Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[mymenace]

Because Bitcoin is digital gold

Let me get this straight.  You're telling people that centralized, valueless, imaginary tokens are better than gold and silver, yet in order to try and trick them into believing you, you're forced to use the word "gold" in your sentence and claim that bitcoin is "gold".  Talk about bad propaganda.

You're right, gold isn't even gold anymore, because the thing it used to be has been completely destroyed by Central Bank manipulation.

Bitcoin is a "digital commodity." Gold is just a shiny rock dug up from the ground.

There, fixed.

For all intents and purposes, gold and silver still work as perfectly fine as ever.  The term you're looking for is rehypothecation.  Lots of people who believe they're holding gold or silver hold none because the bank has rehypothecated them and given them worthless digital numbers instead, so the only people who hold any type of value are the ones who hold physical in their possession, while everyone else has been robbed by the bank.

Yeah, they give you a piece of paper and say yes we are holding your gold, and then you feel safe....WHY!!!!!

I buy a bitcoin, I can track it monitor it, etc etc etc on a trusted ledger

this is beautiful

R0ach only advocates that you buy the actual bullion, not pieces of paper. Therefore, your argument isn't going to fly.  

no argument just a statement

i know I am not going to hold a million dollars in gold on my property, where shall i go? ....bitcoin...

[bones261]

R0ach only advocates that you buy the actual bullion, not pieces of paper. Therefore, your argument isn't going to fly.  

Tungsten.

R0ach actually favors silver over gold. So the Tungsten argument is only going to be dismissed.

[realr0ach]

Because Bitcoin is digital gold

Let me get this straight.  You're telling people that centralized, valueless, imaginary tokens are better than gold and silver, yet in order to try and trick them into believing you, you're forced to use the word "gold" in your sentence and claim that bitcoin is "gold".  Talk about bad propaganda.

You're right, gold isn't even gold anymore, because the thing it used to be has been completely destroyed by Central Bank manipulation.

Bitcoin is a "digital commodity." Gold is just a shiny rock dug up from the ground.

There, fixed.

For all intents and purposes, gold and silver still work as perfectly fine as ever.  The term you're looking for is rehypothecation.  Lots of people who believe they're holding gold or silver hold none because the bank has rehypothecated them and given them worthless digital numbers instead, so the only people who hold any type of value are the ones who hold physical in their possession.  Everyone else has been robbed by the bank or sold coupons by the bank for metals that don't exist.  That's not a fault of metals, it's the fault of people trusting banks.  The metals didn't rob you, the bank did.

Yeah, they give you a piece of paper and say yes we are holding your gold, and then you feel safe....WHY!!!!!

I buy a bitcoin, I can track it monitor it, etc etc etc on a trusted ledger

this is beautiful

Totally wrong because you can't actually take delivery of a bitcoin even if you have the private key.  Bitcoin is an imaginary digital loaf of bread that lives in "the cloud".  But there's no such thing as "the cloud", just you uploading your shit to someone else's computer you don't control.  If you want to then do something with your imaginary loaf of broad, you're required to ask permission to a miner to do it because transactions are not blinded and he can block your transaction if he wants.  It's also designed to centralized, so it's inevitable govt co-opts the mining facility and you will be asking permission of the govt.

Even if you pretend mining doesn't centralize, you're then required to pay a ransom or usury fee to a built-in middleman that's impossible to remove called a transaction validator (miner).  So it never was YOUR bitcoin in the first place, now was it?  You were just a child who has to ask permission to a parent to do anything and the property was never yours to do as you wish in the first place.

[fabiorem]

Bitcoin is more safe to hold than gold. Gold you can lost or be robbed.

[mymenace]

Because Bitcoin is digital gold

Let me get this straight.  You're telling people that centralized, valueless, imaginary tokens are better than gold and silver, yet in order to try and trick them into believing you, you're forced to use the word "gold" in your sentence and claim that bitcoin is "gold".  Talk about bad propaganda.

You're right, gold isn't even gold anymore, because the thing it used to be has been completely destroyed by Central Bank manipulation.

Bitcoin is a "digital commodity." Gold is just a shiny rock dug up from the ground.

There, fixed.

For all intents and purposes, gold and silver still work as perfectly fine as ever.  The term you're looking for is rehypothecation.  Lots of people who believe they're holding gold or silver hold none because the bank has rehypothecated them and given them worthless digital numbers instead, so the only people who hold any type of value are the ones who hold physical in their possession.  Everyone else has been robbed by the bank or sold coupons by the bank for metals that don't exist.  That's not a fault of metals, it's the fault of people trusting banks.  The metals didn't rob you, the bank did.

