ANTMINER S7 is available at bitmaintech.com with 4.86TH/s, 0.25J/GH

[VirosaGITS]

Can a buck converter provide variable voltage depending on the clock the miner is set at? Some people said by underclocking it raised their efficiency and that should not happen unless the voltage is variable to an extent or there is more efficiency loss at higher speed.

If it is tied into the main controller then it could be adjusting the voltage, until someone traces the circuit / makes some measurements we will not know.

But agreed as we have all discovered just changing the clock frequency and leaving the voltage the same leaves the efficiency virtually the same. What sort of improvement to efficiency have people seen?


Rich

I look forward seeing whether or not the people who said you could underclock to increase efficiency were right. I did not say anything then because i'm not sure its untrue. Maybe they think raising efficiency is just lowering hashrate/clock/consumption.

But we'll see, i think phil or whoever gets a B8 to do test before me will do it, if not i will test it when i receive mine in a week or two(?).

[dontetris]

Did anyone receive the "late shipping compensation" yet?

[SLEI]

Biodom or Anyone else,

Help me remember...  Did Batch 6 have 135 chips or 162 chips?  My question was never really answered about number of chips.  I'm curious if I would get similar efficiency with under clocking as Biodom mentions here with Batch 6 but similar with Batch 8?

Batch 6,8,9 are all 135 chip. Efficiency should be similar so long as the Buck Converter is set to the same voltage, which it may well not be, in all batches?

Rich

Miners can't be identical if batch 8 can have 200W difference in power usage at same frequence.

[SLEI]

Have anybody experience of zwilla.de firmwares for S7 they have very big promises?

Never heard of them. What are they claiming their firmware does?

20% more power (GHS?) 30% less power usage.

[marvykkio]

to me they should send 3X S7 day 4, we see if it is true

[VirosaGITS]

Have anybody experience of zwilla.de firmwares for S7 they have very big promises?

Never heard of them. What are they claiming their firmware does?

20% more power (GHS?) 30% less power usage.

Firmware that magically improve efficiency by 56%(0.16J/GH)? Yeah i don't think so.

[RichBC]

Biodom or Anyone else,

Help me remember...  Did Batch 6 have 135 chips or 162 chips?  My question was never really answered about number of chips.  I'm curious if I would get similar efficiency with under clocking as Biodom mentions here with Batch 6 but similar with Batch 8?

Batch 6,8,9 are all 135 chip. Efficiency should be similar so long as the Buck Converter is set to the same voltage, which it may well not be, in all batches?

Rich

Miners can't be identical if batch 8 can have 200W difference in power usage at same frequence.

Which other Batch are you comparing the Batch 8 Miner to?

Rich

[philipma1957]

Have anybody experience of zwilla.de firmwares for S7 they have very big promises?

Never heard of them. What are they claiming their firmware does?

20% more power (GHS?) 30% less power usage.

Firmware that magically improve efficiency by 56%(0.16J/GH)? Yeah i don't think so.

Well the batch eight went into the other direction about .3 watts vs .25 watts.

Based on some testing I did with early batch I am pretty sure the freq 575 batch 2 could run at .2 watts at freq 550 .

My grip with the s-7 is the batches vary so fucking much that you don't know want you are buying until you get your hands on it.


@ richbc I think the 200 watt difference he is talking about is on the same batch number order a few days apart.

I had this happen with batch 1 I had a dog at 4500 and a good one at 4800.

@ bitmaintech no comp no coupon really a lack of honor on your part.

Sad to see you act like that.

[Biodom]

At 700MHz they're pretty much tapped out, and overclocking is not an option until we figure out how to control voltage. My OG S7s run at 6TH/s in comparison with overclocking.

I totally agree with you.  I'm coming close to making the decision to go ahead and under clock these back to 600 MHz from the 700 MHz factory setting.  If I'm not mistaken, the batch 6 (135 chips) were clocked at 600 MHz and hashed at 4.0 TH/s?  I'm thinking about treating the new 135 chip rigs as batch 6 and under clock all of them to 600 MHz for longevity.

