I just got a reply from BFL: Peter,
We estimate the bulk of the pre-orders will be shipped by the end of September. We are not granting refunds at this time. That is all I am able to share with you at this time.
Regards,
name (censored)
BF Labs, Inc.
What a bullshit. They spent four months producing two weeks worth of orders. Now they somehow magically do 25-times more orders in just one month, e.g. 1/4th of the time? That would be possible only if the units are already produced, but instead of being shipped, has been hashing secretly for someone else. Common sense would dictate sheer volume of orders once they opened it up. But unfortunately, common sense is not common on this forum. The hashing argument is one of the old standbys, debunked time and again, yet it still rears it's ugly head. Listen to K9 sometime... BFL is DAMN LUCKY to have 80TH on the network, and counting 150TH of Avalon chips he admits "Right now, all that I am aware of is the chips supposedly left Yifu's hands but never arrived in the customers". But that 150TH drops BFL down to like 30TH on the network. So by k9's theories alone you are mistaken about BFL hashing with customer rigs. |
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How them old upgrades going?
Try the new upgrades yet?
-another 1000 for trolling ancient posts. |
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What has happened with BFL chips? Were they on time?
I don't think the shipping date has arrived yet. *edit* Chips sales started Jun 15, so mid September would be the 100 days. |
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Ooop, there we go. You are already trying to back out of your commitment. No surprise there. Of course it's not a bitcoin miner you fucking idiot. It's a screen, that's what you asked for. It's the screen in the Minirig, which is what you requested. It's also the only device BFL sells that HAS a screen. How stupid are you, seriously? Do they even have a scale for your level of stupidity? Where is the "screen" in that device? http://buttcoin.org/butterfly-labs-mini-rig-is-a-huge-broken-unstable-piece-of-shitAre you aware this unit is LukeJR unit...? a Dev unit ? (and you can remove it you know ?) More simpleton...NEXT! Yup, an article probably written by a troll like k9, who is using pictures SOMEONE ELSE posted to show the unit and decribing it like it's his. On top of that, the poor handling of the box by the delivery service is of course 100% BFLs fault. After all, the USPS would NEVER drop, or smash or rip open or even fail to deliver any package entrusted to them. For all we know the unit was taken out and photographed before the person realized there was cardboard covering the screen. OH NO!!! THAT MAKES SENSE!!!! WE CANNOT HAVE SENSE IN A TROLL THREAD!!! WE NEED LIES AND INNUEDNO AND TO BELITTLE OTHERS!!! |
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This is what I love most. Start-up after start-up fails yet people cling to the next new thing out there and denounce everything else. Everybody uses the LONG CON example on BFL. Ok, so maybe they are a long con, does that make every other company legit?
No, but BFL has been giving new schedules and then failing to meet them for months on end now. Also, they are insulting and dismissive of any and all complaints. Those are two very serious red flags for scams, so many people think BFL is a scam. The 100TH/s mining pool delay was due to their boards that they designed having issues, not Bitfury chips having issues. There are several deployments of Bitfury that are successful. Avalon has failed to get their chips into the hands of developers of a lot of the English speaking DIY. There have been photos of Avalon chip batches arriving from multiple sources but there is no getting around the fact that a large chunk of DIY projects are ruined by the delay. It is impossible to know the cause of the delay at this time, but eventually more evidence will come to light and then we can start speculating. Right now, all that I am aware of is the chips supposedly left Yifu's hands but never arrived in the customers.Yet 150TH of those chips are on the network. Which chips? |
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Darin, you really need to seek help. You are in contact with children on a daily basis and you are unstable and delusional. I honestly fear for the children you are in charge of. You see me in every poster on this forum. You disbelieve benign government websites like the FCC's (You probably think I somehow hacked into the FCC's DB and changed things, no doubt.). You are one screwed up individual man. It's no wonder you had to travel to Asia to start your own school, no Canadian or US institution would allow you within 250 feet of a child after seeing your mental evaluation scores.
