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Author Topic: Bitcoin-Central, first exchange licensed to operate with a bank. This is HUGE  (Read 150702 times)
acoindr
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December 06, 2012, 10:18:33 PM
 #101

So the other side of the (bit)coin is that the banksters and the eurocrats will know how many bitcoins you have in there, how do you trade them (capital gains? repent!) and above all they will be enabled to lock your bitcoin-backed credit card if you end in some black list of them.
Thanks, but no thanks.
After all these efforts and complications to get out from the banksters' matrix, it is ironic to get back at square 1.

Very good point.

You two seem to think in absolutes. You act like one exchange becoming a bank equals bitcoin is now the same as banking fiat.

Bitcoin is a currency, a free market one at that. People use currencies (including dollars) differently, for both legal and illegal use, and in various ways. Not every single bitcoin user will open this type of bank account. I don't know why you might think so.

So, all the while Bitcoin becomes more widely accepted and easier to use various ways... it is still capped at 21 million coins in total guaranteed; and still has its anonymous and low/zero fee capabilities. Back at square 1? Not quite.
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marcus_of_augustus
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December 06, 2012, 10:19:22 PM
 #102

So the other side of the (bit)coin is that the banksters and the eurocrats will know how many bitcoins you have in there, how do you trade them (capital gains? repent!) and above all they will be enabled to lock your bitcoin-backed credit card if you end in some black list of them.
Thanks, but no thanks.
After all these efforts and complications to get out from the banksters' matrix, it is ironic to get back at square 1.
Beat them at their own game, that's the way I roll.

Also if they want to lock your Bitcoins they have to define them legally first : no matter the way you look at it Bitcoin wins.

Davout, I hear what you are saying and appreciate your enthusiasm. You are one of the guys who I've respected as having the right attitude from the first time I arrived at this forum ... so go for it I say. Fortune favours the brave.

That said, I wonder how much the ECB (who released their little report into bitcoin) are trying to take you (and bitcoin) "under their wing", so to speak, so that at a later stage it will be that much easier for them to regulate bitcoin into oblivion. At this point in time they have no moral (or even legal perhaps) standing to regulate bitcoin, in as much as they have no standing to regulate exotic rock mining in Angolia.

Be careful, as the old saying goes, "lie down with dogs .... ".

Monetary Freedom - a basic human right
The ultimate outcome of central banking must be that everybody goes broke borrowing fiat money that has no value.
247saver
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December 06, 2012, 10:21:46 PM
 #103

Congratulations, this is another good solid step along the way for Bitcoin!
Brunic
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December 06, 2012, 10:32:24 PM
 #104

Congratulations!
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December 06, 2012, 10:32:42 PM
 #105

How did the french manage that? Nice one!!  Grin
Hahaha oh god


at a later stage it will be that much easier for them to regulate bitcoin into oblivion
They can regulate BC (not the ECB though), good luck regulating math Smiley

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December 06, 2012, 10:45:09 PM
 #106

Obviously every great leap forward has the potential to encounter a wall with steel spikes on it.
This is most likely what will happen. Don't be overexcited and act with extreme care, David. Fiat money world and bitcoin by definition just can't peacefully coexist and be legally 'interfaced' in current regulatory environment. Credit Mutuel have started a dangerous game and I'm afraid the role of bitcoin-central in this game is the role of a scape goat.

Nevertheless, it is a major development in the bitcoin world. You did it. Congrats!

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acoindr
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December 06, 2012, 10:48:50 PM
 #107

Back at square 1? Not quite.

True - it's much worse than that.

Reading between the lines... do you mean

SELL SELL SELL!!!
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December 06, 2012, 10:49:14 PM
 #108

So the other side of the (bit)coin is that the banksters and the eurocrats will know how many bitcoins you have in there, how do you trade them (capital gains? repent!) and above all they will be enabled to lock your bitcoin-backed credit card if you end in some black list of them.
Thanks, but no thanks.
After all these efforts and complications to get out from the banksters' matrix, it is ironic to get back at square 1.
Beat them at their own game, that's the way I roll.

Also if they want to lock your Bitcoins they have to define them legally first : no matter the way you look at it Bitcoin wins.