I got batch 6...it is totally stable being overclocked to 625, a bit less stable (or maybe less efficient?) at 650, so I will try either of these two instead of just 600, if you have room on PSU. The funny thing, if you remember as everyone was saying that B1 "likes' heat-~60C. In my observation, B6 "likes" being cold-I got better speed and less errors at 41-45C (same goes for B7, interestingly).

625-4.15-4.2 TH (1090W at the wall); 4.3 TH at 650 (1150W)

Biodom or Anyone else,

Help me remember...  Did Batch 6 have 135 chips or 162 chips?  My question was never really answered about number of chips.  I'm curious if I would get similar efficiency with under clocking as Biodom mentions here with Batch 6 but similar with Batch 8?

sorry, others already answered (135). So far B6 is doing well at 625 (~4.18Th average) with low power use (~0.26 J/Gh).
Re underclocking...I am sure that it does not pay to underclock right now from the profitability point of view. However, machine reliability is a whole another story. I had difficulty pushing B6 past 650, so I am amazed that they made essentially the same machine (B8) work (mostly) at 700.
Someone had made a spreadsheet in SP20 thread that calculated the optimal speed vs profitability, but in Sp20 there was a big difference in efficiency vs speed. S7 is quite profitable right now (if you are not taking hardware cost into consideration) based just on electricity usage. However, with current difficulty increases, it might run out of steam at 0.1/kwh by summer. That's where downclocking might give it a month or two extra and then they will be sold to super low electricity cost areas.

[lightfoot]

Hm. Are s7's worth my time to learn to fix for other people?

Most of the miner problems seem to be the same things: Heat and power distribution. Thoughts?

your skill set. your tool set.  if both are good yeah I would say go for it.

I'll watch the thread for a bit. I've got the tools and probably some skills, but it's a balance: If Bitmain is doing RMAs then of course the best option is to go with them.

However if anyone has a fireballed S7 or one that is not rma-able due to "dirt" or something like that they want to send to me to research on, drop me a PM.

As I say on my Neptune/Titan threads, what's the worst that can happen? :-)

[opentoe]

Can I see a picture of your Foam setup?  Also the this screeching sound is not normal as the other S7s are not like this one.  I see other people having same issues and the noise goes way beyond the garage door due to the high pitch vs 2 other S7 which can't be heard thru my entrance door which is a strong fire resistant door.  I will see what support says.  Not sure if it's due to New Year but it's been almost 2 days with no response, they were faster on the response when I was short $18 for my order due to fees just 2 days ago.  What's everyone's experience on the turn around time for response?  Is this normal?

This is brand new and within Warranty period, they should fix it.  I don't think that's asking too much.  If we keep giving in on trying to fix everything or come up with Mickey Mouse solutions, we will continue getting inferior products and  services.

The fan easily comes off with 4 screws. Remove the fan. Put the fan on top of the foam sheet and outline the fan. Cut away the excess foam. Install foam template onto miner then the fan. Install the fan with the 4 screws. Some times by just having that small gap between the foam fan and the miner frame makes a huge difference in sound. Hey, I agree, you shouldn't have to be doing any of this to a miner that cost that much money, but this is what a bitcoin miner does. This is an example of the foam. Also, difference thickness produces better/worse sound(s) from fan. This did not affect fan performance.

http://www.amazon.com/Foam-Sheets-2-Inch--2-Inch-50-Pack-Rainbow/dp/B00284NN82/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1451681628&sr=8-3&keywords=foam+crafts

[opentoe]

Can I see a picture of your Foam setup?  Also the this screeching sound is not normal as the other S7s are not like this one.  I see other people having same issues and the noise goes way beyond the garage door due to the high pitch vs 2 other S7 which can't be heard thru my entrance door which is a strong fire resistant door.  I will see what support says.  Not sure if it's due to New Year but it's been almost 2 days with no response, they were faster on the response when I was short $18 for my order due to fees just 2 days ago.  What's everyone's experience on the turn around time for response?  Is this normal?