That weirdo work with children ?!?  In Asia...yeah...yeah...ok...i have the picture now... Yeah, check this out: http://www.canadianmontessori.org/about.htmlClick the mail to link on the top. Guess who's name pops up... and the whois registration for the domain, you guessed it, our friend Darin Bicknell. Talk about frightening. He couldn't get approved in Canada (I suspect because of his legal problems) and decided to move somewhere with less stringent laws governing people such as himself coming in contact with children. I believe his wife is listed as the "owner" of the school, which is probably why he was able to pass a background check to get the place started. For bonus points, check out his video's on Youtube. Dude is classic coiled spring waiting to go off. You think he is related to DrJoeGrine? |
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<intentional troll bait deleted> I have been doing math. Math which shows that either your 7PH/s orderbook stance is wrong, or BFL can't ship by the end of Sept 30th. Both cannot be true, because by BFL's own admission they can only ship maximum of 300 units a day. So you take the data you have from http://bfl.ptz.ro/. You don't like it so you double it. That is not far enough from 80TH/s (which was the last number calculated for BFL shipments using a method that made sense), so you want to triple it. You feel like you might be pushing things so you decide not to quadruple it. Nice method. Very MIT chic. After we put to bed the 7 Peta/Hash per second BFL order book prediction you made. We can focus on adding up the hash rate of the other ASIC players and seeing what is left. Until you can agree to the old math or point out where it is flawed, it is pointless to move on. You will just continue to claim 2+2=5 and play fast and loose about your own statements (which I will have to continue to post here to "refresh" your memory). 7PH 7PH 7PH 7PH 7PH 7PH... damn, that troll record is still stuck. <--- fast and dirty estimate. nothing else. untill you accept this fact you are just more troll bait. I know it is a fast and dirty estimate. I have been demonstrating that either the estimate is not accurate or BFL is lying about their ability to clear the backlog by Sept. 30th. Nothing in my posts is intentional troll bait. Until you either say that the 7 PH/s estimate is not accurate, or say that it is accurate but BFL can't ship we cannot move on Since you cannot seem to stay on this subject, lets make 3 simple questions for you to answer: Were there 7PH/s of BFL orders in your estimation? Were there 70,000 orders in your estimation? Were there 100,000 devices ordered in your estimation? Pre order not backlog... Preorder not backlog... Preorder not backlog... Preorder not backlog... Preorder not backlog... Preorder not backlog... Preorder not backlog... Preorder not backlog... Preorder not backlog... Preorder not backlog... Preorder not backlog... Preorder not backlog... Preorder not backlog... Preorder not backlog... Preorder not backlog... Preorder not backlog... Preorder not backlog... Preorder not backlog... You're record is stuck and now so is mine. You are using TOTAL POTENTIAL ORDERBOOK vice pre-order fact. Now, do I believe there POSSIBLY COULD have been 7PH ordered? yes. Do I believe there POSSIBLY COULD have been 70,000 potential orders? yes. Do I believe there POSSIBLY COULD have been over 100,000 devices ordered? yes. With all of the cancellations and refunds, do I still believe the above POSSIBLE ESTIMATES to be 100% valid? no. Since the POTENTIAL 100k units ordered have been decimated by cancellations and refunds, your continued harping is still trolling. Since the Backlog is only the preorders up until April 5th when the price changed, I do believe they have a fair shot of completing pre-orders by Sept 30. |
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Wow, interesting turn of events. Makes me think one thing... Everyone is looking for FCC approval of the Jalapeno and the LS and teh Single and the Mini... What if only the board needs to be FCC approved? That, like the scren, would not be "manufactured" by BFL...
Food for thought.
We have been asking this question for 9 months. If there were a simple answer, Josh would have given it 9 months ago. He refuses to even discuss it. Not once in 9 months. He will spend hours insulting his customers, but won't spend 15 seconds to clear up a valid question? And like I said, for pure troll value, *I* would have led you down the primrose path. |
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This is what I love most. Start-up after start-up fails yet people cling to the next new thing out there and denounce everything else. Everybody uses the LONG CON example on BFL. Ok, so maybe they are a long con, does that make every other company legit?
No, but BFL has been giving new schedules and then failing to meet them for months on end now. Also, they are insulting and dismissive of any and all complaints. Those are two very serious red flags for scams, so many people think BFL is a scam. The 100TH/s mining pool delay was due to their boards that they designed having issues, not Bitfury chips having issues. There are several deployments of Bitfury that are successful. Avalon has failed to get their chips into the hands of developers of a lot of the English speaking DIY. There have been photos of Avalon chip batches arriving from multiple sources but there is no getting around the fact that a large chunk of DIY projects are ruined by the delay. It is impossible to know the cause of the delay at this time, but eventually more evidence will come to light and then we can start speculating. Right now, all that I am aware of is the chips supposedly left Yifu's hands but never arrived in the customers. Yet 150TH of those chips are on the network. |
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Wow, interesting turn of events. Makes me think one thing... Everyone is looking for FCC approval of the Jalapeno and the LS and the Single and the Mini... What if only the board needs to be FCC approved? That, like the screen, would not be "manufactured" by BFL...
Food for thought.
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What happened with Terrahash that they are receiving refund complaints?
