Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[brg444]

I'm really neutral in which way I want the market to go. I'm still over 90% long, but I want the cripplecoiners to get the message that coins on a throttled network are not as valuable.

Retail is not buying in.

Why are you so excited about scaling transactions for retail demand that doesn't exist?

If you wanna get people interested in coin collecting, you don't start them out with Krugerrands.  You start them out with wheat pennies.  Then, I want anti-spam email, faucets to drive traffic to websites, etc.

That's the gist of your broken logic. That somehow the "mainstream" sheeps are going to drive Bitcoin success and its price.

Better get this idea out of your head because it's not happening. The average consumer will get in Bitcoin much later in the game.

[cyclotronmajesty]

You seem much too sensitive, if you are understanding my prior response posts to be a name calling rants. 

In my earlier posts, I seem to be for the large part responding substantively to various points that you were making, and characterizing them as inadequate in a variety of respects, and to agree with you that your thinking seems to be much too simplistic if you believe that the main factors in determining direction of a market is its most recent price direction (even though sometimes you are going to be correct when you guess in that regard nonetheless, that analysis seems to miss a lot of nuances and a variety of factors that I referred to in my previous responses to you).

Too sensitive? Too emotional, too poor, too impatient, too ignorant. Yea who isn't?

I'm saying the investment I made is a bad one. .
I'm saying it from my perspective. If it's good for you. Then good.
Obviously you're doing something i'm not. I'm just spending my money in time the way I see best.
I wasn't even talking about whether the price goes up as a measure of good investment. While that was my first criterion, it's now changed.
My sole measure now is if I am making money, or at least breaking even.
So if I'm not. It's not a good investment.
FOR ME. For bitcoin and litecoin? I'm sure they're THRILLED i'm loosing money. It just means more for them. Frankly I got into this not really knowing WTF I was doing. I'm just trying to go forward making mistakes, while I try to correct for them.
At first I didn't even know about longs and shorts. I traded at ANX.
I didn't know you could make money when the price is going down.
After I lost 65% on just buying litecoin with my money. (right before coming a inch of breaking even)
I figured I could try using leverage. So I made some money and then the price went down again.
Then I tried shorting. Made some then the price went up.
It's just splitting me apart. So i'm willing to pay for that, and accept the consequences.
If me and crypto are incompatible, I can accept that. I've learned a few things about trading in the mean time. I could have wasted the money on a DJ system or something. Probably wouldn't have learned anything.

[ChartBuddy]

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Explanation

[billyjoeallen]

That's the gist of your broken logic. That somehow the "mainstream" sheeps are going to drive Bitcoin success and its price.

Better get this idea out of your head because it's not happening. The average consumer will get in Bitcoin much later in the game.

No shit, Sherlock. But when the sheep get in, microtransactions will be a feature. People with vision will have to continue to build the infrastructure first, and part of that infrastructure will involve microtransactions.

You're starting to piss me off.  I've seen nothing from you to merit your arrogance. Keep it up and you go on the ignore list. Criticism is cheap. Show me some insight.

Talk about flawed logic: Retail isn't interested in Bitcoin, so we shouldn't cater to retail, which isn't interested because we don't cater to retail. Fuck you.

[aztecminer]

bitcoin movement now began to slow down, perhaps waiting for a new issue.
just hope the price of bitcoin soon rise, and I can sell it at that moment  

we are on our way up... one margin long at a time! just a few more longs and that moment will arrive and you can finally sell your "blockchain blacklist" "cripplecoin"! #victory

the ~$1 million direct investment that is required daily for BTC to have price stability doesn't yet seem to be affected by the block size controversy. But I am noticing some subtle things at the margins that may be an indicator of another leg down:

1. My orders on purse.io are not getting filled.
2. My offers on bitquick.co are not being accepted

Retail is not buying in. I don't know if the ~15,000 in margin shorts on bfx is going to be enough to stop another crash. Conversely, squeezing them won't cause much of a spike either. If miners are holding off selling all their coins in hopes of getting a higher price, then we may have a lot of overhead resistance in addition to the $23M in dollar swaps (margin longs).  