This is brand new and within Warranty period, they should fix it.  I don't think that's asking too much.  If we keep giving in on trying to fix everything or come up with Mickey Mouse solutions, we will continue getting inferior products and  services.

Good Luck. You will not get a response over the whistling fan noise unless you are a high profile customer meaning you order a ton of miners. The little guys cannot get a bad fan replaced and they will tell you to buy one locally.
Yoshi did me a solid by helping out, but even he will tell you China is doing anything for a fan.
May as well put a piece of tape or one of the other suggestions.

I sincerely do wish you the best and I am with you as far as making as much noise as possible.
When I was done wrong I also documented everything and people here on the forum told me to forget it, they had already learned Bitmain isn't going to help. Look at all the people who are waiting on complete miners or hash boards, they could care less about a fan...unfortunately.
As long as they have the market cornered, they make the rules.

^unfortunately true and on-point.
these delta fans are worth at least $10/ea  and are heavy to ship from china, so replacing one will likely cost them up to $15 plus time spend arranging it. Due to minimal manpower, they have bigger things to deal with (this isnt good service though)

These fans are naturally loud, but sometimes theres a defect in there that doesnt read PWM, has a chipped/off-balance fan, bad bearing, etc and as a result can be much higher pitched whine/screech than normal.

your best bet is aftermarket replacement. go find a fan that can meet your airflow needs. 20% fans is about 70-80cfm, 40% fans is 90-100cfm, 80% is likely over 120cfm. a replacement will cost you $15-30 and be a better quality/noiselevel without waiting 1-2 weeks from china

ps: Spondoolies-Tech replaced my bad SP20 fan (had a defect, likely a bad bearing, and was horrifically loud compared to even an Sp10). They were the most stand-up manufacturer for support, but bitmain doesn't give much after-market focus

I stocked on up the S5/S7 fans a while back. I sold about 10 of them already and have I think 10 or 12 left. They are brand new. Never used. I am in the US, so I would only ship in the US. If you want to buy any message me. I do charge a premium, but you can get these a lot cheaper if you look around a little, but more risk.

Default S5/S7 Fan
http://www.nidecpg.com/fanpdfs/va450dcf.pdf

[dmwardjr]

Well the batch eight went into the other direction about .3 watts vs .25 watts.

Just to make sure we are on the same page:

Batch 6 was factory set at 600 MHz for 4.06 TH/s with 135 Chips
Batch 8 was factory set at 700 MHz for 4.73 TH/s with 135 Chips

Hence the .25 watts versus .3 watts because of Batch 8 clocked at a higher frequency.

My question is, can I under clock Batch 8 down to 600 MHz and get the same .25 watts efficiency as the Batch 6 at 600 MHz?

[J4bberwock]

Well the batch eight went into the other direction about .3 watts vs .25 watts.

Just to make sure we are on the same page:

Batch 6 was factory set at 600 MHz for 4.06 TH/s with 135 Chips
Batch 8 was factory set at 700 MHz for 4.73 TH/s with 135 Chips

Hence the .25 watts versus .3 watts because of Batch 8 clocked at a higher frequency.

My question is, can I under clock Batch 8 down to 600 MHz and get the same .25 watts efficiency as the Batch 6 at 600 MHz?

If the efficency is really different, it's very likely that the buck converter is set to another voltage.
I'm back home. Will answer PM, quote requests, arrange a few deliveries first.
Then, I'll look more in depth at what can be done on this buck converter.
Better efficiency should be easy by setting the output voltage slightly lower.
Overvolting might be tricky because the MOSFETs could already be close to their limits at 800MHz. I didn't check the data sheets.
(my batch 8 ran without any issue 10 days at 800, I set it back to 700 so it's not too loud now that we are back.

[RichBC]

Well the batch eight went into the other direction about .3 watts vs .25 watts.

Just to make sure we are on the same page:

Batch 6 was factory set at 600 MHz for 4.06 TH/s with 135 Chips
Batch 8 was factory set at 700 MHz for 4.73 TH/s with 135 Chips

Hence the .25 watts versus .3 watts because of Batch 8 clocked at a higher frequency.

