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361  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: Proof that MineThatCloud is a Ponzi on: January 17, 2015, 02:02:52 PM
just found this one and was wondering whats going on.

Minethatcloud is a confirmed ponzi scheme. That's about it.
362  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: cloud mining = ponzi on: January 17, 2015, 01:57:45 PM
Question about cloud mining :

If they have the spare capacity... Why aren't *they* mining with it? Why do they want to "share" the profit? Smiley

Clearly, it's more profitable for them to "rent" you the capacity than to mine themselves. So how can YOU achieve ANY profit?

There are reasons why legitimate mining operations would want to offer cloudmining.

For example, say a miner costs 1 btc and will produce 1.5 btc over the next 6 months.

A cloudmining company could offer the miner for 1.25 btc (for immediate profit), reinvest in hardware, sell new hardware for 1.25 btc. Rinse and repeat.

Cloudmining is like selling hardware but instead of shipping it, the company hosts it. That way people can have access to cheap industrial electricity rates.

With that said, ~95% of existing cloudmining companies are likely ponzis.
363  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: GAW Zen Hashlet PayCoin unofficial uncensored discussion. ALWAYS MAKE MONEY :-) on: January 17, 2015, 01:48:50 PM
Yeah "suchmoon" talk all day about how your the only one that can see scams. Like how GAW ran away with everyones money :') wah wah wah. Thank god we can be saved by you. Oh please save the world gov'

I do look forward to your apology post admitting that us "fudsters" have been right all along about GAW. I believe you and bitgeek are the only people who visit this thread and haven't swallowed the red pill by now.

Eventually you won't be able to continue ignoring the abundance of red flags, the countless accurate predictions made here, and the general stench of BS coming from GAW.

Why do you think almost all of the former GAW loyalists are now detractors? (tankjnr, daffy, allen1980, redacted, rootdude, animo, eoakland, and so on)

Try reading this thread full of GAW refugees: http://forum.gethashing.com/t/xpy-paycoin-discussion/90/
364  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: Proof that MineThatCloud is a Ponzi on: January 17, 2015, 01:47:11 PM
just wanted to say that op deleted all my posts hence he is a lying troll with dictatorial tendencies so ignore this thread people.

You mean the OP of the ponzi thread right? (The one you're advertising)

This thread is not self moderated.
365  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: GAW Zen Hashlet PayCoin unofficial uncensored discussion. ALWAYS MAKE MONEY :-) on: January 17, 2015, 02:56:51 AM
Is https://www.ziftrcoin.com going to be the same thing?
I threw 1.25 BTC at it when they first opened the presale just to see what sticks. Stay tuned...

On the surface, they appear light-years ahead of Garza/GAW.

Scott

Looks to me like the same scam but with a better web designer.

Is there anything that suggest they will be able to pull off their get rich quick scheme more successfully than GAW?
366  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: ███ Stay away from GAWminers.com / Paycoin / Paybase - SCAM ! ███ on: January 16, 2015, 10:32:19 PM

Check out this FUD and trolling: http://forum.gethashing.com/t/xpy-paycoin-discussion/90/

Oh wait those aren't trolls, they are hashtalks "most reputable users".
367  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: ▁ ▂ ▄ ▅ ▆ Cloudmining 101 (ponzi risk assessment) ▆ ▅ ▄ ▂ ▁ on: January 16, 2015, 10:25:35 PM
again, how usefull would it be, if there was a site, where from now on, if you typed that adress, you would get a fat red warning, links to this thread, and more ...

blocktrail.com already sort of does that. (no warnings, but it will link you to all the places the address was mentioned)
368  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: ▁ ▂ ▄ ▅ ▆ Cloudmining 101 (ponzi risk assessment) ▆ ▅ ▄ ▂ ▁ on: January 16, 2015, 10:14:41 PM
Proof of ponzi for MineThatCloud:

The payments were made form 1844aNo5gAssVSmUmLwk6qG61uBNdQswH3.

0.0087 BTC was sent from 12wmRSVf1e6MTpmvGuUxreEXxbaRHkepuC to 1JgxteZWCuZLu4FnPUWv3Jxgj89QkFXLvX which sent 0.0087 BTC to 1844aNo5gAssVSmUmLwk6qG61uBNdQswH3 which sent 0.0001402 BTC to 12wmRSVf1e6MTpmvGuUxreEXxbaRHkepuC.