Big money may come to the rescue, but it may not. My guess is still that we're going sideways until the people who dumped at $260 run out of money to reinvest and then, unless some new development changes things, we'll retest support.

I'm really neutral in which way I want the market to go. I'm still over 90% long, but I want the cripplecoiners to get the message that coins on a throttled network are not as valuable.

i dont know whats going to happen... my best guess is we will go sideways and pump some until we either get dumped on by the chinese miner.. or something . .. really i have no idea because the market most always moves opposite of what i am thinking and doing. if i buy then the market will go lower, if i sell then the market will go higher.. so most the time i am sitting around waiting. i'm not that great of a trader really. if you hear me giving any trading advice, really i am mostly just fuding the market. i have no clue what bitcoin is doing or going to do. bitfinex might collapse tomorrow for all i know. sometimes i am a bull and sometimes i am a bear.. depending on how i am feeling and whats going on .

however.... i do sometimes understand whats going on in the overall of things. and i think that is why there are weird things going on that really don't make a lot of sense.. it does make sense from the big overall of whatever is going on . bitcoin is really only one part of whats happening.. and some people who think they are smart do dumb stuff and mess up ALL THE TIME.. like almost every single time all the time . i think they are already lower intelligence and they compound it by brushing their teeth with flouride and other dumb things. if you understand that there are a lot of dumb people in the world then you can strategist and outsmart them consistently . and they will make mistakes that will mess themselves up worse.. like "cripplecoiners" are doing.. lol ... that why we can make fun of them all day long because it is a total dumb idea that is obviously going to fail ...

[megadeth]

That's the gist of your broken logic. That somehow the "mainstream" sheeps are going to drive Bitcoin success and its price.

Better get this idea out of your head because it's not happening. The average consumer will get in Bitcoin much later in the game.

No shit, Sherlock. But when the sheep get in, microtransactions will be a feature. People with vision will have to continue to build the infrastructure first, and part of that infrastructure will involve microtransactions.

You're starting to piss me off.  I've seen nothing from you to merit your arrogance. Keep it up and you go on the ignore list. Criticism is cheap. Show me some insight.

Talk about flawed logic: Retail isn't interested in Bitcoin, so we shouldn't cater to retail, which isn't interested because we don't cater to retail. Fuck you.

Concur with Billy on this one. Masses need an Xt(ish)coin that lets them transact at the current price per txn, so they can roll in Bitcoin into their daily lives.
Let the fork happen, Bitcoin classic can be used as the store of value, settlement layer. Xt can be the cheap txn, coffee purchasing network.
(Or do the block size increase to buy time and hope for lightning type tech to be built to allow both use cases)

[brg444]

That's the gist of your broken logic. That somehow the "mainstream" sheeps are going to drive Bitcoin success and its price.

Better get this idea out of your head because it's not happening. The average consumer will get in Bitcoin much later in the game.

No shit, Sherlock. But when the sheep get in, microtransactions will be a feature. People with vision will have to continue to build the infrastructure first, and part of that infrastructure will involve microtransactions.

You're starting to piss me off.  I've seen nothing from you to merit your arrogance. Keep it up and you go on the ignore list. Criticism is cheap. Show me some insight.

Talk about flawed logic: Retail isn't interested in Bitcoin, so we shouldn't cater to retail, which isn't interested because we don't cater to retail. Fuck you.

Microtransactions will be handled off chain, either through Lightning or sidechains. I don't see a problem here, Sherlock.

Bitcoin, the foundation layer, should not, ever, cater to retail.

[brg444]

That's the gist of your broken logic. That somehow the "mainstream" sheeps are going to drive Bitcoin success and its price.