Yeah, they give you a piece of paper and say yes we are holding your gold, and then you feel safe....WHY!!!!!

I buy a bitcoin, I can track it monitor it, etc etc etc on a trusted ledger

this is beautiful

Totally wrong because you can't actually take delivery of a bitcoin even if you have the private key.  Bitcoin is an imaginary digital loaf of bread that lives in "the cloud".  But there's no such thing as "the cloud", just you uploading your shit to someone else's computer you don't control.  If you want to then do something with your imaginary loaf of broad, you're required to ask permission to a miner to do it because transactions are not blinded and he can block your transaction if he wants.  It's also designed to centralized, so it's inevitable govt co-opts the mining facility and you will be asking permission of the govt.

Even if you pretend mining doesn't centralize, you're then required to pay a ransom or usury fee to a built-in middleman that's impossible to remove called a transaction validator (miner).  So it never was YOUR bitcoin in the first place, now was it?  You were just a child who has to ask permission to a parent to do anything and the property was never yours to do as you wish in the first place.

you just explained how the world works (economy)

if you want use it, pay your way

other wise keep you gold at home

same thing applies to gold as well

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Executive_Order_6102

it is never your gold

[Torque]

Bitcoin is more safe to hold than gold. Gold you can lost or be robbed.

And you don't have to worry about who made it, how it was made, or it's resell value.

[gentlemand]

R0ach actually favors silver over gold. So the Tungsten argument is only going to be dismissed.

Alright. Let me go off and do some research. I want to keep the irritation up.

[bitserve]

Haha, so now the trolls are in an uproar because of the thought that Bitcoin maximalists won't even bother to hold altcoins because they know that such can be traded for as needed for day-to-day transactions?

Well they should be. Because Bitcoin is digital gold, that only has value that continues to increase because people to choose to hold it long term and not spend it.

Altcoins, not so much.

Trading BTC to altcoins "as needed for day-to-day transactions" is pointless. You will incur in more fees (exchanging, txs, etc) instead of avoiding them. At least until Bitcoin deploys LN and/or increase blocksize... but then it wouldn't be needed to use any altcoin.

So, in some way, this situation is forcing us to hold a higher percentage of altcoins than what we would be initially willing/comfortable to. Maybe that is even good for some people, or they think so because of the shorter term higher gains we have involuntarily experienced... but I don't think that is sustainable in the longer run.

[jojo69]

cue ominous metal riff

[Samplex]

Bitcoin is more safe to hold than gold. Gold you can lost or be robbed.

With bitcoin you can forget/lose you address or send to different address that you have wanted to, hmmm? Bitcoin is easier in a sence that with gold its like staying in one place - its hard to move it.

[criptix]

Why is everyone deliberately ignoring the bitmain mining fud?

Everyone is fine with the CPC controlling the network in the future?!

[bitserve]

R0ach actually favors silver over gold. So the Tungsten argument is only going to be dismissed.

Alright. Let me go off and do some research. I want to keep the irritation up.

Just doing the calculation of how much size and weight one would need to manage for storing a few million $ in silver is more than enough to dismiss the idea of storing "value" in it.

[realr0ach]

R0ach actually favors silver over gold. So the Tungsten argument is only going to be dismissed.

Alright. Let me go off and do some research. I want to keep the irritation up.

Save your time, it's harder to fake both silver and platinum than gold because tungsten is very close to gold in the specific gravity test.  You could create alloys of other metals to try and accomplish the same thing in silver, but silver has unique characteristics that gold doesn't have to give the fakes away.  All of this is completely meaningless though, as people use things like Xray machines to test them nowadays and the fakes aren't going to pass no matter what.

The common man can easily test silver.  There are not that many coin and round makers.  The simple act of pinging one of these coins will give off a unique sound wave you can either tell by ear, or you can hold it up to the microphone of a cellphone and your free cellphone app will tell you if the resonance matches and if it's real or not.  A fake silver alloy will not pass.

[JayJuanGee]

Just found a stack of paper wallets from 2015. I was giving away 0.05 Bitcoi in each and these were the leftovers. It’s a nice find I didn’t know I had it....

Yep.   All of a sudden scrap amounts become real money.

It is kind of bullshit, though, regarding how some of these people treat their gifts, and I have a few war stories regarding that too.