More:

1PdvNQYCnWP9NftxE6gu5DvYVSnkgwnXu3 > 0.0087 > 1GSWxmZU3oHiyBA7PhoqE5ZrAN5YHtjbYx > 0.0087 > 1844aNo5gAssVSmUmLwk6qG61uBNdQswH3 > 0.0002804 > 1PdvNQYCnWP9NftxE6gu5DvYVSnkgwnXu3

1PdvNQYCnWP9NftxE6gu5DvYVSnkgwnXu3 > 0.0087 > 1LTcF4xkch1d5Gb5yTkbGCUsjspHp9KWVp > 0.0087 > 1844aNo5gAssVSmUmLwk6qG61uBNdQswH3 > 0.0002804 > 1PdvNQYCnWP9NftxE6gu5DvYVSnkgwnXu3

1s3DP7QaqwsRrTEn6UQBd9zPCmmvv6KW3 > 0.0087 > 1DzwbKnTXSJtnW2QXjE5EtV1TSSa5bDfki > 0.0087 > 1844aNo5gAssVSmUmLwk6qG61uBNdQswH3 > 0.0043462 > 1s3DP7QaqwsRrTEn6UQBd9zPCmmvv6KW3
369  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: Do you think you were scammed by GAW? Tell Ars Technica on: January 16, 2015, 09:50:16 PM
Indeed. BUT! It is a free market. If I were to sell you a handful of dog feces, and you offered 100.000 USD for it, it would still be a valid exchange.
Besides, I did not make money "off of them". You know it is called demand and supply. Or based on your statement, all trades that carry any kind of gain for any of the parties should be stopped immediately?

The trade was simple - someone (whom I do not know - the hashlet market is anonymous for the buyer) wanted a hashlet. I sold it for way under the official price (Zen Hashlets were going for 14.99 at that time, I sold mine for 7.59 minus the fees), and made about 2$ on the trade. The buyer was happy as he received an item at half the official price, while I was happy as I had 2 extra dollars in my pocket. Is it a win-win?

The problem is you are selling dog feces along with the PROMISE of making money off of it.

Fact is, all hashlets earned dust for anyone who didn't get in during the first few weeks of zencloud or switch to mining IOU's.

This leaves all those people hoping to get rich quick stuck in a situation where they can only profit if they pass on their unprofitable investment to another naive/greedy cryptonoob. So we have a thing that will produce maybe $5 over it's lifetime, valued at $40 because a horde of greedy cryptonoobs must hype the shit out of it to see their money back.

It's a free market yes, but it's all just people passing on their shit to the next unsuspecting victim.

Quote
It is not a lie if you underperform because of the unaccounted circumstances. 

I can buy this excuse for the first time the mistake happens. Maybe even the second time. But GAW has over promised and failed to deliver over and over again with no signs of stopping.

How many other companies make so many "mistakes" which always reward them with massive profit?

The fact that these "mistakes" happen and GAW tries to go back and erase/modify history as shapeshift says "This moves it from fool's errand to the realm of deception"

Quote
GAW proved multiple times that they do have the mining capacity: there were multiple pictures, non-doctored ones, showing their mining park set up in a warehouse (or was it an old airplane hangar? I can't recall, but it had a quite large internal height).

GAW proved they have mining capacity, not THE mining capacity they claimed to have.

They claimed to have 40 PH/s+ worth of hardware. They have so far proven they own a single row of bitmain miners (~0.1 PH/s) and a SINGLE 5 PH/s order with bitmain.

Sure, this is easily enough hardware to payout everyone currently mining 1 satoshi per day (might only require an S4 or two) but the chances they actually have 40 PH/s sha-256 or ~1000 GH/s scrypt are slim to none.

Quote
It is quite interesting that you say people were misled and lost money

6 month hashstakers will, according to the rules, produce no more than ~1.75 xpy.

You were sold hashstakers for $20 based on the promise that xpy would be worth $20.

Now that xpy is worth ~$4, you paid ~5 xpy for a thing that can produce 1.75 xpy over 6 months.

You were misled and lost money.

Quote
I'm yet to meet one who truly owned a Hashlet and lost money on it

You could visit the bitcointalk thread. 90% of the "trolls" are actually former GAW customers who feel they've been scammed.

Otherwise there's this forum where the former hashtalk trusted members have taken refuge (tankjr, rootdude, daffy, allen1980, redacted, etc)

http://forum.gethashing.com/t/xpy-paycoin-discussion/90/
370  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: GAW Zen Hashlet PayCoin unofficial uncensored discussion. ALWAYS MAKE MONEY :-) on: January 16, 2015, 07:22:23 AM
GAW: Please Merchant, take our API, we have customers waiting to buy from you.

Merchant: Who are you again?

GAW: We are GAWMiner, the fastest growing and most innovative Cryptocurrency ever!