Yifu happened to TH. Could you be a bit more specific? Link? He means we are ALL waiting for the million chips to arrive in the mail... still no sign. No ROI and now people are selling off lots of 10K at 50% off... oh that be the issue for any DIY team right now. Most will probably implode in the next week or two as a result. Sad. Specifically check out any of the DIY thread or group chip buys... it is starting to get ugly. This is what I love most. Start-up after start-up fails yet people cling to the next new thing out there and denounce everything else. Everybody uses the LONG CON example on BFL. Ok, so maybe they are a long con, does that make every other company legit? ASICMiner shares have plummeted over 30% of their value in a week... what do the shareholder know we don't? At this monent in time they have mined 8% of the current blocks in the last 24 hours. 8% of 3825 or 306 BTC which is ~30k not bad... untill you consider 210k per week divided among 400k shares = less than .0057 BTC per share BEFORE expenses, yet somehow they paid out .0123BTC per share. Maybe this is the beginning of the deathknell and they are scraping every last dime from thier USB sticks, maybe not. Avalon... B1 YAY... B2 YAY... B3... ok, maybe yea... Chips... WTF DUDE? Now Labcoin... IPO and poof it appears, Terrahash appears screwed by Avalon. Liquid Synergy is screwed cause of Avalon. BPM is screwed cause of Avalon. KnC - Sept shipping. Hashfast - October shipping. Cointerra - December shipping. That pretty much leaves BitFury. They're supposed to have 90+TH on their network pool, 50TH of that in 5 days and now https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=280375.0 2 month delay. I guess at this moment the only TRUE option is ASICMiner, and with their prices, they got you by the balls. |
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<intentional troll bait deleted> I have been doing math. Math which shows that either your 7PH/s orderbook stance is wrong, or BFL can't ship by the end of Sept 30th. Both cannot be true, because by BFL's own admission they can only ship maximum of 300 units a day. So you take the data you have from http://bfl.ptz.ro/. You don't like it so you double it. That is not far enough from 80TH/s (which was the last number calculated for BFL shipments using a method that made sense), so you want to triple it. You feel like you might be pushing things so you decide not to quadruple it. Nice method. Very MIT chic. After we put to bed the 7 Peta/Hash per second BFL order book prediction you made. We can focus on adding up the hash rate of the other ASIC players and seeing what is left. Until you can agree to the old math or point out where it is flawed, it is pointless to move on. You will just continue to claim 2+2=5 and play fast and loose about your own statements (which I will have to continue to post here to "refresh" your memory). 7PH 7PH 7PH 7PH 7PH 7PH... damn, that troll record is still stuck. <--- fast and dirty estimate. nothing else. untill you accept this fact you are just more troll bait. You are still adding 2 + 2 and coming up complete order book. In reality 2 + 2 = pre-orders. You are still trolling. I simply showed a "If A were true, then B would follow scenario" and now to you I have said A ***IS*** 100% TRUE!!!!!!!!! You refuse to understand the diffence and continue your trolling. Since you continue to use fantasy numbers even after being told they ARE fantasy numbers, I must conclude you are only doing it for the troll value and treat your remaining responses as such. You claim your 80TH "made sense" yet you use wild supposition like 150TH for chips that may or may not even be in the hands of the peope who ordered them. You are speculating just as badly as I was with my 7PH. Using the MINIMUMS I listed before: 930 Jalapenos over the course 60 days of listed shipping. 15.5 per day minimum <-- a single person could do this in under an hour and a half. 123 L.S. over the course of 27 days of listed shipping. 4.5 per day minimum 298 Singles over the course of 41 days shipping. 5.5 per day minimum 45 500gh mini rig units over 34 days shipping. 1.3 per day minimum. <-- I bet *I* could build 2x that by myself in a day while learning how. This is the problem with using such a small sample of orders. While you and all the other detractors firmly believe this is the maximum output BFL could do, I'd bet my next paycheck they have been doing at a minimum 2-3x that. Now's the time for your "400 units" bleating to begin. The plain and simple fact here is you have been just as fast and loose with some of the numbers as I have, yet while I have admitted MANY MANY times those were guesses and estimates, you still consider them blood oaths and then turn around and prattle off numbers that also have no real basis of proof. |
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Also captured for posterity. Post contains no content except denials so: If you have ordered from ButterFly Labs and have not yet received your product, you are entitled to a refund whenever you request one (per FTC rules). First ask ButterFly Labs for a refund, they will probably say no but you might get lucky. If you ordered via PayPal you can file a complaint with them even if you are outside the 45 day window. Multiple customers have already gotten a refund from PayPal that was outside the 45 days. If you ordered via Bitcoin or Bank wire, you can fill out a complaint with the FTC at http://www.ftc.gov/complaint and they will advocate for you with ButterFly Labs to get your refund. You can also contact the office of the Kansas Attorney General and inform them that you have had your money taken with no product delivered for months, just more promises. You can also do a paper filing with the DA here: http://da.jocogov.org/complaint-formsThere are also several threads on how to get a refund from ButterFly Labs, here are two: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=266945.0https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=272585.0cool down the threadjacking, BFL refunds are a totally different topic for one of 100 other threads my 0.02btc : the new erupters look really cool, and i actually kind of want one  at least once they drop to 0.2BTC Good point. They do look cool. I would buy at 0.20 BTC. You already said you'd never buy anything for BTC that would not mine that amount of BTC. That'll never mine .2 BTC. |
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Ah, you finally respond to what I posted. Glad you admitted that you estimated 70,000 orders, we can stop arguing about that.