My question is, can I under clock Batch 8 down to 600 MHz and get the same .25 watts efficiency as the Batch 6 at 600 MHz?

If the efficency is really different, it's very likely that the buck converter is set to another voltage.
I'm back home. Will answer PM, quote requests, arrange a few deliveries first.
Then, I'll look more in depth at what can be done on this buck converter.
Better efficiency should be easy by setting the output voltage slightly lower.
Overvolting might be tricky because the MOSFETs could already be close to their limits at 800MHz. I didn't check the data sheets.
(my batch 8 ran without any issue 10 days at 800, I set it back to 700 so it's not too loud now that we are back.

As has been said, if the efficiency is significantly different then that requires a different core voltage. What I am not sure about is where the numbers shown are coming from?

The Batch 6 spec was 600MHz, 4.05TH/s, 1042W, 0.25J/GH
The Batch 8 spec was 700MHz, 4.73TH/s, 1293W, 0.25J/GH

If you do the maths yourself on the above TH/s & W you get

Batch 6 0.257J/GH
Batch 8 0.274J/GH

Will however be very interesting to see if the Buck Converter voltage is different between Batch 6 & 8. Also if it is Factory set or controlled by the Controller?


Rich

[dmwardjr]

If the efficency is really different, it's very likely that the buck converter is set to another voltage.
I'm back home. Will answer PM, quote requests, arrange a few deliveries first.
Then, I'll look more in depth at what can be done on this buck converter.
Better efficiency should be easy by setting the output voltage slightly lower.
Overvolting might be tricky because the MOSFETs could already be close to their limits at 800MHz. I didn't check the data sheets.
(my batch 8 ran without any issue 10 days at 800, I set it back to 700 so it's not too loud now that we are back.

Thanks for taking the time to do this.  I don't think you realize how much this is helping me.  I'm running numbers for future revenue projections and making necessary decisions on when to move to get access to cheaper power, etc..  My goal is to acquire 200+ S7's by block halving.

[J4bberwock]

Well the batch eight went into the other direction about .3 watts vs .25 watts.

Just to make sure we are on the same page:

Batch 6 was factory set at 600 MHz for 4.06 TH/s with 135 Chips
Batch 8 was factory set at 700 MHz for 4.73 TH/s with 135 Chips

Hence the .25 watts versus .3 watts because of Batch 8 clocked at a higher frequency.

My question is, can I under clock Batch 8 down to 600 MHz and get the same .25 watts efficiency as the Batch 6 at 600 MHz?

If the efficency is really different, it's very likely that the buck converter is set to another voltage.
I'm back home. Will answer PM, quote requests, arrange a few deliveries first.
Then, I'll look more in depth at what can be done on this buck converter.
Better efficiency should be easy by setting the output voltage slightly lower.
Overvolting might be tricky because the MOSFETs could already be close to their limits at 800MHz. I didn't check the data sheets.
(my batch 8 ran without any issue 10 days at 800, I set it back to 700 so it's not too loud now that we are back.

As has been said, if the efficiency is significantly different then that requires a different core voltage. What I am not sure about is where the numbers shown are coming from?

The Batch 6 spec was 600MHz, 4.05TH/s, 1042W, 0.25J/GH
The Batch 8 spec was 700MHz, 4.73TH/s, 1293W, 0.25J/GH

If you do the maths yourself on the above TH/s & W you get

Batch 6 0.257J/GH
Batch 8 0.274J/GH

Will however be very interesting to see if the Buck Converter voltage is different between Batch 6 & 8. Also if it is Factory set or controlled by the Controller?


Rich

if it was set by the controller according to requested frequency, I believe that we shouldn't see people having trouble overclocking to 750 or 800 since the voltage would also rise (unless capped in the software).
Anyway, I'll try to get some time to play with the S7 on tuesday so we can get some answers

[dmwardjr]

Well the batch eight went into the other direction about .3 watts vs .25 watts.