Better get this idea out of your head because it's not happening. The average consumer will get in Bitcoin much later in the game.

No shit, Sherlock. But when the sheep get in, microtransactions will be a feature. People with vision will have to continue to build the infrastructure first, and part of that infrastructure will involve microtransactions.

You're starting to piss me off.  I've seen nothing from you to merit your arrogance. Keep it up and you go on the ignore list. Criticism is cheap. Show me some insight.

Talk about flawed logic: Retail isn't interested in Bitcoin, so we shouldn't cater to retail, which isn't interested because we don't cater to retail. Fuck you.

Concur with Billy on this one. Masses need an Xt(ish)coin that lets them transact at the current price per txn, so they can roll in Bitcoin into their daily lives.
Let the fork happen, Bitcoin classic can be used as the store of value, settlement layer. Xt can be the cheap txn, coffee purchasing network.
(Or do the block size increase to buy time and hope for lightning type tech to be built to allow both use cases)

This ignores the whole value of having one uniquer ledger of ownership. We don't need another coin, additional layers can serve these needs equally well.

[billyjoeallen]

Bitcoins are not just some tokens that we trade back and forth. They are real estate on the blockchain ledger.  We will record titles with them, time stamp creative works, etc. The ledger is what gives bitcoins value. It needs to expand because someday we may record damn near ALL titles on it and use it for almost all timestamps. 

The record of almost everything that almost everybody owns will be extremely valuable and worth maintaining, even if it takes up a lot of hard drive space.  When Seward bought Alaska from the Russians, he caught a lot of heat from people who didn't see the potential. That's what bitcoins are now, raw potential.

[billyjoeallen]

Bitcoin, the foundation layer, should not, ever, cater to retail.

Why not? An assertion is not an argument.

[ChartBuddy]

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Explanation

[megadeth]

This ignores the whole value of having one uniquer ledger of ownership. We don't need another coin, additional layers can serve these needs equally well.

Bitcoins are not just some tokens that we trade back and forth. They are real estate on the blockchain ledger.  We will record titles with them, time stamp creative works, etc. The ledger is what gives bitcoins value. It needs to expand because someday we may record damn near ALL titles on it and use it for almost all timestamps.  

The record of almost everything that almost everybody owns will be extremely valuable and worth maintaining, even if it takes up a lot of hard drive space.  When Seward bought Alaska from the Russians, he caught a lot of heat from people who didn't see the potential. That's what bitcoins are now, raw potential.

Forking the ledger is not a bad thing: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1161157.0.
If there is enough demand by market forces, there can be two ledgers protected by a varying percentage of hashpower.
Exchanges will help determine the value of each fork. Unfortunately people are currently split on their demands of two orthogonal use cases of Bitcoin, one of which could lead to it being more centralized.

Just to be clear, fork or no fork. Both paths will lead to immense wealth creation enabled by Bitcoin tech.

[ChartBuddy]

Coin
Explanation

[billyjoeallen]

This ignores the whole value of having one uniquer ledger of ownership. We don't need another coin, additional layers can serve these needs equally well.

Bitcoins are not just some tokens that we trade back and forth. They are real estate on the blockchain ledger.  We will record titles with them, time stamp creative works, etc. The ledger is what gives bitcoins value. It needs to expand because someday we may record damn near ALL titles on it and use it for almost all timestamps.  

The record of almost everything that almost everybody owns will be extremely valuable and worth maintaining, even if it takes up a lot of hard drive space.  When Seward bought Alaska from the Russians, he caught a lot of heat from people who didn't see the potential. That's what bitcoins are now, raw potential.

Forking the ledger is not a bad thing: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1161157.0.
If there is enough demand by market forces, there can be two ledgers protected by a varying percentage of hashpower.
Exchanges will help determine the value of each fork. Unfortunately people are currently split on their demands of two orthogonal use cases of Bitcoin, one of which could lead to it being more centralized.

