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Question: When will BTC get back above $70K:
7/14 - 0 (0%)
7/21 - 1 (0.8%)
7/28 - 11 (9.1%)
8/4 - 16 (13.2%)
8/11 - 7 (5.8%)
8/18 - 6 (5%)
8/25 - 8 (6.6%)
After August - 72 (59.5%)
Total Voters: 121

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Author Topic: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion  (Read 26484396 times)
This is a self-moderated topic. If you do not want to be moderated by the person who started this topic, create a new topic. (174 posts by 3 users with 9 merit deleted.)
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September 14, 2015, 03:02:06 AM

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September 14, 2015, 04:02:03 AM

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September 14, 2015, 04:26:23 AM
Last edit: September 14, 2015, 04:50:14 AM by yefi

As much as I hate to agree with the professor... but Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_economic_thought) says that the history of economic sciences stretches back to 500 BC. So at least there were at least proto-economists as far back as before the time of Jebus.

It's a little bit like calling Alchemists scientists. In any case, I would like to hear which 16th century mind argued for inflation, especially as currency was specie.
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September 14, 2015, 04:59:06 AM

back to 220? or are we going lower than that? Roll Eyes

no more more moooooooon?
or bottom?
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September 14, 2015, 05:02:05 AM

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September 14, 2015, 05:18:07 AM

As much as I hate to agree with the professor... but Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_economic_thought) says that the history of economic sciences stretches back to 500 BC. So at least there were at least proto-economists as far back as before the time of Jebus.

It's a little bit like calling Alchemists scientists. In any case, I would like to hear which 16th century mind argued for inflation, especially as currency was specie.

Economists now are still in the Alchemist stage. Its mostly just pseudo-science.
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September 14, 2015, 05:43:15 AM

As much as I hate to agree with the professor... but Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_economic_thought) says that the history of economic sciences stretches back to 500 BC. So at least there were at least proto-economists as far back as before the time of Jebus.

It's a little bit like calling Alchemists scientists. In any case, I would like to hear which 16th century mind argued for inflation, especially as currency was specie.


The punchline is that Stolfi is making things up to suit his own rendition of history, and trying to characterize some kind of united front and consensus in economics, which would hardly be the case in any given time frame... surely there are going to be majority and mainstream economists and starting in the 1800s there are going to be marxists, who were NOT mainstream, except maybe in certain communist country circles.
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September 14, 2015, 05:43:27 AM
Last edit: September 14, 2015, 08:47:37 AM by Divitiae miserae

As much as I hate to agree with the professor... but Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_economic_thought) says that the history of economic sciences stretches back to 500 BC. So at least there were at least proto-economists as far back as before the time of Jebus.

It's a little bit like calling Alchemists scientists. In any case, I would like to hear which 16th century mind argued for inflation, especially as currency was specie.

Economists now are still in the Alchemist stage. Its mostly just pseudo-science.
I can't agree more. It's still the best branch of knowledge we have about the subject.
People here fail to realise that all the economic considerations of Stolfi are strictly mainstream and found in any textbook.
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September 14, 2015, 06:02:11 AM

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September 14, 2015, 06:16:37 AM

Filament To Power The Internet of Things With a 20-year Battery, A 10-Mile Range And Bitcoin:

http://bravenewcoin.com/news/filament-to-power-the-internet-of-things-with-a-20-year-battery-a-10-mile-range-and-bitcoin/

bullish!
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September 14, 2015, 07:02:20 AM

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September 14, 2015, 08:02:03 AM

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September 14, 2015, 08:02:19 AM

Economists have know for 500 years that a currency must have some inflation, otherwise people will hoard it and it will not be available for use as a currency.  

During the past 500 years, there were long periods of effectively zero inflation where economies boomed. In the industrial revolution in Britain, for example.

Also, I don't think there was such a thing as an economist 500 years ago.

Gold and silver coins kept the price for a pint steady as a rock for hundreds of years.
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September 14, 2015, 08:12:19 AM

Quote from: JorgeStolfi
WARNING: Do not trust e-mail!
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September 14, 2015, 08:42:56 AM

Economists have know for 500 years that a currency must have some inflation, otherwise people will hoard it and it will not be available for use as a currency.  