Davout, I hear what you are saying and appreciate your enthusiasm. You are one of the guys who I've respected as having the right attitude from the first time I arrived at this forum ... so go for it I say. Fortune favours the brave.

That said, I wonder how much the ECB (who released their little report into bitcoin) are trying to take you (and bitcoin) "under their wing", so to speak, so that at a later stage it will be that much easier for them to regulate bitcoin into oblivion. At this point in time they have no moral (or even legal perhaps) standing to regulate bitcoin, in as much as they have no standing to regulate exotic rock mining in Angolia.

Be careful, as the old saying goes, "lie down with dogs .... ".
It'd be akin to trying to regulate cash transactions.  It only works if those conducting the transactions want them to be regulated.
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December 06, 2012, 10:53:09 PM
 #109

Is there a connection between the Finnish flag on the site and the confirmation by their Central Bank that bitcoins are "legal"?

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December 06, 2012, 11:00:49 PM
 #110

We need more stable/legal exchange.

No, we don't. We need other ppl use Bitcoin as a medium of exchange for goods, not for other currencies.

+1 although any increase in usage is good.

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December 07, 2012, 12:00:44 AM
 #111

For example, i would expect ALOT of fraud going on from your 'customers' once you do IBAN accounts with just ID

These guys are running a BANK. I am sure they can figure it out.
To be precise we partnered with a licensed PSP in such a way that we are allowed to do most of what banks do.

But for clarification.... you are in fact NOT running a bank... correct?

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December 07, 2012, 12:15:35 AM
 #112

C'est fantastique!   Cool

This event marks the end of the beginning!

Bitcoin-XT shatters existing structures, fragments the community, and spins the ecosystem into chaos.
Bitcoin XTs Tor IP blacklist downloading system has significant privacy leaks.
Use PseudoNode and NotXT to protect status quo until real technical consensus is formed about the blocksize.  NotXT can also be used to mine.



DASH --> Digital Avarice Scamming Humanity

Why the darkcoin/dash instamine matters

The difference between bad and well-developed digital cash will determine whether we have a dictatorship or a real democracy.  -David Chaum 1996



Technology tends to move in the direction of making surveillance easier, and the ability of computers to track us doubles every eighteen months. - Phil Zimmerman 2013
Resiliency, not efficiency, is the paramount goal of decentralized, non-state sanctioned currency -Jon Matonis 2015
The raison d'etre of bitcoin is trustlessness. - Eric Lombrozo 2015
The only way to make software secure, reliable, and fast is to make it small. Fight Features. - Andy Tanenbaum 2004
Crypto is the separation of Power and State.


"Monero" : { Untraceable - Anonymous - Fungible - Trustless - Adaptive Blocksize - 100% PoW & FOSS - No ASIC or Premine - Wallets - Buy Local - Podcats - Roadmap - XMR.to } -Tacotime 2015

"Hard forks cannot be controversial things" -Peiter Wuille
"Blocksize is an intentionally limited resource, like the 21e6 BTC limit.  Changing it degrades the surrounding economics, creating negative incentives" -Jeff Garzik.
"Gavin is the only committer to Bitcoin core who supports this [20MB block] proposal....the rest of us have significant concerns" -gmaxwell


If Bitcoin was fungible, CoinJoin and CT would not exist.
http://www.slideshare.net/arnuschky/monero-geneva
https://letstalkbitcoin.com/blog/post/ltb-e202-understanding-monero

"Bitcoin is a settlement system, by design."

Bitcoin users might get increasingly tyrannical about limiting the size of the chain so it's easy for lots of users and small devices.  - Satoshi Nakamoto 2010

"Current payment systems simply can’t compete with bitcoin’s fees, security and convenience.  As a currency, no sovereign can match it.  As a payment system, no financial institution can compete with it.  As a distributed network, no government can stop it."     -Chris Horlacher

Bitcoin and Monero are the anvils upon which we shall smash the State.

BitcoinXT is
evoorhees
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December 07, 2012, 12:33:51 AM
 #113

We need more stable/legal exchange.

No, we don't. We need other ppl use Bitcoin as a medium of exchange for goods, not for other currencies.

