Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[ghandi]

Bitcoin makes me happy. Just saying

[Elwar]

I don't know if there is any exact solution, Elwar.    Losing 85 bitcoins in one shot is a pretty big deal, and I have suffered some similar losses - but mine was through forced phone porting and simultaneously gaining access to two of my main e-mail accounts.  

Well, it wasn't so much a hack as it was the old school way of a professional pick pocket and a crime syndicate targeting me with a team of people. I too was about to shut down my localbtc account due to some shady people starting to show up (up until then it had been just typical German dudes that wanted to get into Bitcoin).

They sent a couple of young guys first to feel me out. I would meet at the local McDonalds and sell coins there in a location directly across from a police station where I parked my car. Then the big boss and his lackey showed up a few weeks later asking for big money. We did a quick 5k euro trade that went fine and he asked if I could do 50k euro. I told him that was too much but could do lower. Eventually I decided I was going to shut down my localbtc account and I would just sell 30k/85BTC (enough to live on for the 2 more years I planned on living in Germany) worth to him.

He sent his lackey, there was a shady dude standing outside of McDonalds when I went in (didn't pay much attention to it then), as we were doing our trade I verified the currency wasn't fake, I transferred the BTC and put the money in my pocket ready to walk out to my car. I shook the guy's hand and as I went to walk toward the door he stood up to put his coat on asking me to hold his bag while he put it on. I obliged taking my hand out of my pocket while I did so, at that moment another guy came up behind me and switched the envelope of euros from my pocket with an envelope of counterfeit euros. Immediately after handing the bag back to the guy I put my hand back in my pocket and walked out confident that I was holding the money.

It wasn't until I got home that I noticed that the money was fake. I went back to the McDonalds to see their video footage, they just had a grainy picture that couldn't identify the guys but showed the guy reaching into my pocket. I knew the police couldn't/wouldn't do anything about it, I tried calling a private investigator but they just told me to call the police. I didn't feel like turning my life into being a victim and constantly worrying about getting it back. I cut my losses and moved on. I warned the folks on localbitcoins and some dude later caught one of the team. Tackled him as they all scattered after he caught him trying to rob him.

My reward for that whole ordeal was the German polizei showing up at my door at 5AM with a search warrant a few weeks later as well as them calling my employer (the US military) to tell them about it. They were likely monitoring the localbitcoins forum. Selling bitcoins is perfectly legal by private parties in Germany, I made sure to check that out before ever selling any.

[vroom]

Why is bitcoin such a volatility market?

Raging Bull: First study to find link between testosterone and stock market instability

because of the testosterone of course!

source: https://phys.org/news/2017-10-raging-bull-link-testosterone-stock.html

[bitserve]

I don't know if there is any exact solution, Elwar.    Losing 85 bitcoins in one shot is a pretty big deal, and I have suffered some similar losses - but mine was through forced phone porting and simultaneously gaining access to two of my main e-mail accounts.  

Well, it wasn't so much a hack as it was the old school way of a professional pick pocket and a crime syndicate targeting me with a team of people. I too was about to shut down my localbtc account due to some shady people starting to show up (up until then it had been just typical German dudes that wanted to get into Bitcoin).

[SNIP]

That's a very interesting story, Elwar. Thanks for sharing it with us... and sorry for your loss and your posterior bad experience with law enforcement.

[cAPSLOCK]

Also, for all those people that vouch for anarchy but do have Bitcoins.... Do you really think you would be able to keep hodling them when someone went to beat you to death until you gave your private keys to them... because they have the "means" and "freedom" to take it from you?

Someone stole 85 bitcoins from me, I let the localbitcoins community know what/who to watch out for. The only response the police gave me was seizing all of my computers/cell phones/money and investigating me for money laundering.

After over a year they finally returned everything to me (everything useless because I already had to replace everything plus who knows what they added to all of my devices).


My thought on preventing such a thing from happening is some sort of "reputation coin" where everyone has a reputation that can be looked up and anyone who has dealt with that person can report on them (like yelp/ebay). Anyone who is a fraud or violent will be punished by society due to nobody wanting to deal with them and taking precautions when they're around.

I don't know if there is any exact solution, Elwar.    Losing 85 bitcoins in one shot is a pretty big deal, and I have suffered some similar losses - but mine was through forced phone porting and simultaneously gaining access to two of my main e-mail accounts.  

Localbitcoins, is a tougher deal in terms of dealing directly with the public and also possibly gaining some exposure because these folks learn that you have coins and also might learn too much about your personal details and your possible bitcoin hodlings, and gosh we likely have to take additional precautions regarding how much we expose ourselves and our coins.. and even if it might be inconvenient to NOT store too many coins in such a way such as on local bitcoins or some of the wallets that we might use in our trading?  