My friend recently contacted me, and told me that he was looking for his son's $40 bitcoin transaction that I had sent for a graduation gift.

Mind you I sent $40 to the son and $10 to the dad, in order that they could, perhaps, learn together about bitcoin.  The price was around $380 at the time... So, a couple of times a year, I would remind him about bitcoin and ask him if he had retrieved the bitcoin... did it through Circle....  He said, yeah, yeah, yeah, he still has access to the e-mail account, and just a few weeks ago when he contacted me, he asked me if I could recover the coins because he said that he did not have access to the e-mail accounts.  The son's value was something like $1,740 and the dads value was something like $440.  Crazy.  I think that they lost everything, unless they can regain access to their earlier e-mails, perhaps there is a way... I think that it was a private domain e-mail that their family administrator allowed the domain to expire.

[Torque]

Haha, so now the trolls are in an uproar because of the thought that Bitcoin maximalists won't even bother to hold altcoins because they know that such can be traded for as needed for day-to-day transactions?

Well they should be. Because Bitcoin is digital gold, that only has value that continues to increase because people to choose to hold it long term and not spend it.

Altcoins, not so much.

Trading BTC to altcoins "as needed for day-to-day transactions" is pointless. You will incur in more fees (exchanging, txs, etc) instead of avoiding them. At least until Bitcoin deploys LN and/or increase blocksize... but then it wouldn't be needed to use any altcoin.

So, in some way, this situation is forcing us to hold a higher percentage of altcoins than what we would be initially willing/comfortable to. Maybe that is even good for some people, or they think so because of the shorter term higher gains we have involuntarily experienced... but I don't think that is sustainable in the longer run.

When I first heard about Bitcoin, I fully bought in to the whole "digital currency is better in every way to fiat for online purchases" line. Only problem though, is that unless you are trying to buy something illegal, it really isn't better than fiat.

In the past 4 years, I've never come across a single scenario where going through the hassle of buying Bitcoin, getting charged the fee, waiting 3-4 days for it, then spending it online for something, transaction fee, waiting for confirmation, was in any way better or faster than just using a credit card or online bank account. The fee for purchasing the bitcoin + the waiting + the fee for the spending transaction + the time for confirmation just never outweighed just spending my fiat directly in the first place.

Truly, something like Lightning Network is the ONLY way Bitcoin is ever going to have a chance to compete with worldwide fiat transaction systems by giving people an INCENTIVE to buy bitcoin for that purpose. Meaning that it actually HAS TO BE better and faster than using fiat systems online for spending. Even then, I just don't see most people buying bitcoin for the purpose of turning around and immediately spending it online. I just don't.

[JayJuanGee]

No one left any positive comments for bitcoin judas.  

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TaN3jYQxmQU

Do you not see anything wrong with this picture?  "CEO of bitcoin.com" vs "CEO of blockstream.com".  That sure as fuck does not sound "decentralized" to me.  It sounds like corporate special interest groups trying to seize some type of public good and exploit it for their own interests.  It also reminds me of African derived banana republics like the nation of Haiti, a completely powerless nation whose military probably serves no purpose at all, but every low level negro in the entire country has given themselves the title of general.

Blockstream.com is not bitcoin, you fucking nutjob!!!!   

[Neo_Coin]

Haha, so now the trolls are in an uproar because of the thought that Bitcoin maximalists won't even bother to hold altcoins because they know that such can be traded for as needed for day-to-day transactions?

Well they should be. Because Bitcoin is digital gold, that only has value that continues to increase because people to choose to hold it long term and not spend it.

Altcoins, not so much.

[bitserve]

R0ach actually favors silver over gold. So the Tungsten argument is only going to be dismissed.

Alright. Let me go off and do some research. I want to keep the irritation up.

Save your time, it's harder to fake both silver and platinum than gold because tungsten is very close to gold in the specific gravity test.  You could create alloys of other metals to try and accomplish the same thing in silver, but silver has unique characteristics that gold doesn't have to give the fakes away.  All of this is completely meaningless though, as people use things like Xray machines to test them nowadays and the fakes aren't going to pass no matter what.

The common man can easily test silver.  There are not that many coin and round makers.  The simple act of pinging one of these coins will give off a unique sound wave you can either tell by ear, or you can hold it up to the microphone of a cellphone and your free cellphone app will tell you if the resonance matches and if it's real or not.  A fake silver alloy will not pass.