Merchant: Wow, is that so? Hang on one sec (Googles GAWMiner)...... *Hangs up the phone*

According to GAW, they must have had tens of thousands of merchants inquiring about accepting paycoin, yet all we have is a handful of halfassed newly created paycoin businesses. (Maybe all the tier 1 merchants were purposely waiting for a random basement dev to build the API's GAW promised? Surely they will get on board now.)
371  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: GAW Zen Hashlet PayCoin unofficial uncensored discussion. ALWAYS MAKE MONEY :-) on: January 16, 2015, 06:49:36 AM
As of a few days ago this as an independent one man show's product paycoingateway.com. So Homero quickly bought it and claims it as his own on his blog? Just before Miami of course. The guy hacking that in his spare time for tow months now and just two days ago even he was soliciting help on certain things with it in their employment forum.

3 days ago he was begging for donations to get to Miami to go to the conference. Then Homero steps in and hands airfare and hotel money.

 So within the last 24-48 hours Homero bought this guy out lock stock and barrel asap in order to announce he has his merchant plugin? Unbelievable

Where is the real team of 60 expert developers working non stop on this? What will they do now since Homero bought this immediate solution?

The guy is incredible. Quickly Copy & Paste a piece of the coin-swap exchange into this little portal, quickly buy out some struggling one man show plugin in developer, all within a day before the conference. Wrap it up all nice and neat with screeds of drivel in his blog, and he is proud as punch patting himself on his back. Giving him enough confidence to go and meet the masses in Miami.

Or not (yet).  Cheesy

Will he make it to Miami and out the hotel? Out the door? How about the perimeter of the conference building.

What will the Magic Man Homero pull next.


Read this guys time line up to where he was struggling for funds to go to Miami to meet his hero. Then note the change of tune in the last couple days.

https://hashtalk.org/user/paycoingateway

Nice find. For a second I was actually impressed to see that GAW's massive team of superdevs managed to create a functional service, but of course it's all a ruse as usual.

At this point I don't even feel bad for the losses of anyone who hasn't jumped ship yet. The evidence/warning signs are there for anyone who is not too blinded by greed.

This is like when you tell a child not to touch a hot pan but they refuse to listen. Sometimes the only way they'll learn is by getting burned.
372  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: GAW Zen Hashlet PayCoin unofficial uncensored discussion. ALWAYS MAKE MONEY :-) on: January 15, 2015, 09:57:41 PM
So now this has got to be total bull shit. He's claiming to get thousands of customers signing up per day. Who the heck would believe this?

@ gawceo I must have missed that memo. Along with the few thousand customers that sign up a day

https://hashtalk.org/topic/29166/quick-poll-on-brand-loyality-and-community/20

200k customers + 2k new customers per day, yet only ~6000 xpy wallets are being used.

Seems legit.
373  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: GAW Zen Hashlet PayCoin unofficial uncensored discussion. ALWAYS MAKE MONEY :-) on: January 15, 2015, 09:26:27 PM
PCfan GAW 2015 Innovative Roots (Admin OP-ED)

https://archive.today/aoFWw


Paycoinnovation: Blatantly stealing other peoples work and passing it off as your own to other less informed individuals.

Example: Homero Hashking Garza tried innovating until he realized paycoinnovating is much easier and more profitable.
374  Economy / Service Announcements / Re: [ANN] ☁ MineThatCloud ☁ SHA-256 - 0.00087 BTC/GHs ☁ 75 GHs Trials Available ☁ on: January 15, 2015, 12:55:38 AM
As for maintenance fees.

Datacenter in UK.

£6,608 Per Month, We have 4 Full Racks Rented out
£0.17 Per Kwh

Datacenter in France.

€8,526 Per Month, We have 4 Full Racks Rented out
€0.26 Per Kwh

Let me know if I'm understanding this correctly.

You pay ~$18,000 USD per month for hosting of your 154 TH/s.

154 TH/s earns $315/day or $9500/month.

So you are asking for $25,000 for 154 TH/s which produces a loss of $8500/month for 12 months? (assuming difficulty doesn't increase which it will)
375  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: Do you think you were scammed by GAW? Tell Ars Technica on: January 14, 2015, 10:03:00 PM
The question you should ask is: What is GAW's principle source of income?

Hashlets, paycoins, stakers, and all the outer recent products are nothing more than pictures on a web page and entries in a database or blockchain. GAW makes a large income promoting and selling intangible objects as investments. There is no evidence of any other income large enough to pay the dividends on all these investments.

So, for every winner crowing about unbelievable returns there must be losers still hoping for returns that will never come.

That's a scam.

+1
376  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: Do you think you were scammed by GAW? Tell Ars Technica on: January 14, 2015, 02:09:14 AM
I have coins in an offline wallet that are steadily paying interest whilst also increasing in value.

You paid 4 paycoins for something that will generate 1.75 paycoins over 6 months. (you were scammed)

Quote
I have coins online that, whilst not at the much maligned $20 floor, can be escrowed for a guaranteed $20 on February 1st

Translation: you can invest your money once again for the promise of 500% profit but it might take months/years to payout.*

*Assuming GAW doesn't declare bankruptcy.