There are attempts at plausible deniability, too, with some wallets, which maybe relates to how we store our coins, but these various devices and systems are still evolving, and if we want security, we have to learn how to employ these mechanisms in ways that maybe even makes it difficult for ourselves to get easy access to some aspects of our BTC stash.

In late August / early September, there were a couple of weeks in which I removed my localbtc advert because people were acting too crazy, and I was also feeling vulnerable in various regards because of how many coins I had in certain wallets and exchanges, including coins I had on local bitcoins and on my blockchain.info wallet.. and a lot of this additional vulnerability came from what seemed to be a sustained price increase that largely took us from the lower $1k prices to approaching $5k.. and then the small number of coins that I had in some locations, started to look like a lot of money.

So, keeping only a couple of coins in each location could be a partial solution, but it might not prevent nor discourage a more serious and determined attacker with guns and spotlights.. so what to do, what to do,?  and maybe even lessening local bitcoin's profile could be a solution, because even if you can increase your bitcoin holdings every year by trading at a premium, it might not be worth the risk to trade so much on local bitcoins, unless extensive precautions are taken?  

I certainly do not have a complete grasp on my various vulnerabilities and there are a couple of places that I likely maintain too many coins, a couple of exchanges, which could cause some problems on various levels whether it is just third party risk or if it is a kind of forced extortion risk (which is probably not a great likelihood, but it becomes a bit of a bigger likelihood when more bad people learn about bitcoin - and we have heard that some people kill over stealing an iphone, so if they can get a hold of 1 bitcoin, they might engage in worse actions to extort... and at what point are we safe?  And what are good measures to take? 

These are likely ongoing questions that we need to figure out including figuring out successorship issues too.. because it would be sad to accumulate a lot of coins, and then no one in the family gets access to them because they cannot figure out holding amounts nor passwords nor other security measures.. OMG.   

The solution to most of your problems stated in the above tome are privacy which produces  true fungibility.  This is currently Bitcoin's biggest Achilles heel.  And in my opinion this is only solved at the protocol level.  Currently only Monero solves it.  But that is an evil ALT coin! 

Then the next step is to reduce counterparty risk. 

Do not keep coins on exchanges!

Solutions here are things like hardware wallets, paper wallets, cryptosteel and bank vaults.

But with actual privicy (fungibility) you dont have to worry as much about obscuring your holdings using many wallets, mixers (yuck) and the like.

[JayJuanGee]

I don't know if there is any exact solution, Elwar.    Losing 85 bitcoins in one shot is a pretty big deal, and I have suffered some similar losses - but mine was through forced phone porting and simultaneously gaining access to two of my main e-mail accounts.  

[edited out]

That is a fucked up situation, Elwar.

Based on the price, it sounds like the situation was either early 2016 or perhaps another time with similar prices.

I recall another time that I got screwed out of coins is when I guy kept pushing a greater and greater price, and I stopped at a certain point, so I only lost a couple of coins when he reversed the venmo transaction.. so I did not use venmo anymore after that.

By the way, my phone hack situation was a team as well, and it occurred in early 2017 when prices were bouncing around in the $1200 territory and this team was dealing with me and my accounts from multiple locations. 

Once a team force ports your phone and then gets access to an email or two, then they can use find my iphone to shut down your phone and other apple devices, and I got lucky that I did not back up my shit on icloud and my main computer was not registered in apple's find my computer.. or whatever it is called...  because it took me a while to get access to my apple account after my phone got bricked, and after they got into that Icloud account and took it over.

We can tell all the stories that we like, yet these various fraudsters are going to come up with more and more ingenious and creative ways to get into our bitcoin accounts and/or trick us out of our bitcoins.

Right now on local bitcoins, I do pretty decent screening of buyers or sellers - however, I still feel a little uncomfortable from time to time, when I am anticipating meeting someone.  I also limit my sales amounts, yet I see how they might gain your trust and confidence by slowly ramping up the amount of trades and sometimes it is not easy to distinguish between good guys and not so good guys when they might have a systematic approach in planning to rob you or some other devious ploy.

[BlindMayorBitcorn]

It's 2017, Jay. Why are you still using Localbitcoins?

[leowonderful]

Looking at bitcoinwisdom I’m quite surprised to see there’s so little volume in the CAD. Perhaps QuadrigaCX is just not so popular anymore or most people just use local bitcoins or something else in Canada? Seems a little odd to me.

[LFC_Bitcoin]

It's 2017, Jay. Why are you still using Localbitcoins?

What’s wrong with LocalBitcoins? On the rare occasion that I’ve sold some of my stash I’ve sold there. Never had a problem with them as long as you sell to somebody with multiple 100% positive feedback.

[gembitz]

consolidation is obvious    #buy&hodl BTC  //^/\

[JessicaG]

It's 2017, Jay. Why are you still using Localbitcoins?