Finally something interesting. May I know the name of that free app I can use with my phone? Have you used it and can vouch for its accuracy?
I would be willing to do some tests RIGHT NOW. What is the name of the app again?

[mymenace]

Haha, so now the trolls are in an uproar because of the thought that Bitcoin maximalists won't even bother to hold altcoins because they know that such can be traded for as needed for day-to-day transactions?

Well they should be. Because Bitcoin is digital gold, that only has value that continues to increase because people to choose to hold it long term and not spend it.

Altcoins, not so much.

Trading BTC to altcoins "as needed for day-to-day transactions" is pointless. You will incur in more fees (exchanging, txs, etc) instead of avoiding them. At least until Bitcoin deploys LN and/or increase blocksize... but then it wouldn't be needed to use any altcoin.

So, in some way, this situation is forcing us to hold a higher percentage of altcoins than what we would be initially willing/comfortable to. Maybe that is even good for some people, or they think so because of the shorter term higher gains we have involuntarily experienced... but I don't think that is sustainable in the longer run.

When I first heard about Bitcoin, I fully bought in to the whole "digital currency is better in every way to fiat for online purchases" line. Only problem though, is that unless you are trying to buy something illegal, it really isn't better than fiat.

In the past 4 years, I've never come across a single scenario where going through the hassle of buying Bitcoin, getting charged the fee, waiting 3-4 days for it, then spending it online for something, was in any way better or faster than just using a credit card or online bank account. The fee for purchasing the bitcoin + the waiting + the fee for the spending transaction + the time for confirmation just never outweighed just spending my fiat directly in the first place.

Truly, something like Lightning Network is the ONLY way Bitcoin is ever going to have a chance to compete with worldwide fiat transaction systems by giving people an INCENTIVE to buy bitcoin for that purpose. Even then, I just don't see most people buying bitcoin for the purpose of turning around and immediately spending it online. I just don't.

I disagree, I like bitcoin for large transactions and the minor transactions to be done on the side

RSK is the first open-source smart contract platform with a 2-way peg to Bitcoin that also rewards the Bitcoin miners via merge-mining, allowing them to actively participate in the Smart Contract revolution. RSK goal is to add value and functionality to the Bitcoin ecosystem by enabling smart-contracts, near instant payments and higher-scalability.

[criptix]

Haha, so now the trolls are in an uproar because of the thought that Bitcoin maximalists won't even bother to hold altcoins because they know that such can be traded for as needed for day-to-day transactions?

Well they should be. Because Bitcoin is digital gold, that only has value that continues to increase because people to choose to hold it long term and not spend it.

Altcoins, not so much.

Trading BTC to altcoins "as needed for day-to-day transactions" is pointless. You will incur in more fees (exchanging, txs, etc) instead of avoiding them. At least until Bitcoin deploys LN and/or increase blocksize... but then it wouldn't be needed to use any altcoin.

So, in some way, this situation is forcing us to hold a higher percentage of altcoins than what we would be initially willing/comfortable to. Maybe that is even good for some people, or they think so because of the shorter term higher gains we have involuntarily experienced... but I don't think that is sustainable in the longer run.

When I first heard about Bitcoin, I fully bought in to the whole "digital currency is better in every way to fiat for online purchases" line. Only problem though, is that unless you are trying to buy something illegal, it really isn't better than fiat.

In the past 4 years, I've never come across a single scenario where going through the hassle of buying Bitcoin, getting charged the fee, waiting 3-4 days for it, then spending it online for something, was in any way better or faster than just using a credit card or online bank account. The fee for purchasing the bitcoin + the waiting + the fee for the spending transaction + the time for confirmation just never outweighed just spending my fiat directly in the first place.

Truly, something like Lightning Network is the ONLY way Bitcoin is ever going to have a chance to compete with worldwide fiat transaction systems by giving people an INCENTIVE to buy bitcoin for that purpose. Even then, I just don't see most people buying bitcoin for the purpose of turning around and immediately spending it online. I just don't.

I disagree, I like bitcoin for large transactions and the minor transactions to be done on the side

RSK is the first open-source smart contract platform with a 2-way peg to Bitcoin that also rewards the Bitcoin miners via merge-mining, allowing them to actively participate in the Smart Contract revolution. RSK goal is to add value and functionality to the Bitcoin ecosystem by enabling smart-contracts, near instant payments and higher-scalability.

Before trying random stuff i would rather go with vitaliks Plasma chain.