During the past 500 years, there were long periods of effectively zero inflation where economies boomed. In the industrial revolution in Britain, for example.

Also, I don't think there was such a thing as an economist 500 years ago.

Gold and silver coins kept the price for a pint steady as a rock for hundreds of years.

So steady
Until 1900: gold/silver standard. 1900-1933: gold standard.
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September 14, 2015, 08:54:03 AM

This other chart highlights the US economy recessions along with the stock index:

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September 14, 2015, 08:55:39 AM

In any case, I would like to hear which 16th century mind argued for inflation, especially as currency was specie.

Economists now are still in the Alchemist stage. Its mostly just pseudo-science.

As I wrote already, I was referring to Gresham's Law (aka Copernicus's Law).  It is stated in terms of face value vs intrinsic value, but the phenomenon applies to bitcoin vs national money: if a currency is  [ perceived as being ] more solid than another, people will hoard one and spend the other.

Alchemists were desperately trying to make sense out of the data that they got out of experimental chemistry.  There were crackpots and scammers, and some who intentionally obfuscated their writing to preserve their trade secrets.  But there were also many who simply inventing their own names for substances and processes, and trying to make general theories out of experiments.  They rightly sensed that there must be *some* laws, but they did not imagine how complicated they would turn out to be.  They were like biologists before biochemistry, or astronomers before gravitation...

Only a few years ago I learned that the real father of chemistry was a guy called Jabir ibn Hayyan (westernized as Geber) who lived around 800 CE.  He perfected the still and discovered the sulphuric, hydrochloric, and nitric acids by distilling vitriol, alone and with salt and saltpeter.  Aqua regia, a mix of HCl and HNO3, was found to dissolve gold.  

But, besides his genuine experimental contributions, he also "perfected" the four-element theory of Aristotle by "explaining" the differences into various metals as "rearrangements" of two basic qualities that all metals had. Five centuries later, when his works were translated to Latin and spread in Europe, that discovery and that theory spawned an epidemic of stereotypical alchemists, obsessed with turning lead into gold.  

Around 1600, Emperor Rudolf II of Bohemia (today's Czech Republic) thought that alchemy could be the solution to his financial difficulties, and built a "research center" -- an alley in the Prague Castle, lined with labs for alchemical "startups" attracted from all Europe. Many of them were scammers, and of course it did not work.

You see, those scammers had to work with gold, because bitcoin had not been invented yet.  Grin


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September 14, 2015, 09:02:03 AM

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September 14, 2015, 09:18:47 AM

Economists have know for 500 years that a currency must have some inflation, otherwise people will hoard it and it will not be available for use as a currency.  

During the past 500 years, there were long periods of effectively zero inflation where economies boomed. In the industrial revolution in Britain, for example.

Also, I don't think there was such a thing as an economist 500 years ago.

Gold and silver coins kept the price for a pint steady as a rock for hundreds of years.
Did you check the gold charts? It fell alot not so long time ago if i remember good.
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September 14, 2015, 09:38:22 AM

In any case, I would like to hear which 16th century mind argued for inflation, especially as currency was specie.

Economists now are still in the Alchemist stage. Its mostly just pseudo-science.

As I wrote already, I was referring to Gresham's Law (aka Copernicus's Law).  It is stated in terms of face value vs intrinsic value, but the phenomenon applies to bitcoin vs national money: if a currency is  [ perceived as being ] more solid than another, people will hoard one and spend the other.

Huh To the degree that ancient historians wrote about political economy, they almost to a man condemned the emperor's debasement of the coinage. Copper was added to gold coins and the gold contents steadily decreased, causing all sorts of economic havoc.  This type of deflation was primarily used for the same purpose that today's inflation is often used: to finance war. 

Just because bad money drives out good, it's no reason to advocate bad money. If anything, it's a reason to repeal all legal tender laws altogether and let the free market sort it out.
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