What’s wrong with LocalBitcoins? On the rare occasion that I’ve sold some of my stash I’ve sold there. Never had a problem with them as long as you sell to somebody with multiple 100% positive feedback.

Multiple 100% feedback says nothing. Or are you under the assumption that that guy who lost his 85 coins transacted with someone with zip or negative feedback?

[Dabs]

The solution or hack to professional pick pockets is an anti-pick pocket thing. Maybe pockets with zippers or pockets or jackets with wire lining to prevent knife slashes. Or you put the money in a bag which has an anti-slash wire through the strap. Or just be more aware of what's going on. Or pockets inside your pants (not outside, I mean, inside the pants, internal.) Or a small bag around your neck, under your shirt. Stuff like that.

But if the pick pocket is good or very good, they might still get your money. If they stick you up at knife/gun point, well, that's outright robbery. Depending on the circumstances, I'd either let them have the money or let them have a bunch of lead.

[Elwar]

It's 2017, Jay. Why are you still using Localbitcoins?

What’s wrong with LocalBitcoins? On the rare occasion that I’ve sold some of my stash I’ve sold there. Never had a problem with them as long as you sell to somebody with multiple 100% positive feedback.

Multiple 100% feedback says nothing. Or are you under the assumption that that guy who lost his 85 coins transacted with someone with zip or negative feedback?

It was a zero feedback person. Almost everyone that bought from me in Germany had no feedback because Germany did all of us sellers a favor and banned localbitcoins from Germany. All that did was locked in all of our ads which gave me a monopoly listing (2 listings, one making 10% and one making 15%) in my area and people could only connect to the site via VPN. 100% of my sales were with people buying on localbitcoins for the first time, I enjoyed helping to introduce Germans to Bitcoin and usually gave them some advice on how to take care of their BTC and some good places to spend them. I had done 15k transactions before so this was not too big of a stretch.

I was actually not going to go to that final sale but it was my 100% rating with over 100 transactions that I didn't want to screw up in case I wanted to sell again in another place.

[LFC_Bitcoin]

It's 2017, Jay. Why are you still using Localbitcoins?

What’s wrong with LocalBitcoins? On the rare occasion that I’ve sold some of my stash I’ve sold there. Never had a problem with them as long as you sell to somebody with multiple 100% positive feedback.

Multiple 100% feedback says nothing. Or are you under the assumption that that guy who lost his 85 coins transacted with someone with zip or negative feedback?

It was a zero feedback person. Almost everyone that bought from me in Germany had no feedback because Germany did all of us sellers a favor and banned localbitcoins from Germany. All that did was locked in all of our ads which gave me a monopoly listing (2 listings, one making 10% and one making 15%) in my area and people could only connect to the site via VPN. 100% of my sales were with people buying on localbitcoins for the first time, I enjoyed helping to introduce Germans to Bitcoin and usually gave them some advice on how to take care of their BTC and some good places to spend them. I had done 15k transactions before so this was not too big of a stretch.

I was actually not going to go to that final sale but it was my 100% rating with over 100 transactions that I didn't want to screw up in case I wanted to sell again in another place.

Did you release the bitcoin’s before the money landed in your bank account? I’m not being sarcastic, it’s just when I have used LocalBitcoin’s UK version the coins are held in escrow, the buyer pays you & then you release coins. No payment, no release.

Was it different in the really early days when you used it?

Thankfully you’re a really early adopter so I hope the loss didn’t affect you too much

[gembitz]

It's 2017, Jay. Why are you still using Localbitcoins?

What’s wrong with LocalBitcoins? On the rare occasion that I’ve sold some of my stash I’ve sold there. Never had a problem with them as long as you sell to somebody with multiple 100% positive feedback.

Multiple 100% feedback says nothing. Or are you under the assumption that that guy who lost his 85 coins transacted with someone with zip or negative feedback?

It was a zero feedback person. Almost everyone that bought from me in Germany had no feedback because Germany did all of us sellers a favor and banned localbitcoins from Germany. All that did was locked in all of our ads which gave me a monopoly listing (2 listings, one making 10% and one making 15%) in my area and people could only connect to the site via VPN. 100% of my sales were with people buying on localbitcoins for the first time, I enjoyed helping to introduce Germans to Bitcoin and usually gave them some advice on how to take care of their BTC and some good places to spend them. I had done 15k transactions before so this was not too big of a stretch.

I was actually not going to go to that final sale but it was my 100% rating with over 100 transactions that I didn't want to screw up in case I wanted to sell again in another place.

Did you release the bitcoin’s before the money landed in your bank account? I’m not being sarcastic, it’s just when I have used LocalBitcoin’s UK version the coins are held in escrow, the buyer pays you & then you release coins. No payment, no release.

Was it different in the really early days when you used it?