Quote
What is it about a coin designed to introduce everyday people to cryptocurrency that so incenses the bitcoin community?

The crypto community has absolutely nothing wrong with coins designed for everyday people.

We have a problem with:

- Coins designed to entice people via get-rich-quick schemes
- Repeated false advertising/broken promises
- Featureless shitcoins claiming innovation
377  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: Do you think you were scammed by GAW? Tell Ars Technica on: January 14, 2015, 01:09:51 AM
https://archive.today/SWQth 

Quote
Second, I already over-stepped our NDA once by disclosing partnerships, and I won't do it again. All I will say is that if any company announced our partnership, they would be in violation of their NDA with us, too. We will respect and honor our agreements until the time that we can disclose them.

Paycoin will be able to be used at tier-one merchants, either directly or through a debit card in the coming months.

Quote
@GAWCEO said: I can confirm that I personally verified the original announcement and the word "partnership" was never used


Check with those web developers what their recommended punishment should be for liars.

Quote
Our partners got upset that I released their names ahead of time, so now I have to mind my P's and Q

https://hashtalk.org/topic/16853/all-is-well-in-the-land

Quote
Short summary:
We said a few things before our partners were ready for folks to hear it.

https://hashtalk.org/topic/17485/large-merchants
378  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: Do you think you were scammed by GAW? Tell Ars Technica on: January 14, 2015, 12:58:36 AM
As for Vaultbreakers, Looks like everything went according to plan:




Don't know why you would bring up a Known Scam group such as KNCminer to try to prove some point.

Did you not read what Josh Garza posted on KNC's forum? He lays out how he thinks KNC is scamming them, then actually creates the scam himself.


Quote
You people need to do your market research to see what happened to the Floor as bigtime miners dug under it and caused it to collapse.

Maybe you should do some market research before spouting nonsense.

There were a total of ~350k xpy mined in the sha-256 phase and from what I could tell ~50k was mined by GAW (could be more).

If 100% of the leftover 300k xpy was dumped on the market, then that would eat through only $6m of their whopping $100m floor.

The real cause of the collapse was GAW only putting up half a million dollars to hold the floor instead of $100m.

Quote
Also making a 'Market floor' is highly illegal in commodity trading so we could not make a floor.

Please do provide a source for this.

I'd also love to know how GAW's latest investment scheme buyback program gets around that law.

Quote
There were big dumps on the exchanges of XPY  at the start which caused the rapid price drop. This should not happen as often now as the coin is mineable through POS only now. Having the POW stage last as long as it did and not limiting the amount of hashrate was a mistake as I beleave there were big mining co. that used there power to mine XPY and cause a huge XPY serge to cause a price drop. This action of purposeful abuse and illegal market manipulation by the BTC community as they felt threatened by XPY being a better long term alternative and we as a community beleave it is still the better long term option as the Current upcomeing crash of BTC is showing it multiple weaknesses.          

You're telling me it's illegal to mine xpy and then sell it later?

#innovation #revolutionary
379  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: Do you think you were scammed by GAW? Tell Ars Technica on: January 14, 2015, 12:45:01 AM
So, I believe only the primes were advertised as never obsolete..

Nope.

380  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: Do you think you were scammed by GAW? Tell Ars Technica on: January 14, 2015, 12:14:27 AM
I've been a customer for almost a year and started with GAW Fury's and then went to cloud miners and then to mining Hashpoints for Paycoins. It has always been profitable and support and service have always been great!

Please do yourself a favor and stop reading the lies and crap from people who have never been a customer and look into the FACTS!! Believe me, You don't want to be left behind at this point!!  Wink

You've been a customer for "almost a year" even though GAW fury's went up for sale last May? Seems like a bit of an exaggeration. (like the $100 million floor)

Here are some FACTS for you:

Hashlets were advertised as:

- Always Profitable
- Reducing maintenance fees
- Never obsolete

In reality you got

- Profit for 2 months (and an extra month if you switched to hashpoints)
- Never reduced maintenance fees
- World first miner to become obsolete.

Anyone who didn't trade their "digital miners" for "cloud stakers" is currently enjoying a total earnings of 1 satoshis per day. Maybe in 30 years they will have enough satoshis to pay for the transaction fee.

Hashstakers were all sold based on the lie that there would be a $20 floor. At $5/paycoin, hashstakers are looking at more than a 50% loss. GAW blames the CFTC and says a $20 floor would be manipulation but apparently it's completely fine if they have a $20 floor buyback program that stretches the payments over months/years. (for a limited time only)

Keep in mind, there's nothing wrong with a high risk investment being unprofitable, unless you're like GAW and promising profit.

As for Vaultbreakers, Looks like everything went according to plan:

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