Well, is it bad math or not? My point was that the math was not consistent with your other claims. Since it is your math I am posting, I would like to know. Is BFL able to ship 100,000 devices in 35 days, or is your math wrong in your "guesstimate".
You called it bad math, you then used it. You decide. I used your math to demonstrate that it was not consistent with your other claims about BFL being able to ship. Therefore, one of your claims must be wrong. It upset you so much that you refused to even discuss it and deleted it from your posts. Now you can either pick: a) 7 PH/s orderbook, or b) backlog cleared by Sept. 30th. If you want to pick both, then you need to explain how BFL can ship 100,000 units by Sept. 30th. Typical. Childish games and nothing more. Pat yourself on the back.
No, I was simply posting 2 things you said and demonstrating that they are incompatible. You STILL haven't explained how BFL can ship 100,000 devices by september 30th. 1) your backlog is not my preorder, so your question is moot.
2) Forest... trees...
You referred to it in a thread about BFL shipping backlogs. You called them orders and orderlog. You asked for the definition of backlog. Everyone was talking about backlogs. You already admitted that you guesstimated 7PH/s. You still have not provided me with your estimate of how much network hash BFL has added to the network using the http://bfl.ptz.ro/ site as I did. To remind you, I said ~8000 Jalapeno, ~1600 LS, ~500 singles and ~77 Mini's. My estimated Network hash = 165TH Now I am sure you will simply continue your childish game of GOTCHA! So I really don't expect an answer. Plus, I doubt you could perform the calculations anyway. Cheers. Here is your claim again so you can't pretend otherwise: BFL: 7PH and rising.
Got a link or breakdown. 1) Has anyone compiled a guestimate of the amount of pre-orders. 2) I did a breakdown in a previous thread I cannot find ATM. Worked out to an average .1TH per BFL order and ~70k orders using the ~4900 known orders. 3) Refunds were not taken into account due to lack of information. 4) Monarchs were considered the "and rising" Why would I provide more math, when you cannot agree to simple addition and subtraction. Either drop the claim that BFL can ship their backlog by Sept 30th, or point out the flaw in the math (it is your math after all), or if there are 100,000 devices in the backlog explain how BFL can ship them by Sept. 30th. If your math is correct, why won't you defend it and why do I need to supply any new estimates? If your math is incorrect, why won't you admit to it? *I* still never said 100,000 you did. *I* also stated refunds and cancellations were not taken into account *I* knew I was overestimating, but you are still taking it as gospel. *I* am not the one using childish "GOTCHA!" tricks to prove nothing. http://bfl.ptz.ro/, while containing some bad data, is the ONLY source of KNOWN BFL orders. Using it, we can simply add up: Current blogs entries show MR up to July 28 32 known devices (1/3). + 13 known(2/3) 22.5TH minimum. (from ~13%[1/3] and ~25%[2.3] of possible orders.) Singles are up to 6 JUL, 298 known devices. 18TH minimum. (from ~14% of possible orders) LS are up to 11 Oct, 123 known devices. 3.075 TH minimum (from ~9.6% of possible orders) Jala up to Jan 31. 930 known devices. 4.65TH minimum. (from ~8.4% of possible orders) 48TH from minimally known orders. I think we can easily double that to 96TH and say minimum they shipped. Tripling it to 144TH possible. Quadrupling it to 194TH doubtful. your 80TH is looking shaky. But then, you refuse to do the math, likely cause you are afraid to show your ability. |
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Josh, would you be so kind as to state which, what and when the screen was passed by the FCC? Us monumental assholes ain't got a clue as to how the FCC site works and desperately need your expertise in helping us find the info.
