surviving doesn't necessarily mean they will survive.
5035  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Is New York Going too far? on: August 17, 2013, 06:53:29 PM
The important thing to understand is that the bitcoin economy can be regulated but the core protocol and currency itself cannot be controlled.  It will be impossible for governments to manipulate the currency

Right up to the point at which NSA turns its servers against mining pools.

My $.02.

While that would make the life of miners more difficult, solo mining is still possible, as in private pools, and decentralized pools like p2pool.  The nice thing about Bitcoin is that one can put a lot of relay nodes between the pool server and the rest of the bitcoin network.  Instead of pool server broadcasting blocks to any peer it only broadcasts them to a handful of "relay peers" which are essentially disposable VPS in a bunch of US unfriendly countries. 

Decentralized systems will always adapt to centralized threats.  Look at bittorrent and tor, they aren't silver bullets and it is a never ending struggle, but they have proven very difficult to attack effectively.
5036  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Technical Support / Re: Bitcoin memory usage on: August 17, 2013, 09:38:45 AM
0.8.1 apparently... I'll keep it until a major flaw is discovered... or pruning is implemented!!!
0.8.1 and 0.8.2 is vulnerable to a memory exhaustion attack. It's highly advised to update.
It's behind firewall, is the attack still possible then?

Yes.
5037  Other / Off-topic / Re: Has anyone heard of Karatbars International? on: August 17, 2013, 04:49:31 AM
If you want to buy gold then buy gold.  You don't need a multi level marketing scheme to buy gold.   Just buy it.   Is it a scam?  Depends on if you believe multi-level marketing is a scam.  In MLM most people never have a positive ROI%.  The profits flow to the few at the top and the expense of everyone else.
5038  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: ASX Project website on: August 17, 2013, 04:04:08 AM
Never heard of it before today but looking through google cache and forum threads it is almost certainly a scam.

If you sent them any funds you will never see it again.
5039  Economy / Securities / Re: ASICMINER: Entering the Future of ASIC Mining by Inventing It on: August 17, 2013, 03:29:26 AM
I'm well aware of transaction fees; their potential simply does not justify ASICMiner's P/E of 100, especially as their first mover advantage is about to come under fire. The magnitude of the hype around this company is unreal.

How do you come up with a P/E of 100?

P/E = (share price)/(earnings of last 6 months*) = 4 BTC/0.5 BTC -> P/E of 8

*should be "earnings of last 12 months but AM's only been mining for 6 mos.

Correct or no?

P/E is annualized so you should convert the earnings of the past x months to 12 months before computing the P/E.
Still I wanted to see how the person I was responding to computed a P/E of 100.  I have a feeling it will be "fun".
5040  Economy / Securities / Re: ASICMINER: Entering the Future of ASIC Mining by Inventing It on: August 17, 2013, 03:21:00 AM
I'm well aware of transaction fees; their potential simply does not justify ASICMiner's P/E of 100, especially as their first mover advantage is about to come under fire. The magnitude of the hype around this company is unreal.

How do you come up with a P/E of 100?
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