Ahhh but what if currencies ARE goods? (hint: they are)
evoorhees
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December 07, 2012, 12:39:43 AM
 #114

So the other side of the (bit)coin is that the banksters and the eurocrats will know how many bitcoins you have in there, how do you trade them (capital gains? repent!) and above all they will be enabled to lock your bitcoin-backed credit card if you end in some black list of them.
Thanks, but no thanks.
After all these efforts and complications to get out from the banksters' matrix, it is ironic to get back at square 1.

Very good point.

No, it's not a good point.

Integrating Bitcoin with the normal financial world is not "going back to square 1". In all cases, you have the option, once in Bitcoin, to be apart from that world. The integration is simply an inevitable (and important) step to help the rest of the world climb on to our superior system. Every integration between Bitcoin and the old systems brings those old systems closer to death, because once attached, Bitcon begins to siphon off economic activity.

It would only be "going back to square 1" if, somehow, were were now all forced to use this French exchange and comply with banking laws there. That would be bad, but that is impossible if you understand how Bitcoin works.

Integrate, integrate, integrate, and Bitcoin will succeed, because it is superior.
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December 07, 2012, 12:47:11 AM
 #115

Now wait, I thought one of the main points of Bitcoin was to get away from big centralized banks and federal regulation.  Of course, you guys have never been shy to call in the Feds to solve your problems, so I guess this latest display of hypocrisy should come as no surprise.

But hey, congratulations for discovering why all modern currencies use banks and government backed insurance.  And at what fine establishments can I use this bitcoin debit card?
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December 07, 2012, 12:47:48 AM
 #116

If you're worried about the Eurocrats freezing your account then use some basic risk management.

Don't store all your bitcoins there. Keep most of your balance on a wallet under your direct control and only add small amounts of bitcoins as needed to fund your debit card.
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December 07, 2012, 12:52:01 AM
 #117

So the other side of the (bit)coin is that the banksters and the eurocrats will know how many bitcoins you have in there, how do you trade them (capital gains? repent!) and above all they will be enabled to lock your bitcoin-backed credit card if you end in some black list of them.
Thanks, but no thanks.
After all these efforts and complications to get out from the banksters' matrix, it is ironic to get back at square 1.

Very good point.

No, it's not a good point.

Integrating Bitcoin with the normal financial world is not "going back to square 1". In all cases, you have the option, once in Bitcoin, to be apart from that world. The integration is simply an inevitable (and important) step to help the rest of the world climb on to our superior system. Every integration between Bitcoin and the old systems brings those old systems closer to death, because once attached, Bitcon begins to siphon off economic activity.

It would only be "going back to square 1" if, somehow, were were now all forced to use this French exchange and comply with banking laws there. That would be bad, but that is impossible if you understand how Bitcoin works.

Integrate, integrate, integrate, and Bitcoin will succeed, because it is superior.

+1 Exact!

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December 07, 2012, 12:56:37 AM
 #118

Integrate, integrate, integrate, and Bitcoin will succeed, because it is superior.

If I wanted to go out to dinner, or needed to go to the store for some groceries, where can I go that will accept this superior currencies debit card?
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December 07, 2012, 01:31:43 AM
 #119

Integrate, integrate, integrate, and Bitcoin will succeed, because it is superior.

If I wanted to go out to dinner, or needed to go to the store for some groceries, where can I go that will accept this superior currencies debit card?

Anywhere debit cards are accepted.

But way to come out swinging before you understand what is being discussed.

https://www.bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf
While no idea is perfect, some ideas are useful.
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December 07, 2012, 01:33:10 AM
 #120

  • Our user's funds will actually be held at the Credit Mutuel under the user's name, they will be separate from Paymium's funds (on the other hand, all of other exchanges funds for example sit in the same account, and are considered by their bank to be their corporate property)

Bitcoin-Central currently operates a BTC/EUR market and a BTC/GBP market (and still has the BTC/USD market showing on the site, without support for offers currently).  Does this mean GBP, USD and any other funds will be held at Credit Mutuel as well?

  • Our user's accounts will be protected by the "Garantie des dépôts" which is the French equivalent of the American FDIC
Presumably this protection applies to just the EUR balances for each Bitcoin-Central account?[/list]

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