Thankfully you’re a really early adopter so I hope the loss didn’t affect you too much

you must have not read the satoshi whitepaper ~ trustless   bitcoin needs no escrow you fool!

[soullyG]

Did you release the bitcoin’s before the money landed in your bank account? I’m not being sarcastic, it’s just when I have used LocalBitcoin’s UK version the coins are held in escrow, the buyer pays you & then you release coins. No payment, no release.

If you read his original post, he actually got the cash from them but had it switched by an accomplice on the way out the door

[Torque]

Man, I am so LMAO right now. Two well known youtube crypto personalities (jsnip4, Bix Weir) spent the entire early spring and summer bagging on Bitcoin, all the while promoting alt coins, ETH, and ICO tokens. One of these guys has 50K+ followers, the other 25K+. I think they spent the last 3-4 months exclusively promoting ICO tokens. They totally fell for The Flippening^TM and sold it hook-line-and-sinker to their followers.

The whole time this was going on I kept watching a few of their videos now and then, SMH, and thinking to myself "Man, you guys are going to get burned so badly and you don't even realize that it's coming. And what's worse is that you've gotten all of your followers to stay away from Bitcoin and focus exclusively on all the alt- and ICO crap."

Now, their tune has suddenly changed. In their latest videos, they are scratching their heads and wondering about why Bitcoin is rising while altlandia and ICO tokens are falling. Funniest shit I've seen. These guys are clueless. Nice guys that mean well, but totally clueless.

[LFC_Bitcoin]

It's 2017, Jay. Why are you still using Localbitcoins?

What’s wrong with LocalBitcoins? On the rare occasion that I’ve sold some of my stash I’ve sold there. Never had a problem with them as long as you sell to somebody with multiple 100% positive feedback.

Multiple 100% feedback says nothing. Or are you under the assumption that that guy who lost his 85 coins transacted with someone with zip or negative feedback?

It was a zero feedback person. Almost everyone that bought from me in Germany had no feedback because Germany did all of us sellers a favor and banned localbitcoins from Germany. All that did was locked in all of our ads which gave me a monopoly listing (2 listings, one making 10% and one making 15%) in my area and people could only connect to the site via VPN. 100% of my sales were with people buying on localbitcoins for the first time, I enjoyed helping to introduce Germans to Bitcoin and usually gave them some advice on how to take care of their BTC and some good places to spend them. I had done 15k transactions before so this was not too big of a stretch.

I was actually not going to go to that final sale but it was my 100% rating with over 100 transactions that I didn't want to screw up in case I wanted to sell again in another place.

Did you release the bitcoin’s before the money landed in your bank account? I’m not being sarcastic, it’s just when I have used LocalBitcoin’s UK version the coins are held in escrow, the buyer pays you & then you release coins. No payment, no release.

Was it different in the really early days when you used it?

Thankfully you’re a really early adopter so I hope the loss didn’t affect you too much

you must have not read the satoshi whitepaper ~ trustless  bitcoin needs no escrow you fool!

Localbitcoin’s use a type of escrow dick head. You don’t release your coins from your wallet to the buyer until you receive payment.

Did you release the bitcoin’s before the money landed in your bank account? I’m not being sarcastic, it’s just when I have used LocalBitcoin’s UK version the coins are held in escrow, the buyer pays you & then you release coins. No payment, no release.

If you read his original post, he actually got the cash from them but had it switched by an accomplice on the way out the door

Ahhhhhh face to face meets - there lies the problem. Bastards.

[buyandhold]

@theymos' side says Sillbert's side are very naughty boys:
https://bitcoin.org/en/alert/2017-10-09-segwit2x-safety
Beware of Bitcoin's possible incompatibility with some major services.

[gembitz]

Man, I am so LMAO right now. Two well known youtube crypto personalities (jsnip4, Bix Weir) spent the entire early spring and summer bagging on Bitcoin, all the while promoting alt coins, ETH, and ICO tokens. One of these guys has 50K+ followers, the other 25K+. I think they spent the last 3-4 months exclusively promoting ICO tokens. They totally fell for The Flippening^TM and sold it hook-line-and-sinker to their followers.

The whole time this was going on I kept watching a few of their videos now and then, SMH, and thinking to myself "Man, you guys are going to get burned so badly and you don't even realize that it's coming. And what's worse is that you've gotten all of your followers to stay away from Bitcoin and focus exclusively on all the alt- and ICO crap."

Now, their tune has suddenly changed. In their latest videos, they are scratching their heads and wondering about why Bitcoin is rising while altlandia and ICO tokens are falling. Funniest shit I've seen. These guys are clueless. Nice guys that mean well, but totally clueless.

Vitalik not in prison yet for masterminding ICO pyramiding schemes?...just amazing~ i wonder how many "ICOs" his sockpuppets pulled off?
 
lel

#alien_head