Just to make sure we are on the same page:

Batch 6 was factory set at 600 MHz for 4.06 TH/s with 135 Chips
Batch 8 was factory set at 700 MHz for 4.73 TH/s with 135 Chips

Hence the .25 watts versus .3 watts because of Batch 8 clocked at a higher frequency.

My question is, can I under clock Batch 8 down to 600 MHz and get the same .25 watts efficiency as the Batch 6 at 600 MHz?

If the efficency is really different, it's very likely that the buck converter is set to another voltage.
I'm back home. Will answer PM, quote requests, arrange a few deliveries first.
Then, I'll look more in depth at what can be done on this buck converter.
Better efficiency should be easy by setting the output voltage slightly lower.
Overvolting might be tricky because the MOSFETs could already be close to their limits at 800MHz. I didn't check the data sheets.
(my batch 8 ran without any issue 10 days at 800, I set it back to 700 so it's not too loud now that we are back.

As has been said, if the efficiency is significantly different then that requires a different core voltage. What I am not sure about is where the numbers shown are coming from?

The Batch 6 spec was 600MHz, 4.05TH/s, 1042W, 0.25J/GH
The Batch 8 spec was 700MHz, 4.73TH/s, 1293W, 0.25J/GH

If you do the maths yourself on the above TH/s & W you get

Batch 6 0.257J/GH
Batch 8 0.274J/GH

Will however be very interesting to see if the Buck Converter voltage is different between Batch 6 & 8. Also if it is Factory set or controlled by the Controller?


Rich

if it was set by the controller according to requested frequency, I believe that we shouldn't see people having trouble overclocking to 750 or 800 since the voltage would also rise (unless capped in the software).
Anyway, I'll try to get some time to play with the S7 on tuesday so we can get some answers

I'm also curious about efficiency when under clocking with the 2880 & 2980 PSU's without having to use a different PSU to under volt.  This would also help me determine if it will be more cost effective to over clock, keep at stock settings or under clock.  It's important for me to make the right decision for PSU to be used with 200+ S7's in the future.

[SLEI]

Biodom or Anyone else,

Help me remember...  Did Batch 6 have 135 chips or 162 chips?  My question was never really answered about number of chips.  I'm curious if I would get similar efficiency with under clocking as Biodom mentions here with Batch 6 but similar with Batch 8?

Batch 6,8,9 are all 135 chip. Efficiency should be similar so long as the Buck Converter is set to the same voltage, which it may well not be, in all batches?

Rich

Miners can't be identical if batch 8 can have 200W difference in power usage at same frequence.

Which other Batch are you comparing the Batch 8 Miner to?

Rich

They are both batch 8 23.11. 2015 shipped takes 1210W with BM APW3... and 23.12. shipped takes 1410W, something very bad happened in that month.
Early bird is little bit on the edge with 700 Mhz but works anyway at that, so I think core voltage is adjusted to later units with hardware or HW mods.

My testing for the very early batch 8 is posted here efficiency were 0,26W per Gh/s 600-700Mhz and if I remember correctly 400Mhz were also about 0,26.
Later batch 8 takes specsed 1293W +10%, with 0C air feed it took 75w less but I didn't get 4700Gh/s 700Mhz as miner was running cold and rpm was 19xx and didn't went slower.
Later is running to some specs but 0,25J/GH is bull.

[cryptichermit]

Well lost my 3rd hashboard yesterday.  This was a batch 8 that had been hashing for 12 days.
Unfortunately Powercycle PSU does little.  Hashboard will come on for a few seconds and spew out copious HW errors.
Then it resets itself and hashboard shows as dead.  Opened another ticket with support, but not sure how well thats going to go with zero response still on the 2 batch 5 hashboards in RMA.

I noticed these run much warmer than the previouis batches.  Obviously due to the 700mhz.  I had underclocked a few units that were running hotter than others.  This unit was left at default 700mhz.  I've since set all units to 650 frequency to cool them down a bit (lower to mid 60c's)  In contrast to prior batches these are inferior.  I doubt they will have close to the lifespan the others will given the 700 frequencies.