As soon as you show us, I will send that $200 I owe you/BFL, and you can use if for whatevery you want. It doesn't have to go to any charity. You, Sonny, and your wifes/lady friends can go to a fancy restaurant and enjoy a fine meal using the funds. No problem here, bud.
All you have to do is show us monumental assholes where to look, and your golden, and we're square.
I'll also take a week off and not state one iota negative comment about you, Sonny, BFL, et al. I promise... I mean Honest Abe.
Bruno Kucinskas
406 W. Center St.
Sandwich, IL 60548
815-508-1668
I've been thinking... what if they are certified and he just doesn't want to tell you so he can laugh at you repeating yourselves? Naw, no one is THAT cruel... Oh, wait, *I* would be  If they were certified, the FCC would list them in it's database. The FCC maintains a list of all certified devices. If you had been around for longer or had read any BFL threads you would know this. REEEEEEEEEALLLLLLYYYYY? Gee willikers, thanks! Sometimes, it's just TOO easy |
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Josh, would you be so kind as to state which, what and when the screen was passed by the FCC? Us monumental assholes ain't got a clue as to how the FCC site works and desperately need your expertise in helping us find the info.
As soon as you show us, I will send that $200 I owe you/BFL, and you can use if for whatevery you want. It doesn't have to go to any charity. You, Sonny, and your wifes/lady friends can go to a fancy restaurant and enjoy a fine meal using the funds. No problem here, bud.
All you have to do is show us monumental assholes where to look, and your golden, and we're square.
I'll also take a week off and not state one iota negative comment about you, Sonny, BFL, et al. I promise... I mean Honest Abe.
Bruno Kucinskas
406 W. Center St.
Sandwich, IL 60548
815-508-1668
I've been thinking... what if they are certified and he just doesn't want to tell you so he can laugh at you repeating yourselves? Naw, no one is THAT cruel... Oh, wait, *I* would be |
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Ah, you finally respond to what I posted. Glad you admitted that you estimated 70,000 orders, we can stop arguing about that.
Well, is it bad math or not? My point was that the math was not consistent with your other claims. Since it is your math I am posting, I would like to know. Is BFL able to ship 100,000 devices in 35 days, or is your math wrong in your "guesstimate".
You called it bad math, you then used it. You decide. Typical. Childish games and nothing more. Pat yourself on the back. 1) your backlog is not my preorder, so your question is moot. 2) Forest... trees... You still have not provided me with your estimate of how much network hash BFL has added to the network using the http://bfl.ptz.ro/ site as I did. To remind you, I said ~8000 Jalapeno, ~1600 LS, ~500 singles and ~77 Mini's. My estimated Network hash = 165TH Now I am sure you will simply continue your childish game of GOTCHA! So I really don't expect an answer. Plus, I doubt you could perform the calculations anyway. Cheers. |
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Months ago I paid 1 BTC each for 2 miners and 1 BTC in shipping to my country (I live in a technological wasteland called Australia), my miners are so far from ROI I can't express it in words.
Don't worry, bcp19 says BTC will go to $1000 and you will get "ROI". Actually, worry. A lot.  That statement is a lot like your long con, until it happens, you can discount it and discount it and discount it. Up until it becomes true. Which will come true first? The supposed long con or BTC=$1000? I bet the latter. Captured for posterity purposes since bcp19 has been ninja editing his posts. Wow, more lies! I'm having trust issues with you now. Also captured for posterity in case he gets caught ninja editing again. Ther only edits I do is removing your cut and paste BS to try and clear up conversation. I am beginning to think you are doing this on purpose to confuse people. You cut and paste from 15 different threads, incoherently babble about things that have been patiently explained multiple times and downright obfuscate the remainder of your posts. I'd ignore you if it wasn't so funny watching what you do next. In addition, what am I supposed to have ninja edited? |
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What is interesting is that Bick is being attacked for having the same issues that BFL fanbois are defending BFL for having ie Supply issues. They make excuses for BFL and the evil suppliers but have no understanding that Bick had the same issues with Avalon delays. He was upfront and refunded all his customers while BFL is not. This is very biased behavior.
BFL is shipping, eh? Bick could not ship, eh? Sprechen zie Engrish? |
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The DIY boards have one massive advantage - they have the lessons learnt from BFL and its boards shemozzle. They know the true power consumption of the chips upfront and can design the power supply to suit. They have reference designs from BFL to work with too, if they want to be extra lazy. Lastly, they aren't working with the kinds of quantity that BFL is. The hardest work has already been done for them. And Bicknellski still couldn't even manage to ship a single board out. Hilarious, the pot calling the kettle black on shipping issues. Slow shipping versus no shipping... hardly a pot/kettle argument. But you can only cut and paste, so we have to allow for that. |
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