Just to be clear, fork or no fork. Both paths will lead to immense wealth creation enabled by Bitcoin tech.

Um, no. Only one fork will survive. The losing fork will be a dead branch, a string of orphaned blocks.

I don't know which fork will prevail, but like the Highlander, there can be only one. If the cripplecoiners get their way, most of the vast potential of Bitcoin will be strangled in the crib. We will have to use a completely different cryptocoin to utilize that potential and progress will be set back years.

Cripplecoiners don't want to be Guardians of the Galaxy. They want to be bouncers at an exclusive club,

[Fatman3001]

This ignores the whole value of having one uniquer ledger of ownership. We don't need another coin, additional layers can serve these needs equally well.

Bitcoins are not just some tokens that we trade back and forth. They are real estate on the blockchain ledger.  We will record titles with them, time stamp creative works, etc. The ledger is what gives bitcoins value. It needs to expand because someday we may record damn near ALL titles on it and use it for almost all timestamps.  

The record of almost everything that almost everybody owns will be extremely valuable and worth maintaining, even if it takes up a lot of hard drive space.  When Seward bought Alaska from the Russians, he caught a lot of heat from people who didn't see the potential. That's what bitcoins are now, raw potential.

Forking the ledger is not a bad thing: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1161157.0.
If there is enough demand by market forces, there can be two ledgers protected by a varying percentage of hashpower.
Exchanges will help determine the value of each fork. Unfortunately people are currently split on their demands of two orthogonal use cases of Bitcoin, one of which could lead to it being more centralized.

Just to be clear, fork or no fork. Both paths will lead to immense wealth creation enabled by Bitcoin tech.

Um, no. Only one fork will survive. The losing fork will be a dead branch, a string of orphaned blocks.

I don't know which fork will prevail, but like the Highlander, there can be only one. If the cripplecoiners get their way, most of the vast potential of Bitcoin will be strangled in the crib. We will have to use a completely different cryptocoin to utilize that potential and progress will be set back years.

Cripplecoiners don't want to be Guardians of the Galaxy. They want to be bouncers at an exclusive club,

"Highlander", "Guardians of the Galaxy". Your nerd power is strong.

[rebuilder]

The flash return rate for BTC swaps is now higher than for USD swaps on Bitfinex. Don't recall seeing that for a while!

[RenegadeMan]

Gavin Andresen is on the latest Epicentre Bitcoin podcast with Brian Fabian Crain & Sébastien Couture talking about The Blocksize And Bitcoin's Governance. Well worth listening to regardless of your beliefs and views on what should be done. The guy is clearly intelligent, balanced and knowledgeable. He also comments on the sheer difficulty of trying to get any changes implemented with the current impasse.

Very glad I listened to this.

https://letstalkbitcoin.com/blog/post/epicenter-bitcoin-94-gavin-andresen-on-the-blocksize-and-bitcoins-governance

[jbreher]

Only 338 votes? Come on guys, this poll is important

Well, no.

With regards to XT, the only poll that matters is the one tabulated on the blockchain. You know - what with the 2016, and the 75%, and the two-week average.

[ChartBuddy]

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Explanation

[hdbuck]

Gavin Andresen is on the latest Epicentre Bitcoin podcast with Brian Fabian Crain & Sébastien Couture talking about The Blocksize And Bitcoin's Governance. Well worth listening to regardless of your beliefs and views on what should be done. The guy is clearly intelligent, balanced and knowledgeable. He also comments on the sheer difficulty of trying to get any changes implemented with the current impasse.

Very glad I listened to this.

https://letstalkbitcoin.com/blog/post/epicenter-bitcoin-94-gavin-andresen-on-the-blocksize-and-bitcoins-governance

lol people are so impressionable, with always this eager to blindly follow sum dude..

FYI, just to make things clear:

 Bitcoin doesn't need governance: Bitcoin is governance.

conclusion: nice try but fork you Gavin!